The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Of course that same black ink would run if it got wet - even after drying
fully. And tended to go brown with age.

Modern inks seem more waterproof when dry - so would seem to be different
in some way.

Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

--
*A bartender is just a pharmacist with a limited inventory *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman wrote:

The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Have you tried the "photo black" ink cartridges (if they're available
for your printer)?

On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 13:29:35 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Of course that same black ink would run if it got wet - even after drying
fully. And tended to go brown with age.

Modern inks seem more waterproof when dry - so would seem to be different
in some way.

Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?

In article ,
Caecilius wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 13:29:35 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Of course that same black ink would run if it got wet - even after
drying fully. And tended to go brown with age.

Modern inks seem more waterproof when dry - so would seem to be
different in some way.

Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?

Yes - I'd got that far. Searching on pigment types suggested they may not
be suitable for all printers.

--
*Stable Relationships Are For Horses.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sunday, 29 January 2017 13:35:11 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

Yes, with a laser printer :-)

Owain

In article ,
wrote:
On Sunday, 29 January 2017 13:35:11 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

Yes, with a laser printer :-)

Not with the cheap one I've got here.

--
*He who laughs last, thinks slowest.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 07:28:54 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Sunday, 29 January 2017 13:35:11 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

Yes, with a laser printer :-)

Not for transparencies, Laser printers produce a not very dark gray.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
Caecilius wrote:
I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?

Yes - I'd got that far. Searching on pigment types suggested they may not
be suitable for all printers.

There may be a difference between inkjet printing (ultrasonically squirt ink
at paper) and bubblejet (boiling ink to steam ejects it) - I could imagine
that the squirting method is better for inks with pigments in. Canon and HP
use(d) bubblejet, while Epson use inkjet.

Epson used to be the go-to manufacturer for squirting things-other-than-ink.
I would have expected Epson to be better at pigmented inks, but you state
elsewhere the problem printer is an Epson. Maybe you have the wrong
cartridge?

Theo

"Peter Parry" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 07:28:54 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Sunday, 29 January 2017 13:35:11 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

Yes, with a laser printer :-)

Not for transparencies, Laser printers produce a not very dark gray.

Overlay a couple, works for me.

On 29-Jan-17 2:02 PM, Caecilius wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 13:29:35 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Of course that same black ink would run if it got wet - even after drying
fully. And tended to go brown with age.

Modern inks seem more waterproof when dry - so would seem to be different
in some way.

Possibly oil based, rather than water based. It is a while since I sold
printer inks and I forget which makers used which.

Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?


Pigment based inks give a denser colour but are also more expensive.
Hence, even if the manufacturer has decided to use pigment based inks,
some compatibles may use the cheaper dye based inks.

--
--

Colin Bignell

In article ,
Theo wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
Caecilius wrote:
I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?

Yes - I'd got that far. Searching on pigment types suggested they may
not be suitable for all printers.

There may be a difference between inkjet printing (ultrasonically squirt
ink at paper) and bubblejet (boiling ink to steam ejects it) - I could
imagine that the squirting method is better for inks with pigments in.
Canon and HP use(d) bubblejet, while Epson use inkjet.

Epson used to be the go-to manufacturer for squirting
things-other-than-ink. I would have expected Epson to be better at
pigmented inks, but you state elsewhere the problem printer is an Epson.
Maybe you have the wrong cartridge?

It's a four cartridge type. But then so was the one which worked well. I
am using none genuine ones now - but it was no better with the originals.

--
*How about "never"? Is "never" good for you?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...

In article ,
Theo wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
Caecilius wrote:
I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?

Yes - I'd got that far. Searching on pigment types suggested they may
not be suitable for all printers.

There may be a difference between inkjet printing (ultrasonically squirt
ink at paper) and bubblejet (boiling ink to steam ejects it) - I could
imagine that the squirting method is better for inks with pigments in.
Canon and HP use(d) bubblejet, while Epson use inkjet.

Epson used to be the go-to manufacturer for squirting
things-other-than-ink. I would have expected Epson to be better at
pigmented inks, but you state elsewhere the problem printer is an Epson.
Maybe you have the wrong cartridge?

It's a four cartridge type. But then so was the one which worked well. I
am using none genuine ones now - but it was no better with the originals.

Are you printing monochrome?
This any help?
http://www.indesignskills.com/skills...-black-black/#

In message , Chris Hogg
writes
Pigment based inks give a denser colour but are also more expensive.
Hence, even if the manufacturer has decided to use pigment based inks,
some compatibles may use the cheaper dye based inks.

Would there not also be a danger that pigment-based inks would be more
likely to dry out and block the jets than dye-based inks, i.e. a
pigment suspension versus a dye solution?
I suppose there is no chance this is a printer setting issue? When you
include paper type/quality, this adds up to about 10 options on my Epson
inkjet.


--
Tim Lamb

"Chris Hogg" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 17:00:45 +0000, Nightjar
wrote:

On 29-Jan-17 2:02 PM, Caecilius wrote:
On Sun, 29 Jan 2017 13:29:35 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced
a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Of course that same black ink would run if it got wet - even after
drying
fully. And tended to go brown with age.

Modern inks seem more waterproof when dry - so would seem to be
different
in some way.

Possibly oil based, rather than water based. It is a while since I sold
printer inks and I forget which makers used which.

Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

I think there are two types of ink: pigment-based and dye-based.
Perhaps the type generally used for black ink has changed over time?


Pigment based inks give a denser colour but are also more expensive.
Hence, even if the manufacturer has decided to use pigment based inks,
some compatibles may use the cheaper dye based inks.

Would there not also be a danger that pigment-based inks would be more
likely to dry out and block the jets than dye-based inks, i.e. a
pigment suspension versus a dye solution?

Yep, and the Epsons were notorious for being more of a problem in that
regard if they were only used quite rarely so they had more time to dry out.

In article ,
Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Chris Hogg
writes
Pigment based inks give a denser colour but are also more expensive.
Hence, even if the manufacturer has decided to use pigment based inks,
some compatibles may use the cheaper dye based inks.

Would there not also be a danger that pigment-based inks would be more
likely to dry out and block the jets than dye-based inks, i.e. a
pigment suspension versus a dye solution?
I suppose there is no chance this is a printer setting issue? When you
include paper type/quality, this adds up to about 10 options on my Epson
inkjet.

Think I've tried them all. But there aren't as many choices as on my
previous Canon - that did have one for transparencies. But still didn't
give as dense a black as the one before that.

--
*What happens when none of your bees wax? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

I was told that many recent inks actually look purple which is an issue we
used to get back in the days of inked ribbons.

I should not say back in the day, as it seems NHS still uses quite a lot of
dot matrix prinnters!

Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
The first inkjet colour printer I had - many many years ago - produced a
much denser black than later ones. Noticeable when producing
transparencies.

Of course that same black ink would run if it got wet - even after drying
fully. And tended to go brown with age.

Modern inks seem more waterproof when dry - so would seem to be different
in some way.

Is it possible to still get that nice dense black?

--
*A bartender is just a pharmacist with a limited inventory *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.