"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...
On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.

... and the presence of aluminium wiring can be a major headache.

Ali can be PITA for voice as well. I get very nervous when ever I see
an Openreach person ferreting about in any of the holes or joints
along the route our pair takes. If it doesn't actually get broken the
crackles from the disturbance can mess up the BRAS, at least if it
does break and voice stops the ADSL being RF can often "leap the gap"
and just about work at 500 kbps or so. At least with Total Care they
come and fix it within 24 hrs 365 days/year. B-)

--
Cheers
Dave.




On Infinity FTTC I've been getting 38Mb download and 9mb upload consistently
for 6 months - my sister has been offered Infinity FTTP - 100Mb and up.

In article , Geoff Pearson
scribeth thus

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ill.co.uk...
On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.

... and the presence of aluminium wiring can be a major headache.

Ali can be PITA for voice as well. I get very nervous when ever I see
an Openreach person ferreting about in any of the holes or joints
along the route our pair takes. If it doesn't actually get broken the
crackles from the disturbance can mess up the BRAS, at least if it
does break and voice stops the ADSL being RF can often "leap the gap"
and just about work at 500 kbps or so. At least with Total Care they
come and fix it within 24 hrs 365 days/year. B-)

--
Cheers
Dave.




On Infinity FTTC I've been getting 38Mb download and 9mb upload consistently
for 6 months - my sister has been offered Infinity FTTP - 100Mb and up.


Indeed .. but does it seem that much faster 'tho?..
--
Tony Sayer

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , Geoff Pearson
scribeth thus

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
hill.co.uk...
On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.

... and the presence of aluminium wiring can be a major headache.

Ali can be PITA for voice as well. I get very nervous when ever I see
an Openreach person ferreting about in any of the holes or joints
along the route our pair takes. If it doesn't actually get broken the
crackles from the disturbance can mess up the BRAS, at least if it
does break and voice stops the ADSL being RF can often "leap the gap"
and just about work at 500 kbps or so. At least with Total Care they
come and fix it within 24 hrs 365 days/year. B-)

--
Cheers
Dave.




On Infinity FTTC I've been getting 38Mb download and 9mb upload
consistently
for 6 months - my sister has been offered Infinity FTTP - 100Mb and up.


Indeed .. but does it seem that much faster 'tho?..
--
Tony Sayer


She didn't take up the offer - as there is no obvious use for such speed.
Who was it said that the UK would manage with half a dozen computers?

On Fri, 11 Oct 2013 09:06:03 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.

They must use line length to the cabinet, otherwise all estimates
would be the same.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.

... and the presence of aluminium wiring can be a major headache.

Ali can be PITA for voice as well. I get very nervous when ever I see
an Openreach person ferreting about in any of the holes or joints
along the route our pair takes. If it doesn't actually get broken the
crackles from the disturbance can mess up the BRAS, at least if it
does break and voice stops the ADSL being RF can often "leap the gap"
and just about work at 500 kbps or so. At least with Total Care they
come and fix it within 24 hrs 365 days/year. B-)

IIRC all total failures of my phone line in the last 10 years have
been immediately after the presence of an Openreach man working
outside my house.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.

... and the presence of aluminium wiring can be a major headache.

Ali can be PITA for voice as well. I get very nervous when ever I see
an Openreach person ferreting about in any of the holes or joints
along the route our pair takes. If it doesn't actually get broken the
crackles from the disturbance can mess up the BRAS, at least if it
does break and voice stops the ADSL being RF can often "leap the gap"
and just about work at 500 kbps or so. At least with Total Care they
come and fix it within 24 hrs 365 days/year. B-)



IIRC all total failures of my phone line in the last 10 years have
been immediately after the presence of an Openreach man working
outside my house.

This must be a record but we've got a VM phone line, still have as part
of the package but usually use VoIP, but since 1996 never known it to
fail;!..
--
Tony Sayer

On Friday 11 October 2013 11:43 Huge wrote in uk.d-i-y:
forgetting to drop the lid of the grain tank before driving under the
overhead to my house & bringing the lot down. When we had the poles
replaced (woodpecker damage - yes, really) we had longer ones, so the
combine can fit under the lines now. Until he buys a bigger combine,
anyway. I've tried to buy the bit of land a couple of times, but he wants
a ridiculous amount of money for it ... as he said to me, "where else are
you going to buy it from?"

As you suurepticiously poured a large bag of sugar into his fuel tank...

--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://squiddy.blog.dionic.net/

http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

Reading this on the web? See:
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=Usenet

On Fri, 11 Oct 2013 09:06:03 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.


As all 6 OR engineers have said the same thing and Plusnet are aware
of it I take it to be the case. My assumption is that BTW decided
that checking the line beyond the cabinet would be too expensive.
As I mentioned earlier Ofcom are aware of the problem but a fix is not
likely until next year. I have asked Plusnet to make it clear in
their estimates that such anomalies can occur and I have just been
told that they are now proposing to do so.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.


According to OR, fibre is much more susceptible to this 'long line
from the cabinet' problem than ADSL.


... and the presence of aluminium wiring can be a major headache.

Ali can be PITA for voice as well. I get very nervous when ever I see
an Openreach person ferreting about in any of the holes or joints
along the route our pair takes. If it doesn't actually get broken the
crackles from the disturbance can mess up the BRAS, at least if it
does break and voice stops the ADSL being RF can often "leap the gap"
and just about work at 500 kbps or so. At least with Total Care they
come and fix it within 24 hrs 365 days/year. B-)

The engineers hate it. Unfortunately when the infrastructure for our
part of the Devon was being created it was during the copper shortage
of the 1970's, so it seems that many others are in a similar position
to me.
--
rbel

In article , rbel ?@?.?
scribeth thus
On Fri, 11 Oct 2013 09:06:03 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.


As all 6 OR engineers have said the same thing and Plusnet are aware
of it I take it to be the case. My assumption is that BTW decided
that checking the line beyond the cabinet would be too expensive.
As I mentioned earlier Ofcom are aware of the problem but a fix is not
likely until next year. I have asked Plusnet to make it clear in
their estimates that such anomalies can occur and I have just been
told that they are now proposing to do so.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.




According to OR, fibre is much more susceptible to this 'long line
from the cabinet' problem than ADSL.

Eh?, you man the copper line length is far more susceptible to the
length of line losses!..

--
Tony Sayer

On 11/10/13 11:34, tony sayer wrote:
In article , rbel ?@?.?
scribeth thus
On Fri, 11 Oct 2013 09:06:03 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Thu, 10 Oct 2013 16:35:12 +0100, rbel wrote:

You should be aware that the speed estimate you are given by your ISP
has the potential to be very inaccurate. The data for all estimates
is sourced from BT Wholesale and does not take into account variables
such as line length from the Fibre cabinet to your property ...

Well if they don't take that into account how can they provide any
estimate at all for the speed. It is that last bit of wire (rather
than glass) that determines the speed on FTTC connections.


As all 6 OR engineers have said the same thing and Plusnet are aware
of it I take it to be the case. My assumption is that BTW decided
that checking the line beyond the cabinet would be too expensive.
As I mentioned earlier Ofcom are aware of the problem but a fix is not
likely until next year. I have asked Plusnet to make it clear in
their estimates that such anomalies can occur and I have just been
told that they are now proposing to do so.

... or whether or not the wiring is aluminium rather than copper.

Our ali does very well but then it is thick ali, looks to be 1 mm dia
rather than the 0.5 mm of "standard" copper.

According to several Openreach engineers I have spoken with speed will
start to fall off much over 1 kilometre from the cabinet ...

Yep, that is about the distance that VDSL has degraded down to ADSL
speeds.




According to OR, fibre is much more susceptible to this 'long line
from the cabinet' problem than ADSL.

Eh?, you man the copper line length is far more susceptible to the
length of line losses!..


I think what he REALLY mnens is that 'ADSL will only do 20Mbps, and we
can cover that on copper up to 500m or so, but VDSL does 160mbps and we
can't get that above 100m or so'


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.