I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume
I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I
de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem, but
this won't be for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)

On 24/05/2017 20:18, wrote:
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume
I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I
de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem, but
this won't be for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)

Any acid should do - vinegar, eco-friendly cleaner

Article Source: http://EzineArticles.com/5413223



--
mailto: news {at} admac {dot] myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

Wrote in message:
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume
I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I
de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem, but
this won't be for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)


Citric acid.
Crystals on eBay as cheap as.
Hot water in bucket add some crystals dissolve.
pour sufficient in the bog.
Leave to fizz overnight say, repeat as necessary.

Septic tank should be ok & at worst repopulated w bacteria
quickly... with use....
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 24/05/17 20:18, wrote:
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume
I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I
de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem, but
this won't be for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)

You can use all of the above.

Fundamentally once everything is clean adjust PH with some brick acid or
some caustic sodafa, whichever.

Or simply run plenty of water through.

The bugs will return.

--
"It is an established fact to 97% confidence limits that left wing
conspirators see right wing conspiracies everywhere"

On 24/05/2017 20:18, wrote:
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume
I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I
de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

You can use brick acid - just get it approximately neutral again by
adding sodium carbonate or bicarbonate before flushing it away.

What you mustn't do is use chlorine bleach - that will kill the bugs. If
all else fails drop a dead hen in the septic tank to restart it.

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem, but
this won't be for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)

A rainwater sump might be a better option for toilet flushing.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

wrote in message ...
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard water area that
has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume I can't use brick acid, Harpic
toilet "pills", or similar so how do I de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem, but this won't be
for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)

With reference to your "can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills"" presumably
this is because you can't allow the resulting liquid to go past the S bend into
the tank.

What's been suggested on here before, although I've never tried
it myself, is to block the bend with an inflated balloon pushing it as far round the
bend as you can. But not so far that you won't be able to puncture it
easily afterwords.

And then apply a concentrated solution of your remedy of
choice to the remaining water. Depending on how long you can leave this
solution in place will probably govern how easy it is to remove the stain in
each case. So that it may need more than one application.

Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams

....

On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message ...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier. If using brick acid,
neutralise with washing soda or ammonia first.

On 2017-05-25, Martin Brown wrote:

On 24/05/2017 20:18, wrote:
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I presume
I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so how do I
de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

You can use brick acid - just get it approximately neutral again by
adding sodium carbonate or bicarbonate before flushing it away.

What you mustn't do is use chlorine bleach - that will kill the bugs. If
all else fails drop a dead hen in the septic tank to restart it.

"voodoo plumbing"

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message ...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier.

First buy your wet and dry vaccuum cleaner.

And in any case this was an observation about baling
out toilets in general.

As from my admittedly limited experience of bailing out toilets
I'm much happier consigning the results to a bucket which can
be flushed away immediately, rather than the inside of a vaccuum
cleaner.


michael adams

....

On 25/05/2017 09:43, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 24/05/17 20:18, wrote:
I'm new to Septic tanks and have recently moved to a house in a hard
water area that has 5 toilets, all of which are badly stained. I
presume I can't use brick acid, Harpic toilet "pills", or similar so
how do I de-scale the loo? With a wooden scraper?

(A water softener is going to be in my future to solve the problem,
but this won't be for at least 6 months and I need to de-scale them now)

You can use all of the above.


We lived with a septic tank for 20 years and never worried about what
was flushed down it. It was never of any concern other than having it
emptied every other year.

Mike

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message ...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier.

First buy your wet and dry vaccuum cleaner.

And in any case this was an observation about baling
out toilets in general.

As from my admittedly limited experience of bailing out toilets
I'm much happier consigning the results to a bucket which can
be flushed away immediately, rather than the inside of a vaccuum
cleaner.


michael adams


Do you have a septic tank?

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message ...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the
water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier.

First buy your wet and dry vaccuum cleaner.

And in any case this was an observation about baling
out toilets in general.

As from my admittedly limited experience of bailing out toilets
I'm much happier consigning the results to a bucket which can
be flushed away immediately, rather than the inside of a vaccuum
cleaner.


michael adams


Do you have a septic tank?

Er no.

The point was to prevent chemicals used to soften the
scale from being flushed into the septic tank. These
are also the sort of chemicals which I wouldn't
necessarily want to sit inside a wet and dry vaccum
cleaner. Not without having to check various labels
spec sheets and disclaimers. A bucket costing 90 p
can be emptied outside over the soil.


michael adams

....

On 25/05/2017 15:44, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message ...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the
water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier.

First buy your wet and dry vaccuum cleaner.

And in any case this was an observation about baling
out toilets in general.

As from my admittedly limited experience of bailing out toilets
I'm much happier consigning the results to a bucket which can
be flushed away immediately, rather than the inside of a vaccuum
cleaner.

Do you have a septic tank?

Er no.

The point was to prevent chemicals used to soften the
scale from being flushed into the septic tank. These
are also the sort of chemicals which I wouldn't
necessarily want to sit inside a wet and dry vaccum
cleaner. Not without having to check various labels
spec sheets and disclaimers. A bucket costing 90 p
can be emptied outside over the soil.

Typically a wet and dry vac is a plastic bucket with a sucking thing on
top. So it'll be fine.
The cheap Titan one we got from Screwfix (or is it Toolsatan?) does very
well for that sort of job.

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:


Do you have a septic tank?

Er no.


Mmm thought not ;-)

The point was to prevent chemicals used to soften the
scale from being flushed into the septic tank.

Presume you mean dissolve, not soften?

Er no. Using chemicals makes it easier to remove the
limescale.

It still requires manual intervention, i.e. scraping.

Only not as vigorously.

It only dissolves it in the adverts.

You put it in. Come back two hours later, or overnight.

Flush the bog and its gone. In your dreams.


Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid or bleach seems a trifle ott.

The OP thought otherwise, and rather than seek to question
the basic assumptions on which his question was based, I provided
a solution which met his requirements.

I hardly feel that sticking a balloon down each of the 5
bogs he needs to initially clean will present any great
hardship. Do you ?



michael adams

....

"Clive George" wrote in message
o.uk...

Typically a wet and dry vac is a plastic bucket with a sucking thing on top. So it'll
be fine.
The cheap Titan one we got from Screwfix (or is it Toolsatan?) does very well for that
sort of job.

Screwfix, cheers. Although I don't really have a use for one, at £39.99
they're almost giving the things away as a back up for the dry vac.,
if nothing else.

michael adams

....

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"newshound" wrote in message
...
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message ...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost all of the
water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier.

First buy your wet and dry vaccuum cleaner.

And in any case this was an observation about baling
out toilets in general.

As from my admittedly limited experience of bailing out toilets
I'm much happier consigning the results to a bucket which can
be flushed away immediately, rather than the inside of a vaccuum
cleaner.


michael adams


Do you have a septic tank?

Er no.


Mmm thought not ;-)

The point was to prevent chemicals used to soften the
scale from being flushed into the septic tank.

Presume you mean dissolve, not soften?

Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid or bleach seems a trifle ott.


Get the bogs cleaned, bleach em once in a while if you want and
just get it flushed (& further diluted). The tank will cope fine
& is constantly brewing appropriate bacteria to do its evil
deeds.


--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

The OP is new to septic tanks & you have no experience of them....
A little knowledge...... :-)

Possibly the OP has been swayed by all the information
avalailable on the net advising him against disturbing
the delicate balance existing in his septic tank by
introducing too much acid, and the possibly highly
unpleasant consequences should this balance be
disturbed.

For the sensitive nose of a townie at least. People with
muckspreaders operating within 200 yards of their
houses as part of their daily lives, may feel
differently I suppose.



I hardly feel that sticking a balloon down each of the 5
bogs he needs to initially clean will present any great
hardship. Do you ?

And baling them out afterwards :-(

Not when using his newly acquired £39.99 wet and dry vac
from Screwfix it isn't. Its almost a pleasure.


Compared to leaving acidic solutions in bogs overnight & flushing
the next day/or so? Mmm tough choices..... :-)

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank. Those microbes will just lap it all up.

Fair enough, I'll take your word for it. Having no intention
myself of ever owning a septic tank.





michael adams

....

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:


Do you have a septic tank?

Er no.


Mmm thought not ;-)

The point was to prevent chemicals used to soften the
scale from being flushed into the septic tank.

Presume you mean dissolve, not soften?

Er no. Using chemicals makes it easier to remove the
limescale.

Depends on the chemicals....

It still requires manual intervention, i.e. scraping.

Only not as vigorously.

Not here.

It only dissolves it in the adverts.

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?

You put it in. Come back two hours later, or overnight.

Flush the bog and its gone. In your dreams.

Once it's done it's job I don't want it back YMMV.


Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid or bleach seems a trifle ott.

The OP thought otherwise, and rather than seek to question
the basic assumptions on which his question was based, I provided
a solution which met his requirements.


The OP is new to septic tanks & you have no experience of them....
A little knowledge...... :-)

I hardly feel that sticking a balloon down each of the 5
bogs he needs to initially clean will present any great
hardship. Do you ?

And baling them out afterwards :-(

Compared to leaving acidic solutions in bogs overnight & flushing
the next day/or so? Mmm tough choices..... :-)

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


michael adams

....

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

If you remember, I originally suggested that the application of
chemicals only softened the limescale and it would still be
necessary to remove some of it manually.

You objected to this and said no. It was possible to dissolve it
all.

Now please explain how you intend to dissolve the limescale on the
back of the bowl all the way down from the rim, such that no
scraping of any kind will be necessary, without filling the
bowl to the rim.


michael adams

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

....

On 25/05/2017 10:12, newshound wrote:
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message
...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial
if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost
all of the water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket
afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier. If using brick acid,
neutralise with washing soda or ammonia first.

Can you still get ammonia?

On 25/05/2017 23:00, jim wrote:
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

It would be so much easier if you just named the acid you were suggesting.

"jim" k wrote in message ...

Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did.

That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl.
The water flows down the back of the bowl from the rim
depositing tiny amounts of limescale as it does
so which build up over time.

I thought your solution to this problem, something which
will dissolve limescale overnight with no need for scraping
covered all typical situations. Not only your own where
apparently you only get limescale under the waterline.



michael adams

....








--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

I have.

Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted.

So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?


michael adams

....

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

The OP is new to septic tanks & you have no experience of them....
A little knowledge...... :-)

Possibly the OP has been swayed by all the information
avalailable on the net advising him against disturbing
the delicate balance existing in his septic tank by
introducing too much acid, and the possibly highly
unpleasant consequences should this balance be
disturbed.

The delicate balance of what?

For your info it's a 2500 litre tank of constantly moving raw
sewage, regularly topped up with distinctly non-stetile bacteria
in the **** from people's arseholes (& keyboards as applicable
;-) ) ... Delicate balance ffs :-D

Go on Google the consequences & share them with us you
scaremongering bull****ter!?


For the sensitive nose of a townie at least. People with
muckspreaders operating within 200 yards of their
houses as part of their daily lives, may feel
differently I suppose.

More guesswork & assumptions.

I hardly feel that sticking a balloon down each of the 5
bogs he needs to initially clean will present any great
hardship. Do you ?

And baling them out afterwards :-(

Not when using his newly acquired £39.99 wet and dry vac
from Screwfix it isn't. Its almost a pleasure.


Get your kicks while you can :-)


Compared to leaving acidic solutions in bogs overnight & flushing
the next day/or so? Mmm tough choices..... :-)

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?


Fair enough, I'll take your word for it. Having no intention
myself of ever owning a septic tank.

But you now know a little more with which to refine the
"expertise" you profer to the next enquirer on a subject you have
no knowledge of & no intention of knowing about ;-)


--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

--

Why would someone (you) who has no knowledge or experience of
septic tanks be interested in advising someone else who hasn't
either?

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

If you remember, I originally suggested that the application of
chemicals only softened the limescale and it would still be
necessary to remove some of it manually.

You objected to this and said no. It was possible to dissolve it
all.

Now please explain how you intend to dissolve the limescale on the
back of the bowl all the way down from the rim, such that no
scraping of any kind will be necessary, without filling the
bowl to the rim.


michael adams




Coming thicker & faster now I note

--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

jim k Wrote in message:
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

If you remember, I originally suggested that the application of
chemicals only softened the limescale and it would still be
necessary to remove some of it manually.

You objected to this and said no. It was possible to dissolve it
all.

Now please explain how you intend to dissolve the limescale on the
back of the bowl all the way down from the rim, such that no
scraping of any kind will be necessary, without filling the
bowl to the rim.


michael adams




Coming thicker & faster now I note


Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did.
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

Fredxxx Wrote in message:
On 25/05/2017 10:12, newshound wrote:
On 5/25/2017 9:59 AM, michael adams wrote:
wrote in message
...


Using a sacrificial soup ladle or similar, (or maybe not sacrfifcial
if funds are
very tight, I suppose) its a fairly simple matter to bail out almost
all of the water
in the bottom of an S bend (and thus the toilet) into a bucket
afterwards if this
is thought necessary.


michael adams


A wet and dry vacuum cleaner is even easier. If using brick acid,
neutralise with washing soda or ammonia first.

Can you still get ammonia?


He imagines so.
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

Fredxxx Wrote in message:
On 25/05/2017 23:00, jim wrote:
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

It would be so much easier if you just named the acid you were suggesting.


You should read the thread too.
--
Jim K


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

On 25/05/2017 23:17, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

I have.

Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted.

So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

I think he's forgotten?

"Fredxxx" wrote in message news
On 25/05/2017 23:17, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message
o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

I have.

Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted.

So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

I think he's forgotten?

He should have stuck with the septic tanks and not allowed
himself to get sidetracked into a discussion of toilet
bowls and acid which are clearly his weaker points.


michael adams

....

On Thursday, 25 May 2017 20:47:05 UTC+1, michael adams wrote:

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls,

That's so dumb it warrants a repost just for the sake of it.

On Thursday, 25 May 2017 23:04:19 UTC+1, Fredxxx wrote:

Can you still get ammonia?

yep.


NT

"jim" k wrote in message .. .
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message ...

Who suggested the stains were "all the way" to the rim? Oh you did.

That's the usual pattern of staining in a lavatory bowl.
The water flows down the back of the bowl from the rim
depositing tiny amounts of limescale as it does
so which build up over time.

For you perhaps.


Not just for me.

Why did you snip the second paragraph I wonder ?

I thought your solution to this problem, something which
will dissolve limescale overnight with no need for scraping
covered all typical situations. Not only your own where
apparently you only get limescale under the waterline.

If only you'd stuck to the septic tank end of this
discussion you might have stood a better chance but
you allowed me to side track you into a discussion
of acids and toilet bowls which are clearly your
weak points.

So much so that you're now feigning amnesia and
a highly untypical pattern of limescale deposits
around your bowl


michael adams

....

wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 25 May 2017 20:47:05 UTC+1, michael adams wrote:

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls,

That's so dumb it warrants a repost just for the sake of it.


I know that you're still bitter about my showing that you totally
contradicted yourself in the pump action screwdriver thread*,
but you really shouldn't allow that bitterness to affect your judgement.

Had you actually taken the trouble to read the thread before jumping
out of your zimmer frame, you'd realise that the OP has insisted right
from the outset that the limescale will be totally dissolved without any
need for manual intervention. No scraping, no brushing, nothing. It will simply
flush away . That can't be achieved with a liquid such as the OP is
proposing using unless all the limescale is immersed.

Anyone else could use a gel which stuck to the back of the bowl
but the OP is denied that possibility by his previous insistence
on using his chemical of choice.



michael adams

*
wrote in message
...

I had a yankee and had no time for it. A hand drill is far better. A mains
drill 'leaves it for dead' when putting in screws, to borrow the idiot's
phrase.

wrote in message
...

The pump action sped them up. But you just can't power drive slotted
screws without the bit falling off repeatedly, and a manual screwdriver
gives more control.

So which did you use ?

The mains drill which left the Yankee "for dead" or the manual screwdriver because
the bit was "falling off repeatedly?


....

On Friday, 26 May 2017 00:04:53 UTC+1, michael adams wrote:
tabbypurr wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 25 May 2017 20:47:05 UTC+1, michael adams wrote:

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls,

That's so dumb it warrants a repost just for the sake of it.


I know that you're still bitter about my showing that you totally
contradicted yourself in the pump action screwdriver thread*,
but you really shouldn't allow that bitterness to affect your judgement.

lol

Had you actually taken the trouble to read the thread before jumping
out of your zimmer frame, you'd realise that the OP has insisted right
from the outset that the limescale will be totally dissolved without any
need for manual intervention. No scraping, no brushing, nothing. It will simply
flush away . That can't be achieved with a liquid such as the OP is
proposing using unless all the limescale is immersed.

Anyone else could use a gel which stuck to the back of the bowl
but the OP is denied that possibility by his previous insistence
on using his chemical of choice.



michael adams

*
tabbypurr wrote in message
...

I had a yankee and had no time for it. A hand drill is far better. A mains
drill 'leaves it for dead' when putting in screws, to borrow the idiot's
phrase.

tabbypurr wrote in message
...

The pump action sped them up. But you just can't power drive slotted
screws without the bit falling off repeatedly, and a manual screwdriver
gives more control.

So which did you use ?

The mains drill which left the Yankee "for dead" or the manual screwdriver because
the bit was "falling off repeatedly?

Boy are you clueless. It's Rod mark II


NT

On 25/05/2017 23:40, jim wrote:
Fredxxx Wrote in message:
On 25/05/2017 23:17, michael adams wrote:
"jim" k wrote in message ...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...
"michael adams" Wrote in message:

"jim" k wrote in message o.uk...

Right so just to be clear. Having blocked the S bend
with a balloon or similar in all 5 cases, the amount of brick
acid solution necessary to clean all 5 bowls, which will necessarily
have to be filled to near the brim to dissolve the limescale on
the backs of the bowls, will do no harm if released into
the septic tank.

Even if that is the issue, (rather than just your imagination of
it) anyone with a better imagination could think of far easier
ways than you apparently can.

I never said use hydrochloric acid did you?

You twice referred to acid which would dissolve limescale
if left overnight. The usual recommendation for this is
dilute hydrochloric acid which is usually referred to as brick
acid, if for no other reason than, it's easier to spell.

Your first reference

"Anyhoo given that a decent septic tank worth having probably has a
capacity of 2-2.5k litres+, all this fretting over a couple of
occasional litres of dilute acid"

"Your second reference in response to my statement that in adverts
for household limescale removers "It only dissolves it in the adverts."

I haven't seen adverts for acid - have you seen any?


Once again. (this time from your own attempt at proof) it is clear
*I* never suggested brick acid or hydrochloric acid. Who
did?

So what acid were you actually referring, to which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

If you remember it was you who insisted that this acid of your
choice actually dissolved the limescale, rather than softened
it, so that no scraping or other manual intervention was
necessary.

That's assuming that you or the other members of your household
do actually need to use this particular lavatory bowl at least
once a day, of course.


michael adams

...

Read the thread.

I have.

Your only references to acid were the two I've already quoted.

So what acid were you actually referring to, which is capable
of dissolving limescale overnight ?

I think he's forgotten?


I think you're being lazy.

No, just illustrating the onset of dementia.