A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

In the US they have a very good solution "Whole-House fans" when temp
drops outside in the evening you switch these on, being fitted on
upstairs ceiling it vents the warmest air in the house into attic space,
this air then being replaced by air form downstairs windows being put in
vent position.
Explanation video & installation video on this page:
http://www.tamtech.com/Whole-House-Fan-Videos.asp

I have been unable to find a manufacturer in Europe .... anybody out
there know of one ?
Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot more
problematic.

Welcome comments from anyone who may have looked into this.

I could buy the US items and run off a 220 - 110V converter .. but it
would not be cheap to ship over plus 20% VAT on import.





--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

Rick Hughes scribbled...


A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

In the US they have a very good solution "Whole-House fans" when temp
drops outside in the evening you switch these on, being fitted on
upstairs ceiling it vents the warmest air in the house into attic space,
this air then being replaced by air form downstairs windows being put in
vent position.
Explanation video & installation video on this page:
http://www.tamtech.com/Whole-House-Fan-Videos.asp

I have been unable to find a manufacturer in Europe .... anybody out
there know of one ?
Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot more
problematic.

Welcome comments from anyone who may have looked into this.

I could buy the US items and run off a 220 - 110V converter .. but it
would not be cheap to ship over plus 20% VAT on import.


Not looking in the right place ?

http://www.homeairconditioning.co.uk...entilation.asp

On 16/06/2014 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

That isn't right then. Is it ingress of heat from the roof or trapping
heat in the rooms from the sun coming through the bedroom windows?

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 13:01:04 +0100, Rick Hughes
wrote:

A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

Leave a couple of upstairs windows open on different sides of the house.

Keep curtains closed on the sunny side of the house

Cross ventilate the loft space with a large slow running fan

Add overhangs to the windows so you only get solar gain in spring autumn and
winter

Reflective coatings on the glass


--

On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 13:01:04 +0100
Rick Hughes wrote:

Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot
more problematic.

The fan we had in a rented house in Kansas City had louvres that were
spring loaded, or even maybe gravity operated, and they just opened when
the fan began sucking air. No actuators required.

The fan was wonderful, even though it sounded like a jet taking off,
but it didn't need to be on for long.

--
Davey.

On 16/06/14 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

On 16/06/2014 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

In the US they have a very good solution "Whole-House fans" when temp
drops outside in the evening you switch these on, being fitted on
upstairs ceiling it vents the warmest air in the house into attic space,
this air then being replaced by air form downstairs windows being put in
vent position.
Explanation video & installation video on this page:
http://www.tamtech.com/Whole-House-Fan-Videos.asp

I have been unable to find a manufacturer in Europe .... anybody out
there know of one ?
Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot more
problematic.

Welcome comments from anyone who may have looked into this.

I could buy the US items and run off a 220 - 110V converter .. but it
would not be cheap to ship over plus 20% VAT on import.


On my list of things to do, is to mount a large fan into a spare loft
hatch, and then just slot this into place in the summer, and run when
required - this might be an easier approach!

--
Toby...
Remove your pants to reply

In article ,
Martin Brown writes:
On 16/06/2014 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

That isn't right then. Is it ingress of heat from the roof or trapping
heat in the rooms from the sun coming through the bedroom windows?

Well known problem with many modern houses - they have no internal
heat capacity, and so only a small amount of energy getting in
causes a significant temperature rise. Lack of loft insulation
would make it very bad (radiating heat from the hot ceiling), but
even with loft insulation, it can be a major problem.

I have two loft hatches - the summer one has a 10" Expelair fan
mounted in it. This was originally done for another reason - I had
some computers in there when I worked for Sun, and it was to try
and stop the temperature up there climbing over 40C. Computers
long since gone, but I still use it to help cool the upstairs if
it gets hot.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 16/06/2014 13:14, Jabba wrote:
Rick Hughes scribbled...


A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

In the US they have a very good solution "Whole-House fans" when temp
drops outside in the evening you switch these on, being fitted on
upstairs ceiling it vents the warmest air in the house into attic space,
this air then being replaced by air form downstairs windows being put in
vent position.
Explanation video & installation video on this page:
http://www.tamtech.com/Whole-House-Fan-Videos.asp

I have been unable to find a manufacturer in Europe .... anybody out
there know of one ?
Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot more
problematic.

Welcome comments from anyone who may have looked into this.

I could buy the US items and run off a 220 - 110V converter .. but it
would not be cheap to ship over plus 20% VAT on import.


Not looking in the right place ?

http://www.homeairconditioning.co.uk...entilation.asp


Unfortunately no ..... I already have a full whole house heat recovery
system ... which is what this unit is part of.
Works very well, includes 4 stage filtration including electrostatic ..
other than when hot ... then it does not bring in enough cool air even
on high speed.

I have this system ...
http://www.rega-uk.com/heat-recovery...ation-hrv.html
using this heat exchanger unit:
http://login.blackboxcms.co.uk/clien...ng%20Units.pdf


The original design allowed for addition of a 'cooling' module to cool
incoming air (not air-con just allowing several degree temp drop)

The company never produced the module though.


--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 13:43, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

That isn't right then. Is it ingress of heat from the roof or trapping
heat in the rooms from the sun coming through the bedroom windows?


Heat from downstairs rises .. so all heat gain during day ... ends up
'upstairs' even though Pilk-K glass used throughout, still a lot of
heat gain.

You can feel significant difference walking form downstairs to upstairs
.... only when it has been really hot day .. and house been soaking up sun.

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 15:50, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Well known problem with many modern houses - they have no internal
heat capacity, and so only a small amount of energy getting in
causes a significant temperature rise. Lack of loft insulation
would make it very bad (radiating heat from the hot ceiling), but
even with loft insulation, it can be a major problem.

I have two loft hatches - the summer one has a 10" Expelair fan
mounted in it. This was originally done for another reason - I had
some computers in there when I worked for Sun, and it was to try
and stop the temperature up there climbing over 40C. Computers
long since gone, but I still use it to help cool the upstairs if
it gets hot.



I have very high levels of wall & loft insulation (sprayed in 450mm
Warmcell)
The issue is as you say it gains heat during the day and being
Timberframe internal (brick external) it does not lose heat easily.


The outerwalls are also like huge heatsinks ...walk past outer S & W
wall in evening after sunny day and wall is putting out tons of heat ...
I know this is outside, but it does mean warm inside rooms even more
difficult to lose heat.

The fan on loft hatch is almost same thing .... just whole house fans
take it a little further with opening shutters & remote speed control

The only loft access is ion sons bedroom he may not like noise of fan ..
so a ceiling mounted extract above stairwell may be answer.


--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 13:56, The Other Mike wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 13:01:04 +0100, Rick Hughes
wrote:

A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

Leave a couple of upstairs windows open on different sides of the house.

with whole house ventilation not supposed to do this as it unbalances
the system.



Keep curtains closed on the sunny side of the house

eE do, plus blinds fitted


Cross ventilate the loft space with a large slow running fan

Not sure that would have much effect due to high levels of insulation in
loft


Add overhangs to the windows so you only get solar gain in spring autumn and
winter

Reflective coatings on the glass

all glass is K-Glass






--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 14:06, Davey wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 13:01:04 +0100
Rick Hughes wrote:

Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot
more problematic.

The fan we had in a rented house in Kansas City had louvres that were
spring loaded, or even maybe gravity operated, and they just opened when
the fan began sucking air. No actuators required.

The fan was wonderful, even though it sounded like a jet taking off,
but it didn't need to be on for long.



That is my thought, put it on at sundown .. and run it long enough to
vent the layer of hot air.

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.




Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build



--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 15:42, Huge wrote:
On 2014-06-16, Toby wrote:


On my list of things to do, is to mount a large fan into a spare loft
hatch, and then just slot this into place in the summer, and run when
required - this might be an easier approach!

Already tried it. It made next to no difference.



What sort of size & power fan did you try this with, out of interest -
and is the loft reasonable well ventilated?

--
Toby...
Remove your pants to reply

On 16/06/2014 17:07, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.


Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build

Grow ivy or climbing plants up the S & SW facing sides?

Install external shutters on the windows... or roller blinds.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 16/06/14 17:07, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.




Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build



timber frame here too. BUT a lot of masonry fireplaces small windows and
overhanging eaves.


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 15:50, Andrew Gabriel wrote:

Well known problem with many modern houses - they have no internal
heat capacity, and so only a small amount of energy getting in
causes a significant temperature rise. Lack of loft insulation
would make it very bad (radiating heat from the hot ceiling), but
even with loft insulation, it can be a major problem.

I have two loft hatches - the summer one has a 10" Expelair fan
mounted in it. This was originally done for another reason - I had
some computers in there when I worked for Sun, and it was to try
and stop the temperature up there climbing over 40C. Computers
long since gone, but I still use it to help cool the upstairs if
it gets hot.



I have very high levels of wall & loft insulation (sprayed in 450mm
Warmcell)
The issue is as you say it gains heat during the day and being
Timberframe internal (brick external) it does not lose heat easily.


The outerwalls are also like huge heatsinks ...walk past outer S & W
wall in evening after sunny day and wall is putting out tons of heat ...
I know this is outside, but it does mean warm inside rooms even more
difficult to lose heat.

The fan on loft hatch is almost same thing .... just whole house fans
take it a little further with opening shutters & remote speed control

The only loft access is ion sons bedroom he may not like noise of fan ..
so a ceiling mounted extract above stairwell may be answer.



Why not fit an air conditioner to one of the rooms? With the doors open
it will cool quite a large area.

On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 16/06/14 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.



We recently had the 9 inch solid walls of our house insulated with 90mm
EPS board and finished with the light weight render. We never really had
any overheating problems prior to this but everyone has noticed the
house is much cooler! Whether 9 inch solid walls are classed as 'a lot'
of thermal mass I don't know but we certainly notice it is cooler than
other houses that have the insulation applied internally or are of a
different construction.

--
Dazza

On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 16:42:57 +0100
Rick Hughes wrote:

The original design allowed for addition of a 'cooling' module to
cool incoming air (not air-con just allowing several degree temp drop)

The company never produced the module though.

How was that going to work? Evaporation of water? Known colloquially in
industry as a Swamp Cooler, as it cooled the air while raising the
humidity. Only worth doing in dry areas, in which the UK is not
included. Arizona is a decent bet.

--
Davey.

On 16/06/2014 20:31, Davey wrote:
On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 16:42:57 +0100
Rick Hughes wrote:

The original design allowed for addition of a 'cooling' module to
cool incoming air (not air-con just allowing several degree temp drop)

The company never produced the module though.

How was that going to work? Evaporation of water? Known colloquially in
industry as a Swamp Cooler, as it cooled the air while raising the
humidity. Only worth doing in dry areas, in which the UK is not
included. Arizona is a decent bet.



This was a going to be a powered cooler ... compressor based I assume
based of 2.5Kw expected current draw.

What was unclear was where teh waste hot air was going (assume loft space)

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 19:10, Capitol wrote:
Rick Hughes wrote:


Why not fit an air conditioner to one of the rooms? With the doors
open it will cool quite a large area.

It's an option but a lot of noise (I assume in one room)

The original plan was the 'central unit' so no fan noise in rooms.


--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 17:17, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:07, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.


Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build

Grow ivy or climbing plants up the S & SW facing sides?

Install external shutters on the windows... or roller blinds.



Bo***cks to that ... ruins brickwork & pointing




--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

We recently had the 9 inch solid walls of our house insulated with 90mm
EPS board and finished with the light weight render. We never really had
any overheating problems prior to this but everyone has noticed the
house is much cooler! Whether 9 inch solid walls are classed as 'a lot'
of thermal mass I don't know but we certainly notice it is cooler than
other houses that have the insulation applied internally or are of a
different construction.



That is a fair bit of mass ... I had 18" stone walls in previous place
never overheated

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 17:10, Toby wrote:
On 16/06/2014 15:42, Huge wrote:
On 2014-06-16, Toby wrote:


On my list of things to do, is to mount a large fan into a spare loft
hatch, and then just slot this into place in the summer, and run when
required - this might be an easier approach!

Already tried it. It made next to no difference.



What sort of size & power fan did you try this with, out of interest -
and is the loft reasonable well ventilated?

Found a formula for the fan size (in imperial)

[ floor area (sq ft) x room hgt (ft) ] x 30 = cu ft per min
required from fan(s)



--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/14 20:25, gremlin_95 wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 16/06/14 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by day
and open the windows by night.



We recently had the 9 inch solid walls of our house insulated with 90mm
EPS board and finished with the light weight render. We never really had
any overheating problems prior to this but everyone has noticed the
house is much cooler! Whether 9 inch solid walls are classed as 'a lot'
of thermal mass I don't know but we certainly notice it is cooler than
other houses that have the insulation applied internally or are of a
different construction.


+1

I love my concrete kitchen and hall floor and brick inner skin cavity
wall - helps keep things cooler in summer.

If I built a house from scratch and had unlimited money - I would have
9" brick inner leaf, 4" celotex filled cavity and a single brick outer skin.

My floors would be concrete/screed on top of celotex.

On 16/06/2014 20:38, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:17, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:07, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by
day
and open the windows by night.


Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build

Grow ivy or climbing plants up the S & SW facing sides?

Install external shutters on the windows... or roller blinds.

Bo***cks to that ... ruins brickwork & pointing

Only if it is rubbish grade pointing and modern useless bricks.

The point is that plants can keep their own temperature under control in
the sunshine and stop the outer walls becoming storage heaters.

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 19:10, Capitol wrote:
Rick Hughes wrote:


Why not fit an air conditioner to one of the rooms? With the doors
open it will cool quite a large area.

It's an option but a lot of noise (I assume in one room)

The original plan was the 'central unit' so no fan noise in rooms.



Only run in daytime. Never noticed much noise in a double glazed house,
quieter than the average ceiling fan.

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
...
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far, thought
I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year the
upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it does not
cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

In the US they have a very good solution "Whole-House fans" when temp
drops outside in the evening you switch these on, being fitted on upstairs
ceiling it vents the warmest air in the house into attic space, this air
then being replaced by air form downstairs windows being put in vent
position.
Explanation video & installation video on this page:
http://www.tamtech.com/Whole-House-Fan-Videos.asp

I have been unable to find a manufacturer in Europe .... anybody out there
know of one ?
Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot more
problematic.

Welcome comments from anyone who may have looked into this.

I could buy the US items and run off a 220 - 110V converter .. but it
would not be cheap to ship over plus 20% VAT on import.

You just need crossflow ventilation - open all upstairs windows and doors a
few hours before you go to bed and it will take half a dozen degrees off the
upstairs temperature.

I fear it's loft insulation that causes most of this, heat rises upstairs
through the day and can't escape as the loft insulation is now up to a foot
thick in most cases, CWI, thermalite blocks and dry lining prevent most of
the heat getting through the walls

On 16/06/14 21:06, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 20:38, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:17, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:07, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by
day
and open the windows by night.


Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build

Grow ivy or climbing plants up the S & SW facing sides?

Install external shutters on the windows... or roller blinds.

Bo***cks to that ... ruins brickwork & pointing

Only if it is rubbish grade pointing and modern useless bricks.

I would agree.

I have had ivy up one corner of my house on bare London Brick Rustics
(herring bone pattern). Bricks are 1950s.

I chop the ivy off and it grows back. Repeat ad infinitum.

The only damage it's done to the bricks it leave its "roots" stuck all
over them.

The main reason I chop it off is I cannot see out one window and it
tries climbing into the soffits.

OTOH the last house I rented, built in the 90's, when I drilled to put
up some hooks in the garage, lumps if the brick face were coming off and
the brick core was made of cheese.

"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Martin Brown writes:
On 16/06/2014 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

That isn't right then. Is it ingress of heat from the roof or trapping
heat in the rooms from the sun coming through the bedroom windows?

Well known problem with many modern houses - they have no internal
heat capacity, and so only a small amount of energy getting in
causes a significant temperature rise. Lack of loft insulation
would make it very bad (radiating heat from the hot ceiling), but
even with loft insulation, it can be a major problem.

I have two loft hatches - the summer one has a 10" Expelair fan
mounted in it.

Trade name cock up:-)? ie Xpelair

I watched the wholesaler google for it today when I needed a DX400 and two
CF40's.



--
Adam

On 16/06/2014 21:24, Capitol wrote:
Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 19:10, Capitol wrote:
Rick Hughes wrote:


Why not fit an air conditioner to one of the rooms? With the doors
open it will cool quite a large area.

It's an option but a lot of noise (I assume in one room)

The original plan was the 'central unit' so no fan noise in rooms.



Only run in daytime. Never noticed much noise in a double glazed
house, quieter than the average ceiling fan.


That is the issue it is 'at night' we need cooling

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 21:06, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 20:38, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:17, Martin Brown wrote:
On 16/06/2014 17:07, Rick Hughes wrote:
On 16/06/2014 14:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

One option is install a LOT of thermal mass and draw the curtains by
day
and open the windows by night.


Timber frame ... so the opposite is in this build

Grow ivy or climbing plants up the S & SW facing sides?

Install external shutters on the windows... or roller blinds.

Bo***cks to that ... ruins brickwork & pointing

Only if it is rubbish grade pointing and modern useless bricks.

The point is that plants can keep their own temperature under control in
the sunshine and stop the outer walls becoming storage heaters.




Maybe ... but I don't like it ... I think it looks awful on a modern
design house .. realise its a personal thing.

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

On 16/06/2014 21:45, Phil L wrote:


I fear it's loft insulation that causes most of this, heat rises upstairs
through the day and can't escape as the loft insulation is now up to a foot
thick in most cases, CWI, thermalite blocks and dry lining prevent most of
the heat getting through the walls


Just suggested that to wife ... her answer was 'not a chance' too many
gnats would come in ... Plus kids have hayfever .. one of reasons for
Whole House ventilation system with electrostatic filtration.

As temporary solution opened loft door and have desk fan blowing into it
.... certainly felt immediate improvement ... so tends to confirm
principle of whole house fan quickly cools upstairs.

--
UK SelfBuild: http://uk.groups.yahoo.com/group/UK_Selfbuild/

In article ,
"ARW" writes:
"Andrew Gabriel" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Martin Brown writes:
On 16/06/2014 13:01, Rick Hughes wrote:
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far,
thought I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year
the upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it
does not cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

That isn't right then. Is it ingress of heat from the roof or trapping
heat in the rooms from the sun coming through the bedroom windows?

Well known problem with many modern houses - they have no internal
heat capacity, and so only a small amount of energy getting in
causes a significant temperature rise. Lack of loft insulation
would make it very bad (radiating heat from the hot ceiling), but
even with loft insulation, it can be a major problem.

I have two loft hatches - the summer one has a 10" Expelair fan
mounted in it.

Trade name cock up:-)? ie Xpelair

I watched the wholesaler google for it today when I needed a DX400 and two
CF40's.

And I even glanced at it to get the spelling right, *FAIL*

BTW, thanks for the extension lead response - I need to be more
awake than I'm likely to be with this week's workload to digest it.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

In article ,
Rick Hughes writes:
On 16/06/2014 19:10, Capitol wrote:
Rick Hughes wrote:


Why not fit an air conditioner to one of the rooms? With the doors
open it will cool quite a large area.

It's an option but a lot of noise (I assume in one room)

A split one isn't much noise - the compressor is outside.

The original plan was the 'central unit' so no fan noise in rooms.

They're more noise than that. You can usually adjust the fan speed.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 22:38:54 +0100, Rick Hughes wrote:

On 16/06/2014 21:45, Phil L wrote:


I fear it's loft insulation that causes most of this, heat rises
upstairs through the day and can't escape as the loft insulation is now
up to a foot thick in most cases, CWI, thermalite blocks and dry lining
prevent most of the heat getting through the walls


Just suggested that to wife ... her answer was 'not a chance' too many
gnats would come in ... Plus kids have hayfever .. one of reasons for
Whole House ventilation system with electrostatic filtration.

As temporary solution opened loft door and have desk fan blowing into it
... certainly felt immediate improvement ... so tends to confirm
principle of whole house fan quickly cools upstairs.

Fit one or two Velux windows in the loft, and in summer open them to vent
the hot air in the evening. You can get electrical kits to open and close
them.

Then all you need is a big central loft hatch to allow the hot air to rise
from the upstairs into the loft.

Bug screens on the downstairs windows so cool air can flow in.

--
Windows 8.1 on PCSpecialist box

On Mon, 16 Jun 2014 17:06:11 +0100, Rick Hughes
wrote:

On 16/06/2014 13:56, The Other Mike wrote:

Reflective coatings on the glass

all glass is K-Glass

K glass helps reduce heating requirements but makes the situation of unwanted
solar gain far worse than plain glass. Too late now but you might have been
better off with Pilkington Suncool rather than K for large or south facing
windows .

Be interesting to see what happens to the temperatures around the house and in
the loft space with zero contribution from occupancy. Then with the outside
temperature profile and sunshine figure you'll have a better idea of how much
you need to reduce the heat gain and from where.


--

On 16 Jun 2014 19:38:59 GMT
Huge wrote:

How was that going to work? Evaporation of water? Known colloquially
in
industry as a Swamp Cooler, as it cooled the air while raising the
humidity. Only worth doing in dry areas, in which the UK is not
included. Arizona is a decent bet.

I've stayed in a hotel in Arizona with swamp "cooling".

It didn't noticeably do anything.

I'm not surprised, it's a bad concept anywhere. Ford Motor Company used
it a lot for the air supply to its US paint shops, it was terrible. It
was a great humidifier, a bad cooler.

I've seen some places with water piped to spread over the roof to cool
that down by evaporation.

--
Davey.

"Rick Hughes" wrote in message
...
A couple of years back I posted a question .. didn't get very far, thought
I'd try again.

I have a modern highly insulated 2 storey house, and this time of year the
upstairs get very hot .... and with high values of insulation it does not
cool quickly ... bedrooms are very hot.

In the US they have a very good solution "Whole-House fans" when temp
drops outside in the evening you switch these on, being fitted on upstairs
ceiling it vents the warmest air in the house into attic space, this air
then being replaced by air form downstairs windows being put in vent
position.
Explanation video & installation video on this page:
http://www.tamtech.com/Whole-House-Fan-Videos.asp

I have been unable to find a manufacturer in Europe .... anybody out there
know of one ?
Getting fans & remote control would not be difficult, but having
'actuating motors that open the insulated doors would appear a lot more
problematic.

Welcome comments from anyone who may have looked into this.

I could buy the US items and run off a 220 - 110V converter .. but it
would not be cheap to ship over plus 20% VAT on import.

I have a highly insulated house.
I just open some windows.
The reason it remains hot is likely to be stored heat in the house
structure. (Thermal mass)

Whole house ventilation is a waste of space.
A stupid fad that came and went about ten years ago.
I know several people that have it and have shut it down.
As you have now realised, it doesn't work in domestic houses.
Fine in intensively occupied commercial spaces.

The attic will likely be even warmer than anywhere in the house in Summer.