I've got a couple of disused fireplaces I'm going to bring back into use
with woodburners. I'll need to fit stainless steel flues. Do all flues &
burners have a standard gauge or do I have to worry about matching them
up? I'll probably be going for quite small burners, about 3-4kW at most.
Recommendations welcome.


--
Les

In message , Big Les Wade
writes
I've got a couple of disused fireplaces I'm going to bring back into
use with woodburners. I'll need to fit stainless steel flues. Do all
flues & burners have a standard gauge or do I have to worry about
matching them up? I'll probably be going for quite small burners, about
3-4kW at most. Recommendations welcome.

The manufacturers site will tell you about flue sizing. Just as
important is insulation.

To meet the regulations you either need to involve building control or
use a Hetas registered installer.



--
Tim Lamb

On Nov 9, 9:15*am, Tim Lamb wrote:
In message , Big Les Wade
writes

I've got a couple of disused fireplaces I'm going to bring back into
use with woodburners. I'll need to fit stainless steel flues. Do all
flues & burners have a standard gauge or do I have to worry about
matching them up? I'll probably be going for quite small burners, about
3-4kW at most. Recommendations welcome.

The manufacturers site will tell you about flue sizing. Just as
important is insulation.

To meet the regulations you either need to involve building control or
use a Hetas registered installer.

to do a "legal" job you have to either pay a HETAS bod to do it for
you OR DIY & meet the regs & involve Bldg Ctrl..

Jim K

On 09/11/2012 13:22, Jim K wrote:

to do a "legal" job you have to either pay a HETAS bod to do it for
you OR DIY & meet the regs & involve Bldg Ctrl..

Out of interest, what "law" would be broken if it was a DIY job without
building regs?

Just curious.

Pete
--
http://www.GymRatZ.co.uk - Fitness+Gym Equipment.
http://www.bodysolid-gym-equipment.co.uk
http://www.trade-price-supplements.co.uk
http://www.water-rower.co.uk

www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

On 09/11/2012 13:22, Jim K wrote:

to do a "legal" job you have to either pay a HETAS bod to do it for
you OR DIY & meet the regs & involve Bldg Ctrl..

Out of interest, what "law" would be broken if it was a DIY job without
building regs?

Just curious.

Pete

"Failing to notify" - a non idictable offence carrying a fine and/or upto 6
months in prison.

ICBA to look up the specific act - but I did once and it exists.

However, being non idictable means thye only have 2 years IIRC to bust you -
and it almost never happens anyway.
--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://www.dionic.net/tim/

"A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject."

Tim Watts wrote:

www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

On 09/11/2012 13:22, Jim K wrote:

to do a "legal" job you have to either pay a HETAS bod to do it for
you OR DIY & meet the regs & involve Bldg Ctrl..

Out of interest, what "law" would be broken if it was a DIY job without
building regs?

Just curious.

Pete

"Failing to notify" - a non idictable offence carrying a fine and/or upto
^^ indictable
6 months in prison.

ICBA to look up the specific act - but I did once and it exists.

However, being non idictable means thye only have 2 years IIRC to bust you
- and it almost never happens anyway.
--
Tim Watts Personal Blog: http://www.dionic.net/tim/

"History will be kind to me for I intend to write it."

In message , Tim Watts
writes
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

On 09/11/2012 13:22, Jim K wrote:

to do a "legal" job you have to either pay a HETAS bod to do it for
you OR DIY & meet the regs & involve Bldg Ctrl..

Out of interest, what "law" would be broken if it was a DIY job without
building regs?

Just curious.

Pete

"Failing to notify" - a non idictable offence carrying a fine and/or upto 6
months in prison.

ICBA to look up the specific act - but I did once and it exists.

However, being non idictable means thye only have 2 years IIRC to bust you -
and it almost never happens anyway.

Might get caught by the *Solicitors questions* on a house sale with no
relevant paperwork.

--
Tim Lamb

On 12/11/2012 20:20, Tim Watts wrote:

"Failing to notify" - a non idictable offence carrying a fine and/or upto 6
months in prison.

ICBA to look up the specific act - but I did once and it exists.

My question was which "law" which an act is not.

However, being non idictable means thye only have 2 years IIRC to bust you -
and it almost never happens anyway.

Thanks all the same though Tim.

--
http://www.GymRatZ.co.uk - Commercial Gym Equipment.
http://www.water-rower.co.uk WaterRowers etc

On Fri, 9 Nov 2012 08:29:48 +0000, Big Les Wade wrote:

Do all flues & burners have a standard gauge or do I have to worry
about matching them up?

There are standard sizes for flue (5, 6 or 7" are the most common) and
yes it does have to match the stove you fit.

--
Cheers
Dave.

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.co.uk...
On Fri, 9 Nov 2012 08:29:48 +0000, Big Les Wade wrote:

Do all flues & burners have a standard gauge or do I have to worry
about matching them up?

There are standard sizes for flue (5, 6 or 7" are the most common) and
yes it does have to match the stove you fit.

--
Cheers
Dave.




Can you not fit the largest flue and them put a spigot plate at the bottom
to match your stove?

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 18:18:44 -0000, Lawrence wrote:

Can you not fit the largest flue and them put a spigot plate at the
bottom to match your stove?

You can as in physically but I don't think the BCO would like it as it is
probably against the installation instructions of the stove.

A large flue will slow down the flow of gases, the longer they take the
cooler they get and more chance of tar/soot deposition in the flue.

It will also affect the draw. I can't decide if it won't draw enough,
large column of air that will be hard to get moving, or draw too much,
wind over chimeny pot sucking a 7" column of air due to the venturi
effect being rather more than a 5" flued stove would want. Or a
combination of both depending on conditions...

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 23:08:31 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 18:18:44 -0000, Lawrence wrote:

Can you not fit the largest flue and them put a spigot plate at the
bottom to match your stove?

You can as in physically but I don't think the BCO would like it as it is
probably against the installation instructions of the stove.

I don't think he can complain as long as it is greater than 150mm id

A large flue will slow down the flow of gases, the longer they take the
cooler they get and more chance of tar/soot deposition in the flue.

Yes but to some extent this will depend on heat loss to the sides, if
the flue is insulated or the brickwork has reached a constant
temperature then there may not be a lot of difference. I imagine many
brick chimney are 9" and would still pass.

It will also affect the draw. I can't decide if it won't draw enough,

The draw is dependent on the buoyancy of the air in the column, if
it's cooler then less draw.

I still cannot figure why a sophisticated bit of kit like a modern gas
boiler, which is fueled by a gas that is readily combustible, has a
fan, yet a wood fire which has a low cv fuel which is difficult to
cleanly burn and would benefit from the turbulence and air control is
resisted.

AJH

In message ,
writes

I still cannot figure why a sophisticated bit of kit like a modern gas
boiler, which is fueled by a gas that is readily combustible, has a
fan, yet a wood fire which has a low cv fuel which is difficult to
cleanly burn and would benefit from the turbulence and air control is
resisted.

Maybe because the gas can be shut off whereas a charged log grate can't?

--
Tim Lamb

On Nov 11, 12:20*pm, wrote:
On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 23:08:31 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Liquorice"

wrote:
On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 18:18:44 -0000, Lawrence wrote:

Can you not fit the largest flue and them put a spigot plate at the
bottom to match your stove?

You can as in physically but I don't think the BCO would like it as it is
probably against the installation instructions of the stove.

I don't think he can complain as long as it is greater than 150mm id



A large flue will slow down the flow of gases, the longer they take the
cooler they get and more chance of tar/soot deposition in the flue.

Yes but to some extent this will depend on heat loss to the sides, if
the flue is insulated or the brickwork has reached a constant
temperature then there may not be a lot of difference. I imagine many
brick chimney are 9" and would still pass.



It will also affect the draw. I can't decide if it won't draw enough,

The draw is dependent on the buoyancy of the air in the column, if
it's cooler then less draw.

I still cannot figure why a sophisticated bit of kit like a modern gas
boiler, which is fueled by a gas that is readily combustible, has a
fan, yet a wood fire which has a low cv fuel which is difficult to
cleanly burn and would benefit from the turbulence and air control is
resisted.

AJH

The fan in most gas gas boilers is working on a mixture of gas and
air.
The effect of this is to thoroughly mix them so promoting efficiency.

Obviously not an option with solid fuel.
With solid fuels you have two options, either suck or blow the
combustion air/products

The problem with blow (forced draught)(air) is that if the chimney
blocks,combustion gases are forced into the room. This means the
boiler has to be in a non-occupied space. Eg a wood pellet boiler

The problem with suck (induced draught) (combustion gases) is that the
fan becomes unbalanced due to tar buildup. So not suitable for wood
burning stoves. But often used with coal. gas and oil.

Large industrial boilers often have both suck and blow (balanced
draught.)

In message ,
writes
.

It will also affect the draw. I can't decide if it won't draw enough,

The draw is dependent on the buoyancy of the air in the column, if
it's cooler then less draw.

I still cannot figure why a sophisticated bit of kit like a modern gas
boiler, which is fueled by a gas that is readily combustible, has a
fan, yet a wood fire which has a low cv fuel which is difficult to
cleanly burn and would benefit from the turbulence and air control is
resisted.


It is because most boilers are room sealed, they are not drawing air in
from the room, it has to be sucked in from the outside via the outer
tube in the flue and the products of combustion pushed out down the
inner tube of the flue


--
geoff

Dave Liquorice posted
On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 18:18:44 -0000, Lawrence wrote:

Can you not fit the largest flue and them put a spigot plate at the
bottom to match your stove?

You can as in physically but I don't think the BCO would like it as it is
probably against the installation instructions of the stove.

Also the existing chimney (into which the flue pipe will be inserted) is
quite narrow. The builder thinks it will only take a 5in pipe.

A large flue will slow down the flow of gases, the longer they take the
cooler they get and more chance of tar/soot deposition in the flue.

It will also affect the draw. I can't decide if it won't draw enough,
large column of air that will be hard to get moving, or draw too much,
wind over chimeny pot sucking a 7" column of air due to the venturi
effect being rather more than a 5" flued stove would want. Or a
combination of both depending on conditions...


--
Les

On Mon, 12 Nov 2012 14:51:20 +0000, Big Les Wade
wrote:

Also the existing chimney (into which the flue pipe will be inserted) is
quite narrow. The builder thinks it will only take a 5in pipe.

Then it will not comply with part J unless burning smokeless fuel,
even the exempt devices under the clean air act only allow for coal
and not wood.

There appears to be no exception when burning wood pellets even though
smaller than 150mm and balanced flues are allowed in other countries.

AJH

On Nov 12, 2:51*pm, Big Les Wade wrote:
Dave Liquorice posted

On Sat, 10 Nov 2012 18:18:44 -0000, Lawrence wrote:

Can you not fit the largest flue and them put a spigot plate at the
bottom to match your stove?

You can as in physically but I don't think the BCO would like it as it is
probably against the installation instructions of the stove.

Also the existing chimney (into which the flue pipe will be inserted) is
quite narrow. The builder thinks it will only take a 5in pipe.

A large flue will slow down the flow of gases, the longer they take the
cooler they get and more chance of tar/soot deposition in the flue.

It will also affect the draw. I can't decide if it won't draw enough,
large column of air that will be hard to get moving, or draw too much,
wind over chimeny pot sucking a 7" column of air due to the venturi
effect being rather more than a 5" flued stove would want. Or a
combination of both depending on conditions...

--
Les

That is unusually small. 8" is normal.

On Fri, 9 Nov 2012 08:29:48 +0000, Big Les Wade wrote:

I've got a couple of disused fireplaces I'm going to bring back into
use
with woodburners. I'll need to fit stainless steel flues. Do all flues
&
burners have a standard gauge or do I have to worry about matching them
up? I'll probably be going for quite small burners, about 3-4kW at
most.
Recommendations welcome.


--
Les

--
Cheers
Dave.