After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may
be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.

--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

On Tuesday, August 5, 2014 5:23:36 PM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may

be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..



But is anything any better?



Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



whats next best?



Fully integrated, remember.

Excuse my ignorance but what does 'fully integrated' mean in a dishwasher?

Jonathan

On 05/08/14 17:51, Jonathan wrote:

Excuse my ignorance but what does 'fully integrated' mean in a dishwasher?

Jonathan


Another term for "Built in" I think...

In message , at 18:23:14 on
Tue, 5 Aug 2014, Tim Streater remarked:
We'll be going away from built-in when we get our kitchen redone. That
way we can get a door-front control panel instead of the nothing ones
along the door edge. So you get to see the progress of the cycle and
don't have to guess whether it's done or not.

My built-in one beeps when it's done.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at
09:51:57 on Tue, 5 Aug 2014, Jonathan remarked:

Excuse my ignorance but what does 'fully integrated' mean in a dishwasher?

Probably, that it requires you to add a door to the front to match the
rest of your kitchen.
--
Roland Perry

On 05/08/14 17:51, Jonathan wrote:
On Tuesday, August 5, 2014 5:23:36 PM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may

be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..



But is anything any better?



Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



whats next best?



Fully integrated, remember.

Excuse my ignorance but what does 'fully integrated' mean in a dishwasher?

Jonathan

It means you slap a matching front to the rest of your kitchen units on it

So no front mounted controls etc.


--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

On 05/08/2014 19:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

It means you slap a matching front to the rest of your kitchen units on it

So no front mounted controls etc.

Hence the utter bewilderment so common when you are in a kitchen other
than your own and have barely any hint as to what is behind each door.
DW? Fridge? Cupboard? Blank to cover something up? Waste bin? Where the
hell is the freezer?

I suppose gargantuan over-sized US-type fridges do at least make
themselves fairly obvious... :-)

--
Rod

On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may
be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.


Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

--
Dazza

gremlin_95 wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may
be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.


Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

Our dirt cheap integrated Beko has performed faultlessly for several
years now. I'm not at all convinced that more expensive lasts (pro
rata) longer in kitchen equipment.

--
Chris Green
·

Not the wife I'ed imagine....
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Jonathan" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, August 5, 2014 5:23:36 PM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may

be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..



But is anything any better?



Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



whats next best?



Fully integrated, remember.

Excuse my ignorance but what does 'fully integrated' mean in a dishwasher?

Jonathan

On 05/08/14 19:43, polygonum wrote:
On 05/08/2014 19:20, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

It means you slap a matching front to the rest of your kitchen units
on it

So no front mounted controls etc.

Hence the utter bewilderment so common when you are in a kitchen other
than your own and have barely any hint as to what is behind each door.
DW? Fridge? Cupboard? Blank to cover something up? Waste bin? Where the
hell is the freezer?

Well who invited you anyway? ;-)

I suppose gargantuan over-sized US-type fridges do at least make
themselves fairly obvious... :-)

Gross and vulgar items.

The real class is the walk-in freezer-larder



--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

On Tue, 05 Aug 2014 20:30:03 +0100, cl wrote:

gremlin_95 wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we
may be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20
dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.


Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

Our dirt cheap integrated Beko has performed faultlessly for several
years now. I'm not at all convinced that more expensive lasts (pro
rata) longer in kitchen equipment.

But perhaos it catches fire less often



--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £30a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On 05/08/2014 21:40, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

The real class is the walk-in freezer-larder

Where I used to live, two local supermarkets had chilled areas - where
half an aisle or so had flappy curtains at each end and a damned
powerful cooler. Customers really did have to walk through them to get
their butter, cheese and milk. One closed, the other got totally
refurbed - so neither existed even before I left the area.

--
Rod

"Tim Streater" wrote in message
.. .
In article ,
Jonathan wrote:

On Tuesday, August 5, 2014 5:23:36 PM UTC+1, The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we
may be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20
dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.

Excuse my ignorance but what does 'fully integrated' mean in a
dishwasher?

We'll be going away from built-in when we get our kitchen redone. That
way we can get a door-front control panel instead of the nothing ones
along the door edge. So you get to see the progress of the cycle and
don't have to guess whether it's done or not.

Makes more sense to get a built in one that has a
decent indication of when its done like the Bosch does.

"Tim Streater" wrote in message
.. .
In article , Roland Perry
wrote:

In message , at 18:23:14 on
Tue, 5 Aug 2014, Tim Streater remarked:
We'll be going away from built-in when we get our kitchen redone. That
way we can get a door-front control panel instead of the nothing ones
along the door edge. So you get to see the progress of the cycle and
don't have to guess whether it's done or not.

My built-in one beeps when it's done.

OK - so does ours, and normally we run it overnight so it's not an
issue, but during the day we're typically gonna be elsewhere.

By Bosch has what is basically a DONE light.

On 05/08/2014 19:47, gremlin_95 wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may
be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.


Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

+1.

Our strategy has been to go mid-range for WM/DW for the last 20 years or
so; typically Bosch, and it seems to have worked OK.

newshound wrote:
On 05/08/2014 19:47, gremlin_95 wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we may
be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20 dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.


Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

+1.

Our strategy has been to go mid-range for WM/DW for the last 20 years or
so; typically Bosch, and it seems to have worked OK.

Our bog-standard Bosch (free-standing) was bought in 1996 and is still
going strong. One of the wheels supporting the upper tray broke a couple
of years ago - two replacements cost well under a tenner.

--
Mike Barnes
Cheshire, England

On 05/08/2014 19:47, gremlin_95 wrote:
Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

Siemens, Bosch and Neff are essentially the same, no? That's what I
recall anyway and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neff_GmbH#International
suggests it may still be true. Along with Pistos (who?) and Gaggenau.

On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.

http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...n/1-6-9/21-23/

(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)

http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.

Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

On 06/08/14 08:03, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 19:47, gremlin_95 wrote:
Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

Siemens, Bosch and Neff are essentially the same, no? That's what I
recall anyway and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neff_GmbH#International
suggests it may still be true. Along with Pistos (who?) and Gaggenau.

Yes.

There are about 4-5 actual appliance manufacturers.

The Neffs, Beko and the Indesit lot which is whirlpool and hotpoint etc etc.

And Miele


MM. It may be worth listing these.

INDESIT: (Mainly Italian)
Indesit
Hotpoint-Ariston
Scholtès
Stinol
Elco
Termogamma

NEFF (Mainly German)
Bosch
Siemens
Pitsos
Neff
Gaggenau.

ARCELIK (Mainly Turkish)
Arçelik
Beko
Grundig (purchased by Koç Holding which owns Arçelik A.Ş.)[16]
Defy (purchased in July 2011)[17]
Altus
Blomberg
Arctic
Elektra Bregenz
Leisure
Flavel

GLEN DIMPLEX (Anglo Irish)
Belling
Valor
Faber
Galaxy Showers
Burco Catering Equipment
Creda
Dimplex
ewt
Glen
Carmen Personal Care
Goblin
LEC Refrigeration
Morphy Richards
New World (cooking appliance brand)
NOBØ
Redring
Roberts Radio
Stoves
Xpelair

MIELE (German)
Miele.


Feel free to add any more.


--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

On Wednesday, August 6, 2014 8:07:22 AM UTC+1, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



They're not all a grand.



http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...n/1-6-9/21-23/



(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)



http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.



Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

I have an integrated Bosch. It cost £400 and it only washes 7/8ths of the dishes. Our previous Indesit couldn't wash dishes either, it was better at drying them.
If I had a different wife I would have a cupboard with a rack in it and wash the dishes in the sink, and stack them in the rack to drip dry.

On Wednesday, August 6, 2014 8:07:22 AM UTC+1, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



They're not all a grand.



http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...n/1-6-9/21-23/



(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)



http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.



Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

The worst one we have ever had was a Smeg. Absolute rubbish. Bloody baskets would never stay on the runners.

On 06/08/14 09:30, fred wrote:
On Wednesday, August 6, 2014 8:07:22 AM UTC+1, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



They're not all a grand.



http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...n/1-6-9/21-23/



(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)



http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.



Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

The worst one we have ever had was a Smeg. Absolute rubbish. Bloody baskets would never stay on the runners.

MM. Id forgotten smeg. Italian again.

How good are creda?


--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

The Natural Philosopher wrote in
:

On 06/08/14 08:03, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 19:47, gremlin_95 wrote:
Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in
that time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in
operation and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer
models though!

Siemens, Bosch and Neff are essentially the same, no? That's what I
recall anyway and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neff_GmbH#International suggests it may
still be true. Along with Pistos (who?) and Gaggenau.

Yes.

There are about 4-5 actual appliance manufacturers.

The Neffs, Beko and the Indesit lot which is whirlpool and hotpoint
etc etc.

And Miele


MM. It may be worth listing these.

INDESIT: (Mainly Italian)
Indesit
Hotpoint-Ariston
Scholtès
Stinol
Elco
Termogamma

NEFF (Mainly German)
Bosch
Siemens
Pitsos
Neff
Gaggenau.

ARCELIK (Mainly Turkish)
Arçelik
Beko
Grundig (purchased by Koç Holding which owns Arçelik A.Ş.)[16]
Defy (purchased in July 2011)[17]
Altus
Blomberg
Arctic
Elektra Bregenz
Leisure
Flavel

GLEN DIMPLEX (Anglo Irish)
Belling
Valor
Faber
Galaxy Showers
Burco Catering Equipment
Creda
Dimplex
ewt
Glen
Carmen Personal Care
Goblin
LEC Refrigeration
Morphy Richards
New World (cooking appliance brand)
NOBØ
Redring
Roberts Radio
Stoves
Xpelair

MIELE (German)
Miele.


Feel free to add any more.



Gorenje
http://www.gorenje.co.uk/

A huge company that has yet to have much impact in the UK. I have just
bought a fridge (based wholey on the styling) A relation has a washing
machine that he is very please with.

On 06/08/14 10:10, DerbyBorn wrote:
The Natural Philosopher wrote in
:

On 06/08/14 08:03, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 19:47, gremlin_95 wrote:
Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in
that time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in
operation and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer
models though!

Siemens, Bosch and Neff are essentially the same, no? That's what I
recall anyway and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neff_GmbH#International suggests it may
still be true. Along with Pistos (who?) and Gaggenau.

Yes.

There are about 4-5 actual appliance manufacturers.

The Neffs, Beko and the Indesit lot which is whirlpool and hotpoint
etc etc.

And Miele


MM. It may be worth listing these.

INDESIT: (Mainly Italian)
Indesit
Hotpoint-Ariston
Scholtès
Stinol
Elco
Termogamma

NEFF (Mainly German)
Bosch
Siemens
Pitsos
Neff
Gaggenau.

ARCELIK (Mainly Turkish)
Arçelik
Beko
Grundig (purchased by Koç Holding which owns Arçelik A.Ş.)[16]
Defy (purchased in July 2011)[17]
Altus
Blomberg
Arctic
Elektra Bregenz
Leisure
Flavel

GLEN DIMPLEX (Anglo Irish)
Belling
Valor
Faber
Galaxy Showers
Burco Catering Equipment
Creda
Dimplex
ewt
Glen
Carmen Personal Care
Goblin
LEC Refrigeration
Morphy Richards
New World (cooking appliance brand)
NOBØ
Redring
Roberts Radio
Stoves
Xpelair

MIELE (German)
Miele.


Feel free to add any more.



Gorenje
http://www.gorenje.co.uk/

A huge company that has yet to have much impact in the UK. I have just
bought a fridge (based wholey on the styling) A relation has a washing
machine that he is very please with.

MM. apropos of my original post it seems that Creda should be in the
indesit group..



--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

In article , Bob Eager
scribeth thus
On Tue, 05 Aug 2014 20:30:03 +0100, cl wrote:

gremlin_95 wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
After years of crap/repairs and 2 years of it not working at all, we
may be able to afford to replace the utterly **** hotpoint BC20
dishwasher..

But is anything any better?

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

whats next best?

Fully integrated, remember.


Siemens/Bosch/Neff; we've had one for nearly 12 years now and in that
time it has only required a pressure chamber. Very quiet in operation
and performance is great. I can't speak for the newer models though!

Our dirt cheap integrated Beko has performed faultlessly for several
years now. I'm not at all convinced that more expensive lasts (pro
rata) longer in kitchen equipment.

But perhaos it catches fire less often




We had a Hotpoint did that once. Comet where we bought it from didn't
want to know so I took it round there one Saturday afternoon and dumped
it in their shop and started having a rant in front of other customers .

Amazing how a full refund was made there and then.



Never again went there, then they went tits up and good riddance!...

--
Tony Sayer

In article , Jon Connell
scribeth thus
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.

http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...d_dishwashers-
miele-built_in/1-6-9/21-23/

(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)

http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.

Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

Must admit we bought a Miele washing machine later last year, best part
of a big 'un it was too but the quality of it is in a different league.

Feels it will last forever and a day...

--
Tony Sayer

In article , fred
scribeth thus
On Wednesday, August 6, 2014 8:07:22 AM UTC+1, Jon Connell wrote:
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...



They're not all a grand.



http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...ard_dishwasher
s-miele-built_in/1-6-9/21-23/



(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)



http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.



Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

The worst one we have ever had was a Smeg. Absolute rubbish. Bloody baskets
would never stay on the runners.

We've had a Siemens and it works very well, and after several years its
not been a problem at all...

--
Tony Sayer

tony sayer wrote:
In , Jon Connell
scribeth thus
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.

http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...d_dishwashers-
miele-built_in/1-6-9/21-23/

(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)

http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.

Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

Must admit we bought a Miele washing machine later last year, best part
of a big 'un it was too but the quality of it is in a different league.

Feels it will last forever and a day...


Well, not integrated, but we bought a Hoover 6612 a couple of years ago
and it's the best dishwasher we've ever owned. It will stack and wash 4
days for us, the previous Bauknecht never managed more than 3. The wash
quality we find to be very good. Not sure who owns the brand these days,
it may be Whirlpool.

To be honest, I don't think that a bad experience with one mode from a
brand has any bearing on other models a few years later. (Miele excepted)
as you don't know where it was designed (but does that tell you anything
anyway) and may not know where it was banged together. Things are changing
all the time (Value Engineering) and many components are bought in generic
parts. I guess that circuit boards for example come from one of 3 or 4
board manufacturers.

I think it comes down to: Do you like the appearance? Do you like the
control functions and logic.

On 06/08/14 11:28, tony sayer wrote:
In article , Jon Connell
scribeth thus
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.

http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...d_dishwashers-
miele-built_in/1-6-9/21-23/

(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)

http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.

Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

Must admit we bought a Miele washing machine later last year, best part
of a big 'un it was too but the quality of it is in a different league.

Feels it will last forever and a day...

well so did we..

I think I am going the other way on the dishwasher. so effin cheap that
if it does break in 2 years it will still be cheaper than a Miele..

White Night is currently top of the list for 'cheap, but actually works'

The instruction manual sounds distinctly oriental in its language and
the giveaway are the chinese characters in the internal PDF description...




--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

On 06/08/14 17:56, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 06/08/14 11:28, tony sayer wrote:
In article , Jon Connell
scribeth thus
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.

http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...d_dishwashers-

miele-built_in/1-6-9/21-23/

(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)

http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various
places.

Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

Must admit we bought a Miele washing machine later last year, best part
of a big 'un it was too but the quality of it is in a different league.

Feels it will last forever and a day...

well so did we..

I think I am going the other way on the dishwasher. so effin cheap that
if it does break in 2 years it will still be cheaper than a Miele..

White Night is currently top of the list for 'cheap, but actually works'

The instruction manual sounds distinctly oriental in its language and
the giveaway are the chinese characters in the internal PDF description...





If you want Chinese - look for Haier. In China that is regarded as a
"Bosch" level of make by my brother in law. Now they market direct to
the UK - seem their products in several stores.

In article , The Natural Philosopher
scribeth thus
On 06/08/14 11:28, tony sayer wrote:
In article , Jon Connell
scribeth thus
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.

http://ao.com/l/standard_dishwashers...dard_dishwashe
rs-
miele-built_in/1-6-9/21-23/

(or http://tinyurl.com/pe3cb9w)

http://www.miele.co.uk/dishwashers/g4280-vi-47/ is £725 at various places.

Sorry, my answer to what appliance questions is always Miele.

Must admit we bought a Miele washing machine later last year, best part
of a big 'un it was too but the quality of it is in a different league.

Feels it will last forever and a day...

well so did we..

I think I am going the other way on the dishwasher. so effin cheap that
if it does break in 2 years it will still be cheaper than a Miele..

White Night is currently top of the list for 'cheap, but actually works'

The instruction manual sounds distinctly oriental in its language and
the giveaway are the chinese characters in the internal PDF description...





With our rental properties I look on the washing machine to cost
somewhere around c.£300 and should last for 3 years, so 100 quid a year.
Anything over that I consider bonus time as getting the only repair
bloke around out, comes back as either can't get the parts and/or by the
time I've charged you for the parts and my time thats going over the ton
by a bit so the economics of it dictate new every three years...

Plus its a few brownie points to our tenants that we're such good
landlords;!

FWIW...
--
Tony Sayer

..

On 06/08/2014 10:45, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

MM. apropos of my original post it seems that Creda should be in the
indesit group..

Hotpoint dishwashers were for many years rebadged Bosch - so that
crossed group boundaries. :-) (No idea if they still are. Anyone know?)

--
Rod

"DerbyBorn" wrote in message
2.236...
To be honest, I don't think that a bad experience with one mode from a
brand has any bearing on other models a few years later. (Miele excepted)
as you don't know where it was designed (but does that tell you anything
anyway) and may not know where it was banged together. Things are changing
all the time (Value Engineering) and many components are bought in generic
parts. I guess that circuit boards for example come from one of 3 or 4
board manufacturers.

I think it comes down to: Do you like the appearance?
Do you like the control functions and logic.

And just as important, does it get a good result.

On 06/08/14 21:30, polygonum wrote:
On 06/08/2014 10:45, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

MM. apropos of my original post it seems that Creda should be in the
indesit group..

Hotpoint dishwashers were for many years rebadged Bosch - so that
crossed group boundaries. :-) (No idea if they still are. Anyone know?)


They are all indesit these days.

Italian crap - not what they were. I don't think they were ever Bosch.

"GEC was eventually transformed into Marconi plc, from which Indesit
(then called Merloni Elettrodomestici) bought 50% of GDA (Hotpoint and
Creda) on 21 December 2001 for £121m. At this point, Hotpoint employed
around 7,000 people at its four UK sites, three of which have
subsequently closed. Indesit UK has been based at Peterborough since 1
June 2003. At the beginning of 2007, Indesit completely took over
Hotpoint and merged it into its own historic brand Ariston, creating a
single entity known as Hotpoint-Ariston, Hotpoint now existing as a
branding on imported products. In 2008, the Indesit Company acquired the
final quota of shares from General Electric for US$ 57,120,000.[3] From
late 2011, Indesit rolled out the Hotpoint brand name across Europe -
replacing the Ariston & Hotpoint-Ariston names."

'Hotpoint now existing as a branding on imported products' may possibly
include Bosch, but I don't think so.


Bosch was a seimens Bosch joint venture.

Of course, like many things the possibility of Bosch and Indesit
sourcing parts from common suppliers definitely exists.

After all, there are in the car industry only about three gearbox
manufacturers in Europe that make boxes for 15 different car 'brands'
under at least 4 multinational ownerships.

And only about 4 injection systems too..

And only two designs. Sporty box, boring box ;-)



--
Everything you read in newspapers is absolutely true, except for the
rare story of which you happen to have first-hand knowledge. €“ Erwin Knoll

tony sayer wrote in
news
In article , The Natural Philosopher
scribeth thus
On 06/08/14 11:28, tony sayer wrote:
In article , Jon Connell
scribeth thus
On 05/08/2014 17:23, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Miele at a grand would be nice...if I had a grand...

They're not all a grand.



With our rental properties I look on the washing machine to cost
somewhere around c.£300 and should last for 3 years, so 100 quid a
year. Anything over that I consider bonus time as getting the only
repair bloke around out, comes back as either can't get the parts
and/or by the time I've charged you for the parts and my time thats
going over the ton by a bit so the economics of it dictate new every
three years...

Plus its a few brownie points to our tenants that we're such good
landlords;!

FWIW...

Very sensible - to some people it seems a matter of principle that they
have something that lasts a long time. I am on my third Indesit after
nearly 40 years. Can't complain if it falls apart tomorrow.

tony sayer wrote:
With our rental properties I look on the washing machine to cost
somewhere around c.£300 and should last for 3 years, so 100 quid a year.
Anything over that I consider bonus time as getting the only repair
bloke around out, comes back as either can't get the parts and/or by the
time I've charged you for the parts and my time thats going over the ton
by a bit so the economics of it dictate new every three years...

Yep, usually with the cheapo ones the standard answer is 'beyond economic
repair' so why have the hassle of scheduling a visit when that's very likely
to be the answer anyway. Even if the tenant is doing something stupid
(seems like lots of people complain their heating doesn't work - probably
because to many people heating systems and heating controllers seem to be
designed by Martians).

Economics changes a bit if you can drop by and give it the once over first.

Theo

In article , Theo Markettos
scribeth thus
tony sayer wrote:
With our rental properties I look on the washing machine to cost
somewhere around c.£300 and should last for 3 years, so 100 quid a year.
Anything over that I consider bonus time as getting the only repair
bloke around out, comes back as either can't get the parts and/or by the
time I've charged you for the parts and my time thats going over the ton
by a bit so the economics of it dictate new every three years...

Yep, usually with the cheapo ones the standard answer is 'beyond economic
repair' so why have the hassle of scheduling a visit when that's very likely
to be the answer anyway. Even if the tenant is doing something stupid
(seems like lots of people complain their heating doesn't work - probably
because to many people heating systems and heating controllers seem to be
designed by Martians).

Yes thats why we have KISS one's

I know where your coming from. I suppose makers think the more gee-gaw's
they put on a bit of gear the better it'll sell whereas really the
installer doesn't want any call-backs to erode his margins...

Economics changes a bit if you can drop by and give it the once over first.

Yes we do and most all of them have RTFM;!.

Some even check the output filter ;!.....

Theo

--
Tony Sayer

In message , at 12:19:53 on Thu,
7 Aug 2014, Theo Markettos remarked:
With our rental properties I look on the washing machine to cost
somewhere around c.£300 and should last for 3 years, so 100 quid a year.
Anything over that I consider bonus time as getting the only repair
bloke around out, comes back as either can't get the parts and/or by the
time I've charged you for the parts and my time thats going over the ton
by a bit so the economics of it dictate new every three years...

Yep, usually with the cheapo ones the standard answer is 'beyond economic
repair' so why have the hassle of scheduling a visit when that's very likely
to be the answer anyway.

The most likely issue is the water feed starting to leak. Tenants (and
householders who don't care) seem to be able to indefinitely put off
fixing such things (just a pair or grippers on the nut).

Even if the tenant is doing something stupid (seems like lots of people
complain their heating doesn't work - probably because to many people
heating systems and heating controllers seem to be designed by
Martians).

At my daughter's last-year rented flat the only way to get any access to
the boiler (or its controls) was by emptying out the free-standing
fridge/freezer and shifting it four feet into the middle of the kitchen.
--
Roland Perry