In article ,
wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 13:09:40 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 11:32:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message

Yes at least we both realise that, pity plow**** doesn't so why not
reply to his email rather than mine and telling him his wrong as
usualy and that he can;t lie his way out of a wet paper bag.

What if yuor loading te4h car or the kids, misses or dogs want to get
in the car while you're in the dunny ?

He really is turning into Rodney.

I do love the way people invent uses to sell 'new' technology. To try and
make it a 'must have'. Which then lies unused at the bottom of a drawer
like all the other Ideal Homes gadgets.

--
*Why is a boxing ring square?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Friday, 21 October 2016 14:09:27 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 11:19:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 16:45:54 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
whisky-dave wrote:
Personally I'd still avoid droping them in tolets at music
festivals, but that's up to you.

I avoid doing that by not going to music festivals

I avoid it by not going to festivals and not carrying a
smartphone at any time.

Then how are you going to control your house

I have little need to control my house.

Sorry - bedsit.

as Wodeny would say.
wrong as usualy.

But you've said how easy it is to control anything via a mobile phone etc..
If you don't have one, how do you know?

I have a friend that has one, and another that is writing apps for phones he;s wrking with a electricity supply with smarmeters, he's section is to collect the data and show graphs of usage etc..
Ther'e these bulbs you can buy even in maplin that yuo can control from your iphone.
Ceentral heatoing systems can now be controlled from simialar devices.

I have 2 ipods one ipad, 3 intel Mac computers and a number of older PPC or 68K ones.


- as you say is ever so easy?

I never said anaything about how easy or difficult it was.

Oh. but you did. Or implied it.

It's easy from the point of view of technacally doing it. The technology
is already avaible we already have bathroom scales, lights etc.. Most
don't have to get up to change things on their TV, most TVs now have IP
addresses, even my toothbrush sends signals to a clock.

Why would you ever want to control your toothbrush remotely?

Whre did I say I wanted to contol it remotely.

Please tell me how yuo worked that out from what I said.

"even my toothbrush sends signals to a clock"

where did I mention ANYTHONG about control.
Are yuo suggeting my toothbrush should be entered into the US presedency
vote ?




Bathroom
scales linked to your computer could be useful if you're anal enough to
keep a chart of your weight, I suppose.

I weight myself two years ago with the idea of keeping records.
It was a nice idea but I wa stoo lazy to carry papper and pen to teh bathroom and not down weight times of day height etc.. BMI and other thing.

But I know people that know how many steps they take everyday I've never bothered counting.



TVs have had remote controls for some 40 years. Because there was a need
for that.

Because people didn't want to get up and use the knobs/buttons provided.

But there's no need tlo see if yuo've turned the lights off or the heating or the gas or set the house alarm....
And no one wants to know if someones entered their property while they are away.



I can control my TV via my ipad how do you control your TV ?.

Your TV already has the means of being controlled remotely. Via its
remote control. Your phone merely does the same as that remote.

No it does not. The remote uses IR, my ipad uses the IP address did you
not know that. My remote needs to be pointed towards the TV my ipad can
to what I want from another room.

Think you missed the point that controlling something remotely which was
already designed for that isn't going to be so much of a problem.

Yes I know.
This is why products need designing for control.




BTW, just why would you want to change a TV channel from another room
where you can't even see the TV? Or from the other side of the world?

If you have kids you could 'monitor' and control what they watch in their bedroom.
I'd love such a device in my mums care home and so would the carers they keep having to go to one clients room to turn the TV down he keeps putting it up to maxuim then calls out for someone to turn the TV down.

Why would you want to start recording a TV program while at work ?



Now explain how easy it would be to control an existing heating system,
hot water system, and everything else in your place via your phone?

It can't ****wit, only an idiot would think it could.

You've not seen the ads on TV?

Might have ignored them, I do that with nappies ads too, in fact I mute or FF though most ads but I don't watch a lot of TV anyway.
Currentyl just eastenders as that's on when I get home or when I have dinner southpark, dwarf, horizon, sky at night are the only things I record reguallry.



Of course with a new build you could incorporate all of that. At a
cost - and likely a considerable one.

Like having a mobile phome the cost will come down with time.

Yes it might.

It will and has done the fiorst mobile cost nearly $4000.

But then whole house control systems have been around for
quite some time. And you won't find them in many new builds.

Are you sure about that, I've seen tehn on the apprentice a coupe of seasons or so ago their task was to sell some high end flats with all this tech.



As I said
I can by an accelerometer for less than the price of a bag of chips. We
used to have a lab set for a rearch project into black box recoding this
was spnsered by a car company giving us a car where we instaled
accerletmoetrs and teh like cost quyite a bit each one being £120 now
insurance compnies give you a free app for your phone to do similar
things.


I've often wondered how I've manage all these years without being able
to switch lights etc on and off when I'm not in the house. I must be
missing something.

you are, but did yuo not see another thread about someone asking how to
install a neon so he can see whethe rthe loft lights have been on or
not. All teh hassle of installing a new switch and teh wiring of it. You
could have every switch report i'ts position on/off/dimmer sent to an
app, just pay a few quid more for each switch might not even cost that
in a few years. I remmeber the days when I had NO reason to phone anyone
while waiting at a bus stop. In 1983 they coast about £3k that's a lot
of money just for a device to say you'll be late home from work isn't it.

In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
I would depending on the cost, just like I have with my halegen
bulbs going over to LEDs. when the halegen blows it gets replaced
with an LED version where possible.

Take be through this.

take be... to Be or not to Be that is the question, then what is the
answer.

You even noticing a typo demands a Pot, Kettle.

You replace a bulb with inbuilt electronics to allow it to be switched
by your mobile phone. Which - unless I'm missing something - means
that lighting circuit had to be left switched on. So you can no longer
switch (and or dim) that light from the wall switch? And what if you
have more than one light on the same circuit?

Not a problem.

See below.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

here you can switch on any LED and make it any colour any LED of the 60
in this example I have 3 metres of it and can stwich on and off any LED
and select almost any colour too in a 3 metre lenght, it's not wireless,
but it can't be long before someone works out how to incoporated a
wireless soilutuion.

You are really putting forward a strip of coloured LEDs as an alterative
to normal room lighting? Especially since it doesn't even do what I asked
about?

--
*You know you're a redneck if your home has wheels and your car doesn't.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Friday, 21 October 2016 14:47:50 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 13:09:40 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 11:32:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message

Yes at least we both realise that, pity plow**** doesn't so why not
reply to his email rather than mine and telling him his wrong as
usualy and that he can;t lie his way out of a wet paper bag.

What if yuor loading te4h car or the kids, misses or dogs want to get
in the car while you're in the dunny ?

He really is turning into Rodney.

I do love the way people invent uses to sell 'new' technology.

People have been doing that since sliced bread and toilet paper we dontl need either do we.

To try and
make it a 'must have'. Which then lies unused at the bottom of a drawer
like all the other Ideal Homes gadgets.

How many smartphones are purchased each year. Have you been on public transport I;d say 70% are staring at them for most of their journey
I notice once yeterday on teh tube just had setting show waiting for a signal to connect while going from leyton to stratford in the tunnel.

On Friday, 21 October 2016 15:22:59 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
I would depending on the cost, just like I have with my halegen
bulbs going over to LEDs. when the halegen blows it gets replaced
with an LED version where possible.

Take be through this.

take be... to Be or not to Be that is the question, then what is the
answer.

You even noticing a typo demands a Pot, Kettle.

Of course it's part of dsylexia noticing other peoples mistakes more than your own.



You replace a bulb with inbuilt electronics to allow it to be switched
by your mobile phone. Which - unless I'm missing something - means
that lighting circuit had to be left switched on. So you can no longer
switch (and or dim) that light from the wall switch? And what if you
have more than one light on the same circuit?

Not a problem.

See below.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

here you can switch on any LED and make it any colour any LED of the 60
in this example I have 3 metres of it and can stwich on and off any LED
and select almost any colour too in a 3 metre lenght, it's not wireless,
but it can't be long before someone works out how to incoporated a
wireless soilutuion.

You are really putting forward a strip of coloured LEDs as an alterative
to normal room lighting? Especially since it doesn't even do what I asked
about?

you seem to think there's no way of putting cirucity in a consumer switch that can detect whether or not the switch is of or on.
Why do you think that ?
The point about the LED strip wass how miniturisation works in a space of under a few mmXmm you can have an LED of virtually any colour and brightness controlled from jiust a two wire signal.
Even 30 years ago intercomes could use main wiring to transmit adudio signals, ehternet repeaters work along the cables too at 500MHz.
You seemt o think it's beyond todays technology for a device to do the same job as a neon indicator.

In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
I thought light switches always needed nuetral or earth in order to
provide a potential differnce from the live unless using a phase
inverter/shifter.

Good grief.

--
*ATHEISM IS A NON-PROPHET ORGANIZATION.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
You are really putting forward a strip of coloured LEDs as an
alterative to normal room lighting? Especially since it doesn't even
do what I asked about?

you seem to think there's no way of putting cirucity in a consumer
switch that can detect whether or not the switch is of or on. Why do you
think that ?

No Dave. I'm perfectly capable of engineering anything like that if I
wanted it.

You. on the other hand...

--
*Proofread carefully to see if you any words out or mispeld something *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 21 October 2016 11:32:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

Yes and in the early 80s if you wanted to buy a blue LEDs you could do
for
something like a few quid each.
How long have TVs on walls been imagined since 1948 and before .



and use those as new remotes and just leave
those phones in a holder in each bathroom.

With TV remotes yuo can get ones which learn your from other
remotes
(programable)

The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

Isn't that their problem.

Nope, I do all the tech stuff and the place is currently being rented out
too.

So it's your problem then isn't it not exactly a world problem.

Its a problem for anyone with a device that
has a remote that is no longer available and
much better done with a phone which can
have appropriate labels like LIGHT FAN HEATER
which even you should have noticed learning
TV remotes dont have.

The technology there you just don;t have the inteligence to label
buttons

Not even possible.

Not for you, but I've known people to use tipex for such things.

You still have the problem with the type of switch button and
no way to label the everything on and off buttons because
there isnt enough space for that label. Much easier on a phone.

Years ago I printed out an overlay for a remote control to
place over the buttons the most difficult bit was cutting out
a neat square for teh buttons, but not beyond my abilities.

But ****ing crude compared with a phone app with icons
that can be any shape you like with any label you like and
a new screen for each device it controls so that ovens can
have completely different buttons to the TV and lights etc
with proper labels for the temperature and convection
microwave and grill with microwave ovens etc.

or to allocated them in a way that makes sense.

Not even possible.

Not for you obvioullsy but more inteligent people can do it.

With a **** house result compared with what a phone.

this is why these things are sold too.
http://lifehacker.com/whats-the-best...rol-1726729528

Pity about the price of those compared with the cheapest phones.
And much better to have everything in the one device, the phone,
instead of lots of separate remotes.

With a mobile phone you can have useful labels and label
the buttons with light fan heater etc and have another couple
that turn everything on and off like the original remote does.

yes exactly but you don't need a new mobile
phone for every new device you buy do you.

Nope, just the one for everything.

thats the key to IoT.

And means it makes a lot more sense to add that functionality
to a phone than to have a universal remote that doesnt have
the other smartphone capability and can't make and receive
calls, play podcasts, takes photos etc.

Currently most have remotes for TV's TiVos DVD player recorders
Blue/ray, perhaps a surrond sound system or sound bar.

The best ones have just the one remote that controls everything.

All thses could be controled from one device connected to your wrist,

Makes more sense not to do that.

that's why it's being done

**** all do that with their phones.

couldn't do that when smartphones first came out or when the first
mobile came out or when the first telephone went into production.

And still isnt done much.

This sort of thing is alrady happening
how can you not see it go further.

Of course it can and will. Its the plow****
that is too stupid to work that out.

Yes at least we both realise that, pity plow**** doesn't
so why not reply to his email rather than mine

Even a terminal ****wit such as yourself
should have noticed I replied to you both.

Poepl love the idea of setting their car alarm from 20ft away,
what's the point we used to use phyical locks and on/off switches.

Even better to have it happen completely automatically
as you walk away and walk back to the car etc.

What if yuor loading te4h car or the kids, misses or dogs
want to get in the car while you're in the dunny ?

Each of the owners wife and kids are recognised by the car too.

Same with the house and with the house it only locks up the
house when everyone has left and is outside the yard etc.

Or locks the doors all the time and unlocks a particular door
when one of the people who lives there approaches the door,
whatever the occupants want done with the door locks.

I'm not sure if this will work with remote dimmers, it
can;t be a very difficult 'code' to crack if there is one.

Yeah, the problem isnt the code, its the fact that a
TV remote doesnt have sensible labels for one of
those fan/light/heater things in a bathroom.

I know which is why it's more efficint to have ONE device to interact
with
all
your other devices rather than have a dedicated remote for each sperate
device.

And that one device should be the phone.

Presently yes. But what's in a name, most would prefer
something smaller like a watch to control things.

Sure, and that's here now too. Trouble with those is that
the screen is so small its nothing like as useful IMO.

This is one reason why yuort car remote is
likely to be smaller than your smartphone.

But thats when it can't do anything except lock and unlock the car.
When you have one device that allows you to control everything,
it makes more sense to have a decent screen so you can show the
controls properly with proper labels or can be told what you want it
to do by voice like all the smartphones and smart watches do right now.

People use smatphones for looking at their home CCTV setup
I have one, why do a need seperate remotes for each , I don't.

You dont, just one phone.

because of the way teh infrastruure works basically IoT.

Duh.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 21 October 2016 13:49:17 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Right. So you're going to change every bulb in the house so you can
control them from your phone. You're even more stupid than even I
thought. If that's possible.

I would depending on the cost, just like I have with my halegen bulbs
going over to LEDs. when the halegen blows it gets replaced with an LED
version where possible.

Take be through this.

take be... to Be or not to Be that is the question, then what is the
answer.

You replace a bulb with inbuilt electronics to allow
it to be switched by your mobile phone. Which - unless I'm missing
something - means that lighting circuit had to be left switched on. So
you
can no longer switch (and or dim) that light from the wall switch? And
what if you have more than one light on the same circuit?

Not a problem.

See below.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

here you can switch on any LED and make it any colour any LED
of the 60 in this example I have 3 metres of it and can stwich on
and off any LED and select almost any colour too in a 3 metre lenght,

it's not wireless, but it can't be long before someone
works out how to incoporated a wireless soilutuion.

They already have, with the bulbs too.

I know some people replace things just because they can some change
cars
every year or so even though there existing car still works, same with
phones TVs and many other products.

I'm genuinely curious about this. Not the principle, but the nuts and
bolts of it. Not on a new build, but as an 'upgrade' to an existing
installation. Just like the TV ads (Hive, etc) suggest is easy.

Never seen this advert so can't comment on it.
As far as I know you can't upgrade a typical old style CRT to connect to
the internet, my 3 previous TVs couldn't but my new one can.
My soundbar with optical or bluetooth connection couldn't be used with my
1980s trinatron TV so I didn't buy one, not that they were aviaible.

Don;t forget designs educated in universities are ahead of the curve or
at least should be leaving the old schools behind you know the ones that
still think you need to get up to change channels.
So things we do here I dob't see a great market for others I do.
My department has been given $5million with another uni to come up with an
invisability cloak, I've been talking to the researcheer who's tracking
naked mole rats.
http://www.qmul.ac.uk/media/news/items/se/155308.html.

another student is doing something with 12 way directional mirrors.
Imagine a mirro that configures itself we've done it with radar dishes in
teh microwave lab area configarble antennes.

One of our projects was on the xmas edition of the gadget show the robot
drummer is sitting downstairs in our performance lab.

-----------
This project was constructed over the weekend in my lab.
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...?ref=discovery


http://www.qmul.ac.uk/media/news/items/se/141726.html

bottom lefthand link regarding lego and school kids run via my lab, even
these kids have much more of an idea of the future possibilities than you
do.


You might be looking at taking canaries down t'pit but we're using
technology to improve (hopefully) lives.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 16:45:54 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
Personally I'd still avoid droping them in tolets at music
festivals, but that's up to you.

I avoid doing that by not going to music festivals

I avoid it by not going to festivals and not carrying a smartphone at
any time.

Then how are you going to control your house

I have little need to control my house.

Sorry - bedsit.

- as you say is ever so easy?

I never said anaything about how easy or difficult it was.

Oh. but you did. Or implied it.

I can control my TV via my ipad how do you control your TV ?.

Your TV already has the means of being controlled remotely. Via its remote
control. Your phone merely does the same as that remote.

Now explain how easy it would be to control an existing heating system,
hot water system, and everything else in your place via your phone?

Of course with a new build you could incorporate all of that. At a cost -
and likely a considerable one.

I've often wondered how I've manage all these years without being able to
switch lights etc on and off when I'm not in the house.

You don’t do it when you arent in the house except as a bonus
anti burglar approach, ****wit.

I must be missing something.

As always. That's why you have always needed a union to wipe your arse.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 21 October 2016 14:09:27 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 11:19:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 16:45:54 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article
,
whisky-dave wrote:
Personally I'd still avoid droping them in tolets at music
festivals, but that's up to you.

I avoid doing that by not going to music festivals

I avoid it by not going to festivals and not carrying a
smartphone at any time.

Then how are you going to control your house

I have little need to control my house.

Sorry - bedsit.

as Wodeny would say.
wrong as usualy.

But you've said how easy it is to control anything via a mobile phone
etc.
If you don't have one, how do you know?

I have a friend that has one, and another that is writing apps for phones
he;s wrking with a electricity supply with smarmeters, he's section is to
collect the data and show graphs of usage etc..
Ther'e these bulbs you can buy even in maplin that yuo can control from
your iphone.
Ceentral heatoing systems can now be controlled from simialar devices.

I have 2 ipods one ipad, 3 intel Mac computers and a number of older PPC
or 68K ones.


- as you say is ever so easy?

I never said anaything about how easy or difficult it was.

Oh. but you did. Or implied it.

It's easy from the point of view of technacally doing it. The
technology
is already avaible we already have bathroom scales, lights etc.. Most
don't have to get up to change things on their TV, most TVs now have IP
addresses, even my toothbrush sends signals to a clock.

Why would you ever want to control your toothbrush remotely?

Whre did I say I wanted to contol it remotely.

Please tell me how yuo worked that out from what I said.

"even my toothbrush sends signals to a clock"

where did I mention ANYTHONG about control.
Are yuo suggeting my toothbrush should be entered into the US presedency
vote ?




Bathroom
scales linked to your computer could be useful if you're anal enough to
keep a chart of your weight, I suppose.

I weight myself two years ago with the idea of keeping records.
It was a nice idea but I wa stoo lazy to carry papper and pen to teh
bathroom
and not down weight times of day height etc.. BMI and other thing.

I weigh myself just after I have got up and had a **** so what
I am wearing is constant and remember the weight and put
that into the spreadsheet when I start using the computer.

But I know people that know how many steps
they take everyday I've never bothered counting.

TVs have had remote controls for some 40 years. Because there was a need
for that.

Because people didn't want to get up and use the knobs/buttons provided.

But there's no need tlo see if yuo've turned the lights off or the heating
or the gas or set the house alarm....
And no one wants to know if someones entered their property while they are
away.



I can control my TV via my ipad how do you control your TV ?.

Your TV already has the means of being controlled remotely. Via its
remote control. Your phone merely does the same as that remote.

No it does not. The remote uses IR, my ipad uses the IP address did you
not know that. My remote needs to be pointed towards the TV my ipad can
to what I want from another room.

Think you missed the point that controlling something remotely which was
already designed for that isn't going to be so much of a problem.

Yes I know.
This is why products need designing for control.




BTW, just why would you want to change a TV channel from another room
where you can't even see the TV? Or from the other side of the world?

If you have kids you could 'monitor' and control what they watch in their
bedroom.
I'd love such a device in my mums care home and so would the carers they
keep having to go to one clients room to turn the TV down he keeps putting
it up to maxuim then calls out for someone to turn the TV down.

Why would you want to start recording a TV program while at work ?



Now explain how easy it would be to control an existing heating
system,
hot water system, and everything else in your place via your phone?

It can't ****wit, only an idiot would think it could.

You've not seen the ads on TV?

Might have ignored them, I do that with nappies
ads too, in fact I mute or FF though most ads

I dont watch anything live, record what looks interesting
and then I can watch it when it suits me and skip the ads.

but I don't watch a lot of TV anyway.

I dont either, normally only a couple of hours a day.

Currentyl just eastenders as that's on when I get home

Bizarre.

or when I have dinner southpark, dwarf, horizon,
sky at night are the only things I record reguallry.

Of course with a new build you could incorporate all of that. At a
cost - and likely a considerable one.

Like having a mobile phome the cost will come down with time.

Yes it might.

It will and has done the fiorst mobile cost nearly $4000.

But then whole house control systems have been around for
quite some time. And you won't find them in many new builds.

Are you sure about that, I've seen tehn on the apprentice a coupe of
seasons
or so ago their task was to sell some high end flats with all this tech.

You dont see many on Grand Designs.

More fool them IMO. Very convenient to have the lights come on and
off automatically as you move around the house. Doesnt cost much either.

I'd love to be able to just select what I am going to eat meal wise and
have the system program the convection oven and microwave to the
program for that meal and just put the food in the appliances and
have it tell me when its time to plate it and eat it and have it start
it auto at the right time to have it ready to eat when I want to eat it.

As I said
I can by an accelerometer for less than the price of a bag of chips.
We
used to have a lab set for a rearch project into black box recoding
this
was spnsered by a car company giving us a car where we instaled
accerletmoetrs and teh like cost quyite a bit each one being £120 now
insurance compnies give you a free app for your phone to do similar
things.


I've often wondered how I've manage all these years without being
able
to switch lights etc on and off when I'm not in the house. I must be
missing something.

you are, but did yuo not see another thread about someone asking how to
install a neon so he can see whethe rthe loft lights have been on or
not. All teh hassle of installing a new switch and teh wiring of it.
You
could have every switch report i'ts position on/off/dimmer sent to an
app, just pay a few quid more for each switch might not even cost that
in a few years. I remmeber the days when I had NO reason to phone
anyone
while waiting at a bus stop. In 1983 they coast about £3k that's a lot
of money just for a device to say you'll be late home from work isn't
it.

To have that interface device at that lightswitch means providing a
neutral so it can be powered.

I thought light switches always needed nuetral or earth in order to
provide
a potential differnce from the live unless using a phase inverter/shifter.

Nope, light switches dont normally have either neutral or earth,
just the active and switched active, even with multiple switches
controlling one light with say external or passage lights.

In my case almost all the lights can be switched from more than
one switch, but that was in the days when it was all simple switches.

Much better to have what are essentially remotes, some fixed to
the wall in particular places like just inside the door if you dont
want them to be completely automatic with movement sensors.

But whethe ror not it;s LED or anything you need to differing points
of potentail differnce if you haven't go that the light won't work.
Unless you can show me a schematic of a lighting circuit that only uses
the live wire.

Trivial with the switches. Its the lights themselves that get the neutral
and earth.

Unless you think batteries will be OK.

I think they would but rather uneccessary I'd have thought.

And with a neutral, a neon to do as wanted
would still be easier, cheaper and more reliable.

Not if your away from the house such as just
driving off and think have a left the light on.

Or when you want lights that make the house look
occupied when not at home.

On Friday, 21 October 2016 17:10:20 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
I thought light switches always needed nuetral or earth in order to
provide a potential differnce from the live unless using a phase
inverter/shifter.

Good grief.

It all looks like pointless grief to me.


NT

In article ,
wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 17:10:20 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
whisky-dave wrote:
I thought light switches always needed nuetral or earth in order to
provide a potential differnce from the live unless using a phase
inverter/shifter.

Good grief.

It all looks like pointless grief to me.

The worry is he claims to be in charge of students conducting electronics
experiments.

--
*I can see your point, but I still think you're full of ****.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sun, 23 Oct 2016 14:53:53 +0100, pamela wrote:

On 14:29 23 Oct 2016, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

whisky-dave wrote:
I thought light switches always needed nuetral or earth in
order to provide a potential differnce from the live
unless using a phase inverter/shifter.

Good grief.

It all looks like pointless grief to me.

The worry is he claims to be in charge of students conducting
electronics experiments.

Seriously? What students?

He can't be that busy if he can read and post to usenet all day.
Wonder if his employers know how much time he spends doing it, if
they know then it makes one wonder how efficient the place is run or
if there is any public money involved and whether it could benefit
from an exercise to reduce costs.

G.Harman

"pamela" wrote in message
...
On 14:29 23 Oct 2016, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article
,
wrote:
On Friday, 21 October 2016 17:10:20 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News)
wrote:
In article
,
whisky-dave wrote:
I thought light switches always needed nuetral or earth in
order to provide a potential differnce from the live
unless using a phase inverter/shifter.

Good grief.

It all looks like pointless grief to me.

The worry is he claims to be in charge of students conducting
electronics experiments.

Seriously?

Nope, he isnt in charge of them, all he does is organise
the supply of the bits they decide they want to use and
organises the supply of the equipment they use etc.

What students?

He did name it, some uni in London.

On Fri, 21 Oct 2016 03:14:53 -0700 (PDT), whisky-dave
wrote:



I know some people replace things just because they can some change cars every year or so even though there existing car still works, same with phones TVs and many other products.


Does that comment apply to women:-)?




---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

On Fri, 21 Oct 2016 12:49:05 +0100, "bm" wrote:


"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Friday, 21 October 2016 11:19:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
snip

I've often wondered how I've manage all these years without being able to
switch lights etc on and off when I'm not in the house. I must be missing
something.

you are, but did yuo not see another thread about someone asking how to
install a neon so he can see whethe rthe loft lights have been on or not.
All teh hassle of installing a new switch and teh wiring of it.



You could have every switch report i'ts position on/off/dimmer sent to an
app, just pay a few quid more for each switch might not even cost that in a
few years.

An app to tell you that the kids have left the lights turned on?

I am not much of an app programmer but all I need to do is design an
an app that say "the lights have been left on". This would require NO
feedback from the lightswitch:-)

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

In article , ARW
wrote:
On Fri, 21 Oct 2016 12:49:05 +0100, "bm" wrote:


"whisky-dave" wrote in message
... On Friday,
21 October 2016 11:19:55 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote: snip

I've often wondered how I've manage all these years without being able
to switch lights etc on and off when I'm not in the house. I must be
missing something.

you are, but did yuo not see another thread about someone asking how to
install a neon so he can see whethe rthe loft lights have been on or
not. All teh hassle of installing a new switch and teh wiring of it.



You could have every switch report i'ts position on/off/dimmer sent to
an app, just pay a few quid more for each switch might not even cost
that in a few years.

An app to tell you that the kids have left the lights turned on?

I am not much of an app programmer but all I need to do is design an an
app that say "the lights have been left on". This would require NO
feedback from the lightswitch:-)


I want one that says "Don't hit me" when an idiot taps a mictophone that's
just been passed to him.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England

In article ,
charles wrote:
I am not much of an app programmer but all I need to do is design an an
app that say "the lights have been left on". This would require NO
feedback from the lightswitch:-)


I want one that says "Don't hit me" when an idiot taps a mictophone
that's just been passed to him.

Moving coil mics can make quite effective speakers.
Famous story was when one of the early and quite large lanyard types (an
RCA BK6 moving coil) was hid in what would be called then the 'ample
boosom' of a famous singer. The sound guy fed it from another mic and amp
and got it to say 'It's hot in here'
Seems a decent singer can scream quite well too.

--
*Of course I'm against sin; I'm against anything that I'm too old to enjoy.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around but no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol everything via a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.



and use those as new remotes and just leave
those phones in a holder in each bathroom.

With TV remotes yuo can get ones which learn your from other remotes
(programable)

The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things so it's not a problem.


With a mobile phone you can have useful labels and label
the buttons with light fan heater etc and have another couple
that turn everything on and off like the original remote does.

you can do the same with a learnable remote.


I'm not sure if this will work with remote dimmers, it
can;t be a very difficult 'code' to crack if there is one.

Yeah, the problem isnt the code, its the fact that a
TV remote doesnt have sensible labels for one of
those fan/light/heater things in a bathroom.

It is not aboave my abilities to reemebr such things as button 1 turn light on button 2 turn light off, maybe it beyond most to be able to make an insert or overlay for a remote.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol everything via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.

Separate matter to what is available.

and use those as new remotes and just leave
those phones in a holder in each bathroom.

With TV remotes yuo can get ones which learn your from other remotes
(programable)

The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things

Corse they are interested in turning the lights/fan/heater off
and on in those two bathrooms.

so it's not a problem.

Wrong, as always.

With a mobile phone you can have useful labels and label
the buttons with light fan heater etc and have another couple
that turn everything on and off like the original remote does.

you can do the same with a learnable remote.

Nothing even remotely like as well as with a mobile phone
with a decent modern touch screen which allows whatever
appropriate icons and labels to be trivially done for each
service it controls.

I'm not sure if this will work with remote dimmers, it
can;t be a very difficult 'code' to crack if there is one.

Yeah, the problem isnt the code, its the fact that a
TV remote doesnt have sensible labels for one of
those fan/light/heater things in a bathroom.

It is not aboave my abilities to reemebr such things
as button 1 turn light on button 2 turn light off,

****ing kludge compared with a decent modern touch
screen smartphone with appropriate icons and labels.

On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare remotes..

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol everything via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.
£100+ for a set of bathroom scales that normally cost under £20.

Nike have made trainers with self tying laces likie back to the future, why don;t we see queueus of people buying these. ?



and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.

Separate matter to what is available.

No it isn't, it's the key to it.
Bring the price down more get sold simple.

You think no one would buy a hover board ?


The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things

Corse they are interested in turning the lights/fan/heater off
and on in those two bathrooms.

They are used to using switches and are quite compendent to do so.

Others those with weath tend to have butlers and servant to do things for them they are their remotes.




With a mobile phone you can have useful labels and label
the buttons with light fan heater etc and have another couple
that turn everything on and off like the original remote does.

you can do the same with a learnable remote.

Nothing even remotely like as well as with a mobile phone
with a decent modern touch screen which allows whatever
appropriate icons and labels to be trivially done for each
service it controls.

who can trivally do them you ?, you know how to right GUI in swift.
for yearac peole have used their brain and stuck pieces of paper to switches to mark what they are used for, we even do that here, so peole can work out which light which switch turns on a sticky label is stuck just under the switch saying such things as back left, and front right.



It is not aboave my abilities to reemebr such things
as button 1 turn light on button 2 turn light off,

****ing kludge compared with a decent modern touch
screen smartphone with appropriate icons and labels.

and who appropriately labels and marks them then ?

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

£100+ for a set of bathroom scales that normally cost under £20.

Plenty by them even if plenty more dont.

Nike have made trainers with self tying laces likie back to the
future, why don;t we see queueus of people buying these. ?

Same with mobile phones, TVs etc etc etc.

and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.

Separate matter to what is available.

No it isn't, it's the key to it.

We weren't discussing how many buy them.

Bring the price down more get sold simple.

Separate matter to what was being discussed,
what is available if you want to buy it.

The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things

Corse they are interested in turning the lights/fan/heater off
and on in those two bathrooms.

They are used to using switches and are quite compendent to do so.

There is no ****ing switch with that particular fan/light/heater.

Just a ****ing remote that is no longer available.

And since this **** is the best you can manage,
here goes the chain on your even sillier ****.

On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another anyway..

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home, do you have card access on your front door.


£100+ for a set of bathroom scales that normally cost under £20.

Plenty by them even if plenty more dont.

Not that many have been buying them due to the cost if they were cheaper more would buy them even if they never got around to using them.


Nike have made trainers with self tying laces like back to the
future, why don;t we see queueus of people buying these. ?

Same with mobile phones, TVs etc etc etc.

Yep, people set a worth on things and that affects sales.


and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.

Separate matter to what is available.

No it isn't, it's the key to it.

We weren't discussing how many buy them.

If people don't buy items they tend not to be made, it's called supply and demand.


Bring the price down more get sold simple.

Separate matter to what was being discussed,
what is available if you want to buy it.

It won't be made availble if people aren't likely to buy it.


The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things

Corse they are interested in turning the lights/fan/heater off
and on in those two bathrooms.

They are used to using switches and are quite compendent to do so.

There is no ****ing switch with that particular fan/light/heater.

Then how does it opperate ?


Just a ****ing remote that is no longer available.

Well that is remote then isn't it.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet, but that is because it would be much better to go
even further and have the system work out that I have just
arrived back after being off the property for by working out
that the phone has just arrived back on the property and is now
at the door and unlock the door completely automatically without
me doing anything at all. And when I just walk out to the car to get
something out of the car or check the letterbox, that there is no
need to lock the door as I go out.

The other problem is that the 13 patio doors that are the only
normal way into and out of the house have a rather unusual
type of lock, all keyed alike, that you can't trivially replace
with the locks that do work like that with the phone.

If they did, I'd be doing that right now for the convenience
and to allow me to get one of the neighbours to check the
the house if the alarm system tells me that something has
gone wrong while I am away by doing that with their phone.

I know all the neighbours well enough to get them to do that.

I did in fact need to do that when I ended up in hospital. Had to
ring one of the neighbours to get them to turn the sprinklers off
in the park next to the house when they wouldnt let me out of
the hospital. They then took the car home, got some stuff out
of the house for me, books to read, and then managed to forget
to lock the house as they left. One of the kids showed up to get
me to do something for them, discovered I wasnt around and
that the door was unlocked and fortunately had enough sense
to ask one of the other neighbours what the problem was.

None of that would have been necessary with a decent lock system
and me being able to monitor what is going on in the house remotely.

Very affordable right now.

£100+ for a set of bathroom scales that normally cost under £20.

Plenty by them even if plenty more dont.

Not that many have been buying them due to the cost

BULL****.

if they were cheaper more would buy them

Duh. And there is no reason why one that automatically
uses the phone as the display can't be cheaper than one
with a display on the top of the scales.

even if they never got around to using them.

Nike have made trainers with self tying laces like back to the
future, why don;t we see queueus of people buying these. ?

Same with mobile phones, TVs etc etc etc.

Yep, people set a worth on things and that affects sales.

How odd that apple has managed to sell quite literally billions of theirs.

and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.

Separate matter to what is available.

No it isn't, it's the key to it.

We weren't discussing how many buy them.

If people don't buy items they tend not to be made,

How odd that apple has made billions quite literally.

The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things

Corse they are interested in turning the lights/fan/heater off
and on in those two bathrooms.

They are used to using switches and are quite compendent to do so.

There is no ****ing switch with that particular fan/light/heater.

Then how does it opperate ?

It uses a ****ing remote, ****wit.

On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling. Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

but that is because it would be much better to go
even further and have the system work out that I have just
arrived back after being off the property for by working out
that the phone has just arrived back on the property and is now
at the door and unlock the door completely automatically without
me doing anything at all. And when I just walk out to the car to get
something out of the car or check the letterbox, that there is no
need to lock the door as I go out.

The other problem is that the 13 patio doors that are the only
normal way into and out of the house have a rather unusual
type of lock, all keyed alike, that you can't trivially replace
with the locks that do work like that with the phone.


Irrelivent to what needs designing in the future.


If they did, I'd be doing that right now for the convenience
and to allow me to get one of the neighbours to check the
the house if the alarm system tells me that something has
gone wrong while I am away by doing that with their phone.

I know all the neighbours well enough to get them to do that.

I did in fact need to do that when I ended up in hospital. Had to
ring one of the neighbours to get them to turn the sprinklers off
in the park next to the house when they wouldnt let me out of
the hospital. They then took the car home, got some stuff out
of the house for me, books to read, and then managed to forget
to lock the house as they left. One of the kids showed up to get
me to do something for them, discovered I wasnt around and
that the door was unlocked and fortunately had enough sense
to ask one of the other neighbours what the problem was.

None of that would have been necessary with a decent lock system
and me being able to monitor what is going on in the house remotely.

Yes I know which is just another advange of IoT .


Very affordable right now.

So why haven't you go it. ?

I know here it cost £100 to have a door maglocked and that's if you have the rest of the system already installed.


£100+ for a set of bathroom scales that normally cost under £20.

Plenty by them even if plenty more dont.

Not that many have been buying them due to the cost

BULL****.

Then you'd think the majority of scales on sale would have this feature but they don't why because few people are willing to pay the price.


if they were cheaper more would buy them

Duh. And there is no reason why one that automatically
uses the phone as the display can't be cheaper than one
with a display on the top of the scales.

Thre's plenty of reasons if you knoew what you were talking about.


even if they never got around to using them.

Nike have made trainers with self tying laces like back to the
future, why don;t we see queueus of people buying these. ?

Same with mobile phones, TVs etc etc etc.

Yep, people set a worth on things and that affects sales.

How odd that apple has managed to sell quite literally billions of theirs..

Because people think the Apples are worth it. But plenty of other phones are still sold in fact they sell more than Apple do.




and even then the prices are high which is limiting the usage.

Separate matter to what is available.

No it isn't, it's the key to it.

We weren't discussing how many buy them.

If people don't buy items they tend not to be made,

How odd that apple has made billions quite literally.

That's because billions people are buying them, unlike say blackberry.



The problem is that the buttons arent labelled appropriately
for the control of those combination fan/light/heater things
in the ceiling of the bathroom. That makes it hard for the
usual technoklutz to work out what button does what.

The "usual technoklutz" won't be intrested in such things

Corse they are interested in turning the lights/fan/heater off
and on in those two bathrooms.

They are used to using switches and are quite compendent to do so.

There is no ****ing switch with that particular fan/light/heater.

Then how does it opperate ?

It uses a ****ing remote, ****wit.

you said it didnlt work.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on
in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use
your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing
some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets
which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling.
Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the
light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still
around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from
another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in
swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of
having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it
going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

Nope, the patio door locks are the only reason I havent done it yet.

but that is because it would be much better to go
even further and have the system work out that I have just
arrived back after being off the property for by working out
that the phone has just arrived back on the property and is now
at the door and unlock the door completely automatically without
me doing anything at all. And when I just walk out to the car to get
something out of the car or check the letterbox, that there is no
need to lock the door as I go out.

The other problem is that the 13 patio doors that are the only
normal way into and out of the house have a rather unusual
type of lock, all keyed alike, that you can't trivially replace
with the locks that do work like that with the phone.

Irrelivent to what needs designing in the future.

Wrong, as always.

If they did, I'd be doing that right now for the convenience
and to allow me to get one of the neighbours to check the
the house if the alarm system tells me that something has
gone wrong while I am away by doing that with their phone.

I know all the neighbours well enough to get them to do that.

I did in fact need to do that when I ended up in hospital. Had to
ring one of the neighbours to get them to turn the sprinklers off
in the park next to the house when they wouldnt let me out of
the hospital. They then took the car home, got some stuff out
of the house for me, books to read, and then managed to forget
to lock the house as they left. One of the kids showed up to get
me to do something for them, discovered I wasnt around and
that the door was unlocked and fortunately had enough sense
to ask one of the other neighbours what the problem was.

None of that would have been necessary with a decent lock system
and me being able to monitor what is going on in the house remotely.

Yes I know which is just another advange of IoT .

Very affordable right now.

So why haven't you go it. ?

Because there arent any buyable locks
that can do that with my patio doors.

Not even that easy to modify the ones that are available
either, the current key locks are quite small and the buyable
electronic locks dont come even close to fitting and work
very differently too. The patio door locks grab a solid 15mmish
bolt thing with a piece cut out of it that is screwed into the
5x3"RHS vertical that forms the frame of all the patio doors.

The currently available electronic locks dont work for sliding doors.

I know here it cost £100 to have a door maglocked and
that's if you have the rest of the system already installed.

It doesnt cost that much for an electronic striker for patio doors.

But the problem is that the current keyed locks are entirely
on the door itself. There is nothing but that completely
passive 15mmish bolt thing that is screwed to the 5x3" RHS
vertical that is fixed. So not that easy to do an electronic striker.

On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 10:30:05 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved on
in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to use
your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing
some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets
which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the ceiling..
Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the
light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still
around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from
another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in
swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of
having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it
going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

Nope, the patio door locks are the only reason I havent done it yet.

So nothing to do with it;s not worth the cost or yuo can;t justify the cost
of doing that for a home I can understadn the advantages in a hotel but not for home until the costs comes down significantly.


but that is because it would be much better to go
even further and have the system work out that I have just
arrived back after being off the property for by working out
that the phone has just arrived back on the property and is now
at the door and unlock the door completely automatically without
me doing anything at all. And when I just walk out to the car to get
something out of the car or check the letterbox, that there is no
need to lock the door as I go out.

The other problem is that the 13 patio doors that are the only
normal way into and out of the house have a rather unusual
type of lock, all keyed alike, that you can't trivially replace
with the locks that do work like that with the phone.

Irrelivent to what needs designing in the future.

Wrong, as always.

right as always, you do know that door locks have to be designed before they can be sold and installed.


If they did, I'd be doing that right now for the convenience
and to allow me to get one of the neighbours to check the
the house if the alarm system tells me that something has
gone wrong while I am away by doing that with their phone.

I know all the neighbours well enough to get them to do that.

I did in fact need to do that when I ended up in hospital. Had to
ring one of the neighbours to get them to turn the sprinklers off
in the park next to the house when they wouldnt let me out of
the hospital. They then took the car home, got some stuff out
of the house for me, books to read, and then managed to forget
to lock the house as they left. One of the kids showed up to get
me to do something for them, discovered I wasnt around and
that the door was unlocked and fortunately had enough sense
to ask one of the other neighbours what the problem was.

None of that would have been necessary with a decent lock system
and me being able to monitor what is going on in the house remotely.

Yes I know which is just another advange of IoT .

Very affordable right now.

So why haven't you go it. ?

Because there arent any buyable locks
that can do that with my patio doors.

So your doors are so special you can't have a decent locking system on them..
Then change the patio doors.


Not even that easy to modify the ones that are available
either, the current key locks are quite small and the buyable
electronic locks dont come even close to fitting and work
very differently too.

So someone needs to update the design don;t they.

The patio door locks grab a solid 15mmish
bolt thing with a piece cut out of it that is screwed into the
5x3"RHS vertical that forms the frame of all the patio doors.

The currently available electronic locks dont work for sliding doors.

Which is why you need clever peole in unis and other places desgning these things so manufacters can make them and supply them.


I know here it cost £100 to have a door maglocked and
that's if you have the rest of the system already installed.

It doesnt cost that much for an electronic striker for patio doors.

So put one in.


But the problem is that the current keyed locks are entirely
on the door itself.

change the door or is that beyond you.


There is nothing but that completely
passive 15mmish bolt thing that is screwed to the 5x3" RHS
vertical that is fixed. So not that easy to do an electronic striker.

The get someone that knows what they are doing.

On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 19:02:14 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 10:30:05 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
....
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably moved
on
in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to
use
your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and
would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been doing
some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase
involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two bathrooms/toilets
which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the
ceiling.
Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the
light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no
longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is still
around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply
spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from
another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop in
swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way of
having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get it
going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt
cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

Nope, the patio door locks are the only reason I havent done it yet.

So nothing to do with it;s not worth the cost

I dont even consider that with something like that.

You don't consider the cost ? or what is it you don't consider ?


Same with a decent smartphone that I use every day either.

I dont use smartphones not everyday or even every week so I'm nit sure what you're refering to here.



Or even with the ****ing mouse I use every day that I was
prepared to spend $100 on hoping that it would be a very
decent reliable product and discovered that Logitech is
actually stupid enough to keep using grotty little microswitches
that start double clicking instead of single clicking in months
and are too stupid to have a proper debounce system in the
software.

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the point.
But I've never spend that much on a mouse that doesnt; work mine are standard cheap mice about £10-£15, I havne't the need to spend any more on a mouse.
It could be the user rather than the product.
Did you not check some reviews on teh mouse before getting it ?



Fortunately with the very long 5 year warrantys
and their tendency to keep redoing the design functionality
wise they often can't replace it when it fails so I get a full
refund and have essentially had the use of it for free.

I'd rather have a cheap owrking mouse than an expensive one that double-clicks that I send back and get a similar replacement.




I can understadn the advantages in a hotel but not
for home until the costs comes down significantly.

Yeah, but you are too stupid to even have a mobile phone.

I do have a modile phone.



Because there arent any buyable locks
that can do that with my patio doors.

So your doors are so special

Nope, patio doors do the locks differently, ****wit.

So patio doors can't be alarmed is that it ?


you can't have a decent locking system on them.

They currently have a decent locking system, ****wit.

So what's the problem ?




Not even that easy to modify the ones that are available
either, the current key locks are quite small and the buyable
electronic locks dont come even close to fitting and work
very differently too.

So someone needs to update the design don;t they.

Not even possible because of how small they are.

Yeah sure.


The patio door locks grab a solid 15mmish
bolt thing with a piece cut out of it that is screwed into the
5x3"RHS vertical that forms the frame of all the patio doors.

The currently available electronic locks dont work for sliding doors.

Which is why you need clever peole in unis and other places desgning
these things so manufacters can make them and supply them.

None of that mechanical stuff is done in unis.

What do you mean not done of course it is. Even we still have our mecanical workshop, thye have lathes CNC macachine, we fabricate antennas the studetns 'design' and we test them.
If it for teh commercail market then it;'s usually done in those companies and it's call R&D.


I know here it cost £100 to have a door maglocked and
that's if you have the rest of the system already installed.

It doesnt cost that much for an electronic striker for patio doors.

But the problem is that the current keyed locks are entirely
on the door itself.

change the door

Changing the door doesnt change that, ****wit.

How doesn't it, if the lock is on the door. as you said "entirely
on the door itself"

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 19:02:14 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 10:30:05 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably
moved
on
in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to
use
your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and
would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been
doing
some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase
involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two
bathrooms/toilets
which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the
ceiling.
Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the
light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no
longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is
still
around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply
spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from
another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop
in
swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way
of
having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get
it
going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need
another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt
cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

Nope, the patio door locks are the only reason I havent done it yet.

So nothing to do with it;s not worth the cost

I dont even consider that with something like that.

You don't consider the cost ?

No unless its outrageous, and it isnt.

or what is it you don't consider ?

The cost, unless its outrageous, and it isnt.

Same with a decent smartphone that I use every day either.

I dont use smartphones not everyday or even every week

Yes, you actually are that stupid.

so I'm nit sure what you're refering to here.

The cost of smartphones, ****wit.

Or even with the ****ing mouse I use every day that I was
prepared to spend $100 on hoping that it would be a very
decent reliable product and discovered that Logitech is
actually stupid enough to keep using grotty little microswitches
that start double clicking instead of single clicking in months
and are too stupid to have a proper debounce system in the
software.

Microswitches should debounce themselves really

Even sillier than you usually manage.

that's partly the point.

Even sillier than you usually manage.

But I've never spend that much on a mouse that doesnt; work

They do work for quite a while and when you get a full refund
when they can't supply a replacement, the price is irrelevant
because you have had the use of it for just the loss of the trivial
amount of interest that you have lost on the mouse.

mine are standard cheap mice about £10-£15,

Those are much worse mice to use.

I havne't the need to spend any more on a mouse.
It could be the user rather than the product.

Nope, there wouldnt be so many having the same problem
if it was the user. And nothing the user does can make the
microswitch double click when it should be single clicking anyway.

Did you not check some reviews on teh mouse before getting it ?

Yes, but the other mice had other downsides.

Fortunately with the very long 5 year warrantys
and their tendency to keep redoing the design functionality
wise they often can't replace it when it fails so I get a full
refund and have essentially had the use of it for free.

I'd rather have a cheap owrking mouse than an expensive one
that double-clicks that I send back and get a similar replacement.

Depends on how long it takes to start double clicking again.

I can understadn the advantages in a hotel but not
for home until the costs comes down significantly.

Yeah, but you are too stupid to even have a mobile phone.

I do have a modile phone.

Yeah, but you are too stupid to even have a smartphone.

reams of your even sillier **** flushed where it belongs

On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 11:12:55 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 19:02:14 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 10:30:05 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
....
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably
moved
on
in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able to
use
your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho and
would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been
doing
some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase
involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two
bathrooms/toilets
which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the
ceiling.
Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the
light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no
longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is
still
around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't supply
spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes from
another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy drop
in
swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy way
of
having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and get
it
going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need
another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some dirt
cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

Nope, the patio door locks are the only reason I havent done it yet..

So nothing to do with it;s not worth the cost

I dont even consider that with something like that.

You don't consider the cost ?

No unless its outrageous, and it isnt.

or what is it you don't consider ?

The cost, unless its outrageous, and it isnt.

Same with a decent smartphone that I use every day either.

I dont use smartphones not everyday or even every week

Yes, you actually are that stupid.

because I have little need for one. Some have a need for two or more.
Some can managed with a pay as you got £10 lioke myself, while others need to spend £500+ I have better uses for that sort of money.



so I'm nit sure what you're refering to here.

The cost of smartphones, ****wit.

So what cost are they ?

If we in unis and other places design things as IoT (I have a lab on IOT running now) then we can make sure that smartphones can intereact with all sorts of things in teh fiture rather than yuor prefered method of buying a dedicated remote for each device you want to control.



But I've never spend that much on a mouse that doesnt; work

They do work for quite a while and when you get a full refund
when they can't supply a replacement, the price is irrelevant
because you have had the use of it for just the loss of the trivial
amount of interest that you have lost on the mouse.

But you've lost the use of a working mouse.


mine are standard cheap mice about £10-£15,

Those are much worse mice to use.

OK for me what's the advantage of a $100 mouse, at work I'm still using the mouse that came with the iMac I'm using.


I havne't the need to spend any more on a mouse.
It could be the user rather than the product.

Nope, there wouldnt be so many having the same problem
if it was the user.

If three's a problem with a $100 mosue why are people buyinh it, because they are stupid ?

And nothing the user does can make the
microswitch double click when it should be single clicking anyway.

So they used a crap microswitch and charge yuou $100 for the mouse more fool you, buy a mouse with a better microswitch.


Did you not check some reviews on teh mouse before getting it ?

Yes, but the other mice had other downsides.

I;d thought clicking was a prettyy important thing to be able to do and would be top my requirements.
I cetainly wouldn't pay $100 for one that didn;t do what I expected.



Fortunately with the very long 5 year warrantys
and their tendency to keep redoing the design functionality
wise they often can't replace it when it fails so I get a full
refund and have essentially had the use of it for free.

I'd rather have a cheap owrking mouse than an expensive one
that double-clicks that I send back and get a similar replacement.

Depends on how long it takes to start double clicking again.

Yes it does, once every year or so isn't too bad, but mines been working nearly 2 years at work no idea about teh one at home 4-5 years or so.
If it stopped working I;'d get anothe rin about 5mins rather than have to send it back even for a free repair for me would be too much hassle.



I can understadn the advantages in a hotel but not
for home until the costs comes down significantly.

Yeah, but you are too stupid to even have a mobile phone.

I do have a modile phone.

Yeah, but you are too stupid to even have a smartphone.

Too smart to have a smartphone.

reams of your even sillier **** flushed where it belongs

On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 10:43:28 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the point.

and another topic.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 11:12:55 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 19:02:14 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 10:30:05 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message


The technology for this sort of thing has probably
moved
on
in
the
13 years. :-)

To some extent, particularly with you now being able
to
use
your
mobile
phone to do it. Not sure how many would bother tho
and
would
prefer
a wired one still.

I've just bought a house for the kids and have been
doing
some
of
the usual maintenance stuff that any house purchase
involves
when
the house isnt a new build. It has two
bathrooms/toilets
which
both
have those combined light/fan/heater things in the
ceiling.
Both
are
identical and each have remotes to control the
light/fan/heater.

One of the remotes is long gone and the other was no
longer
working
and had lost its battery cover. The manufacturer is
still
around
but
no
longer does any of those with remotes so can't
supply
spare
remotes.

It is possible to buy the same thing with remotes
from
another
manufacturer, but the chances of it being an easy
drop
in
swap
are very poor and obviously a silly price. No easy
way
of
having
wired switches instead.

I did manage to dissemble the remaining remote and
get
it
going
again, but it may not be viable for long and need
another
anyway.

It would be great if it were possible to get some
dirt
cheap
android smartphones that can replace remotes

well when IoT really takes off you'll be able to
contol
everything
via
a
mobile.

You can right now if you buy the right everythings.

No you can;t not that much is avaible

Plenty is available addon wise for most stuff.

No there isn't not at the price people are willing to pay.

Corse there is.

What about card access to your own home,
do you have card access on your front door.

I dont yet,

That's the 'key' isn't it.

Nope, the patio door locks are the only reason I havent done it
yet.

So nothing to do with it;s not worth the cost

I dont even consider that with something like that.

You don't consider the cost ?

No unless its outrageous, and it isnt.

or what is it you don't consider ?

The cost, unless its outrageous, and it isnt.

Same with a decent smartphone that I use every day either.

I dont use smartphones not everyday or even every week

Yes, you actually are that stupid.

because I have little need for one. Some have a need for two or more.
Some can managed with a pay as you got £10 lioke myself, while others need
to spend £500+ I have better uses for that sort of money.



so I'm nit sure what you're refering to here.

The cost of smartphones, ****wit.

So what cost are they ?

If we in unis and other places design things as IoT (I have a lab on IOT
running now) then we can make sure that smartphones can intereact with all
sorts of things in teh fiture rather than yuor prefered method of buying a
dedicated remote for each device you want to control.

My preferred method is the exact opposite of that and
since you can't even manage to comprehend even the
most basic stuff like that, here goes the chain on the
rest of your even more mindless silly ****.

On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 15:20:58 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 10:43:28 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the point.

and another topic.

That you know **** all about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniat...-action_switch

Switching happens reliably at specific and repeatable positions of the actuator, which is not necessarily true of other mechanisms.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 15:20:58 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 10:43:28 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the
point.

and another topic.

That you know **** all about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniat...-action_switch

Switching happens reliably at specific and repeatable positions of the
actuator, which is not necessarily true of other mechanisms.

Are you suggesting that the switchbounce can be ignored?

whisky-dave wrote
wrote
whisky-dave wrote

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the point.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniat...-action_switch

Switching happens reliably at specific and repeatable positions
of the actuator, which is not necessarily true of other mechanisms.

Irrelevant to the FACT that when ALL of their ****ing mice that use a
microswitch start double clicking, only a terminal ****wit like you would
stupidly claim that those microswitches dont need electronic debouncing.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 11:12:55 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 19:02:14 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 25 October 2016 10:30:05 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 21:02:29 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 12:20:10 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Monday, 24 October 2016 11:43:24 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Thursday, 20 October 2016 19:05:50 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 18 October 2016 21:19:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed
wrote:
"pamela" wrote in message

But I've never spend that much on a mouse that doesnt; work

They do work for quite a while and when you get a full refund
when they can't supply a replacement, the price is irrelevant
because you have had the use of it for just the loss of the trivial
amount of interest that you have lost on the mouse.

But you've lost the use of a working mouse.

Nope, I always have working mice available that
can be used while I get a replacement shipped.

And with a normal replacement, the best suppliers
ship the replacement on a phone call, and you return
the dead one in the packaging that the new one
came in, with the courier person waiting while you
hand him the dead one which they pay for the return of.

mine are standard cheap mice about £10-£15,

Those are much worse mice to use.

OK for me what's the advantage of a $100 mouse,

Lots of programmable buttons, backwards and forwards buttons,
scroll wheel that works both horizontally and vertically.

at work I'm still using the mouse that came with the iMac I'm using.

And that has **** all capability. Something I use all
day every day needs to do everything I do much.

I havne't the need to spend any more on a mouse.
It could be the user rather than the product.

Nope, there wouldnt be so many having
the same problem if it was the user.

If three's a problem with a $100 mosue why are people buyinh it,

Because there is a dearth of alternatives in wireless mice with
those capabilitys that dont have the same problem, and most
of them dont realise the double clicking problem that is endemic
with Logitech mice until they have had more than one.

And nothing the user does can make the microswitch
double click when it should be single clicking anyway.

So they used a crap microswitch

They use a standard microswitch and are
too stupid to debounce it electronically.

The microswitches dont fail physically, and still feel like they
are clicking properly. They just double or triple click because
Logitech is too stupid to debounce them electronically.

buy a mouse with a better microswitch.

It isnt the microswitch thats the problem.

Did you not check some reviews on teh mouse before getting it ?

Yes, but the other mice had other downsides.

I;d thought clicking was a prettyy important thing
to be able to do and would be top my requirements.

They click, ****wit.

Fortunately with the very long 5 year warrantys
and their tendency to keep redoing the design functionality
wise they often can't replace it when it fails so I get a full
refund and have essentially had the use of it for free.

I'd rather have a cheap owrking mouse than an expensive one
that double-clicks that I send back and get a similar replacement.

Depends on how long it takes to start double clicking again.

Yes it does, once every year or so isn't too bad,

And that is what happens.

but mines been working nearly 2 years at work
no idea about teh one at home 4-5 years or so.

But doesnt get used anything like as much as mine do.

If it stopped working I;'d get anothe rin about 5mins rather than have
to send it back even for a free repair for me would be too much hassle.

Even less hassle than getting another. Ring them, the replacement
shows up and you hand the courier the one being replaced.

The double clicking isnt bad enough so the mouse isnt useable
while you wait till the replacement turns up tomorrow.

On Thursday, 27 October 2016 10:12:58 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 15:20:58 UTC+1, tabbypurr wrote:
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 10:43:28 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the point.

and another topic.

That you know **** all about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniat...-action_switch

Switching happens reliably at specific and repeatable positions of the actuator, which is not necessarily true of other mechanisms.

Rodney must be your brother or something.


NT

On Thursday, 27 October 2016 10:53:55 UTC+1, bm wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 15:20:58 UTC+1, wrote:
On Wednesday, 26 October 2016 10:43:28 UTC+1, whisky-dave wrote:

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the
point.

and another topic.

That you know **** all about.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miniat...-action_switch

Switching happens reliably at specific and repeatable positions of the
actuator, which is not necessarily true of other mechanisms.

Are you suggesting that the switchbounce can be ignored?

Yes it can dependant on the application.

On Thursday, 27 October 2016 18:36:26 UTC+1, Rod Speed wrote:
whisky-dave wrote
wrote
whisky-dave wrote

Microswitches should debounce themselves really that's partly the point.