On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 15:08:43 -0000, "Owain"
wrote:

"Andy Hall" wrote
| "Owain" wrote:
| | If people take care of their teeth properly, the ongoing costs
| | are not excessive at all.
| If people have good teeth to start off with.
| It does vary, but I had found that NHS treatment in early life had
| left a legacy of poor quality restorative work.

Yes, that's why I think the NHS should keep my teeth sorted out; they made
them what they are.


The trouble is that hell will freeze over before that happens.


Dentists are paid a flat per annum rate for children, the idea is this will
encourage dentists to do preventative care so that expensive treatments are
not needed. Although dentists now concentrate on preserving natural teeth,
when faced with a nervous child patient and the dentist knows the patient
and family history is such that dental health will deteriorate again anyway,
extraction of deciduous teeth is a quick (for the dentist and the patient)
and cheap treatment, especially in the days when dentists could use general
anaesthesia for extractions. It also fosters a culture that the quick cure
for dental problems is extraction.

It certainly was a generation ago, and earlier than that it was
commonplace for people when they reached a certain age to have all
teeth removed, healthy as well and to get dentures. A complete
nonsense.


The problem is that if deciduous teeth
are extracted the sockets are not properly formed in the jaw and the
permanent teeth can then grow squint.

Right.


| Over a period of several years, as replacement fillings were needed,
| they were done privately with much more time and effort being taken
| and better materials being used.

Unless you want non-amalgam fillings for appearance or particular health
concerns, the materials shoudl be the same.

They are not though. There is really no excuse for using amalgam
fillings any longer. I got shot of the last of mine more than 10
years ago, when the available alternative materials had reached the
stage of development that they would last at least as long.

However the main criterion of
success and longevity of a filling is preparation of the cavity,
particularly dryness. The more time a dentist can take over this, the better
the filling will be.

Yep. This is where one of the major issues is with any of this type
of work and time is where much of the cost lies.

If you can get private dentistry fairly cheaply it
might actually work out cheaper than continual NHS renewal.

In terms of long term viability of the teeth, yes. Each time a
filling is replaced, a small amount of tooth is lost. Beyond a
certain point, it becomes so weakened that a crown or extraction are
the only options left.

This was my earlier point. Once a stable situation can be achieved,
the focus should be on care and so hygienist visits are important,
especially for people older than 40.





Owain


..andy

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"Neil Jones" wrote in message
...

"Mike Mitchell" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:53:39 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Owain" wrote in message
...
"Andy Hall" wrote
| Today the big story is NHS dentistry, or rather, the lack
| of it for vast numbers of the population and their need
| to go private. Do you know how much private dentistry costs?
| It is exhorbitant beyond all measure.

| Nope. It is the true cost of providing
| quality treatment.

Quality? Total "rip off" treatment. It is extortion.

I can vouch for that! Here there is no NHS dentist. There is only a
private dentist. Last year I paid £320 for root canal work on ONE
tooth! Last week I had an esitmate for the repair of one filling (not
the same tooth) in a 30-minute appointment: £60! Sixty quid just to
*repair* a filling! The dentist now has a price list on the wall, and
some of the prices would frighten off most people from ever going
anywhere near a dentist again. Oh, the hygenist costs £40 for a
descaling, i.e. about 20 minutes' work.

Rip-off, extortion, thoroughly unsupportable in the so-called
fourth-richest nation. Utterly ludicrous. Unlike that brave old Lady
from Devon however, we cannot refuse to pay when our teeth hurt.
Usurious private dentistry is taking advantage of pain. There is a
word for that, I believe.

MM

So what would a fair price have been, in your opinion?

Not £360 for one tooth.

On Sun, 29 Feb 2004 14:48:26 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Neil Jones" wrote in message
...

"Mike Mitchell" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 19 Feb 2004 20:53:39 -0000, "IMM" wrote:


"Owain" wrote in message
...
"Andy Hall" wrote
| Today the big story is NHS dentistry, or rather, the lack
| of it for vast numbers of the population and their need
| to go private. Do you know how much private dentistry costs?
| It is exhorbitant beyond all measure.

| Nope. It is the true cost of providing
| quality treatment.

Quality? Total "rip off" treatment. It is extortion.

I can vouch for that! Here there is no NHS dentist. There is only a
private dentist. Last year I paid £320 for root canal work on ONE
tooth! Last week I had an esitmate for the repair of one filling (not
the same tooth) in a 30-minute appointment: £60! Sixty quid just to
*repair* a filling! The dentist now has a price list on the wall, and
some of the prices would frighten off most people from ever going
anywhere near a dentist again. Oh, the hygenist costs £40 for a
descaling, i.e. about 20 minutes' work.

Rip-off, extortion, thoroughly unsupportable in the so-called
fourth-richest nation. Utterly ludicrous. Unlike that brave old Lady
from Devon however, we cannot refuse to pay when our teeth hurt.
Usurious private dentistry is taking advantage of pain. There is a
word for that, I believe.

MM

So what would a fair price have been, in your opinion?

Not £360 for one tooth.

For what is involved in doing a root canal treatment, especially if it
is towards the back of the mouth, this is not an unreasonable price at
all.

To get it right, the dentist has to remove all of the soft tissue
leading into the far tips of the root and do so without leaving any
behind or without pushing the extremely fine tools used through the
end of the root. This involves working to tolerances of a fraction
of a millimetre and very carefully done sterilisation procedures to
avoid later infection, weakening of the bone support for the tooth and
its subsequent loss. Then there is the restorative work to make
sure it's sound and possibly a gold crown afterwards.

Done carefully and properly, a greater than 90% success rate can be
achieved by a good dentist. Done without taking the time and trouble,
it is around a 50% success rate.

In the context of that, £360 is inexpensive indeed.

The alternative, of course, is to simply have the tooth extracted.
That is a lot less expensive and faster. One can choose.




..andy

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