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  #1   Report Post  
Grunff
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Some of you may recall my previous posts about our very odd 1930s house
(back wall subsiding, damp, internal walls made of 2" thick block laid
directly on floorboards, lots of other interesting features). Well,
today we came across a particularly interesting feature which I'd like
to share with you.

To recap, the house is roughly square. As you come in the front door,
which is in the middle of the house wall, you see the stairs. So the
stairs run down the middle of the house, with rooms either side both
downstairs and upstairs.

We're currently working on bedroom no.1, which is the room on the right
as you go up the stairs. We've finished bedroom no.2, which is the one
on the left.

Both of these rooms have walls which form the stair well. But bedroom
no.1 also has the wall which forms the end of the stair well - the wall
which you might bump your head on going up the stairs.

In bedroom no.2, the wall which forms part of the stair well is made of
the lovely 2" black blocks mentioned earlier, laid directly onto the
floor boards. Nothing unusual about that (for this house, at any rate).

But in bedroom no.1, the equivalent wall, and the wall which forms the
end of the stair well are made of T&G, lined on the inside (i.e. inside
the room) with 1/8" hardboard (yes, that's right).

Today's job was to remove these walls. Having removed the hardboard, we
found that the wall which is part of the stair well is lined with
asbestos sheets! Four sheets of 4'x2'x5mm of grey asbestos sheet, very
hard amd brittle.

I thought that was a bit odd, given the age of the house, and given that
it looks like an original feature. I thought asbestos was only used
after the 40s.

But even more interesting - the other wall, the one forming the end of
the stair well - wasn't lined with the same sheets. Instead, it's lined
with 1/2" fibre board (like MDF but very low density).

Why would they do that? Why would anyone go to the trouble of lining one
wall with asbestos sheet, but line the adjacent wall with fibre board
(which is useless when it comes to fire resistance)?

Any thoughts/experiences/wisdom?


--
Grunff
  #2   Report Post  
N. Thornton
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Grunff wrote in message ...

Why would they do that? Why would anyone go to the trouble of lining one
wall with asbestos sheet, but line the adjacent wall with fibre board
(which is useless when it comes to fire resistance)?

Any thoughts/experiences/wisdom?


Not really. Asbestos was used in Victorian times though, asbestos
fluff was the standard incandescent stuff in gas fires before ceramic
knobbly plates took over.

I guess the real question is what to do about it.


Regards, NT
  #3   Report Post  
Chris Oates
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"N. Thornton" wrote in message
m...
Grunff wrote in message

...

Why would they do that? Why would anyone go to the trouble of lining one
wall with asbestos sheet, but line the adjacent wall with fibre board
(which is useless when it comes to fire resistance)?

Any thoughts/experiences/wisdom?


Not really. Asbestos was used in Victorian times though


damn stuff was used till 19veryrecently in Artex
and as plain boards - inspector who found ours
pulled out fibres of it and held it very close to his
face/nose & proceeded to explain how expensive it's
going to be to remove this deadly stuff.



  #4   Report Post  
Chris Oates
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"Steve" wrote in message
...
Chris Oates wrote:

damn stuff was used till 19veryrecently in Artex
and as plain boards - inspector who found ours
pulled out fibres of it and held it very close to his
face/nose & proceeded to explain how expensive it's
going to be to remove this deadly stuff.


There's no clinching evidence that WHITE asbestos is a problem - the
blue and brown forms are a different matter.


I didn't imply enough sarcasm

Insurance companies and the HSE think the
stuff is worse than Ebola virus....
the inspector obviously knew the score


  #5   Report Post  
Grunff
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

N. Thornton wrote:

I guess the real question is what to do about it.


Not really - it's nowhere near as scary as it's made out to be. In
reality, risks only result from prolonged exposure. Before anyone
invokes the "one fibre" theory, find some studies which support it.

As for disposal:

http://www.oxford.gov.uk/oxford%5Cservices.nsf/Public/AllServices/E1F036E230FE0B0C80256A310051B471?OpenDocument
http://www.allerdale.gov.uk/show.asp?PageID=149
http://www.alnwick.gov.uk/alnwick/council.nsf/pages/Asbestos122231.html?OpenDocument&Start=1&Count=100 0&ExpandView

(many more available, just google)

--
Grunff


  #6   Report Post  
The Natural Philosopher
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Grunff wrote:

Some of you may recall my previous posts about our very odd 1930s house
(back wall subsiding, damp, internal walls made of 2" thick block laid
directly on floorboards, lots of other interesting features). Well,
today we came across a particularly interesting feature which I'd like
to share with you.

To recap, the house is roughly square. As you come in the front door,
which is in the middle of the house wall, you see the stairs. So the
stairs run down the middle of the house, with rooms either side both
downstairs and upstairs.

We're currently working on bedroom no.1, which is the room on the right
as you go up the stairs. We've finished bedroom no.2, which is the one
on the left.

Both of these rooms have walls which form the stair well. But bedroom
no.1 also has the wall which forms the end of the stair well - the wall
which you might bump your head on going up the stairs.

In bedroom no.2, the wall which forms part of the stair well is made of
the lovely 2" black blocks mentioned earlier, laid directly onto the
floor boards. Nothing unusual about that (for this house, at any rate).

But in bedroom no.1, the equivalent wall, and the wall which forms the
end of the stair well are made of T&G, lined on the inside (i.e. inside
the room) with 1/8" hardboard (yes, that's right).

Today's job was to remove these walls. Having removed the hardboard, we
found that the wall which is part of the stair well is lined with
asbestos sheets! Four sheets of 4'x2'x5mm of grey asbestos sheet, very
hard amd brittle.

I thought that was a bit odd, given the age of the house, and given that
it looks like an original feature. I thought asbestos was only used
after the 40s.

But even more interesting - the other wall, the one forming the end of
the stair well - wasn't lined with the same sheets. Instead, it's lined
with 1/2" fibre board (like MDF but very low density).

Why would they do that? Why would anyone go to the trouble of lining one
wall with asbestos sheet, but line the adjacent wall with fibre board
(which is useless when it comes to fire resistance)?



Because that is what they got cheap.

In those days, D-I-Y on a house of this value was domne on an absolute
shoestring, usually to remodel a new room for yet another mewling puking
brat.

If someone had a couple of sheets of this or that left over going cheap,
you used it. The 50's were very limited times financially.





Any thoughts/experiences/wisdom?




  #7   Report Post  
Grunff
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Because that is what they got cheap.


Well, yeah, I get your meaning, but surely the fibre board was *loads*
cheaper than the asbestos sheet (as well as being easier to work).

What I don't get is the juxtaposition of the two materials, when the use
of fibreboard on one of the walls completely nullifies any benefit the
asbestos might have provided.

--
Grunff
  #8   Report Post  
Steve
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Chris Oates wrote:

damn stuff was used till 19veryrecently in Artex
and as plain boards - inspector who found ours
pulled out fibres of it and held it very close to his
face/nose & proceeded to explain how expensive it's
going to be to remove this deadly stuff.


There's no clinching evidence that WHITE asbestos is a problem - the
blue and brown forms are a different matter.

Steve

  #9   Report Post  
Chris Oates
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

The 50's were very limited times financially.


you're not kidding !

I got sent next door to watch black & white TV
Our weekly bath was in something that got lowered
from the ceiling.
The 'wash' was done in a 'luxury' gas fired
oil drum & was dried with the aid of a mangle
Fridges only existed in America
Milk came decanted from churns on a wagon
drawn by horses
Only the rich had a phone
Ditto cars
Sugar was still rationed

those were the days



  #10   Report Post  
PoP
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 01:06:33 -0000, "Chris Oates" none wrote:

you're not kidding !

I got sent next door to watch black & white TV
Our weekly bath was in something that got lowered


::Cue violins::

PoP

Sending email to my published email address isn't
guaranteed to reach me.


  #11   Report Post  
The Natural Philosopher
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Chris Oates wrote:

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...


The 50's were very limited times financially.


you're not kidding !

I got sent next door to watch black & white TV
Our weekly bath was in something that got lowered
from the ceiling.
The 'wash' was done in a 'luxury' gas fired
oil drum & was dried with the aid of a mangle
Fridges only existed in America
Milk came decanted from churns on a wagon
drawn by horses
Only the rich had a phone
Ditto cars
Sugar was still rationed

those were the days




NOT.
:-)






  #12   Report Post  
R W
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Grunff wrote:

Some of you may recall my previous posts about our very odd 1930s
house (back wall subsiding, damp, internal walls made of 2" thick
block laid directly on floorboards, lots of other interesting
features). Well, today we came across a particularly interesting
feature which I'd like to share with you.

To recap, the house is roughly square. As you come in the front door,
which is in the middle of the house wall, you see the stairs. So the
stairs run down the middle of the house, with rooms either side both
downstairs and upstairs.

We're currently working on bedroom no.1, which is the room on the
right as you go up the stairs. We've finished bedroom no.2, which is
the one on the left.

Both of these rooms have walls which form the stair well. But bedroom
no.1 also has the wall which forms the end of the stair well - the
wall which you might bump your head on going up the stairs.

In bedroom no.2, the wall which forms part of the stair well is made
of the lovely 2" black blocks mentioned earlier, laid directly onto
the floor boards. Nothing unusual about that (for this house, at any
rate).

But in bedroom no.1, the equivalent wall, and the wall which forms
the end of the stair well are made of T&G, lined on the inside (i.e.
inside the room) with 1/8" hardboard (yes, that's right).

Today's job was to remove these walls. Having removed the hardboard,
we found that the wall which is part of the stair well is lined with
asbestos sheets! Four sheets of 4'x2'x5mm of grey asbestos sheet,
very hard amd brittle.

I thought that was a bit odd, given the age of the house, and given
that it looks like an original feature. I thought asbestos was only
used after the 40s.

But even more interesting - the other wall, the one forming the end
of the stair well - wasn't lined with the same sheets. Instead, it's
lined with 1/2" fibre board (like MDF but very low density).

Why would they do that? Why would anyone go to the trouble of lining
one wall with asbestos sheet, but line the adjacent wall with fibre
board (which is useless when it comes to fire resistance)?



Because that is what they got cheap.

In those days, D-I-Y on a house of this value was domne on an absolute
shoestring, usually to remodel a new room for yet another mewling
puking brat.

If someone had a couple of sheets of this or that left over going
cheap, you used it. The 50's were very limited times financially.


Yep, the door frames in our 1950s house are metal, and all the
soffits/fascias, guttering and drainage pipes are (were) asbestos.

Apparently wood wasn't cheap then. But you wouldn't think it was
expensive when you see the size, thickness and number of floor joists!


  #13   Report Post  
Mary Fisher
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"PoP" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 01:06:33 -0000, "Chris Oates" none wrote:

you're not kidding !

I got sent next door to watch black & white TV


I was sent next door to listen to 78rpm records.

Our weekly bath was in something that got lowered


We were posh, we went to the public baths. When we wouldn't fit into the
zinc bath any more.

Mary


  #14   Report Post  
PoP
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 22:08:05 -0000, "Mary Fisher"
wrote:

I was sent next door to listen to 78rpm records.


Oi! If you are going to quote then please reply to the person that
wrote the original article

PoP

Sending email to my published email address isn't
guaranteed to reach me.
  #15   Report Post  
Mary Fisher
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"PoP" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 22:08:05 -0000, "Mary Fisher"
wrote:

I was sent next door to listen to 78rpm records.


Oi! If you are going to quote then please reply to the person that
wrote the original article


Sorry!

Mary
on my knees (make the most of it, it doesn't happen often!)

PoP

Sending email to my published email address isn't
guaranteed to reach me.





  #16   Report Post  
Chris Oates
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"Mary Fisher" wrote in message
...

"PoP" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 22:08:05 -0000, "Mary Fisher"
wrote:

I was sent next door to listen to 78rpm records.


Oi! If you are going to quote then please reply to the person that
wrote the original article


Sorry!

Mary
on my knees (make the most of it, it doesn't happen often!)


housemaids knee was a common problem then



  #17   Report Post  
PoP
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

On Tue, 20 Jan 2004 21:14:24 -0000, "Mary Fisher"
wrote:

on my knees (make the most of it, it doesn't happen often!)


The mind boggles

PoP

Sending email to my published email address isn't
guaranteed to reach me.
  #18   Report Post  
The Natural Philosopher
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Chris Oates wrote:

"Mary Fisher" wrote in message
...

"PoP" wrote in message
. ..

On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 22:08:05 -0000, "Mary Fisher"
wrote:


I was sent next door to listen to 78rpm records.

Oi! If you are going to quote then please reply to the person that
wrote the original article

Sorry!

Mary
on my knees (make the most of it, it doesn't happen often!)


housemaids knee was a common problem then


#
Still is for carpet fitters.







  #19   Report Post  
PoP
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

On Wed, 21 Jan 2004 08:39:31 +0000, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:

housemaids knee was a common problem then


Still is for carpet fitters.


I've had problems with my knees when installing loft flooring on a
couple of occasions recently, I presume that is known as housemaids
knee.

I do find that wearing a pair of knee pads helps enormously. And for
that someone unknown on this forum is due thanks - I had never tried
knee pads prior to someone mentioning them here a while back, a quick
visit to ebay and I had a pair to try.

PoP

Sending email to my published email address isn't
guaranteed to reach me.
  #20   Report Post  
Mary Fisher
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house


"Chris Oates" none wrote in message
...

"Mary Fisher" wrote in message
...

"PoP" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 19 Jan 2004 22:08:05 -0000, "Mary Fisher"
wrote:

I was sent next door to listen to 78rpm records.

Oi! If you are going to quote then please reply to the person that
wrote the original article


Sorry!

Mary
on my knees (make the most of it, it doesn't happen often!)


housemaids knee was a common problem then


I'll let you know when I have the result of the whole body scan I had on
Monday.

Mary







  #21   Report Post  
Martin Angove
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

In message ,
Grunff wrote:

Some of you may recall my previous posts about our very odd 1930s house
(back wall subsiding, damp, internal walls made of 2" thick block laid
directly on floorboards, lots of other interesting features).


We have (ok, had) walls like that too; two partition walls upstairs
built directly on the floorboards out of 3" thick "breezeblock"-type
blocks (someone called them cinderblocks). These were interesting in
that they had a toungue-and-groove arrangement on their narrow vertical
faces!

+--------+

+--------+

What counts as plaster in this 1930s council-built semi is about a
half to threequarters of an inch of black coal dust capped with no more
than a sixteenth of cement render. This is further coated with gorgeous
Artex in much of the house (see pictures still up at
http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/danygraig/ )

[...]
we found that the wall which is part of the stair well is lined with
asbestos sheets! Four sheets of 4'x2'x5mm of grey asbestos sheet, very
hard amd brittle.

I thought that was a bit odd, given the age of the house, and given that
it looks like an original feature. I thought asbestos was only used
after the 40s.


All the ceilings in the house mentioned above are (or were) asbestos
sheet. As part of the refurbishment these are going - at least in the
half of the house we're doing at the moment.

So you're not in an entirely unique position :-) Obviously some odd
things went on in the 1930s. Like the ceiling joists upstairs (i.e.
attic joists) which are on 2ft or so centres and not properly supported
over their 6m span. Again, the support will be better when we've
refurbished, though I'm blowed if I'm adding extra joists just to make
putting a bit of board up there a bit easier.

Hwyl!

M.

--
Martin Angove: http://www.tridwr.demon.co.uk/
Two free issues: http://www.livtech.co.uk/ Living With Technology
.... Your cat's missing? Have you checked my bumper?
  #22   Report Post  
Grunff
 
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Default Interesting asbestos use in 1930s house

Martin Angove wrote:

All the ceilings in the house mentioned above are (or were) asbestos
sheet. As part of the refurbishment these are going - at least in the
half of the house we're doing at the moment.


Wow! For the first time since buying this house I feel truly privileged
- our ceilings were a mixture of lath+plaster clad over with fibreboard!

--
Grunff
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