What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and moving
services to a fresh location?

I have found on-line suppliers of black duct, yellow pierced duct and
marking tapes but little further information.

The run is about 15m from existing supplies which are laid at around 18"
deep and about 12" separation with no tape.
--
Tim Lamb

In message , Tim Lamb
writes
What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and
moving services to a fresh location?

I have found on-line suppliers of black duct, yellow pierced duct and
marking tapes but little further information.

The run is about 15m from existing supplies which are laid at around
18" deep and about 12" separation with no tape.

Ah! I hadn't dug very far.

Gas 450mm, water 750mm, electric 600mm

Any further thoughts?


--
Tim Lamb

On 09-Dec-16 11:33 AM, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Tim Lamb
writes
What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and
moving services to a fresh location?

I have found on-line suppliers of black duct, yellow pierced duct and
marking tapes but little further information.

The run is about 15m from existing supplies which are laid at around
18" deep and about 12" separation with no tape.

Ah! I hadn't dug very far.

Gas 450mm, water 750mm, electric 600mm

Any further thoughts?



When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug trenches
in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each property. The
water company's contractor also used a mole to replace the service pipe
to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think the gas company likes
ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

--
--

Colin Bignell

On Friday, 9 December 2016 10:55:33 UTC, Tim Lamb wrote:
What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and moving
services to a fresh location?

They usually have the info buried deep within their website, often in the 'new connections' section.

Western Power Distribution say

We require a trench which is 530mm deep and 300mm wide along its whole length. You can only dig trenches on your own land.
The trench bottom should be level and free from any sharp stones or objects which may damage the service cable.
Our cables are normally laid directly into the trench so need to be reinstated with 75mm of stone dust. In some cases ducting can be laid in advance of the new supply, and this ducting can be obtained from your local WPD office.

Draw cords should be incorporated and the ends marked for ease of location. Trench depths in pavement or private land shall be 530mm (min. cover over cable 450mm) and in roadway shall be 600mm (min. cover 520mm). Where cables are not protected in duct they must be blinded with 75mm of crushed stone dust and approved yellow €œelectric cable€� marker tape laid above.

Without charge to WPD the Customer/Developer will, where agreed by prior
arrangement, install suitable 38mm internal diameter WPD approved tubing
from the service position to the footpath or verge etc. as shown on the plan.

Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't put gas
pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not gas and
water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains - apparently
someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire life has suggested
that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and contamination and/or
deteriation could occur.

Water mains needs 300mm of soil covering, then a blue polythene, wire
reinforced mesh (sold by the 100m roll) laying over, then backfilling

Huge wrote:
On 2016-12-09, Phil L wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't
put gas pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not
gas and water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains -
apparently someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire
life has suggested that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and
contamination and/or deteriation could occur.

Nonsense. It's because water in the gas mains is a nightmare to sort
out.

How is water going to get inside a pressurised gas pipe unless both are
leaking?

In message , Phil L
writes
Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't put gas
pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not gas and
water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains - apparently
someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire life has suggested
that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and contamination and/or
deteriation could occur.

Water mains needs 300mm of soil covering, then a blue polythene, wire
reinforced mesh (sold by the 100m roll) laying over, then backfilling

OK Phil. Somebody should have told the original groundworks
contractor:-)



--
Tim Lamb

On 09/12/16 17:30, Phil L wrote:
Huge wrote:
On 2016-12-09, Phil L wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't
put gas pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not
gas and water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains -
apparently someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire
life has suggested that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and
contamination and/or deteriation could occur.

Nonsense. It's because water in the gas mains is a nightmare to sort
out.

How is water going to get inside a pressurised gas pipe unless both are
leaking?



When paddy puts a digger through both at once?

On 09/12/2016 11:33, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Tim Lamb
writes
What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and
moving services to a fresh location?

I have found on-line suppliers of black duct, yellow pierced duct and
marking tapes but little further information.

The run is about 15m from existing supplies which are laid at around
18" deep and about 12" separation with no tape.

Ah! I hadn't dug very far.

Gas 450mm, water 750mm, electric 600mm

Any further thoughts?


Gas only needs to be that deep if it is unprotected. Under a concrete
path you can get away with less.

Water needs to be deep enough not to freeze, so 750mm seems a lot
for anywhere south of Northumberland.

Only electricity needs to be below spade depth, but it will be
armoured cable anyway.

On 09/12/2016 12:02, Nightjar wrote:
On 09-Dec-16 11:33 AM, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Tim Lamb
writes
What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and
moving services to a fresh location?

I have found on-line suppliers of black duct, yellow pierced duct and
marking tapes but little further information.

The run is about 15m from existing supplies which are laid at around
18" deep and about 12" separation with no tape.

Ah! I hadn't dug very far.

Gas 450mm, water 750mm, electric 600mm

Any further thoughts?



When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug trenches
in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each property. The
water company's contractor also used a mole to replace the service pipe
to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think the gas company likes
ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.


In about 1985 near East Grinstead in West Sussex, a contractor drove
his mole through both medium/high pressure gas and a water main.
The water pressure 'won' and people were surprised to see a water
feature coming out their gas hob for miles around.

Gas was cut off for miles around, and BG had to visit *every* property
and turn off their appliances and then return and purge them. If you
were out they just dug up your garden and/or pavement and chopped your
supply.

They brought gas engineers in from all over the country and Eire and
commandeered the (largish) carpark in one sussex village as their
Ops centre sorting the mess out.

On 09/12/2016 17:10, Huge wrote:
On 2016-12-09, Phil L wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't put gas
pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not gas and
water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains - apparently
someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire life has suggested
that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and contamination and/or
deteriation could occur.

Nonsense. It's because water in the gas mains is a nightmare to sort out.


See my comment above. I remember it well. Neighbour was an air hostess
and she came home to a cold house and a hole in her front garden where
BG had chopped and sealed her supply while she was over the Atlantic.

In article ,
Tim Lamb writes:
In message , Tim Lamb
writes
What do the electricity, gas and water companies require by way of
trench depth, separation of ducts, marking etc. for extending and
moving services to a fresh location?

I have found on-line suppliers of black duct, yellow pierced duct and
marking tapes but little further information.

The run is about 15m from existing supplies which are laid at around
18" deep and about 12" separation with no tape.

Ah! I hadn't dug very far.

Gas 450mm, water 750mm, electric 600mm

Any further thoughts?

For water, IME, that's only if you are doing the trenching.
If water company do the trenching themselves, it will be 300mm.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article ,
"Phil L" writes:
Huge wrote:
On 2016-12-09, Phil L wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't
put gas pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not
gas and water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains -
apparently someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire
life has suggested that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and
contamination and/or deteriation could occur.

Nonsense. It's because water in the gas mains is a nightmare to sort
out.

How is water going to get inside a pressurised gas pipe unless both are
leaking?

That's how (leaks in both are very common, particularly nearby
each other when ground moves), and water pressure is much higher
than gas pressure in the street network.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
"Phil L" writes:

Nonsense. It's because water in the gas mains is a nightmare to sort
out.

How is water going to get inside a pressurised gas pipe unless both are
leaking?

That's how (leaks in both are very common, particularly nearby
each other when ground moves), and water pressure is much higher
than gas pressure in the street network.

I can arrange a different route for the water supply and put ducts at
600mm for gas and electric. Until Phil mentioned red I assumed electric
duct would be black. Where would one go to obtain this?

Also, assuming an authorised alteration of an existing supply and
pre-laid ducts, what are the likely fees?


--
Tim Lamb

In message , Tim Lamb
writes
In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
"Phil L" writes:

Nonsense. It's because water in the gas mains is a nightmare to sort
out.

How is water going to get inside a pressurised gas pipe unless both are
leaking?

That's how (leaks in both are very common, particularly nearby
each other when ground moves), and water pressure is much higher
than gas pressure in the street network.

I can arrange a different route for the water supply and put ducts at
600mm for gas and electric. Until Phil mentioned red I assumed electric
duct would be black. Where would one go to obtain this?

Also, assuming an authorised alteration of an existing supply and
pre-laid ducts, what are the likely fees?

Further investigation....

UK Power networks specify minimum 450mm depth (under garden) right angle
turns with a specified radius and are happy with black duct which must
be identified as electrical. Cost appears to start at £956:-(

National grid want 425mm depth and yellow perforated 60mm duct, cost
£400 plus..

Everyone wants warning tape.

--
Tim Lamb

On 09/12/2016 16:50, Phil L wrote:
Nightjar wrote:

When the gas company replaced the services in my road they dug
trenches in the road, but used a mole to run new pipes to each
property. The water company's contractor also used a mole to replace
the service pipe to my next door neighbour recently. I don't think
the gas company likes ducts, as they can pose an explosion risk.

They require perforated ducting and it must be yellow, they won't put gas
pipe in anything else.

To the OP:

Red for leccy, they will supply it, unlike the gas people.

Water and leccy can go in the same hole as can gas and leccy. Not gas and
water though, water must be kept away from the gas mains - apparently
someone who's probably never dug a hole in his entire life has suggested
that gas leaking can 'affect' the water pipe and contamination and/or
deteriation could occur.

Water mains needs 300mm of soil covering, then a blue polythene, wire
reinforced mesh (sold by the 100m roll) laying over, then backfilling




I put all mine in same trench - utilities were happy with that.
Gas provided me with the pipe in advance I just lay in in trench and
back filled.
Leccy I put in old uPVC downpipes with a draw cord - only as I wanted to
backfill before leccy turned up.


Water went in first, had it connected & tested, then partial backfill,
then leccy ducting, backfill then gas pipe.

Officially Gas can insist on trench being left open to inspect depth ...
I just put an offcut of 110mm drain pipe vertically over the pipe at 2
places in case they wanted to inspect - they didn't.


Most amazing thing to me was they connected gas to a stop cock in empty
services cabinet and after purging line (vent to atmosphere) left it. No
seal, just simple screw top.
They said as they don't supply meter or sell the gas - not their issue.
I mentioned what was to stop me connecting a regulator and running free
gas for life - nothing.

Wonder how much of that goes on.

rick wrote:

Officially Gas can insist on trench being left open to inspect depth ...
I just put an offcut of 110mm drain pipe vertically over the pipe at 2
places in case they wanted to inspect - they didn't.

I was interested to see contractors doing gas pipe renewal
locally. They had a calibrated board to drop into the trench, and
took phone photos before backfilling.

Chris
--
Chris J Dixon Nottingham UK


Plant amazing Acers.