I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.
Also - I recall that some starters had 4 pins. Why?

You know I have no idea about either, but I do remember some lights having
strips, might have been to attempt to stop that wiggling line effect some
tubes have when first put on in a cold room.

All I know about starters is that they are n just basically bimetal strip
switches to try to get the tube to strike then remove that extra kick from
the inductive part of the circuit.
Maybe some double tube fittings had two in one housing?
Brian

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"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.
Also - I recall that some starters had 4 pins. Why?

"Brian Gaff" wrote in
:

You know I have no idea about either, but I do remember some lights
having strips, might have been to attempt to stop that wiggling line
effect some tubes have when first put on in a cold room.

All I know about starters is that they are n just basically bimetal
strip switches to try to get the tube to strike then remove that extra
kick from the inductive part of the circuit.
Maybe some double tube fittings had two in one housing?
Brian


I am thinking back to a Church Hall I helped to care for. It had old 5ft
tubes with bayonet caps on the end. I eventually helped to fit adaptors for
bi-pin and the new tubes sometimes had a metal strip. Not sure if they
needed it.

On Saturday, 15 October 2016 17:10:44 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.

Aided starting with some ballasts. disappeared decades ago

Also - I recall that some starters had 4 pins. Why?

For the heating element in thermal starters.


NT

DerbyBorn wrote:

I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.

In think Mr Flameport has one in his recent youtube video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkgKmjVMesE

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

En el artículo , Andy Burns
escribió:

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

I did, when I was a kid. We had one in the garage, and at school the
hall had them in the ceiling fittings which were waaay high. Well and
truly dates me, I suppose

--
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On Saturday, 15 October 2016 20:27:05 UTC+1, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Andy Burns
escribió:

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

I did, when I was a kid. We had one in the garage, and at school the
hall had them in the ceiling fittings which were waaay high. Well and
truly dates me, I suppose

A shop I know has one still in service. Probably has a PCB filled capacitor too.


NT

"Mike Tomlinson" wrote in message
...
En el artículo , Andy Burns
escribió:

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

I did, when I was a kid. We had one in the garage, and at school the
hall had them in the ceiling fittings which were waaay high. Well and
truly dates me, I suppose

My old chap died 10 years back. AFAIK there's still one working in his shed.
Almost certainly backed up with a few "borrowed" spares

In article ,
Andy Burns writes:
DerbyBorn wrote:

I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.

In think Mr Flameport has one in his recent youtube video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkgKmjVMesE

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

My parents still have two in their loft.
A builder broke one a few years ago, but fortunately I found a spare
tube elsewhere in the loft.

Fluorescent tubes started off with bayonet connectors in this country.
The first commercial size in the UK was the 5' 80W tube. It used the
same ballast as an 80W mercury vapour lamp and same lamp holders as
regular filament lamps, so no new parts were needed to roll these
out during WWII. This was not an ideal power rating from the efficieny
point of view, and 5' tubes were dropped to 65W in 1960, and switched
to bi-pin which all the newer tubes were using by then. In practice,
all the 5' tubes produced during 1960s/1970s were dual rated 65/80W,
and you could buy bi-pin to bayonet cap adapters, to fit them in
older fittings.

(In the US, the first tube size was the 18" 15W 1" diameter tube,
probably due to their lower mains voltage.)

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article 6,
DerbyBorn writes:
I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.

They were used with quickstart and rapidstart control gear, when
mounted away from grounded metalwork. These two control gear types
vanished quite quickly because they were expensive, just to avoid
the flashing at startup. Semi-resonant start replaced them, and
didn't need the earth strip because it starts the tube with twice
mains voltage across it. They can still be found on special tubes
designed for low temperature starting, supplied for use in large
commercial freezers and the like.

BTW, it wasn't just an earthed strip - the whole tube had a
(very slightly) conductive coating, which the strip made the
connection to from the metalic edge on the end connectors.

Also - I recall that some starters had 4 pins. Why?

The very first starters (before glow starters were invented) used
a thermal element. They died out quickly because they were slow
to start and unreliable, so most 4-pin starters actually just have
a glow starter in them, and the other two pins shorted together.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Saturday, 15 October 2016 17:10:44 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
I don't need one but was just wondering what happened to the tubes that
used to have a metallic strip along their length.
Also - I recall that some starters had 4 pins. Why?

Four pin starters have a bi-metallic srip and a resistor to make it work.
Two pin starters are worked by corona discharge in a near vacuum tube.

The metal strip on the tube was to aid starting; it was earthed via a contact on the lampholders.

On Saturday, 15 October 2016 20:27:05 UTC+1, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Andy Burns
escribió:

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

I did, when I was a kid. We had one in the garage, and at school the
hall had them in the ceiling fittings which were waaay high. Well and
truly dates me, I suppose

Yes,I remember them in our local barbers shop in the early fifties. They took a minute or two to start ISTR.

On 16 Oct 2016 07:51, harry wrote:
On Saturday, 15 October 2016 20:27:05 UTC+1, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Andy Burns
escribió:

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

I did, when I was a kid. We had one in the garage, and at school the
hall had them in the ceiling fittings which were waaay high. Well and
truly dates me, I suppose

Yes,I remember them in our local barbers shop in the early fifties. They took a minute or two to start ISTR.

They were in use in the drawing offices at work until the early 70's or
thereabouts.

--
Flying on Per Ardua ad Astra

On Saturday, 15 October 2016 23:19:08 UTC+1, Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article 6,

Also - I recall that some starters had 4 pins. Why?

The very first starters (before glow starters were invented) used
a thermal element. They died out quickly because they were slow
to start and unreliable, so most 4-pin starters actually just have
a glow starter in them, and the other two pins shorted together.

Having used them they aren't slow and they're much more reliable than glowstarters. The reason for their demise was the constant 1w power draw, plus their inability to restart if switched off very briefly.


NT

On Sunday, 16 October 2016 07:51:46 UTC+1, harry wrote:
On Saturday, 15 October 2016 20:27:05 UTC+1, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo , Andy Burns
escribió:

I never saw any tubes with bayonet ends though

I did, when I was a kid. We had one in the garage, and at school the
hall had them in the ceiling fittings which were waaay high. Well and
truly dates me, I suppose

Yes,I remember them in our local barbers shop in the early fifties. They took a minute or two to start ISTR.

then they were very knackered.


NT

Andy Burns wrote in news:e6fc5lFn9ldU1
@mid.individual.net:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkgKmjVMesE

Thanks - I like his stuff. Will go and make some toast and then watch it.

DerbyBorn wrote in
2.236:

Andy Burns wrote in news:e6fc5lFn9ldU1
@mid.individual.net:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkgKmjVMesE

Thanks - I like his stuff. Will go and make some toast and then watch it.


A great video - complete with the bayonet caps! The mention of the voltage
selector on the Choke brought back memories of having once fitted a plug,
you also had to set the voltage selector on many items.

En el artículo , Andrew Gabriel
escribió:

In practice,
all the 5' tubes produced during 1960s/1970s were dual rated 65/80W,
and you could buy bi-pin to bayonet cap adapters, to fit them in
older fittings.

Pic of those adapters he

http://www.lighting-gallery.net/gall...0532/normal_DS
CF3214.JPG

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(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

Mike Tomlinson wrote in news:nV
:

http://www.lighting-gallery.net/gall...0532/normal_DS
CF3214.JPG

It is said tha the bayonet was used because they were already manufactured.
Did other countries go straight to the bi-pin?

On Sunday, 16 October 2016 10:08:48 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:
DerbyBorn wrote in
2.236:

Andy Burns wrote in news:e6fc5lFn9ldU1
@mid.individual.net:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkgKmjVMesE

Thanks - I like his stuff. Will go and make some toast and then watch it.


A great video - complete with the bayonet caps! The mention of the voltage
selector on the Choke brought back memories of having once fitted a plug,
you also had to set the voltage selector on many items.

Back then, there were multiple voltages around the country.
Some places even ran on DC.

Prewar, electricity often came from local factories, mines etc.

En el artículo 6,
DerbyBorn escribió:

It is said tha the bayonet was used because they were already manufactured.
Did other countries go straight to the bi-pin?

I'm not sure, not quite old enough to know

It seems to me likely that the bayonet was chosen as it was a known and
proven design. Putting Edison screws on the ends wouldn't have worked -
if you rotated the tube to fit one end the other would unscrew.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=) systemd: the Linux version of Windows 10
(")_(")

On Sunday, 16 October 2016 18:47:07 UTC+1, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artÃ*culo 6,
DerbyBorn escribió:

It is said tha the bayonet was used because they were already manufactured.
Did other countries go straight to the bi-pin?

I'm not sure, not quite old enough to know

It seems to me likely that the bayonet was chosen as it was a known and
proven design. Putting Edison screws on the ends wouldn't have worked -
if you rotated the tube to fit one end the other would unscrew.

There was a war on. No way were they developing a new connector when they already had one, ready mass produced, that did the job. Factories were for war machinery.


NT

It seems to me likely that the bayonet was chosen as it was a known
and proven design. Putting Edison screws on the ends wouldn't have
worked - if you rotated the tube to fit one end the other would
unscrew.

There was a war on. No way were they developing a new connector when
they already had one, ready mass produced, that did the job. Factories
were for war machinery.


NT


But Continental Europe and the USA would not be using the bayonet - ES was
unsuitable - so did they go directly to Bi Pin?

On Sunday, 16 October 2016 20:51:47 UTC+1, DerbyBorn wrote:

It seems to me likely that the bayonet was chosen as it was a known
and proven design. Putting Edison screws on the ends wouldn't have
worked - if you rotated the tube to fit one end the other would
unscrew.

There was a war on. No way were they developing a new connector when
they already had one, ready mass produced, that did the job. Factories
were for war machinery.

But Continental Europe and the USA would not be using the bayonet - ES was
unsuitable - so did they go directly to Bi Pin?

I believe they did. US history is different, with different tubes and differing terminology. And IIRC sometimes they use our terms used to describe different things.


NT