I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.


--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Michael Chare wrote:

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.

Have an ask on vwaf.co.uk if anyone near you has a VCDS cable, of course
you need to let them know exactly what model of box has been fitted to
what make, model and year of car ... as an example ...

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Trailer_Hitch_Retrofitting_(4L)

Andy Burns wrote:

of course you need to let them know exactly what model of box has
been fitted to what make, model and year of car
List of cars known to the software

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Retrofitting#Trailer_Hitch_Retrofitting

On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.



I fitted the Vauxhaul one and it worked without reprogramming the car.
It was also cheaper than the after market ones from witter and the likes.

On 07/08/2017 20:27, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.

Have an ask on vwaf.co.uk if anyone near you has a VCDS cable, of course
you need to let them know exactly what model of box has been fitted to
what make, model and year of car ... as an example ...

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Trailer_Hitch_Retrofitting_(4L)

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

Not only would I need a tool to do the job I would also need to know
exactly what to do. It does not appear to be obvious.

All the previous vehicles I have owned have been much easier to deal
with when it comes to fitting tow bar electrics. The last VW car was the
easiest. I just removed the plug from the rear light cluster and plugged
it into the tow bar electrics harness, then put a plug from the harness
into the light cluster socket. Same both sides, found a location for
some small box and connected the socket itself.

--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Michael Chare wrote:

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

What's the car? Is the "box" an OEM part or 3rd party?

On 07/08/2017 21:12, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

What's the car? Is the "box" an OEM part or 3rd party?

The car is a VW Passat B8 and the box is made by Westfalia who also make
diagnostic equipment.

--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

"Michael Chare" wrote in message
news
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a box
which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage said
this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a place
which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long?

Because its ****ed by design.

I was thinking that it would just be a five minute job clicking a few
screens.

I was considering getting another VW sometime. Wont be doing that now.

"Michael Chare" wrote in message
news
On 07/08/2017 21:12, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

What's the car? Is the "box" an OEM part or 3rd party?

The car is a VW Passat B8 and the box is made by Westfalia who also make
diagnostic equipment.

Likely thats the problem, you chose not to use what VW makes for that.

In message , Michael Chare
writes
I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who
sold me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

All I know is that when looking for the s/h car I just bought, I read up
about towbar electrics, felt increasingly alarmed and walked away from
cars with no towbars already fitted.

It's a can (bus?) of worms. I was advised to tell my insurance company
that my previous Jeep came with a towbar. The young lady looked it up,
said "That's odd" and told me the premium would be reduced.
--
Bill

On Monday, August 7, 2017 at 9:06:49 PM UTC+1, Michael Chare wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:27, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.

Have an ask on vwaf.co.uk if anyone near you has a VCDS cable, of course
you need to let them know exactly what model of box has been fitted to
what make, model and year of car ... as an example ...

http://wiki.ross-tech.com/wiki/index.php/Trailer_Hitch_Retrofitting_(4L)

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

Not only would I need a tool to do the job I would also need to know
exactly what to do. It does not appear to be obvious.

All the previous vehicles I have owned have been much easier to deal
with when it comes to fitting tow bar electrics. The last VW car was the
easiest. I just removed the plug from the rear light cluster and plugged
it into the tow bar electrics harness, then put a plug from the harness
into the light cluster socket. Same both sides, found a location for
some small box and connected the socket itself.


I fitted generic relays (road lights and fridge/battery charger) to my Passat B6, expecting all sorts of complaints from the CANBUS system, or problems with the electronic handbrake, but I seem to have got away with it, the B6 possibly being less sophisticated than the B8. I'm certainly not going to let the local dealer charge me £50 for the privilege.

Michael Chare wrote:

The car is a VW Passat B8 and the box is made by Westfalia who also make
diagnostic equipment.

I'd be tempted to let a Westfalia dealer do the coding then, they may
charge you for an hour, but I expect it's about 2 minutes work for
anyone with the kit

https://www.westfalia-automotive.com/uk/products/wiring-kits/wiring-kit-coding/

Probably reading the manual takes the time... grin.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Michael Chare" wrote in message
news
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a box
which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage said
this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a place
which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be a
five minute job clicking a few screens.


--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On 08/08/2017 07:34, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

The car is a VW Passat B8 and the box is made by Westfalia who also make
diagnostic equipment.

I'd be tempted to let a Westfalia dealer do the coding then, they may
charge you for an hour, but I expect it's about 2 minutes work for
anyone with the kit

https://www.westfalia-automotive.com/uk/products/wiring-kits/wiring-kit-coding/


I have arranged to take it to them. They did say half an hour £50 inc vat.

--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.


It doesn't. I've done it for someone. About 15 Min, including booting
the laptop and looking up the coding.

Go to one of the VW forums, find a list of owners of VCDS
(http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/index.html) and ask one of them.

If you're anywhere near West Mids, I'll do it.

On 07/08/2017 23:25, Rod Speed wrote:


"Michael Chare" wrote in message
news
On 07/08/2017 21:12, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who
sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

What's the car? Is the "box" an OEM part or 3rd party?

The car is a VW Passat B8 and the box is made by Westfalia who also
make diagnostic equipment.

Likely thats the problem, you chose not to use what VW makes for that.

There's a good chance that Westfalia are the OEM for VW. They certainly
make many of the OE towbars.

On 07/08/2017 23:28, Bill wrote:
In message , Michael Chare
writes
I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who
sold me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

All I know is that when looking for the s/h car I just bought, I read up
about towbar electrics, felt increasingly alarmed and walked away from
cars with no towbars already fitted.

It's a can (bus?) of worms.

It really isn't. It's just a question of telling the CAN gateway that
there's a new node connected for the towbar electrics. Compared to the
messes I've seen where people bodge in traditional towbar electrics it's
much, much better.


I was advised to tell my insurance company
that my previous Jeep came with a towbar. The young lady looked it up,
said "That's odd" and told me the premium would be reduced.

Yes, apparently so.

On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just be
a five minute job clicking a few screens.


The coding alters things like:
Parking sensors display
Car Alarm - unplugging lighting board will trigger alarm if set.
ESP - changes settings for towing.
May change rear Foglight or Reversing light on car if one fitted to
Towing Board.

dennis@home has brought this to us :
I fitted the Vauxhaul one and it worked without reprogramming the car.
It was also cheaper than the after market ones from witter and the likes.

It maybe depends on the complexity. My BMW version is quite
sophisticated. It constantly checks every trailer lamp and identifies
on a text/graphics display, any which fail, disables the fog lights on
the car and the reversing sensors and I understand modifies the road
holding slightly. The reverse sensors are also supposed to allow for
the extra few inches which the tow ball sticks out beyond the rear
bumper.

On 08/08/2017 08:48, Chris Bartram wrote:
On 07/08/2017 23:25, Rod Speed wrote:


"Michael Chare" wrote in message
news
On 07/08/2017 21:12, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

I am beginning to think taking the car to pfjones in Manchester who
sold
me the Westfalia electrics might not be such a bad idea.

What's the car? Is the "box" an OEM part or 3rd party?

The car is a VW Passat B8 and the box is made by Westfalia who also
make diagnostic equipment.

Likely thats the problem, you chose not to use what VW makes for that.

There's a good chance that Westfalia are the OEM for VW. They certainly
make many of the OE towbars.

The vauxhall one I fitted looked identical to some of the after market
ones but it was half the price and worked without any programming to be
done.

I have full computer monitoring of the trailer lights, etc.

IIRC it cost me £85 less trade, it was so easy to fit that guy who did
the towbar didn't charge me.

On 08/08/2017 10:19, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
dennis@home has brought this to us :
I fitted the Vauxhaul one and it worked without reprogramming the car.
It was also cheaper than the after market ones from witter and the likes.

It maybe depends on the complexity. My BMW version is quite
sophisticated. It constantly checks every trailer lamp and identifies on
a text/graphics display, any which fail, disables the fog lights on the
car and the reversing sensors and I understand modifies the road holding
slightly. The reverse sensors are also supposed to allow for the extra
few inches which the tow ball sticks out beyond the rear bumper.

Yep, does all that except I don't have any sensors other than the mark
one eyeballs.

On 08/08/2017 12:33, Chris Bartram wrote:

CAN itself isn't. I'd guess that your car (and Harry's) probably have
some of the logic built into the existing body ECU that handles it. What
car, out of interest?

Astra J

Brian Reay has brought this to us :
Another option for CANBUS vehicles is one of the 'relay'units (note the
quotes) which isolate the towing electrics from the vehicle.

They detect when, for example, the rear lights are on and turn on the towing
lights.

They don't interfere with the main vehicle.

I fitted one to my CANBUS vehicle and it worked fine.

...and are cheap, but you lose all of the added value of having a
can-bus system, at least that for your rear end lighting.

You can get the 'relay' units for around £20-£25. I chose to pay the
£140 and got the proper can-bus equipment. It does so much more, plus
the peace of mind knowing your trailer lights are working before you
set off and on router - it was worth the extra.

On 08/08/2017 09:08, Robert wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just
be a five minute job clicking a few screens.


The coding alters things like:
Parking sensors display

Yes, I'd forgetten that- it recalibrates them for the extra length.

Car Alarm - unplugging lighting board will trigger alarm if set.
ESP - changes settings for towing.
May change rear Foglight or Reversing light on car if one fitted to
Towing Board.

On 08/08/2017 08:26, Chris Bartram wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just
be a five minute job clicking a few screens.


It doesn't. I've done it for someone. About 15 Min, including booting
the laptop and looking up the coding.

Go to one of the VW forums, find a list of owners of VCDS
(http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/index.html) and ask one of them.

If you're anywhere near West Mids, I'll do it.

Thank you for the offer. I have booked it in now at wfjones. What kit do
you have to this sort of job. I have been tempted to buy something.


--
Michael Chare

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On 08/08/2017 14:38, Michael Chare wrote:
On 08/08/2017 08:26, Chris Bartram wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just
be a five minute job clicking a few screens.


It doesn't. I've done it for someone. About 15 Min, including booting
the laptop and looking up the coding.

Go to one of the VW forums, find a list of owners of VCDS
(http://www.ross-tech.com/vag-com/index.html) and ask one of them.

If you're anywhere near West Mids, I'll do it.

Thank you for the offer. I have booked it in now at wfjones. What kit do
you have to this sort of job. I have been tempted to buy something.


VCDS- see link above. You can buy it from the likes of Gendan. It's
useful if you have multiple VAG cars like I do, and even more so if you
do your own servicing.

http://www.gendan.co.uk/

It happens that Michael Chare formulated :
I could have done that and the parts would have been cheaper, however as the
rear light units are LED and are connected to the CAN bus what looked like
the cables for the power are thin and probably not thick enough to carry the
current for the incandescent trailer light bulbs.
I would have to have run additional cables from the front of the car, a job
that that solution would otherwise have avoided.

Even fitting the BMW can-bus unit, I had to run a new main feed for
current supply to the for the extra lighting and run a thin data cable
to enable the extra can-bus monitoring.

On 08/08/17 12:52, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Brian Reay has brought this to us :
Another option for CANBUS vehicles is one of the 'relay'units (note
the quotes) which isolate the towing electrics from the vehicle.

They detect when, for example, the rear lights are on and turn on the
towing lights.

They don't interfere with the main vehicle.

I fitted one to my CANBUS vehicle and it worked fine.

..and are cheap, but you lose all of the added value of having a can-bus
system, at least that for your rear end lighting.

You can get the 'relay' units for around £20-£25. I chose to pay the
£140 and got the proper can-bus equipment. It does so much more, plus
the peace of mind knowing your trailer lights are working before you set
off and on router - it was worth the extra.

You are, of course, correct, you 'get what you pay for'.


We spend a few minutes checking the lights etc. after 'hitching up', it
gives the XYL something to do ;-) I suppose we wouldn't know if we
'lost' a rear tail bulb enroute but the 'relay' (I can't recall the
correct name) option does give an indication the indicators are working-
that is required by law (in the UK).

Brian Reay wrote :
We spend a few minutes checking the lights etc. after 'hitching up', it gives
the XYL something to do ;-) I suppose we wouldn't know if we 'lost' a rear
tail bulb enroute but the 'relay' (I can't recall the correct name) option
does give an indication the indicators are working- that is required by law
(in the UK).

That was a requirement going back to I think the 1960's.

When I first installed mine, I still continued the routine of checking
the trailer lights were working, before driving away - until I carried
out tests and realised it was completely unnecessary. It even flags up
a slightly dodgy connection.

Michael Chare wrote:

I have arranged to take it to them. They did say half an hour £50 inc vat.

Well for an £1850 box they have to have and £250/year to keep it
working, and a bloke's time, it's not so bad.

Chris Bartram wrote:

Bill wrote:

I was advised to tell my insurance company
that my previous Jeep came with a towbar. The young lady looked it up,
said "That's odd" and told me the premium would be reduced.

Yes, apparently so.

But the car's eventual resale value will be lower

In message , Chris Bartram
writes
On 08/08/2017 09:08, Robert wrote:
The coding alters things like:
Parking sensors display

Yes, I'd forgetten that- it recalibrates them for the extra length.

How on earth does it do that? I thought it would just turn them off.

My 2 likely trailers on the Range Rover are about 22' and 6'
respectively.

How does it know (admittedly I haven't tried yet so maybe it brings up a
question?)?
--
Bill

On 08/08/2017 18:48, Andy Burns wrote:
Michael Chare wrote:

I have arranged to take it to them. They did say half an hour £50 inc
vat.

Well for an £1850 box they have to have and £250/year to keep it
working, and a bloke's time, it's not so bad.

What a rip-off. Cost me £20 for a lead to connect my laptop to my
Vauxhall Zafira and came complete with a link to download software. Less
than 10 minutes for me to enable and configure the trailer lights
interface and enable cruise control (just had to plug in a different
stalk and enable it in three locations).

SteveW

On 07/08/2017 20:59, dennis@home wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just
be a five minute job clicking a few screens.



I fitted the Vauxhaul one and it worked without reprogramming the car.
It was also cheaper than the after market ones from witter and the likes.

If it is similar to the one for my Zafira, it will work when just
plugged in, but it won't adjust the stability control for towing when a
trailer is plugged in or check all the trailer lights every few seconds
instead of just the indicators when used, without enabling those
software options.

SteveW

On 08/08/2017 19:07, Steve Walker wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:59, dennis@home wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just
be a five minute job clicking a few screens.



I fitted the Vauxhaul one and it worked without reprogramming the car.
It was also cheaper than the after market ones from witter and the likes.

If it is similar to the one for my Zafira, it will work when just
plugged in, but it won't adjust the stability control for towing when a
trailer is plugged in or check all the trailer lights every few seconds
instead of just the indicators when used, without enabling those
software options.

SteveW

Ah, forgot. I think disabling rear parking sensors when a trailer is
plugged in is also a selectable option.

SteveW

Bill wrote:

Chris Bartram wrote:

Robert wrote:

The coding alters things like: Parking sensors display

Yes, I'd forgetten that- it recalibrates them for the extra length.

How on earth does it do that? I thought it would just turn them off.

Presumably when towing it turns them off, but when *not* towing it
allows a few extra inches to stop you ramming stuff with the towball

Steve Walker wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

Well for an £1850 box they have to have and £250/year to keep it
working, and a bloke's time, it's not so bad.

What a rip-off. Cost me £20 for a lead to connect my laptop

Well, that's why I started off suggesting finding someone who has a VCDS
lead, I've done tweaks to my car with mine, and enabled extra
functionality (such as dual SIM for phone/satnav) for a few locals,
usually people pay "a drink or two" ...

"Bill" wrote in message
...
In message , Chris Bartram
writes
On 08/08/2017 09:08, Robert wrote:
The coding alters things like:
Parking sensors display

Yes, I'd forgetten that- it recalibrates them for the extra length.

How on earth does it do that? I thought it would just turn them off.

My 2 likely trailers on the Range Rover are about 22' and 6' respectively.

How does it know (admittedly I haven't tried yet so maybe it brings up a
question?)?

A well designed trailer tells it how long it is.

On 08/08/2017 19:07, Steve Walker wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:59, dennis@home wrote:
On 07/08/2017 20:20, Michael Chare wrote:
I have fitted tow bar electrics to my VW car. The electrics include a
box which is connect to the CAN bus.

To work properly the car has to be re-programmed. A local VW garage
said this would take an hour, based on recent past experience. Even a
place which specialised in this work said it would take half an hour.

Why on earth does it take so long? I was thinking that it would just
be a five minute job clicking a few screens.



I fitted the Vauxhaul one and it worked without reprogramming the car.
It was also cheaper than the after market ones from witter and the likes.

If it is similar to the one for my Zafira, it will work when just
plugged in, but it won't adjust the stability control for towing when a
trailer is plugged in or check all the trailer lights every few seconds
instead of just the indicators when used, without enabling those
software options.


It certainly checks the lights as it has informed me of a fault while
driving.

I don't know about the stability program, the computer tells me a
trailer has been connected.

On 08/08/17 18:50, Bill wrote:
In message , Chris Bartram
writes
On 08/08/2017 09:08, Robert wrote:
The coding alters things like:
Parking sensors display

Yes, I'd forgetten that- it recalibrates them for the extra length.

How on earth does it do that? I thought it would just turn them off.

My 2 likely trailers on the Range Rover are about 22' and 6' respectively.

How does it know (admittedly I haven't tried yet so maybe it brings up a
question?)?
Sorry, I was unclear.The extra length of the car with the towbar.