How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?

--
Cheers
Dave.

In article o.uk,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module
has failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display
still works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a
replacement timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their
eStore, UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in
the Dimplex eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do
any spares for your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?

Not possible to do a repair at component level?

--
*It ain't the size, it's... er... no, it IS ..the size.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 11:15:09 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Not possible to do a repair at component level?

Haven't investigated that yet but it might come to that. But with
something that I'd expect to have at least a 15 year life to be scrapheap
material because of no spares after six is a bit off.

The board with the relay on is at mains potential. I want some means of
firmly holding the board while I poke about on it with probes rather than
having it skating about the desk. B-)

Not even sure what the coil voltage of the relay is it's not mains for
sure from trace following and I have looked at the markings.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 10:49:55 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?

I sympaphise with your predicament but I don't believe there is any
statutory requirement. I had to scrap a fridge/freezer after 6 years
because I couldn't get spares. Manufacturers don't want you to repair
their products - they want you to buy new.

A decent company should hold spares for a good long time but there are
few of those now the bean counters run everything.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 11:34:50 +0000, Mark wrote:

I sympaphise with your predicament but I don't believe there is any
statutory requirement.

Bother, maybe I'm getting mixed up with cars? I sure there is some ruling
somewhere on some parts that a maker has to provide for x years after
manufacture stops.

I had to scrap a fridge/freezer after 6 years because I couldn't get
spares.

Sort of surprises me as compressors etc are fairly generic, depends what
bust of course.

Manufacturers don't want you to repair their products - they want you
to buy new.

Yeah, this attempt will fail though. Currently the heater is back in
service with the spade terminals that connected to the time switch joined
together with a strip of copper trimmed from the remains of an old HW
cylinder. The hole where the timer should be is covered with gaffer tape
to keep fingers out. If I can't repair or get another suitable timer
it'll go back in as a nice hole filler and a plugin timeswitch used
instead.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 23:58:34 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 11:34:50 +0000, Mark wrote:

I sympaphise with your predicament but I don't believe there is any
statutory requirement.

Bother, maybe I'm getting mixed up with cars? I sure there is some ruling
somewhere on some parts that a maker has to provide for x years after
manufacture stops.

Not sure about that but there has traditionally been a decent supply
of spares for cars.

I had to scrap a fridge/freezer after 6 years because I couldn't get
spares.

Sort of surprises me as compressors etc are fairly generic, depends what
bust of course.

Electronic control board to control the grossly overcomplicated
frost-free[1] freezer.

[1] Translated means it clogs up with ice and stops working.

Manufacturers don't want you to repair their products - they want you
to buy new.

Yeah, this attempt will fail though. Currently the heater is back in
service with the spade terminals that connected to the time switch joined
together with a strip of copper trimmed from the remains of an old HW
cylinder. The hole where the timer should be is covered with gaffer tape
to keep fingers out. If I can't repair or get another suitable timer
it'll go back in as a nice hole filler and a plugin timeswitch used
instead.

:-)
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

In article ,
Mark wrote:
Bother, maybe I'm getting mixed up with cars? I sure there is some
ruling somewhere on some parts that a maker has to provide for x years
after manufacture stops.

Not sure about that but there has traditionally been a decent supply
of spares for cars.

It depends. Lots of car parts are service items which are expected to be
replaced sometime in a car's life. Those which aren't can be very hard to
find.

--
*Don't squat with your spurs on *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 19/12/12 10:24, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Mark wrote:
Bother, maybe I'm getting mixed up with cars? I sure there is some
ruling somewhere on some parts that a maker has to provide for x years
after manufacture stops.

Not sure about that but there has traditionally been a decent supply
of spares for cars.

It depends. Lots of car parts are service items which are expected to be
replaced sometime in a car's life. Those which aren't can be very hard to
find.

I think these days you can in fact build a completely new frog eyed
sprite from brand new spare parts.


Not that you would get it past emissions regulations with a couple of
SUS and no catalyst..


--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc-ra-cy) €“ a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.

in 1188340 20121218 113450 Mark wrote:

A decent company should hold spares for a good long time but there are
few of those now the bean counters run everything.

You omitted the 'i' from the penultimate word.

Dave Liquorice presented the following explanation :
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

I would doubt any manufacturer keeps any spares for such low cost items
anymore. Most these days import and rebadge. Should one fail within
guarantee, they simply scrap the old and replace with new, so your only
fix is to source the parts yourself from other than the manufacturer.

Larger, higher cost items like washing machines can still have original
replacement parts sourced because they are not yet imported in from the
far east, but thats only a matter of time.

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

On 18/12/2012 10:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?

Maybe manufacturers, and retailers, should be compelled to list a
"spares will be available for nn years" commitment on their products?
Add to the existing energy efficiency notices where feasible. With some
degree of enforcement.

OK - so that probably would not help customers of Comet. :-(

--
Rod

In article ,
polygonum wrote:
Maybe manufacturers, and retailers, should be compelled to list a
"spares will be available for nn years" commitment on their products?
Add to the existing energy efficiency notices where feasible. With some
degree of enforcement.

That's fine if you don't mind the initial cost being considerably more.
Running a 'just in case' spares service is very expensive. Which is why
many cheaper power tools have no spares availability at all - just money
back if it fails within a certain period.

--
*I used to be a banker, but then I lost interest.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 18/12/2012 13:05, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
polygonum wrote:
Maybe manufacturers, and retailers, should be compelled to list a
"spares will be available for nn years" commitment on their products?
Add to the existing energy efficiency notices where feasible. With some
degree of enforcement.

That's fine if you don't mind the initial cost being considerably more.
Running a 'just in case' spares service is very expensive. Which is why
many cheaper power tools have no spares availability at all - just money
back if it fails within a certain period.

Why would it change any costs? Miele say "spares will be available for
at least 10 years", Arfur's fell-of-the-back-of-the-lorry specials say
"spares will be available for as long as it takes you to read this
statement". The only enforcement is that a claim should be mandatory and
would form a part of the contract and if spares are not available as
claimed, then there is a breach to be resolved. With, perhaps, a default
position of five years for minor goods, ten years for more significant
goods - if nothing else is displayed.

You go to B&Q, see a Macallister and a Makita. One says "no spares"; the
other says "three years spares". You make your choice on that basis
rather than some guess as now.

--
Rod

In article ,
polygonum wrote:
That's fine if you don't mind the initial cost being considerably
more. Running a 'just in case' spares service is very expensive. Which
is why many cheaper power tools have no spares availability at all -
just money back if it fails within a certain period.

Why would it change any costs?

You think a spares service can be set up for nothing? And stocks kept
which may never be needed?

Miele say "spares will be available for
at least 10 years",

Quite. As I said at high initial cost.

Arfur's fell-of-the-back-of-the-lorry specials say
"spares will be available for as long as it takes you to read this
statement". The only enforcement is that a claim should be mandatory and
would form a part of the contract and if spares are not available as
claimed, then there is a breach to be resolved. With, perhaps, a default
position of five years for minor goods, ten years for more significant
goods - if nothing else is displayed.

You go to B&Q, see a Macallister and a Makita. One says "no spares"; the
other says "three years spares". You make your choice on that basis
rather than some guess as now.

Lidl offer a money back warranty for three years - but no pretty well no
spares. Of course their quality is such that they expect most of the tools
they sell will outlast that period comfortably. If you wish to pay perhaps
three times the price for a tool that has spares, it's your choice.

--
*The average person falls asleep in seven minutes *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 18/12/2012 16:30, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
polygonum wrote:
That's fine if you don't mind the initial cost being considerably
more. Running a 'just in case' spares service is very expensive. Which
is why many cheaper power tools have no spares availability at all -
just money back if it fails within a certain period.

Why would it change any costs?

You think a spares service can be set up for nothing? And stocks kept
which may never be needed?


But he is not suggesting that spares _must_ be kept. The suggestion is
that if a company like Miele keeps spares for ten years they must state
that on the box. If they choose not to keep spares or only keep them for
two years then they must state that as well.

There is no onus on a company to keep spares for any particular length
of time, just to state the minimum period that they will keep them for.

On 18/12/2012 16:30, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
polygonum wrote:
That's fine if you don't mind the initial cost being considerably
more. Running a 'just in case' spares service is very expensive. Which
is why many cheaper power tools have no spares availability at all -
just money back if it fails within a certain period.

Why would it change any costs?

You think a spares service can be set up for nothing? And stocks kept
which may never be needed?

Miele say "spares will be available for
at least 10 years",

Quite. As I said at high initial cost.

Arfur's fell-of-the-back-of-the-lorry specials say
"spares will be available for as long as it takes you to read this
statement". The only enforcement is that a claim should be mandatory and
would form a part of the contract and if spares are not available as
claimed, then there is a breach to be resolved. With, perhaps, a default
position of five years for minor goods, ten years for more significant
goods - if nothing else is displayed.

You go to B&Q, see a Macallister and a Makita. One says "no spares"; the
other says "three years spares". You make your choice on that basis
rather than some guess as now.

Lidl offer a money back warranty for three years - but no pretty well no
spares. Of course their quality is such that they expect most of the tools
they sell will outlast that period comfortably. If you wish to pay perhaps
three times the price for a tool that has spares, it's your choice.

I am not in any way saying that they SHOULD set up a spares service. The
ONLY change I want is for the suppliers (manufacturers, importers,
distributors, retailers) to declare what the situation is up front -
with something to encourage compliance.

I am more than happy with the Lidl approach - and they could say "no
spares available but whole product has 3 year warranty". Fine.

--
Rod

On 2012-12-18, polygonum wrote:

On 18/12/2012 13:05, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
polygonum wrote:
Maybe manufacturers, and retailers, should be compelled to list a
"spares will be available for nn years" commitment on their products?
Add to the existing energy efficiency notices where feasible. With some
degree of enforcement.

That's fine if you don't mind the initial cost being considerably more.
Running a 'just in case' spares service is very expensive. Which is why
many cheaper power tools have no spares availability at all - just money
back if it fails within a certain period.

Why would it change any costs? Miele say "spares will be available for
at least 10 years", Arfur's fell-of-the-back-of-the-lorry specials say
"spares will be available for as long as it takes you to read this
statement". The only enforcement is that a claim should be mandatory and
would form a part of the contract and if spares are not available as
claimed, then there is a breach to be resolved. With, perhaps, a default
position of five years for minor goods, ten years for more significant
goods - if nothing else is displayed.

You go to B&Q, see a Macallister and a Makita. One says "no spares"; the
other says "three years spares". You make your choice on that basis
rather than some guess as now.

I think this would be a great idea.

Something else I thought of would be requiring the label to specify a
total cost of ownership over 10 years in normal domestic use (with an
obligation to make good on it).

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 20:58:12 +0000, Adam Funk wrote:


Something else I thought of would be requiring the label to specify a
total cost of ownership over 10 years in normal domestic use (with an
obligation to make good on it).

Great idea, as a bonus it would bankrupt those producing ****e white goods.


--

On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 1:21:10 PM UTC, polygonum wrote:
Why would it change any costs? Miele say "spares will be available for
at least 10 years"

Yes, BUT Miele parts are very very expensive.

Siemens genuine washing machine pump circa £39, pattern part £19.
Miele genuine washing machine pump circa £80-109, pattern part £49?

Classic is the Miele S400/S300 series accessory housing "flip-lid", which has weak hinge clips. Once a hinge clip breaks the spring ejects the lid into the air. That lid is available - but at £38 as I recall. Likewise pipes & tubes are available, the bent-end (not curved) typically £26.

The RISK is the key luxury brands have a collateral here where they can decline quality a bit and keep the premium, boosting profitability - for a time. It is noteworthy the recent bottom of range Miele have begun to become "less commercial tiger tank grade" than their older models. Think the same is true for some of their washing machines.

wrote:
The RISK is the key luxury brands have a collateral here where they can
decline quality a bit and keep the premium, boosting profitability - for a
time. It is noteworthy the recent bottom of range Miele have begun to
become "less commercial tiger tank grade" than their older models. Think
the same is true for some of their washing machines.

I've got that impression too.

One thing I'm looking forward to is decent 3D printing coming along. Then
it's possible to re-produce those stupid bits of plastic that are often the
parts that break first. Currently 3D printing isn't quite up to the job as
it's not structural enough - but I've seen some homebrew printers that print
nylon with decent strength, which is very promising.

Of course, you might not own one of these yourself, but get one made by a
'copy shop' like you get brochure printing done today. If someone else had
the same problem they could put the part design on Github or Instructables
or something for other people to print themselves. And if it's a really
common part someone could print batches of the thing for pennies each.

Theo

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...

How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?


That's progress for you. They originally had a simple bi-metallic strip with
a knob bearing on it - ours is still going strong after 25 years. Personally
I avoid electronics in these sort of thing if I can, despite spending a
working lifetime working with electronics.

AWEM

On 18/12/2012 12:41, Andrew Mawson wrote:
Personally I avoid electronics in these sort of thing if I can, despite
spending a working lifetime working with electronics.

Despite, or because of?

Andy

On 18/12/2012 10:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?


Under UK law, if goods fail due to an inherent fault within six years of
purchase, you are entitled to a repair or a partial refund, the amount
of which would take into account the use you have had from the item.
Therefore, it is unlikely that many manufacturers will keep spares for
more than six years after they stop making a product. As, after the
first six months, the onus is on the consumer to show that it failed due
to an inherent fault, rather than fair wear and tear, a lot will
probably work on the principle that it is cheaper not to keep any spares
for products no longer sold and to do the partial refund if they really
have to.

Colin Bignell

On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 1:11:40 PM UTC, Nightjar wrote:

Under UK law, if goods fail due to an inherent fault within six years
of purchase, you are entitled to a repair or a partial refund, [...]

No, the six years is the statute of limitation i.e. how long after an event you are entitled to bring legal proceedings. This does not mean that all goods must necessarilly last six years.

Mathew

On 18/12/2012 13:24, Mathew Newton wrote:
On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 1:11:40 PM UTC, Nightjar wrote:

Under UK law, if goods fail due to an inherent fault within six years
of purchase, you are entitled to a repair or a partial refund, [...]

No, the six years is the statute of limitation i.e. how long after an event you are entitled to bring legal proceedings. This does not mean that all goods must necessarilly last six years.

Hence my point about the amount of the refund being diminished according
to the amount of use obtained from the item.

Colin Bignell

On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 1:42:54 PM UTC, Nightjar wrote:

Hence my point about the amount of the refund being diminished according
to the amount of use obtained from the item.

No, you are missing the point.

The six years is the time limit within which you are entitled to make a *claim* against the retailer. It is not an automatic entitlement to repair or refund, regardless of whether that refund diminishes or not.

Mathew

On 18/12/2012 15:11, Mathew Newton wrote:
On Tuesday, December 18, 2012 1:42:54 PM UTC, Nightjar wrote:

Hence my point about the amount of the refund being diminished according
to the amount of use obtained from the item.

No, you are missing the point.

Not at all. I just didn't think it important to go into that much detail
when I was only pointing out that manufacturers didn't really have much
incentive to keep spares on the shelf for long periods.

Colin Bignell

On Tue, 18 Dec 2012 13:11:40 +0000, Nightjar
wrote:

On 18/12/2012 10:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?


Under UK law, if goods fail due to an inherent fault within six years of
purchase, you are entitled to a repair or a partial refund, the amount
of which would take into account the use you have had from the item.
Therefore, it is unlikely that many manufacturers will keep spares for
more than six years after they stop making a product. As, after the
first six months, the onus is on the consumer to show that it failed due
to an inherent fault, rather than fair wear and tear, a lot will
probably work on the principle that it is cheaper not to keep any spares
for products no longer sold and to do the partial refund if they really
have to.

Manufacturers are not going to care one hoot about this since the
rights about which you speak are only between the consumer and the
retailer. The manufacturer may choose to offer a warranty and any
failures outside this are SEP[1]

[1] Somebody Else's Problem.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

On 18/12/2012 10:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?


An alternative is that when a manufacturer/importer no longer supports
the item, perhaps they should be obliged to publish drawings and
circuits, firmware and software to enable others to maintain the product?

On 18/12/2012 15:17, Fredxx wrote:
On 18/12/2012 10:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?


An alternative is that when a manufacturer/importer no longer supports
the item, perhaps they should be obliged to publish drawings and
circuits, firmware and software to enable others to maintain the product?

I do think that something like would have some benefits.

I particularly hate seeing things like laptops for which there is no
manufacturer-authorised replacement battery - often within a very short
time of it being a current product. So we all have to take a chance with
some third-party product.

Perhaps such a requirement would push manufacturers to sell such details
to companies and thereby allow authorised third-party spares. Their
choice - make the spares available yourselves or allow someone else to
do so and possibly get a few quid as well. (The sooner they allow, the
more they could make.) Or wait a while and be forced to do so anyway but
get nothing from it.

--
Rod

On 2012-12-18, Fredxx wrote:

On 18/12/2012 10:49, Dave Liquorice wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?


An alternative is that when a manufacturer/importer no longer supports
the item, perhaps they should be obliged to publish drawings and
circuits, firmware and software to enable others to maintain the product?

Absolutely!

Similarly, software companies should be allowed to copyright
executables only if they lodge the source code with the relevant
national library, who would release it in cases of "abandonware".

a lot of companies have to work out how many spares to keep as they often
will no longer hav any way to make them again. Sometimes its a goodly lot
sometimes not it appears.

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Dec 18, 10:49*am, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
How long would you expect a company to hold spares for an electrical
appliance? ISTR that there is a statutary requirement?

We have a Dimplex oil filled radiator and the electronic timer module has
failed, relay not switching on/off but the electronic timer/display still
works. This radiator is about 6 years old but can I find a replacement
timer CIF. Dimplex don't even mention the heater in their eStore,
UK-Spares are mentioned as a possible source for stuff not in the Dimplex
eStore but when I asked them they said "DIMPLEX don't do any spares for
your heater".

6 years seem to me to be well within the "expected life" of an oild
filled radiator so surely spares should still be available?

--
Cheers
Dave.

Probably made in China or somewhere.
Things these days are not made with the idea of repair, they just want
you to junk them.

Even when spares are available, they cost silly money.

In article
,
harry wrote:
Probably made in China or somewhere.
Things these days are not made with the idea of repair, they just want
you to junk them.

Even when spares are available, they cost silly money.

Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

--
*CAN VEGETARIANS EAT ANIMAL CRACKERS?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 10:21:52 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article
,
harry wrote:
Probably made in China or somewhere.
Things these days are not made with the idea of repair, they just want
you to junk them.

Even when spares are available, they cost silly money.

Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

It's a matter of proportion though. I'm sure some spares could be
sold at lower cost without the spares business being run at a loss.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

On 19/12/2012 10:55, Mark wrote:
On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 10:21:52 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article
,
harry wrote:
Probably made in China or somewhere.
Things these days are not made with the idea of repair, they just want
you to junk them.

Even when spares are available, they cost silly money.

Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

It's a matter of proportion though. I'm sure some spares could be
sold at lower cost without the spares business being run at a loss.

And maybe, at least sometimes, simply providing information would be
sufficient? E.g. that a particular screw has a certain spec. Or an
O-ring is some diameter nitrile. Enough that you can go and buy a
commodity replacement.

Then they would not need to have a stock of those items.

(Yes - I know it probably over-simplifies.)

--
Rod

In article ,
Mark wrote:
Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

It's a matter of proportion though. I'm sure some spares could be
sold at lower cost without the spares business being run at a loss.

The big snag is you don't know which spares are going to be needed most at
the introduction of a device. So for a comprehensive service, all have to
be available. Once a device becomes established, aftermarket companies
might well cream off the sale of the common parts at a decent price -
leaving the maker's service operation even more pressed to make a profit.

--
*If at first you don't succeed, redefine success.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
In article ,
Mark wrote:
Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

It's a matter of proportion though. I'm sure some spares could be
sold at lower cost without the spares business being run at a loss.

The big snag is you don't know which spares are going to be needed most at
the introduction of a device. So for a comprehensive service, all have to
be available. Once a device becomes established, aftermarket companies
might well cream off the sale of the common parts at a decent price -
leaving the maker's service operation even more pressed to make a profit.


All this makes me wonder if I ought to order some spares for my 20 year old
gas White Knight dryer. Crossley has always turned up trumps on the few
occasions I've wanted spares but my luck can't hold out forever.

Tim

On Wed, 19 Dec 2012 17:49:40 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Mark wrote:
Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

It's a matter of proportion though. I'm sure some spares could be
sold at lower cost without the spares business being run at a loss.

The big snag is you don't know which spares are going to be needed most at
the introduction of a device. So for a comprehensive service, all have to
be available. Once a device becomes established, aftermarket companies
might well cream off the sale of the common parts at a decent price -
leaving the maker's service operation even more pressed to make a profit.

Iff the manufacturer licenses them to produce parts. I very much
doubt it's legal to manufacture spares for another without prior
permission.
--
(\__/) M.
(='.'=) If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around
(")_(") is he still wrong?

In article ,
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article
,
harry wrote:
Probably made in China or somewhere.
Things these days are not made with the idea of repair, they just want
you to junk them.

Even when spares are available, they cost silly money.

Spare parts are always expensive relative to a new complete unit. Which
reflects the cost of running a spares scheme.

Dennis, the fire engine manufacturers, went bust becasue they had too much
capital tied up in spares.

--
From KT24

Using a RISC OS computer running v5.18