My garage-workshop conversion has reached the stage where the internal walls
are ready to be battened and lined out. As suggested in an earlier thread,
2"x1" tile battens will be perfect and relatively inexpensive (an important
consideration for the whole project) and can be screwed and/or glued to the
concrete wall-panels leaving room for 2" Celotex or similar behind the
lining. But I'm not sure about the best choice of sheet material.
Shuttering ply was recommended, also standard WPB ply, both at 18mm thick.
But is there any reason why I shouldn't also consider MDF and chipboard?

My local timber yard mentioned that shuttering ply "has more of a flex to it
than 'ordinary' ply" and would require more battening. But given the
relative costs of ply and battens, that might be a good trade-off.

I'll be painting the walls, probably matt white, and I'm not after a perfect
living-room-type finish. Heavy fixings can be screwed through to the
battening, and 18mm should be thick enough for lighter attachments,
shouldn't it?

Thanks as ever for any thoughts.

Bert

"Bert Coules" wrote in message
o.uk...
My garage-workshop conversion has reached the stage where the internal
walls are ready to be battened and lined out. As suggested in an earlier
thread, 2"x1" tile battens will be perfect and relatively inexpensive (an
important consideration for the whole project) and can be screwed and/or
glued to the concrete wall-panels leaving room for 2" Celotex or similar
behind the lining. But I'm not sure about the best choice of sheet
material. Shuttering ply was recommended, also standard WPB ply, both at
18mm thick. But is there any reason why I shouldn't also consider MDF and
chipboard?

My local timber yard mentioned that shuttering ply "has more of a flex to
it than 'ordinary' ply" and would require more battening. But given the
relative costs of ply and battens, that might be a good trade-off.

I'll be painting the walls, probably matt white, and I'm not after a
perfect living-room-type finish. Heavy fixings can be screwed through to
the battening, and 18mm should be thick enough for lighter attachments,
shouldn't it?

Thanks as ever for any thoughts.

Bert

Did not see the earlier thread referred to in your post but 2 x 1 battens
set edge on to to allow a 2 inch gap would in my opinion be no use for what
you intend as they are to narrow to join 2 sheets togther. either 2x2
battens or 2 x 1 set face to wall giving a 1 inch gap would be a better
option

Being old fashioned I would prefer screws for the battens rather than glue
if possible

Further with decent battens you have the option to fit shelf brackets

Sterling board would be my choice probably at 11mm

regards

TMC wrote:

...2 x 1 battens set edge on... are too narrow to join 2 sheets...

I was thinking of using two battens together (ie to make 2"x2") at board
junctions, with single battens in between. The costs work out cheaper than
using 2"x2" timber, which in any case is under that size which would be a
problem for the Celotex - the tile battens I've looked at are an exact
2"x1".

Being old fashioned I would prefer screws for the battens
rather than glue if possible...

You haven't tried drilling into my garage walls! But I'll use screws where
I can.

Sterling board would be my choice probably at 11mm.

I've never heard of Sterling board: I'll look it up.

LATER...

Oh, *that's* what Sterling board is. I've seen it, of course, in boarded-up
shop fronts and similar, but I've never looked closely enough to tell what
the surface is like: is it smooth enough to paint successfully?

Thanks for the reply.

Bert

On Mon, 15 Aug 2011 12:00:32 +0100, "Bert Coules"
wrote:

My garage-workshop conversion has reached the stage where the internal walls
are ready to be battened and lined out. As suggested in an earlier thread,
2"x1" tile battens will be perfect and relatively inexpensive (an important
consideration for the whole project) and can be screwed and/or glued to the
concrete wall-panels leaving room for 2" Celotex or similar behind the
lining. But I'm not sure about the best choice of sheet material.
Shuttering ply was recommended, also standard WPB ply, both at 18mm thick.
But is there any reason why I shouldn't also consider MDF and chipboard?

My local timber yard mentioned that shuttering ply "has more of a flex to it
than 'ordinary' ply" and would require more battening. But given the
relative costs of ply and battens, that might be a good trade-off.

Don't forget though, that the more battens you have, you'll have less
insulation material :-)

--
Frank Erskine

Frank Erskine wrote:

Don't forget though, that the more battens you have, you'll have less
insulation material :-)

Hardly enough to make any appreciable difference though, surely? Or is that
the reason for the ":-)" ? Thanks for that thought!

Bert

"Bert Coules" wrote in message
...
TMC wrote:

...2 x 1 battens set edge on... are too narrow to join 2 sheets...

I was thinking of using two battens together (ie to make 2"x2") at board
junctions, with single battens in between. The costs work out cheaper
than using 2"x2" timber, which in any case is under that size which would
be a problem for the Celotex - the tile battens I've looked at are an
exact 2"x1".

Being old fashioned I would prefer screws for the battens
rather than glue if possible...

You haven't tried drilling into my garage walls! But I'll use screws
where I can.

Sterling board would be my choice probably at 11mm.

I've never heard of Sterling board: I'll look it up.

LATER...

Oh, *that's* what Sterling board is. I've seen it, of course, in
boarded-up shop fronts and similar, but I've never looked closely enough
to tell what the surface is like: is it smooth enough to paint
successfully?

Thanks for the reply.

Bert

I have done so

One coat of sandtex white about 12 years ago due for another coat when I
have time

yes you can see the texture of the board surface

Regards

TMC wrote:

Yes you can see the texture of the board surface...

That shouldn't matter overmuch: as I said, it's a workshop, not a living
room. I'll investigate; thanks.

Bert

"Bert Coules" wrote in message
o.uk...

I'll be painting the walls, probably matt white, and I'm not after a
perfect living-room-type finish. Heavy fixings can be screwed through to
the battening, and 18mm should be thick enough for lighter attachments,
shouldn't it?


I used OSB, its cheap enough and looks like this;
http://share.ovi.com/media/Muddymike...e.10823?sort=3
After a couple of coats of the cheapest white emulsion I could find. That's
a very close up picture taken today, but painted when I built it 4 years
ago. If you look through the pictures in that workshop album you will see
what the OSB looked like before it was painted.

Mike

On 15/08/2011 12:00, Bert Coules wrote:
My garage-workshop conversion has reached the stage where the internal
walls are ready to be battened and lined out. As suggested in an earlier
thread, 2"x1" tile battens will be perfect and relatively inexpensive
(an important consideration for the whole project) and can be screwed
and/or glued to the concrete wall-panels leaving room for 2" Celotex or
similar behind the lining. But I'm not sure about the best choice of

When I did mine, I skipped on the battens altogether - even cheaper!
Just screwed through the board (1/2" ply), through the PIT (50mm) and
into the block. Bought a couple of boxes of 5 1/8 12 gauge quicksilver
screws from SF for the job.

sheet material. Shuttering ply was recommended, also standard WPB ply,
both at 18mm thick. But is there any reason why I shouldn't also
consider MDF and chipboard?

(WBP) Ply is moisture resistant - and so will far better if it ever got
damp out there. Chip is harder to screw into and screws do not hold as
well - so makes shelf fitting etc less easy.

My local timber yard mentioned that shuttering ply "has more of a flex
to it than 'ordinary' ply" and would require more battening. But given
the relative costs of ply and battens, that might be a good trade-off.

I used shuttering ply, and fixed with six screws per sheet. Not had any
difficulties. The one particularly heavy set of shelves (using spur
style brackets) have the struts run floor to ceiling, and they aree
screwed through to the blockwork.

I'll be painting the walls, probably matt white, and I'm not after a
perfect living-room-type finish. Heavy fixings can be screwed through to
the battening, and 18mm should be thick enough for lighter attachments,
shouldn't it?

As would 12mm to be honest.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
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|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Mon, 15 Aug 2011 12:29:43 +0100, Bert Coules wrote:

TMC wrote:

...2 x 1 battens set edge on... are too narrow to join 2 sheets...

I was thinking of using two battens together (ie to make 2"x2") at board
junctions, with single battens in between. The costs work out cheaper than
using 2"x2" timber, which in any case is under that size which would be a
problem for the Celotex - the tile battens I've looked at are an exact
2"x1".

Being old fashioned I would prefer screws for the battens
rather than glue if possible...

You haven't tried drilling into my garage walls! But I'll use screws where
I can.

Sterling board would be my choice probably at 11mm.

I've never heard of Sterling board: I'll look it up.

LATER...

Oh, *that's* what Sterling board is. I've seen it, of course, in boarded-up
shop fronts and similar, but I've never looked closely enough to tell what
the surface is like: is it smooth enough to paint successfully?

Thanks for the reply.

Bert

OSB3 is the least to use as it's resistant to water
http://www.osb-info.org/rightgrade.html
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

MuddyMike wrote:

I used OSB, its cheap enough and looks like this;

Thanks for that. I'm having trouble getting onto that site ("We've
encountered an error... we will try to fix the problem") but I'll persevere.

Bert

I wrote:

I'm having trouble getting onto that site...

It's working now and I've looked at the pics. I was momentarily confused by
the fact that they run from 1/20 being the finished article through to 18/20
which shows things before work began, but it's a fascinating collection and
a very nice job, as well as showing the Sterling board/OSB. Thanks.

Bert

In message , Bert
Coules writes
Frank Erskine wrote:

Don't forget though, that the more battens you have, you'll have less
insulation material :-)

Hardly enough to make any appreciable difference though, surely? Or is
that the reason for the ":-)" ? Thanks for that thought!

You could use adjustable screws and have an air gap over the insulation.
I have only used them for fixing through insulation into wood and don't
know how big a problem fitting the plugs would be. If the hole is big
enough for the screw and plug it might be too big for the *back thread*
to work.

regards

--
Tim Lamb

"Bert Coules" wrote in message
o.uk...
I wrote:

I'm having trouble getting onto that site...

It's working now and I've looked at the pics. I was momentarily confused
by the fact that they run from 1/20 being the finished article through to
18/20 which shows things before work began, but it's a fascinating
collection and a very nice job, as well as showing the Sterling board/OSB.
Thanks.

Hmmm, I see what you mean about the sequence, strange that. If you go in by
this link http://share.ovi.com/album/Muddymike.Workshop
They flow correctly.

Mike

On Aug 15, 3:32*pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 15/08/2011 12:00, Bert Coules wrote:

My garage-workshop conversion has reached the stage where the internal
walls are ready to be battened and lined out. As suggested in an earlier
thread, 2"x1" tile battens will be perfect and relatively inexpensive
(an important consideration for the whole project) and can be screwed
and/or glued to the concrete wall-panels leaving room for 2" Celotex or
similar behind the lining. But I'm not sure about the best choice of

When I did mine, I skipped on the battens altogether - even cheaper!
Just screwed through the board (1/2" ply), through the PIT (50mm) and
into the block. Bought a couple of boxes of 5 1/8 12 gauge quicksilver
screws from SF for the job.

If the OP does use battens, you can use cheaper non-rigid insulation.
I dont know how much you'll heat it, and thus what insulation would
get you the lowest TCO.


sheet material. Shuttering ply was recommended, also standard WPB ply,
both at 18mm thick. But is there any reason why I shouldn't also
consider MDF and chipboard?

MDF costs more than chip and has no advantage over it, other than fine
texture and thus mouldability.
Shuttering ply has a rougher surface than WBP, but OSB is almost as
strong. OSB2 is moisture resistant, OSB3 more waterproof.
Chipboard would work fine if you can trust it to stay dry. Its a good
bit weaker than OSB but also far cheaper, so going up to 18mm high
density chip would give you a fairly tough result. Its a common
flooring material.


(WBP) Ply is moisture resistant - and so will far better if it ever got
damp out there. Chip is harder to screw into and screws do not hold as
well - so makes shelf fitting etc less easy.

Be sure to screw brackets to the battens as well as the chip sheet.
Use brackets with 2 holes at the top not 1, and use the widest screws
that will fit.


My local timber yard mentioned that shuttering ply "has more of a flex
to it than 'ordinary' ply" and would require more battening. But given
the relative costs of ply and battens, that might be a good trade-off.

Flex depends entierly on thickness. 9mm shuttering flexes all over the
place.

I used shuttering ply, and fixed with six screws per sheet. Not had any
difficulties. The one particularly heavy set of shelves (using spur
style brackets) have the struts run floor to ceiling, and they aree
screwed through to the blockwork.

I'll be painting the walls, probably matt white, and I'm not after a
perfect living-room-type finish. Heavy fixings can be screwed through to
the battening, and 18mm should be thick enough for lighter attachments,
shouldn't it?

As would 12mm to be honest.

You could use lime paint then, plenty good enough for a workshop, and
supremely cheap.


NT

NT thanks for all the thoughts. My local timber yard also recommended OSB
and I think that's the path I'll take.

Talking to them about rigid insulation, they told me they stock not Kingspan
or Celotex but a comparable product called Quinn Therm. I must
investigate...

Bert

MuddyMike wrote:

Hmmm, I see what you mean about the sequence, strange that.

I assumed it was an idiosyncracy of the site rather than the way you
arranged things. It was mildly disconcerting at first but hardly mattered
once I twigged.

Bert

On 16/08/2011 08:35, Bert Coules wrote:
NT thanks for all the thoughts. My local timber yard also recommended
OSB and I think that's the path I'll take.

Talking to them about rigid insulation, they told me they stock not
Kingspan or Celotex but a comparable product called Quinn Therm. I must
investigate...

Yup, there are loads of makes of PIR foam boards. Kingspan and Celotex
are the well known trade names, but they usually have prices to reflect
all that brand awareness!

I figured with my workshop, a decent level of insulation would mean the
reduction in ongoing cost of keeping the temperature high enough in
there to prevent rusting of tools would pay back eventually. It also
means that its quick to get it to a comfortable operating temperature in
the winter.




--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:

Yup, there are loads of makes of PIR foam boards. Kingspan and Celotex are
the well known trade names, but they usually have prices to reflect all
that brand awareness!

They quoted the 2" Quinn Therm boards at £18.28 per 8x4ft sheet. I don't
have any other builders' yard prices, but that's less than Wickes charge for
a 1" sheet of Celotex, so seems not too unreasonable.

Celotex seconds would be cheaper but the two suppliers I know of both impose
a hefty delivery charge which knocks out the advantage.

Incidentally, it looks as though while I can get 2" of insulation into the
walls, the limited headroom means that the roof will be limited to 1". I'm
hoping that will be better than nothing.

Bert

In article , Bert
Coules writes
John Rumm wrote:

Yup, there are loads of makes of PIR foam boards. Kingspan and Celotex are
the well known trade names, but they usually have prices to reflect all
that brand awareness!

They quoted the 2" Quinn Therm boards at £18.28 per 8x4ft sheet. I don't
have any other builders' yard prices, but that's less than Wickes charge for
a 1" sheet of Celotex, so seems not too unreasonable.

Wickes 10 up price for 50mm is 19.98 a sheet so maybe there is a bit
more room for negotiation in the BM's price.

Celotex seconds would be cheaper but the two suppliers I know of both impose
a hefty delivery charge which knocks out the advantage.

--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

On Aug 16, 2:50*pm, John Rumm wrote:
On 16/08/2011 08:35, Bert Coules wrote:

NT thanks for all the thoughts. My local timber yard also recommended
OSB and I think that's the path I'll take.

Talking to them about rigid insulation, they told me they stock not
Kingspan or Celotex but a comparable product called Quinn Therm. I must
investigate...

Yup, there are loads of makes of PIR foam boards. Kingspan and Celotex
are the well known trade names, but they usually have prices to reflect
all that brand awareness!

I figured with my workshop, a decent level of insulation would mean the
reduction in ongoing cost of keeping the temperature high enough in
there to prevent rusting of tools would pay back eventually. It also
means that its quick to get it to a comfortable operating temperature in
the winter.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| * * * * *Internode Ltd - *http://www.internode.co.uk* * * * * *|
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| * * * *John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk * * * * * * *|
\================================================= ================/

I've always thought this concern about tools rusting in the modern
workshop was a piece of nonsense. Let's see - concrete floor with
dpm, insulated walls and roof with membrane to protect the insulation,
so where's the moisture going to come from? OK, you warm the workshop
up in winter but the only source of moisture is you and that's not
going to be very significant, and if the workshop is like mine then
there's plenty of saw dust and shavings to absorb the moisture long
before it thinks about condensing on any metal surfaces.

And in fact even that is a load of cobblers as my last workshop had
none of these - it was just a wooden shed on a plain concrete floor -
no insulation - no dpm's, and in 30 years use in mid-belt Scotland I
was never aware of my wide range of tools getting any rust.

Rob

"fred" wrote:

Wickes 10 up price for 50mm is 19.98 a sheet so maybe there is a bit
more room for negotiation in the BM's price.

That does even things up a bit, I agree. Thanks.

Bert

"robgraham" wrote:

And in fact even that is a load of cobblers as my last workshop had
none of these - it was just a wooden shed on a plain concrete floor -
no insulation - no dpm's, and in 30 years use in mid-belt Scotland I
was never aware of my wide range of tools getting any rust.

Before I started my garage-workshop conversion I found that keeping anything
made of metal in the garage definitely led to it rusting. This was a
concrete sectional building with a cement floor, no insulation, and a
corrugated galvanised steel roof the ends of which were open to the outside.
The copious condensation that formed on the inside of the roof and dripped
freely down was presumably the cause.

Bert

On 16/08/2011 23:15, Bert Coules wrote:
"fred" wrote:

Wickes 10 up price for 50mm is 19.98 a sheet so maybe there is a bit
more room for negotiation in the BM's price.

That does even things up a bit, I agree. Thanks.

Our local supplier does new sheets at £14/each and seconds at £12 for
50mm. Additional discount if you a "van load".


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On 16/08/2011 22:29, robgraham wrote:
On Aug 16, 2:50 pm, John wrote:
On 16/08/2011 08:35, Bert Coules wrote:

NT thanks for all the thoughts. My local timber yard also recommended
OSB and I think that's the path I'll take.

Talking to them about rigid insulation, they told me they stock not
Kingspan or Celotex but a comparable product called Quinn Therm. I must
investigate...

Yup, there are loads of makes of PIR foam boards. Kingspan and Celotex
are the well known trade names, but they usually have prices to reflect
all that brand awareness!

I figured with my workshop, a decent level of insulation would mean the
reduction in ongoing cost of keeping the temperature high enough in
there to prevent rusting of tools would pay back eventually. It also
means that its quick to get it to a comfortable operating temperature in
the winter.

I've always thought this concern about tools rusting in the modern
workshop was a piece of nonsense. Let's see - concrete floor with
dpm, insulated walls and roof with membrane to protect the insulation,
so where's the moisture going to come from? OK, you warm the workshop

Once the surface temperature falls below the dew point, stuff starts to
get damp. Can't see how you can avoid it if you are going to allow wet
air in there.

up in winter but the only source of moisture is you and that's not
going to be very significant, and if the workshop is like mine then
there's plenty of saw dust and shavings to absorb the moisture long
before it thinks about condensing on any metal surfaces.

And in fact even that is a load of cobblers as my last workshop had
none of these - it was just a wooden shed on a plain concrete floor -
no insulation - no dpm's, and in 30 years use in mid-belt Scotland I
was never aware of my wide range of tools getting any rust.

My experience is different, but perhaps the climate makes a difference?

It took me several hours of work with a wire cup brush on an angle
grinder clearing all the surface rust off my table saw when I bought it
from my mate. He had stored it in unheated and uninsulated garage for
several years, and it was looking a bit sorry for itself. After cleaning
and repainting, its been in my insulated and gently heated workshop for
three years, and shows no signs of further rust.

There are various other fringe benefits to having it well insulated etc.
Aprons / overalls etc stay dry and don't feel damp, magazines, plans,
designs etc stay crisp etc. and I have no qualms about leaving
electronic gear out there either. Not to mention fast warmup when you
want to work in the winter, and not overheating in the summer.



--
Cheers,

John.

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| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:

Our local supplier does new sheets at £14/each and seconds at £12 for
50mm.

I must live in an expensive area! Or at least one with less enlightened
suppliers.

Additional discount if you [take a "van load".

One of the best bits of advice I ever saw about selfbuilding/DIY was "buy a
van that can take 8x4 sheets". Sadly, it was advice I never took. What
I've paid in delivery charges over the years would probably have covered the
cost of a vehicle and then some.

Bert

In message , Bert
Coules writes
"robgraham" wrote:

And in fact even that is a load of cobblers as my last workshop had
none of these - it was just a wooden shed on a plain concrete floor -
no insulation - no dpm's, and in 30 years use in mid-belt Scotland I
was never aware of my wide range of tools getting any rust.

Before I started my garage-workshop conversion I found that keeping
anything made of metal in the garage definitely led to it rusting.
This was a concrete sectional building with a cement floor, no
insulation, and a corrugated galvanised steel roof the ends of which
were open to the outside. The copious condensation that formed on the
inside of the roof and dripped freely down was presumably the cause.

I find it is a seasonal issue.

My tractor workshop is uninsulated and certainly unheated with concrete
block walls.

Lumps of metal; particularly the lathe, get chilled during a period of
cold weather and then collect condensation when the weather warms and
there is more moisture in the air.

The simplest cure is to drape a cover over the object. I'm not sure how
this works but it may trap dry air or prevent significant air movement.

regards
--
Tim Lamb

On Aug 16, 10:29*pm, robgraham wrote:

And in fact even that is a load of cobblers as my last workshop had
none of these - it was just a wooden shed on a plain concrete floor -
no insulation - no dpm's, and in 30 years use in mid-belt Scotland I
was never aware of my wide range of tools getting any rust.


The sun shines all day, the air absorbs moisture from the ground,
plants, exhalation, evaporating surface water, sea, etc.. The air RH
and moisture content increases.

The sun sets, air temperature drops, air RH increases, excess moisture
condenses on anything below the dew point or precipitates as dew. It's
de-ionized water (almost) and so is more reactive than tap water.

"Onetap" wrote:

The sun shines all day, the air absorbs moisture from the ground,
plants, exhalation, evaporating surface water, sea, etc.. The air RH
and moisture content increases.

Does that mean that a constantly-running dehumidifier would be the best way
to defeat the condensation problem?

Bert

Tim,

My problem is not only that metal object get chilled: the underside of the
galvanised steel roof drips copiously. Only, as you say, at certain times,
but even so it's enough to be a real annoyance.

I'm hoping that a suspended ceiling incorporating 1" of insulation and
sealed to the interior wall-cladding will alleviate the dripping, but I'll
only know for sure by actually doing it.

Bert

In message , Bert
Coules writes
"Onetap" wrote:

The sun shines all day, the air absorbs moisture from the ground,
plants, exhalation, evaporating surface water, sea, etc.. The air RH
and moisture content increases.

Does that mean that a constantly-running dehumidifier would be the best
way to defeat the condensation problem?

ISTM there are two solutions. One is to prevent moist air coming in
contact with the cold corrugated roofing. The other is to arrange some
moisture absorbent material able to trap the condensed water and
re-evaporate it when things warm up.

If your proposed insulation prevents fresh air reaching the steel, it
may well work. You could close off the corrugations with tinned foam.

regards

--
Tim Lamb

On 17/08/2011 07:59, Bert Coules wrote:
John Rumm wrote:

Our local supplier does new sheets at £14/each and seconds at £12 for
50mm.

I must live in an expensive area! Or at least one with less enlightened
suppliers.

Additional discount if you [take a "van load".

One of the best bits of advice I ever saw about selfbuilding/DIY was
"buy a van that can take 8x4 sheets". Sadly, it was advice I never took.
What I've paid in delivery charges over the years would probably have
covered the cost of a vehicle and then some.

In this case the van in question is the suppliers rather than yours - a
long wheelbase Merc Sprinter. Tis what I ordered for the workshop plus a
couple of other bits for another job. Was about £320 IIRC.


--
Cheers,

John.

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| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Tim Lamb wrote:

If your proposed insulation prevents fresh air reaching the steel, it may
well work.

I was actually thinking more of preventing the hotter, wetter internal air
from reaching the steel. Then both the inner and outer sides of the roof
ought to be at the same temperature, resulting in no condensation. At
least, that's the theory.

You could close off the corrugations with tinned foam.

I discovered the other day that Compton garages make a polyurethane foam
infill strip specially shaped to fit their particular roof corrugations. I
doubt if my (unknown make) garage has exactly the same profile, though. And
I've never had much luck with tinned foam, which seems to be both pretty
uncontrollable and pretty unpredictable, and also fairly useless after a
first session with the tin, however carefully you clean out the nozzle and
tube.

Bert

In message , Bert
Coules writes
Tim Lamb wrote:

If your proposed insulation prevents fresh air reaching the steel, it
may well work.

I was actually thinking more of preventing the hotter, wetter internal
air from reaching the steel. Then both the inner and outer sides of
the roof ought to be at the same temperature, resulting in no
condensation. At least, that's the theory.

You could close off the corrugations with tinned foam.

I discovered the other day that Compton garages make a polyurethane
foam infill strip specially shaped to fit their particular roof
corrugations. I doubt if my (unknown make) garage has exactly the same
profile, though. And I've never had much luck with tinned foam, which
seems to be both pretty uncontrollable and pretty unpredictable, and
also fairly useless after a first session with the tin, however
carefully you clean out the nozzle and tube.

You can purchase foam strips to suit rolled box section as well. They
are £1.00/m. One tin of foam should do the job. Moisten the surfaces
first and cut off the excess when it has hardened.

regards

--
Tim Lamb

In article , Bert
Coules writes
Tim Lamb wrote:

If your proposed insulation prevents fresh air reaching the steel, it may
well work.

I was actually thinking more of preventing the hotter, wetter internal air
from reaching the steel. Then both the inner and outer sides of the roof
ought to be at the same temperature, resulting in no condensation. At
least, that's the theory.

You could close off the corrugations with tinned foam.

I discovered the other day that Compton garages make a polyurethane foam
infill strip specially shaped to fit their particular roof corrugations. I
doubt if my (unknown make) garage has exactly the same profile, though. And
I've never had much luck with tinned foam, which seems to be both pretty
uncontrollable and pretty unpredictable, and also fairly useless after a
first session with the tin, however carefully you clean out the nozzle and
tube.

Far better control with a proper gun and gun foam:

Gun:
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p75661
Foam:
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p57280
Gun cleaner:
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p30658
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

"fred" wrote:

Far better control with a proper gun and gun foam:

I didn't know about that, so thanks. When I start on the roof/ceiling I'll
probably go down that route.

I see that the cleaner works only on uncured foam, so you have to be
reasonably nippy in its use. I think I'm right in saying that there's no
solvent or cleaner for cured foam, is there?

Bert

In article , Bert
Coules writes
"fred" wrote:

Far better control with a proper gun and gun foam:

I didn't know about that, so thanks. When I start on the roof/ceiling I'll
probably go down that route.

I see that the cleaner works only on uncured foam, so you have to be
reasonably nippy in its use. I think I'm right in saying that there's no
solvent or cleaner for cured foam, is there?

I would definitely clean the gun after each as mine is currently
awaiting a strip down and clean out[1] after leaving it too long between
uses. Others here who use their guns more often say they just leave
theirs 'live' and don't have problems.

Not really for gun cleaning I think but try Foam Eater:
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p21592

[1] they are dismantlable to component level for cleaning if required
but normally a skoosh through with cleaner is enough
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

"fred" wrote:

Not really for gun cleaning I think but try Foam Eater:
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p21592

Thanks for that, and the rest.

Bert

On 18/08/2011 10:34, fred wrote:
In article , Bert
Coules writes
"fred" wrote:

Far better control with a proper gun and gun foam:

I didn't know about that, so thanks. When I start on the roof/ceiling
I'll
probably go down that route.

I see that the cleaner works only on uncured foam, so you have to be
reasonably nippy in its use. I think I'm right in saying that there's no
solvent or cleaner for cured foam, is there?

I would definitely clean the gun after each as mine is currently
awaiting a strip down and clean out[1] after leaving it too long between
uses. Others here who use their guns more often say they just leave
theirs 'live' and don't have problems.

If I am using it again within a few weeks, then I will leave the can on.
The seal on the gun is far better than on the can. You may need to slice
of the layer of cured foam from the nozzel prior to next use.

Not really for gun cleaning I think but try Foam Eater:
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/p21592

[1] they are dismantlable to component level for cleaning if required
but normally a skoosh through with cleaner is enough


--
Cheers,

John.

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|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
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\================================================= ================/

I decided to try a single wall as a test: tile battens, 2" Quinn-therm, OSB.
It's gone well and I think the OSB will look fine once it's painted, but I
didn't find the Quinn-therm as pleasant to use as Celotex: the core foam
seems to be much more crumbly and messy to cut, almost like normal expanded
polystyrene. Celotex for me in future, I think.

Bert