I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK. I
have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and UK
mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility but
you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up and
the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Thanks.

"Kit Jackson" wrote in message
eb.com...
I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK. I
have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and UK
mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility but
you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up and
the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Thanks.

You need to ask Dave Plowman.
He'll know.

On 25 Oct 2017 00:09:40 GMT, Kit Jackson coalesced
the vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful
comprehension...

I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK. I
have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and UK
mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility but
you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up and
the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Thanks.

Lots of possibilities here.
I suggest you put CSipSimple on your Android phone, and sign up with a
SIP provider, my favourite, based on call cost is discountvoip.co.uk

You don't mention if you need a UK, or Kiwi VoIP number for incoming
calls.
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On 25/10/17 01:09, Kit Jackson wrote:
I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK. I
have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and UK
mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility but
you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up and
the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Thanks.

Get a payg account with SIPGATE, tied to a UK number.

Then access it worldwide


--
Microsoft : the best reason to go to Linux that ever existed.

On Wednesday, 25 October 2017 01:10:03 UTC+1, Kit Jackson wrote:
Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Zoiper on Android has a record calls option, but I've never used it so can't saydefinately that it wiorks.

If you sign up to Sipgate Basic you can download a pre-configured Zoiper from them. 1.2p/minute to most UK numbers and a free UK number for incoming.

Owain

Graham. wrote:
Lots of possibilities here.
I suggest you put CSipSimple on your Android phone, and sign up with a
SIP provider, my favourite, based on call cost is discountvoip.co.uk

There's lots of pseudo-brands run by the same company. Pick whichever is
cheapest for the destinations you call:
http://progx.ch/PROGX_WEB/UK/all-rat...comparator.awp

You don't mention if you need a UK, or Kiwi VoIP number for incoming
calls.

Also worth knowing that you don't need to carry calls over the internet, you
can use a local landline or mobile. These services do 'phone to phone' -
you type your local number and the number you want to call into a web form.
First your phone rings and you answer, then you hear it ringing at the other
end.

This is handy if you have a local SIM so can receive calls OK, but no data
plan and no sensible tariff for international calls.

Theo

On Wed, 25 Oct 2017 02:20:30 +0100, Graham. wrote:

I suggest you put CSipSimple on your Android phone,

Or take a look a Zoiper.

You don't mention if you need a UK, or Kiwi VoIP number for incoming
calls.

Geographical number isn't overly relevant to the person being called,
provided they have a suitable 'net connection they can be anywhere on
the planet.

It's relevant to the people making (paying for) the call but just
have two SIP accounts one with a UK number, one with an NZ.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Wed, 25 Oct 2017 02:20:30 +0100, Graham. wrote:

On 25 Oct 2017 00:09:40 GMT, Kit Jackson coalesced the
vapors of human experience into a viable and meaningful comprehension...

I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK.
I have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi
access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and
UK mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility
but you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up
and the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Thanks.

Lots of possibilities here.
I suggest you put CSipSimple on your Android phone, and sign up with a
SIP provider, my favourite, based on call cost is discountvoip.co.uk

You don't mention if you need a UK, or Kiwi VoIP number for incoming
calls.

I hadn't even thought about that but if I sign up to a UK provider I get
a UK phone number, do I? I was thinking of making outgoing calls from my
end. Is it an extra cost to get a UK number or is that always included?
Then somebody else can ring that number and my phone will ring here but
they just get changed their normal rate for a call to a UK landline
number. Have I understood that right?

On Tue, 24 Oct 2017 23:59:56 -0700, spuorgelgoog wrote:

On Wednesday, 25 October 2017 01:10:03 UTC+1, Kit Jackson wrote:
Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Zoiper on Android has a record calls option, but I've never used it so
can't saydefinately that it wiorks.

If you sign up to Sipgate Basic you can download a pre-configured Zoiper
from them. 1.2p/minute to most UK numbers and a free UK number for
incoming.

Owain

So looking at www.sipgatebasic.co.uk I can get a monthly package for 9.95
per month including all calls to UK landlines and mobiles. Alternatively
I can pay 1.18p per minute to UK landlines and 9.9p per minute to UK
mobiles on a pay as you go basis. Either way I install Zoiper on the
Android as the software to make and receive calls and I get a UK phone
number for people to call me. Have I understood that correctly?

Half the reason I kept it is (a) it's cheap and (b) It's a landline
number. Especially since we ditched the fixed landline it's useful to be
able to put on forms. Even though geographically it's "wrong" ....


A couple of things worth mentioning about Sipgate Basic.

Firstly it's not as useful as it once was for setting up ad hoc
geographic numbers, because of the extra red tape they introduced
about a year ago.
Whereas the number used to be activated immediately, now you have to
submit a UK postal address and wait for the Royal Mail to deliver an
activation code. Also the address you give is recorded as your
location for 999 purposes. Not always helpful given the nature of
VoIP, but there it is.

Also Sipgate is expensive IMHO, contrast 10p/min for calling a UK
mobile with 0.3p/min with my recommendation of
https://www.discountvoip.co.uk/calling_rates/


--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%

On 25/10/2017 01:09, Kit Jackson wrote:
I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK. I
have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and UK
mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility but
you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up and
the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

voipcheap.co.uk

Run the app on your mobile, top the account up and get "free days" to
landlines and £0.02 per minute to UK mobiles.

Alternatively use one of the abundant "free speech" applications like
"Signal"

Kit Jackson wrote:
I hadn't even thought about that but if I sign up to a UK provider I get
a UK phone number, do I? I was thinking of making outgoing calls from my
end. Is it an extra cost to get a UK number or is that always included?
Then somebody else can ring that number and my phone will ring here but
they just get changed their normal rate for a call to a UK landline
number. Have I understood that right?

There are two kinds:

The pseudo-landline providers to whom you (usually) pay a monthly fee and
you get a number for incoming calls. To do that you want to be logged in
all the time you might receive calls. Many people plug these into some kind
of hardware phone or mobile app so you don't have to have your laptop on at
all times. Obviously outbound calls are also possible, like any normal
phone.

The 'calling credit' providers who provide something a bit similar to those
calling cards in newsagents windows: Xp per minute to destination Y, buying
credit in lumps of 10 pounds (or whatever). They only do outbound calls,
but can often join two outbounds together to use a phone near to you as your
end instead of the internet. For these you only need to login/run the app
when you want to make a call.


If you don't need to receive incoming calls the latter are usually cheaper.
VOIP is international: you don't need a UK company to give you a UK number
if you want one.

Theo

On Wednesday, 25 October 2017 10:55:35 UTC+1, Kit Jackson wrote:
So looking at www.sipgatebasic.co.uk I can get a monthly package for 9.95
per month including all calls to UK landlines and mobiles. Alternatively
I can pay 1.18p per minute to UK landlines and 9.9p per minute to UK
mobiles on a pay as you go basis. Either way I install Zoiper on the
Android as the software to make and receive calls and I get a UK phone
number for people to call me. Have I understood that correctly?

Yes, and when you're not running Zoiper your calls go to voicemail, which you can retrieve through Zoiper (press and hold 1 or dial 50000) and you get the messages emailed to you.

Your UK number is presented as your outgoing CLI so people can call you back on it.

Owain

It's DIGITAL....you didn't expect it to work did you ?

On 25/10/2017 13:58, Theo wrote:
Kit Jackson wrote:
I hadn't even thought about that but if I sign up to a UK provider I get
a UK phone number, do I? I was thinking of making outgoing calls from my
end. Is it an extra cost to get a UK number or is that always included?
Then somebody else can ring that number and my phone will ring here but
they just get changed their normal rate for a call to a UK landline
number. Have I understood that right?

There are two kinds:

The pseudo-landline providers to whom you (usually) pay a monthly fee and
you get a number for incoming calls. To do that you want to be logged in
all the time you might receive calls. Many people plug these into some kind
of hardware phone or mobile app so you don't have to have your laptop on at
all times. Obviously outbound calls are also possible, like any normal
phone.

The 'calling credit' providers who provide something a bit similar to those
calling cards in newsagents windows: Xp per minute to destination Y, buying
credit in lumps of 10 pounds (or whatever). They only do outbound calls,
but can often join two outbounds together to use a phone near to you as your
end instead of the internet. For these you only need to login/run the app
when you want to make a call.


If you don't need to receive incoming calls the latter are usually cheaper.
VOIP is international: you don't need a UK company to give you a UK number
if you want one.

Although a UK SIP provider will probably give you one by default.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 25/10/2017 01:09, Kit Jackson wrote:
I am currently in New Zealand and would like to call people in the UK. I
have an ASUS laptop running 32 bit Debian 9 and a Huawei phone running
Android 4.4.2 with a New Zeland phone chip. I generally have wifi access.

I can ask people I phone regularly to install some software at their end
but I also want to make phone calls to regular UK landline numbers and UK
mobile phones and of course the cost of calls is a factor. Can you
suggest what software to get please? Skype is an obvious possibility but
you seem to have to give your life history to Microsoft to sign up and
the Linux version seems to be 64 bit only.

Finally if the software could record the conversation that would be an
advantage but not essential.

Thanks.

Probably the easiest way is to install Skype on your phone. Skype to
Skype calls are free. Create an account, and put a few £'s in it for the
cases where you need to call someone who doesn't use it. Calls are
pennies/minute.

On Wed, 25 Oct 2017 12:41:46 +0100, Graham. wrote:


Half the reason I kept it is (a) it's cheap and (b) It's a landline
number. Especially since we ditched the fixed landline it's useful to be
able to put on forms. Even though geographically it's "wrong" ....


A couple of things worth mentioning about Sipgate Basic.

Firstly it's not as useful as it once was for setting up ad hoc
geographic numbers, because of the extra red tape they introduced about
a year ago.
Whereas the number used to be activated immediately, now you have to
submit a UK postal address and wait for the Royal Mail to deliver an
activation code. Also the address you give is recorded as your location
for 999 purposes. Not always helpful given the nature of VoIP, but there
it is.

Also Sipgate is expensive IMHO, contrast 10p/min for calling a UK mobile
with 0.3p/min with my recommendation of
https://www.discountvoip.co.uk/calling_rates/

Yes, there's a huge difference in price - 0.1p/min to call landlines from
Discountvoip and 0.3p/min to call mobiles compared to Sipgate costing 1p/
min to landlines and 9p/min to mobiles. How do Discountvoip do it? Is
the quality of the call that's not so good?

Do you know what controls the quality of calls anyway? Is it the
application on the Android or is the provider the call goes through?
Discountvoip seems to use an app called MobileVOIP. Is this just another
Android program like Zoiper or CSipSimple? Can any of these Android apps
be used with any SIP provider or are there some restrictions?

On 27 Oct 2017 06:22:51 GMT, Kit Jackson wrote:

A couple of things worth mentioning about Sipgate Basic.

Whereas the number used to be activated immediately, now you have
to
submit a UK postal address and wait for the Royal Mail to deliver
an
activation code. Also the address you give is recorded ...

Not overly surprising, easy to get, hard to trace, phone numbers are
very useful to drug dealers to international terrorists

Yes, there's a huge difference in price - 0.1p/min to call landlines
from Discountvoip and 0.3p/min to call mobiles compared to Sipgate
costing 1p/ min to landlines and 9p/min to mobiles.

Sipgate at 1p/9p minute is still a damn sight cheaper than BT and
there isn't a connection charge plus the per minute cost.

How do Discountvoip do it? Is the quality of the call that's not so
good?

Gawd knows but it's either a hook to catch you on then sell other
services or they scrimp on servers and/or size of the pipes.

Can any of these Android apps be used with any SIP provider or are there
some restrictions?

Should be able to if you can get the server names, IP address's,
ports etc to use. VOIP can be a bit tricky to set up particulary if
you are running it behind NAT.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 27/10/2017 18:18, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On 27 Oct 2017 06:22:51 GMT, Kit Jackson wrote:

A couple of things worth mentioning about Sipgate Basic.

Whereas the number used to be activated immediately, now you have
to
submit a UK postal address and wait for the Royal Mail to deliver
an
activation code. Also the address you give is recorded ...

Not overly surprising, easy to get, hard to trace, phone numbers are
very useful to drug dealers to international terrorists

Yes, there's a huge difference in price - 0.1p/min to call landlines
from Discountvoip and 0.3p/min to call mobiles compared to Sipgate
costing 1p/ min to landlines and 9p/min to mobiles.

Sipgate at 1p/9p minute is still a damn sight cheaper than BT and
there isn't a connection charge plus the per minute cost.

That depends on if you go for a flat rate calling package though. If you
make a fair number of calls, then stumping up a few extra quid on rental
for "free" local and national calls can swing it the other way.

How do Discountvoip do it? Is the quality of the call that's not so
good?

It certainly poorer than a good landline connection, and not as good as
a resonable mobile one. However its usable from my limited experience
with someone who used it.


Gawd knows but it's either a hook to catch you on then sell other
services or they scrimp on servers and/or size of the pipes.

Can any of these Android apps be used with any SIP provider or are there
some restrictions?

Many of the VoIP apps are affilated to the same parent company (Delmont
IIRC) and you can chose which "flavour" you are using from a drop down.
You can also usually configure manually. Some handsets also support VoIP
natively.


Should be able to if you can get the server names, IP address's,
ports etc to use. VOIP can be a bit tricky to set up particulary if
you are running it behind NAT.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Fri, 27 Oct 2017 20:42:57 +0100, John Rumm wrote:

Sipgate at 1p/9p minute is still a damn sight cheaper than BT and
there isn't a connection charge plus the per minute cost.

That depends on if you go for a flat rate calling package though. If you
make a fair number of calls,

We don't have a phone glued to an ear like some people seem to have.
SWMBO'd uses it the most and a £10 SIPGate top-up lasts her at least
6 months...

How do Discountvoip do it? Is the quality of the call that's not
so
good?

It certainly poorer than a good landline connection, and not as good as
a resonable mobile one. However its usable from my limited experience
with someone who used it.

"... not as good as a reasonable mobile ..." flipin 'eck that's BAD!

SIPGate VOIP here is better than the landline (3 km of twisted pair
means the level is a bit low and the bandwidth is lower). It knocks
the socks of all mobile calls, much less delay and no Donald Duck
codec artifacts. Just occasionally it'll suffer lost packets but that
just produces holes, not donald duck. Such packet loss is normally
down to some one else using the 'net.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 29/10/2017 01:14, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 27 Oct 2017 20:42:57 +0100, John Rumm wrote:

Sipgate at 1p/9p minute is still a damn sight cheaper than BT and
there isn't a connection charge plus the per minute cost.

That depends on if you go for a flat rate calling package though. If you
make a fair number of calls,

We don't have a phone glued to an ear like some people seem to have.
SWMBO'd uses it the most and a £10 SIPGate top-up lasts her at least
6 months...

How do Discountvoip do it? Is the quality of the call that's not
so
good?

It certainly poorer than a good landline connection, and not as good as
a resonable mobile one. However its usable from my limited experience
with someone who used it.

"... not as good as a reasonable mobile ..." flipin 'eck that's BAD!

Depends on the mobile call - I get some where it seems to switch into a
almost "hifi" mode, and the voice quality is far superior to a normal
3Khz telephony channel. However that only happens mobile to mobile, and
both parties need to be in the "right" place.

Given decent broadband the (discount) voip is ok - however in a poor or
congested link then its less usable IME (more drop outs, delay, breakup etc)

SIPGate VOIP here is better than the landline (3 km of twisted pair
means the level is a bit low and the bandwidth is lower). It knocks
the socks of all mobile calls, much less delay and no Donald Duck
codec artifacts.

Full fat voip using a sip provider is better than the discount
international voip services, and as you day can be better than
conventional land line (as can skype etc)

Just occasionally it'll suffer lost packets but that
just produces holes, not donald duck. Such packet loss is normally
down to some one else using the 'net.

You can mitigate that a bit if you have a router that can traffic
prioritise, or reserve bandwidth for voip.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sun, 29 Oct 2017 17:55:36 +0000, John Rumm wrote:

"... not as good as a reasonable mobile ..." flipin 'eck that's
BAD!

Depends on the mobile call - I get some where it seems to switch into a
almost "hifi" mode, and the voice quality is far superior to a normal
3Khz telephony channel. However that only happens mobile to mobile, and
both parties need to be in the "right" place.

And have the "right sort of phone" that supports than mode. In my
experience calls involving a mobile are normally hard work with the
delay, dropouts and codec artifacts.

Just occasionally it'll suffer lost packets but that just produces

holes, not donald duck. Such packet loss is normally down to some
one
else using the 'net.

You can mitigate that a bit if you have a router that can traffic
prioritise, or reserve bandwidth for voip.

My ISP allows some bandwidth to be reserved but I think that is based
on packet size rather than any packet inspection. Having thought
about it a bit I suspect it's the "storm" of small DNS lookup packets
that occurs when some one loads a new (uncached) page. File downloads
that are effectively filling the pipe don't mess up the VoIP, but
they will be using packets of maximum size.

--
Cheers
Dave.