Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering


Dave R


--
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In article ,
David writes:
Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Jan-March is the time when we get periods of little light,
no wind, and cold weather.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

There are some things which are probably not obvious from grid
watch...

Some large customers buy electricity cheaper on the basis that they
can be switched off without much warning when there's a shortage.
(Same with gas customers.) Electricity companies now directly
control many streetlamps (all in Hampshire AFAIK, via a mesh network),
and they can switch them all on and off whenever they like. I don't
know if they have a process in place to switch them off if there's
a supply deficit, but it would be technically possible for sure.

A few years ago, the backup generators for our data centres
were modified so they can back-feed the grid if asked. I suspect
there's probably quite a bit of this across the country too.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Tue, 9 Jan 2018 15:05:58 -0000 (UTC), Andrew Gabriel wrote:

There are some things which are probably not obvious from grid
watch...

Some large customers buy electricity cheaper on the basis that they
can be switched off without much warning when there's a shortage.
(Same with gas customers.)

Pretty sure they do get some warning, if only from the warning
notices issued by National Grid that they might have to impliment
some of the Demand Side Response (DSR).

There used to be Supplemental Balancing Reserve (SBR), power stations
paid to be ready to start if required. That system no longer exists
and has been replaced by the "Capacity Market". Haven't looked at how
that (is supposed to) work(s).

A few years ago, the backup generators for our data centres
were modified so they can back-feed the grid if asked. I suspect
there's probably quite a bit of this across the country too.

They probably form part of the Short Term Operating Reserve (STOR).
Small systems that can be started up quickly and with little/no
notice. Possibly even under remote control.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 9 Jan 2018 12:50:55 GMT, David wrote:

Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

No point in looking at Gridwatch as supply always equals supply + losses

The orange and red zones bear no relationship to actual availability which
varies enormously season to season.

The National Grid winter outlook report 2017/18 shows the anticipated plant
capacity and margins

https://www.nationalgrid.com/uk/docu...outlook-report

The predicted winter peak was for week 3 at 50960MW

As for live data, from the horses mouth

For 530pm to 6pm today there is around 5GW of derated margin.

For the same period yesterday it was 7GW

For the same period tomorrow, at 24 hours out it is currently 500MW, for
previous half hour it is currently minus 30MW, with a peak demand of 51610MW

But that does not mean there are going to be power cuts at 5pm tomorrow, nor
dimming lights, nor a shortage of generation. Despite recent generation
closures (both coal and gas) and a lack of significant new build the margins
this winter are larger than for quite some time.

Others could comment with more authority on the weather in the USA reaching here
some time later, often it does but it would appear that in the case of these
extreme low temperature and significant snow falls that will not happen. If
you want a country with power cuts and people trapped by snow try Switzerland
and the current situation in Zermatt, a place where cars are banned.

--

On 09/01/18 15:05, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article ,
David writes:
Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Jan-March is the time when we get periods of little light,
no wind, and cold weather.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

There are some things which are probably not obvious from grid
watch...

Some large customers buy electricity cheaper on the basis that they
can be switched off without much warning when there's a shortage.
(Same with gas customers.) Electricity companies now directly
control many streetlamps (all in Hampshire AFAIK, via a mesh network),
and they can switch them all on and off whenever they like. I don't
know if they have a process in place to switch them off if there's
a supply deficit, but it would be technically possible for sure.

A few years ago, the backup generators for our data centres
were modified so they can back-feed the grid if asked. I suspect
there's probably quite a bit of this across the country too.

Yes. there's getting on for probaly about a gigawatt of 'disposable demand'

'The other mike' propbably knows more


--
Climate Change: Socialism wearing a lab coat.

How much capacity does Europe have and at what cost and how good is the
connection?
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"David" wrote in message
...
Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering


Dave R


--
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Be a neat trick to power cars from the mains. I do gather that after such a
long time brits are very economical with lights on cars. all a bit lost on
me of course, but I wonder how they got on in the war during the black outs?
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Jethro_uk" wrote in message
news
Well any demand for energy certainly isn't coming from car headlights.

Visibility is down to 100m in places, and about 2/3 of cars are dark.

On Tue, 9 Jan 2018 18:22:41 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Be a neat trick to power cars from the mains. I do gather that after such a
long time brits are very economical with lights on cars. all a bit lost on
me of course, but I wonder how they got on in the war during the black outs?

With difficulty ,but there were far fewer cars on the road and for
many fuel rationing meant they weren't used as freely as before the
war.
Lots of white paint on kerbs, trees and potential hazards some of
which was still visible well into the 70's.
Vehicles themselves had often had wings bumpers and running boards
painted white,a sensible precaution in era when most cars were black
and other colours if available were dark shades. Bicycles had white
painted on the rear mudguard which often remains on old examples.
Pedestrians still got killed in large numbers with over 1100 killed in
the first month of the blackout and whose death was attributed to it.

In those places that had them following a tram or the lines was a
useful way of not driving into the kerb.

G.Harman

On 09/01/18 20:00, wrote:
On Tue, 9 Jan 2018 18:22:41 -0000, "Brian Gaff"
wrote:

Be a neat trick to power cars from the mains. I do gather that after such a
long time brits are very economical with lights on cars. all a bit lost on
me of course, but I wonder how they got on in the war during the black outs?

With difficulty ,but there were far fewer cars on the road and for
many fuel rationing meant they weren't used as freely as before the
war.
Lots of white paint on kerbs, trees and potential hazards some of
which was still visible well into the 70's.

Given the lack of street lighting in some places and the tendency to
turn it off later at night (or all the time in some cash strapped areas)
we should go back to whitening things...

Vehicles themselves had often had wings bumpers and running boards
painted white,a sensible precaution in era when most cars were black
and other colours if available were dark shades. Bicycles had white
painted on the rear mudguard which often remains on old examples.
Pedestrians still got killed in large numbers with over 1100 killed in
the first month of the blackout and whose death was attributed to it.

In those places that had them following a tram or the lines was a
useful way of not driving into the kerb.

G.Harman

On 09/01/2018 18:21, Brian Gaff wrote:
How much capacity does Europe have and at what cost and how good is the
connection?
Brian


https://www.elexon.co.uk/about/backg...terconnectors/

Four interconnectors at the moment I think (more under construction)

2 GW to France, 1 GW to Holland, 500 MW each to Northern Ireland and to
the Irish Republic.

Pretty reliable. Historically the French one was almost all one way
(importing) but I think we have been exporting while some of their plant
was down.

Don't have the figures but I'd expect capacity and consumption per
capita to be similar for broadly similar countries.

On 09/01/18 20:20, newshound wrote:
On 09/01/2018 18:21, Brian Gaff wrote:
How much capacity does Europe have and at what cost and how good is the
connection?
Â* Brian


https://www.elexon.co.uk/about/backg...terconnectors/

Four interconnectors at the moment I think (more under construction)

2 GW to France, 1 GW to Holland, 500 MW each to Northern Ireland and to
the Irish Republic.

Pretty reliable. Historically the French one was almost all one way
(importing) but I think we have been exporting while some of their plant
was down.

Don't have the figures but I'd expect capacity and consumption per
capita to be similar for broadly similar countries.

Not quite. France is higher because with cheap nuclear electric its the
main way they heat houses.


--
Those who want slavery should have the grace to name it by its proper
name. They must face the full meaning of that which they are advocating
or condoning; the full, exact, specific meaning of collectivism, of its
logical implications, of the principles upon which it is based, and of
the ultimate consequences to which these principles will lead. They must
face it, then decide whether this is what they want or not.

Ayn Rand.

On 09/01/18 16:45, The Other Mike wrote:
If
you want a country with power cuts and people trapped by snow try Switzerland
and the current situation in Zermatt, a place where cars are banned.


That's usual for Zermatt, a couple of days every winter there is an
avalanche on the railway and the village cut off. I have also been there
in summer when a large lump of mountain came down with similar effect.


--
djc

(–€Ì¿Ä¹Ì¯–€Ì¿ Ì¿)
No low-hanging fruit, just a lot of small berries up a tall tree.

On Tue, 9 Jan 2018 20:08:39 +0000, Tim Watts
wrote:


me of course, but I wonder how they got on in the war during the black outs?

With difficulty ,but there were far fewer cars on the road and for
many fuel rationing meant they weren't used as freely as before the
war.
Lots of white paint on kerbs, trees and potential hazards some of
which was still visible well into the 70's.

Given the lack of street lighting in some places and the tendency to
turn it off later at night (or all the time in some cash strapped areas)
we should go back to whitening things...

I expect we do have a lot better reflective surfaces now and many
bends will be marked with chevrons ,in some places there is an excess
road of signs with reflective surfaces.
I live in a village without any street lighting and like it that way
as do the majority of the residents.
A lot people don't get to find out that except on really filthy nights
how much you can see once the eyes have been allowed to adjust to the
conditions.

One thing that has helped those who venture out at night now compared
with previous generations is the LED which offers bright torches that
don't eat through a load of Every Ready batteries each week and
clothing fitted with Leds is now common place as well as ordinary
reflective tabards ,armbands etc being easily obtained .
Somewhere there will be a line as to what is best, providing lighting
which may well be money wasted if no one passes in a quiet area or
passing the cost onto the small numbers of people passing by expecting
them to carry decent personal lighting instead. Where that line is
placed could be a source of much debate but I think it has moved in
recent times now a small light pocket torch easily outshines a hand
lantern with a 6 volt battery from a couple of decades ago.

One thing I did not mention about the WW2 blackout was that
pedestrians were advised to carry a newspaper at night to hopefully
act as a reflector.


G.Harman

On Tue, 09 Jan 2018 20:48:04 +0000, wrote:

Given the lack of street lighting in some places and the tendency
to
turn it off later at night (or all the time in some cash strapped
areas) we should go back to whitening things...

I expect we do have a lot better reflective surfaces now and many
bends will be marked with chevrons ,in some places there is an excess
road of signs with reflective surfaces.



I live in a village without any street lighting and like it that way
as do the majority of the residents.

Dark Skies. There must be a great many people who have never seen
anything but the brightest stars/planets. It's quite a sight to look
up on a clear moonless night and see the Milky Way arching across the
sky and so many stars that it makes it hard to pick out the
constelations.

A lot people don't get to find out that except on really filthy nights
how much you can see once the eyes have been allowed to adjust to the
conditions.

Or like find out what "dark" really means. Dark as in eyes open, not
able to see *anything*, not the faintest of glows, not a pinpoint,
absolulely nothing, decidely disturbingly dark.

One thing I did not mention about the WW2 blackout was that
pedestrians were advised to carry a newspaper at night to hopefully
act as a reflector.

With the tendancy of outdoor clothing to be dark and wet road
surfaces being dark pedestrians are well advised to carrying
something light coloured or have reflective arm bands, even in street
lit areas.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 00:08:52 +0000, Dave Liquorice wrote:

With the tendancy of outdoor clothing to be dark and wet road surfaces
being dark pedestrians are well advised to carrying something light
coloured or have reflective arm bands, even in street lit areas.

And if a vehicle is approaching, move the light thing or arm bands. More
noticeable.



--
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wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 10 Jan 2018 00:22:43 GMT, Bob Eager wrote:

On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 00:08:52 +0000, Dave Liquorice wrote:

With the tendancy of outdoor clothing to be dark and wet road surfaces
being dark pedestrians are well advised to carrying something light
coloured or have reflective arm bands, even in street lit areas.

And if a vehicle is approaching, move the light thing or arm bands. More
noticeable.

We had that in Norfork recently when approaching someone walking a dog
(on the right side of the road) but the first thing we saw of them was
the flash of a (moving) torch (still a reasonable distance away etc).

Had they been wearing anything bright or even better, reflective, I
may have seen them sooner and would have preferred that.

When buying an outdoor / waterproof jacket I see if I can get
something with some form of reflective component. My current one has
reflective piping for example (very 'Tron' like). ;-)

Cheers, T i m

In article ,
Jethro_uk wrote:
Well any demand for energy certainly isn't coming from car headlights.

Visibility is down to 100m in places, and about 2/3 of cars are dark.

Round here, people use headlights in anything other than bright sunlight.
Never did quite understand the theory. Other than making the vehicle more
visible to pedestrians with poor eyesight. And I doubt many care about
those.

--
*Never slap a man who's chewing tobacco *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Jethro_uk wrote:
Well any demand for energy certainly isn't coming from car headlights.

Visibility is down to 100m in places, and about 2/3 of cars are dark.

Round here, people use headlights in anything other than bright sunlight.
Never did quite understand the theory. Other than making the vehicle more
visible to pedestrians with poor eyesight. And I doubt many care about
those.
Unlit country lane here. Closing yard gates etc. I often come across
cyclists using forward facing lamps roughly equivalent to a car
headlight. Fine if it makes them feel safer but, when it is mounted on
their helmet and they look to see what is standing by the road, has a
blinding effect. I've not yet met one while driving but suspect this
might actually be dangerous.


--
Tim Lamb

In article ,
says...

In those places that had them following a tram or the lines was a
useful way of not driving into the kerb.


It can backfire, though.

I remember driving around the Hague, following the tram lines
in broad daylight.

I very nearly failed to spot that the road turned left while
the tram lines carried straight onto reserved track!

Fortunately I spotted my error in time to just avoid driving
straight off the road!


--

Terry

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In article ,
says...


One thing I did not mention about the WW2 blackout was that
pedestrians were advised to carry a newspaper at night to hopefully
act as a reflector.


Even in the 60s I remember the COI film on TV exhorting us to
"wear something light at night".

Featured an attractive blonde wearing a raincoat, IIRC.

--

Terry

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On Tue, 09 Jan 2018 16:45:25 +0000, The Other Mike
wrote:

On 9 Jan 2018 12:50:55 GMT, David wrote:

Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

No point in looking at Gridwatch as supply always equals supply + losses

The orange and red zones bear no relationship to actual availability which
varies enormously season to season.


How meaningful is it to look at Frequency as an indicator that the
system is being pushed hard?

--
AnthonyL

On Tue, 09 Jan 2018 12:50:55 +0000, David wrote:

Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up
open for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather
two weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

Noted the comments about not relying too heavily on the figures.

However the wind output has dropped down to very little (0.98GW) and coal
has ramped up to 7.0 GW at the moment.

We certainly aren't in Guardian celebration territory of wind and solar
outperforming coal at the moment.


As a slight rephrase of the question, I wonder how close we are to firing
up the emergency backup stuff and/or load shedding.

It looks as though we are using the French and Dutch feeds almost flat out
at the moment, and only the OCGT to go.

Cheers


Dave R




--
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In article ,
Tim Lamb wrote:
I often come across
cyclists using forward facing lamps roughly equivalent to a car
headlight. Fine if it makes them feel safer but, when it is mounted on
their helmet and they look to see what is standing by the road, has a
blinding effect. I've not yet met one while driving but suspect this
might actually be dangerous.

Common with many motorcycles too. Set the headlamp to create maximum
dazzle. On the assumption they are more likely to be seen. Therefore
putting the onus on others to avoid them, rather than by driving in a safe
way.

--
*There are two kinds of pedestrians... the quick and the dead.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
AnthonyL wrote:
How meaningful is it to look at Frequency as an indicator that the
system is being pushed hard?

I have a mains locked digital LED clock in the bedroom. Usually see it
click over to 1 am while hearing the pips on R4. It seems be more 'slow'
on a day where you'd expect heavy power consumption.

Not sure what time 'they' use as a starting point to average out the 50Hz
over 24 hours, though.

--
*There's two theories to arguing with a woman. Neither one works *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 09/01/2018 15:05, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
Electricity companies now directly
control many streetlamps (all in Hampshire AFAIK, via a mesh network),
and they can switch them all on and off whenever they like.

The car park at my local Southern rail station seems to have new
LED lighting. There is a footpath running along one side and as I
walked along it at about 8PM a few days ago, I'm sure that they either
suddenly brightened up or some came on as I passed each column.

On 10/01/2018 11:03, Jethro_uk wrote:
Driving about 7am yesterday, there was a pedestrian wearing something
which*really* lit up/stood out. It was some sort of white coat, but the
retroreflection must have been well over 50% ...

I have a Rohan cycling jacket that looks grey in daylight but shines
white at night because the entire fabric is coated with scotchlite.

Unfortunately, it makes you sweat because the coating overpowers the
Rohan fabric design.

On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 16:16:25 +0000, Andrew wrote:

On 10/01/2018 11:03, Jethro_uk wrote:
Driving about 7am yesterday, there was a pedestrian wearing something
which*really* lit up/stood out. It was some sort of white coat, but
the retroreflection must have been well over 50% ...

I have a Rohan cycling jacket that looks grey in daylight but shines
white at night because the entire fabric is coated with scotchlite.

Unfortunately, it makes you sweat because the coating overpowers the
Rohan fabric design.

I can understand that. Rohan stuff usually works well, and I wear it most
days.

--
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wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
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On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 11:40:19 +0000, Tim Lamb
wrote:

In message , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Jethro_uk wrote:
Well any demand for energy certainly isn't coming from car headlights.

Visibility is down to 100m in places, and about 2/3 of cars are dark.

Round here, people use headlights in anything other than bright sunlight.
Never did quite understand the theory. Other than making the vehicle more
visible to pedestrians with poor eyesight. And I doubt many care about
those.

Unlit country lane here. Closing yard gates etc. I often come across
cyclists using forward facing lamps roughly equivalent to a car
headlight. Fine if it makes them feel safer but, when it is mounted on
their helmet and they look to see what is standing by the road, has a
blinding effect.

And potentially illegal:

http://www.lightmare.org/the_law.htm

"114 You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to
other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders"

I've not yet met one while driving but suspect this
might actually be dangerous.

And illegal. ;-)

Cheers, T i m

p.s. And this one winds me up ...

"In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off
the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again."

Especial when in a std car behind a 4X4 or big SUV etc.

On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 11:40:19 +0000, Tim Lamb wrote:

Round here, people use headlights in anything other than bright
sunlight. Never did quite understand the theory.

All recent cars have bright front only Daylight Running Lights
(DLRs). Many also have auto lights, which if they are anything like
the auto mode on my car are a bit eager to come on. The biggest
annoyance is them silently switching off in bright daylight fog...

Unlit country lane here. Closing yard gates etc. I often come across
cyclists using forward facing lamps roughly equivalent to a car
headlight. Fine if it makes them feel safer but, when it is mounted on
their helmet and they look to see what is standing by the road, has a
blinding effect. I've not yet met one while driving but suspect this
might actually be dangerous.

I have, bloody awful. 50% of the time the mount is crap and the lamp
bounces about giving blinding flashes of light, 50% of the time the
mount is OK but there is no "dip" and the lamp is set such that
oncoming drivers are dazzled.

And why do people park up and leave the headlights on? Had a "moment"
the other night, straight road then a with gentle right bend, dark
night no streetlights. Come round corner onto straight section
headlights in distance, go to dip, carry on, on coming headlights
start to dazzle, carry on, oncoming lights really starting to dazzle,
aiming into the darknes to pass with the lights to my right, serious
dazzle, go to main beam just in time to see the white line starting
the gentle right bend and the "oncoming" headlights on a car parked
off the road, on my side, on main beam. Needed a rather hasty change
of direction to pass with them to my left.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 18:19:39 +0000, T i m wrote:

http://www.lightmare.org/the_law.htm

"114 You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to
other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders"

Your missing the fact that cyclists think the Highway Code only
applies to motorists not all road users, including cyclists.

"In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off
the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again."

Yes, but I put it down to change in how people are taught to drive
these days. I was taught to use the gears in combination with the
brakes to slow down and use the handbrake. These days it appears to
be brakes only and hold the vehicle with the foot brake.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 10/01/2018 18:51, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 18:19:39 +0000, T i m wrote:

http://www.lightmare.org/the_law.htm

"114 You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to
other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders"

Your missing the fact that cyclists think the Highway Code only
applies to motorists not all road users, including cyclists.

"In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off
the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again."

Yes, but I put it down to change in how people are taught to drive
these days. I was taught to use the gears in combination with the
brakes to slow down and use the handbrake. These days it appears to
be brakes only and hold the vehicle with the foot brake.


I think that debate could run and run. My instructor (40 years ago)
used to insist its wasn't a "handbrake" its a "parking" brake. If you
are not parked you don't use it (except if absolutely necessary for hill
starts).

The other camp argued that if stationary and you got rear ended the foot
would inevitably come off the brake and there was no knowing where you
might end up. With the parking brake applied you wouldn't go far.

I think both arguments have some value, so I'm not saying which camp I
belong to.

I don't think dazzle from brake lights was a thing when I learned to
drive. :-)

--
Chris B (News)

In article ,
Chris B wrote:
On 10/01/2018 18:51, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 18:19:39 +0000, T i m wrote:

http://www.lightmare.org/the_law.htm

"114 You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to
other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders"

Your missing the fact that cyclists think the Highway Code only
applies to motorists not all road users, including cyclists.

"In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off
the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again."

Yes, but I put it down to change in how people are taught to drive
these days. I was taught to use the gears in combination with the
brakes to slow down and use the handbrake. These days it appears to
be brakes only and hold the vehicle with the foot brake.


I think that debate could run and run. My instructor (40 years ago)
used to insist its wasn't a "handbrake" its a "parking" brake. If you
are not parked you don't use it (except if absolutely necessary for hill
starts).

The other camp argued that if stationary and you got rear ended the foot
would inevitably come off the brake and there was no knowing where you
might end up. With the parking brake applied you wouldn't go far.

I think both arguments have some value, so I'm not saying which camp I
belong to.

I don't think dazzle from brake lights was a thing when I learned to
drive. :-)

If I keep my foot hard on the brake pedal, the engine stops and
automatically restarts when I lift it off. This is to minimise polution
and use less fuel.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 18:39:06 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

snip

And why do people park up and leave the headlights on?

Because they are either stupid or inconsiderate?

Had a "moment"
the other night, straight road then a with gentle right bend, dark
night no streetlights. Come round corner onto straight section
headlights in distance, go to dip, carry on, on coming headlights
start to dazzle, carry on, oncoming lights really starting to dazzle,
aiming into the darknes to pass with the lights to my right, serious
dazzle, go to main beam just in time to see the white line starting
the gentle right bend and the "oncoming" headlights on a car parked
off the road, on my side, on main beam.

Yup, lovely. Been there been dazzled by that.

Needed a rather hasty change
of direction to pass with them to my left.

And even if they are dipped beam, they can still be ridiculously
bright because they are dipped *into* your eyes. ;-(

I've given many of them full beam, simply to be able to see past them
myself.

If I ever pull up on the wrong side of the road at night (and I hardly
ever do [1]), the first thing I do is drop to sidelights.

Cheers, T i m

[1] I also feel it's wrong to actually park the wrong way round so
rarely do that either, even during the day! ;-)

On 10/01/18 12:52, AnthonyL wrote:
On Tue, 09 Jan 2018 16:45:25 +0000, The Other Mike
wrote:

On 9 Jan 2018 12:50:55 GMT, David wrote:

Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up open
for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather two
weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

No point in looking at Gridwatch as supply always equals supply + losses

The orange and red zones bear no relationship to actual availability which
varies enormously season to season.


How meaningful is it to look at Frequency as an indicator that the
system is being pushed hard?

quite meaningful,. It indicates a short term lack of as much supply as
one would like.



--
The biggest threat to humanity comes from socialism, which has utterly
diverted our attention away from what really matters to our existential
survival, to indulging in navel gazing and faux moral investigations
into what the world ought to be, whilst we fail utterly to deal with
what it actually is.

On 10/01/18 13:03, David wrote:
On Tue, 09 Jan 2018 12:50:55 +0000, David wrote:

Following on from other Gridwatch references I've had the web site up
open for a few days now.

It looks as though demand is slowly going up each day, nuclear and CCGT
are at the top end of their range (presumably most nuclear reactors are
now on line) and coal is slowly ramping up.

With this grey overcast and the cold weather it is beginning to look as
though if the wind drops we could be pushing the boundaries a bit.

Fortunately it looks as though we are still in windy times. Although
Thursday and Friday seem to have lower wind speeds predicted.

Realistically, how close are we to demand outstripping supply?

How much 'headroom' do we have if we get the traditional "USA weather
two weeks later" with snow and freezing temperatures?

Just wondering

Noted the comments about not relying too heavily on the figures.

However the wind output has dropped down to very little (0.98GW) and coal
has ramped up to 7.0 GW at the moment.

We certainly aren't in Guardian celebration territory of wind and solar
outperforming coal at the moment.


As a slight rephrase of the question, I wonder how close we are to firing
up the emergency backup stuff and/or load shedding.

It looks as though we are using the French and Dutch feeds almost flat out
at the moment, and only the OCGT to go.


No, there still a couple of GW available and its not that cold - when it
is France reverses and imports

Cheers


Dave R






--
The biggest threat to humanity comes from socialism, which has utterly
diverted our attention away from what really matters to our existential
survival, to indulging in navel gazing and faux moral investigations
into what the world ought to be, whilst we fail utterly to deal with
what it actually is.

On 09/01/18 20:48, wrote:

I expect we do have a lot better reflective surfaces now and many
bends will be marked with chevrons ,in some places there is an excess
road of signs with reflective surfaces.

True, sometimes more dazzling than un-dipped headlights


I live in a village without any street lighting and like it that way
as do the majority of the residents.
A lot people don't get to find out that except on really filthy nights
how much you can see once the eyes have been allowed to adjust to the
conditions.

Wonderfull clear night tonight, stars I haven't seen for years.



One thing that has helped those who venture out at night now compared
with previous generations is the LED which offers bright torches that
don't eat through a load of Every Ready batteries each week and
clothing fitted with Leds is now common place as well as ordinary
reflective tabards ,armbands etc being easily obtained .



--
djc

(–€Ì¿Ä¹Ì¯–€Ì¿ Ì¿)
No low-hanging fruit, just a lot of small berries up a tall tree.

"T i m" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 18:39:06 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

snip

And why do people park up and leave the headlights on?

Because they are either stupid or inconsiderate?

Had a "moment"
the other night, straight road then a with gentle right bend, dark
night no streetlights. Come round corner onto straight section
headlights in distance, go to dip, carry on, on coming headlights
start to dazzle, carry on, oncoming lights really starting to dazzle,
aiming into the darknes to pass with the lights to my right, serious
dazzle, go to main beam just in time to see the white line starting
the gentle right bend and the "oncoming" headlights on a car parked
off the road, on my side, on main beam.

Yup, lovely. Been there been dazzled by that.

Needed a rather hasty change
of direction to pass with them to my left.

And even if they are dipped beam, they can still be ridiculously
bright because they are dipped *into* your eyes. ;-(

I've given many of them full beam, simply to be able to see past them
myself.

If I ever pull up on the wrong side of the road at night (and I hardly
ever do [1]), the first thing I do is drop to sidelights.

[1] I also feel it's wrong to actually park the wrong way
round so rarely do that either, even during the day! ;-)

Its illegal here. I do it at times during the garage sale runs but
I'm hardly ever there for long and never need to in the dark.

On Thu, 11 Jan 2018 08:35:02 +1100, "Rod Speed"
wrote:

snip

If I ever pull up on the wrong side of the road at night (and I hardly
ever do [1]), the first thing I do is drop to sidelights.

[1] I also feel it's wrong to actually park the wrong way
round so rarely do that either, even during the day! ;-)

Its illegal here. I do it at times during the garage sale runs but
I'm hardly ever there for long and never need to in the dark.

So it's illegal to do even in the day?

I'm not sure I'd go as far as that ... other than if someone parks up
that way in the day they can easily end up leaving it that way
overnight (or longer etc).

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-high...ing-238-to-252

ITRW, I'm, pretty sure thousands if not millions of people break the
....

"Rule 250

Cars, goods vehicles not exceeding 2500 kg laden weight, invalid
carriages, motorcycles and pedal cycles may be parked without lights
on a road (or lay-by) with a speed limit of 30 mph (48 km/h) or less
if they a

at least 10 metres (32 feet) away from any junction, close to the
kerb and facing in the direction of the traffic flow"

.... every day (well, night), especially in big cities like London. ;-(

Cheers, T i m

In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice writes
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 11:40:19 +0000, Tim Lamb wrote:

Round here, people use headlights in anything other than bright
sunlight. Never did quite understand the theory.

All recent cars have bright front only Daylight Running Lights
(DLRs). Many also have auto lights, which if they are anything like
the auto mode on my car are a bit eager to come on. The biggest
annoyance is them silently switching off in bright daylight fog...

Unlit country lane here. Closing yard gates etc. I often come across
cyclists using forward facing lamps roughly equivalent to a car
headlight. Fine if it makes them feel safer but, when it is mounted on
their helmet and they look to see what is standing by the road, has a
blinding effect. I've not yet met one while driving but suspect this
might actually be dangerous.

I have, bloody awful. 50% of the time the mount is crap and the lamp
bounces about giving blinding flashes of light, 50% of the time the
mount is OK but there is no "dip" and the lamp is set such that
oncoming drivers are dazzled.

And why do people park up and leave the headlights on? Had a "moment"
the other night, straight road then a with gentle right bend, dark
night no streetlights. Come round corner onto straight section
headlights in distance, go to dip, carry on, on coming headlights
start to dazzle, carry on, oncoming lights really starting to dazzle,
aiming into the darknes to pass with the lights to my right, serious
dazzle, go to main beam just in time to see the white line starting
the gentle right bend and the "oncoming" headlights on a car parked
off the road, on my side, on main beam. Needed a rather hasty change
of direction to pass with them to my left.

Just wonder what the opinions are in here on the latest gimmick which is
for a single fog (or low mounted) lamp to come on with the corresponding
indicator. Are they any use?
--
bert

In article , Chris B
writes
On 10/01/2018 18:51, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Wed, 10 Jan 2018 18:19:39 +0000, T i m wrote:

http://www.lightmare.org/the_law.htm

"114 You MUST NOT

use any lights in a way which would dazzle or cause discomfort to
other road users, including pedestrians, cyclists and horse riders"
Your missing the fact that cyclists think the Highway Code only
applies to motorists not all road users, including cyclists.

"In stationary queues of traffic, drivers should apply the parking
brake and, once the following traffic has stopped, take their foot off
the footbrake to deactivate the vehicle brake lights. This will
minimise glare to road users behind until the traffic moves again."
Yes, but I put it down to change in how people are taught to drive
these days. I was taught to use the gears in combination with the
brakes to slow down and use the handbrake. These days it appears to
be brakes only and hold the vehicle with the foot brake.


I think that debate could run and run. My instructor (40 years ago)
used to insist its wasn't a "handbrake" its a "parking" brake. If you
are not parked you don't use it (except if absolutely necessary for
hill starts).

The other camp argued that if stationary and you got rear ended the
foot would inevitably come off the brake and there was no knowing where
you might end up. With the parking brake applied you wouldn't go far.

I think both arguments have some value, so I'm not saying which camp I
belong to.

I don't think dazzle from brake lights was a thing when I learned to
drive. :-)

On the subject of learning to drive, and to go off at a tangent a bit,
if learners must be able to follow sat nav instructions is there a need
for a new international road sign
DO NOT FOLLOW SAT NAV INSTRUCTIONS
One to be placed on each cliff top.
--
bert