Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 4:21:35 PM UTC, harry wrote:
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.

Sign the e-petition here about this matter.



https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

yes I heard this on the radio this morning, something like 1.6 Billion a year, but I was half asleep or is that half awake.

Strange that considering I was told by someone on here yesyerday that it was run by a charity/charities

whisky-dave wrote:

Strange that considering I was told by someone on here yesyerday that it was run by a charity/charities

Mountain rescue teams, lifeboats etc are run by charities but this
is for the military run SAR you know sea kings/nimrods etc, whose
primary role was retrieval of downed military pilots, civilian SAR was
a (very important) sideshoot to this role.


ASIDE:-
Are the coastgaurd considered as governmental or are they a charity
run thing?

On 29/03/2013 09:21, soup wrote:
whisky-dave wrote:

Strange that considering I was told by someone on here yesyerday that
it was run by a charity/charities

Mountain rescue teams, lifeboats etc are run by charities but this
is for the military run SAR you know sea kings/nimrods etc, whose
primary role was retrieval of downed military pilots, civilian SAR was
a (very important) sideshoot to this role.


ASIDE:-
Are the coastgaurd considered as governmental or are they a charity
run thing?


It is currently part of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency, which is
part of the Department for Transport, although it has been handed around
a number of different Ministries and Departments since the Board of
Trade took it over from the Admiralty in 1923. Its origins were as part
of HM Customs. They have had sub-contracted SAR helicopters at four
bases for quite some time now.

The Coastguard Rescue Service, which does cliff, swift water and mud
rescue and searches for missing people is a volunteer body within HM
Coastguard.

Colin Bignell

Nightjar wrote:

It is currently part of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency, which is
part of the Department for Transport, although it has been handed around
a number of different Ministries and Departments since the Board of
Trade took it over from the Admiralty in 1923. Its origins were as part
of HM Customs. They have had sub-contracted SAR helicopters at four
bases for quite some time now.

The Coastguard Rescue Service, which does cliff, swift water and mud
rescue and searches for missing people is a volunteer body within HM
Coastguard.

Thanks for that.

On Fri, 29 Mar 2013 10:05:35 -0000, Nightjar wrote:

On 29/03/2013 09:21, soup wrote:
whisky-dave wrote:

Strange that considering I was told by someone on here yesyerday that
it was run by a charity/charities

Mountain rescue teams, lifeboats etc are run by charities but this
is for the military run SAR you know sea kings/nimrods etc, whose
primary role was retrieval of downed military pilots, civilian SAR was
a (very important) sideshoot to this role.


ASIDE:-
Are the coastgaurd considered as governmental or are they a charity
run thing?


It is currently part of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency, which is
part of the Department for Transport, although it has been handed around
a number of different Ministries and Departments since the Board of
Trade took it over from the Admiralty in 1923. Its origins were as part
of HM Customs. They have had sub-contracted SAR helicopters at four
bases for quite some time now.

The Coastguard Rescue Service, which does cliff, swift water and mud
rescue and searches for missing people is a volunteer body within HM
Coastguard.

Indeed, so why should we expect search and rescue to be paid for by taxes?

--
On going to war over religion:
You're basically killing each other to see who's got the better imaginary friend. -- Richard Jeni

On Apr 2, 12:40*pm, "Major Scott" wrote:
On Fri, 29 Mar 2013 10:05:35 -0000, Nightjar wrote:
On 29/03/2013 09:21, soup wrote:
* *whisky-dave wrote:

Strange that considering I was told by someone on here yesyerday that
it was run by a charity/charities

* *Mountain rescue teams, lifeboats *etc are run by charities but this
is for the military run SAR you know sea kings/nimrods etc, whose
primary role was retrieval of downed military pilots, civilian SAR was
a (very important) sideshoot to this role.

ASIDE:-
* Are the coastgaurd considered as governmental or are they a charity
run thing?

It is currently part of the Maritime and Coastguard Agency, which is
part of the Department for Transport, although it has been handed around
a number of different Ministries and Departments since the Board of
Trade took it over from the Admiralty in 1923. Its origins were as part
of HM Customs. They have had sub-contracted SAR helicopters at four
bases for quite some time now.

The Coastguard Rescue Service, which does cliff, swift water and mud
rescue and searches for missing people is a volunteer body within HM
Coastguard.

Indeed, so why should we expect search and rescue to be paid for by taxes?

The same reason we pay for police and health out of taxea.

In article ,
soup wrote:
whisky-dave wrote:

Strange that considering I was told by someone on here yesyerday that it was run by a charity/charities

Mountain rescue teams, lifeboats etc are run by charities but this
is for the military run SAR you know sea kings/nimrods etc, whose
primary role was retrieval of downed military pilots, civilian SAR was
a (very important) sideshoot to this role.


ASIDE:-
Are the coastgaurd considered as governmental or are they a charity
run thing?

in the appropriate area you contact the by ringing 999 (or 112). No they
aren't a charity. In the USA they are one of the 4 Armed Services.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18

On Tuesday 26 March 2013 16:21 harry wrote in uk.d-i-y:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

Done

--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://squiddy.blog.dionic.net/

http://www.sensorly.com/ Crowd mapping of 2G/3G/4G mobile signal coverage

Reading this on the web? See:
http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=Usenet

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 16:36 +0000, Tim Watts wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

Done

Harry is behind the times again. It's a bit late now it's a done and
dusted deal. Should have made a fuss back in 2011 when this was first
mooted and the procurment process started.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Mar 26, 5:09*pm, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 16:36 +0000, Tim Watts wrote:
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

Done

Harry is behind the times again. It's a bit late now it's a done and
dusted deal. Should have made a fuss back in 2011 when this was first
mooted and the procurment process started.

--
Cheers
Dave.

It has been hidden from us 'til now.
If you knew,why didn't you speak up earlier?

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 23:49:55 -0700 (PDT), harry wrote:

Harry is behind the times again. It's a bit late now it's a done and
dusted deal. Should have made a fuss back in 2011 when this was first
mooted and the procurment process started.

It has been hidden from us 'til now.

Don't talk rubbish and I was wrong about 2011, it was early 2010:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/8506806.stm 9 Feb 2010
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-11672272 2 Nov 2010
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11793069 18 Nov 2010
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-11977239 12 Dec 2010
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12389512 8 Feb 2011
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-15179055 5 Oct 2011
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...lands-15926403 28 Nov
2011

Most of those stories have links to others as well, plenty of coverage

If you knew,why didn't you speak up earlier?

With that amount of coverage anyone with half a deaf ear to the ground
would have picked it up.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283


HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

On Mar 26, 4:37*pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a military
operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and the Police
helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell

On 26/03/2013 16:49, Nightjar wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a military
operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and the Police
helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell

The traditional justification for SAR being military was to provide
training. If made non-military, how then will the remaining military SAR
get trained? Dummy missions only?

(The military will still require SAR facilities elsewhere than round here.)

--
Rod

On 26/03/2013 16:59, polygonum wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:49, Nightjar wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we
need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a military
operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and the Police
helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell

The traditional justification for SAR being military was to provide
training. If made non-military, how then will the remaining military SAR
get trained? Dummy missions only?

(The military will still require SAR facilities elsewhere than round here.)

The questions being, do really they need as much training as running SAR
around Britain provides and do they need as many SAR helicopters as that
requires? If yes, then that could be a justification for buying new
helicopters and continuing the service. Otherwise, it makes sense to
find other ways to train.

Colin Bignell

Nightjar wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a military
operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and the Police
helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell

Because the military will fly in conditions that would make any civilian
pilot's hair curl.

Tim

On 26/03/2013 17:12, Tim+ wrote:
Nightjar wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a military
operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and the Police
helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell

Because the military will fly in conditions that would make any civilian
pilot's hair curl.

Where do you think the Police and Coastguard hire their pilots?

Colin Bignell

In message , Nightjar
writes
On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a
military operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and the
Police helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell
Mountain rescue helicopters are run by RAF. Their main purpose is
recovery of RAF pilots
Mountain rescue teams are volunteers.
--
bert

On 27/03/2013 00:12, bert wrote:
In message , Nightjar
writes
On 26/03/2013 16:41, harry wrote:
On Mar 26, 4:37 pm, Nightjar
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:21, harry wrote:

Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines. It is not as if we
need to
get a lot of downed pilots out of The Channel these days.

Colin Bignell

Tch. The service is for ANYONE in trouble on land or sea.
They fly in all weathers,sea rescue, mountain rescue civilians
military etc.

Exactly, so what particular reason is there for the SAR to be a
military operation? As I said, the Coastguard do it around here and
the Police helicopter also does searches.

Colin Bignell
Mountain rescue helicopters are run by RAF. Their main purpose is
recovery of RAF pilots

How many downed RAF pilots needed to be rescued last year?

Colin Bignell

..

In article ,
Nightjar wrote:
HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines.

As I understood it, they were paid to provide the service.

--
*Work like you don't need the money. Love like you've never been hurt.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 26/03/2013 16:47, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Nightjar wrote:
HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines.

As I understood it, they were paid to provide the service.

The problem is that, if they were to continue to do it, they would need
to replace their ageing fleet of helicopters and SAR helicopters are
fairly specialised bits of kit.

Colin Bignell

On 26/03/2013 16:58, Nightjar wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:47, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Nightjar wrote:
HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines.

It still makes sense to be able to do military search and rescue though.
Domestic SAR work provides very realistic training.

As I understood it, they were paid to provide the service.

The problem is that, if they were to continue to do it, they would need
to replace their ageing fleet of helicopters and SAR helicopters are
fairly specialised bits of kit.

Colin Bignell

So to avoid that short term hardware cost and retaining trained SAR
teams we outsource it and get royally ripped off in the longer term
losing most of our military SAR capability too. How very clever

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

On 26/03/2013 17:13, Martin Brown wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:58, Nightjar wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:47, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Nightjar wrote:
HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines.

It still makes sense to be able to do military search and rescue though.
Domestic SAR work provides very realistic training.

As I understood it, they were paid to provide the service.

The problem is that, if they were to continue to do it, they would need
to replace their ageing fleet of helicopters and SAR helicopters are
fairly specialised bits of kit.

Colin Bignell

So to avoid that short term hardware cost and retaining trained SAR
teams we outsource it and get royally ripped off in the longer term
losing most of our military SAR capability too. How very clever


The money for the equipment has to come from somewhere and, in the
current climate, that somewhere will be things that front line troops
need. The Coastguard and Police seem quite capable of running SAR in my
area.

Colin Bignell

On Mar 26, 5:13*pm, Martin Brown
wrote:
On 26/03/2013 16:58, Nightjar wrote:

On 26/03/2013 16:47, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
* * Nightjar wrote:
HM Coastguard runs the ones around here and AIUI, they will oversee the
new service in much the same way. Personally, in times when the
Services' budget is being cut, I would rather see what money there is
going to equip the troops on the front lines.

It still makes sense to be able to do military search and rescue though.
Domestic SAR work provides very realistic training.

As I understood it, they were paid to provide the service.

The problem is that, if they were to continue to do it, they would need
to replace their ageing fleet of helicopters and SAR helicopters are
fairly specialised bits of kit.

Colin Bignell

So to avoid that short term hardware cost and retaining trained SAR
teams we outsource it and get royally ripped off in the longer term
losing most of our military SAR capability too. How very clever

--
Regards,
Martin Brown

That about sums up political thinking these days.
The sort of thinking that got us in the electricity mess we are in
right now.

The privatised firm will be able to get ex-military pilots at the
moment. But when the supply of them runs out, who will pay for the
cost of training new pilots?

On Mar 26, 6:01*pm, Tim Streater wrote:
In article ,
*Martin Brown wrote:

So to avoid that short term hardware cost and retaining trained SAR
teams we outsource it and get royally ripped off in the longer term
losing most of our military SAR capability too. How very clever

You can justify "royally ripped off" can you, with facts and figures? Or
is it more bluster.

--
Tim

"That excessive bail ought not to be required, nor excessive fines imposed,
nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted" *-- *Bill of Rights 1689

Who will pay for pilot training?
When the existing organisation is dismantled, they will be able charge
what they like as there will be no competition.

On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 6:01:18 PM UTC, Tim Streater wrote:
In article ,

Martin Brown wrote:



So to avoid that short term hardware cost and retaining trained SAR

teams we outsource it and get royally ripped off in the longer term

losing most of our military SAR capability too. How very clever



You can justify "royally ripped off" can you, with facts and figures? Or

is it more bluster.

I'd liek to know the reason(s) why they are taking it over first.
Is it really to save us the UK money ?

In message
,
harry writes
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

Does this mean that Prince William could get Tuped over to Bristow's?

--
Bill

In message , Bill
writes
In message
,
harry writes
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

Does this mean that Prince William could get Tuped over to Bristow's?


Mutterings on the news this afternoon suggested that the service
personnel would have to apply for jobs rather than be moved.


Adrian
--
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In message
,
harry writes
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283
The deal was done and announced some time ago.
--
bert

And while we are about it, the fact that RNLI is really not funded by
Government should have been a scandal for years, or are we saying that the
insurance you obviously take out when you go for a walk is going to pay for
you if you go for a sail instead?

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"harry" wrote in message
...
Latest thing to be sold off, search and rescue.
Sign the e-petition here about this matter.

https://submissions.epetitions.direc...etitions/45283

On 27/03/2013 08:51, Brian Gaff wrote:
And while we are about it, the fact that RNLI is really not funded by
Government should have been a scandal for years, or are we saying that the
insurance you obviously take out when you go for a walk is going to pay for
you if you go for a sail instead?

The RNLI prefers the independence that comes with being funded entirely
by charitable donations.

Colin Bignell