Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:
Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

3. 4 won't work.

You could also drill little holes up from undernaeth to help the wood
dry out if it gets damp.

Really the only perfect method is to not use a non-waterproof material
to begin with.


NT

"MM" wrote in message
...
Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.


My experience is of bubbles closer to the point of ingress, not a couple of
inches in. The underside looks relatively dry as well.

Its fairly easy to remove a worksurface, allowing closer inspection and
re-sealing. I've also varnished or painted the wood exposed by the sawcuts
to minimise any further ingress.

I'm not so sure the bubbles or swelling will go down for a long time, if
ever?

On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:
Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Removing the sink and testing the soundness of the bond between the
laminate and the chipboard,,
would be my first thought
If it were possible to raise the laminate slightly and then inject a
slightly dilute pva ,,,
and then clamp firmley,,,, could be worth a try...

My thinking is that the ingress of water has probably tracked between
the two surfaces,, and that there is no serious damage to the
chipboard,,
By the piccies it does not look so bad..

You might be lucky an fix it..

..............................................

On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:

On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:
Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!


If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.


I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose. My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'. It would 'stay' in that
position by dint of the woodworking glue applied beforehand (the
clamps would stay in place overnight).


Removing the sink and testing the soundness of the bond between the
laminate and the chipboard,,
would be my first thought
If it were possible to raise the laminate slightly and then inject a
slightly dilute pva ,,,
and then clamp firmley,,,, could be worth a try...

Yes.


My thinking is that the ingress of water has probably tracked between
the two surfaces,, and that there is no serious damage to the
chipboard,,
By the piccies it does not look so bad..

Well, it's not THAT bad, but when I come to sell the house in order to
downsize, prospective buyers would pick up on that immediately.

I could really kick myself that I didn't go right round the underside
join between sink and chipboard with sealant the day I moved in, since
I know what an absolute pain these chipboard worksurfaces can be with
water present.

It seems that kitchen installers do not routinely seal the vertical
cut surface of the sink opening before fitting the sink.


You might be lucky an fix it..

Let's hope so! Thanks.

MM

On Apr 26, 6:20*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:
On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:


Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Cleaning_sinks


If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.



I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose.

Wont achieve anything, theres no airflow in a blind hole, and even
less when its blocked by a drill bit.


My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'.

How on earth are yuo going to achieve that?

It would 'stay' in that
position by dint of the woodworking glue applied beforehand (the
clamps would stay in place overnight).

What will the wet glue do to the chipboard? Maybe you'll get away with
it.


NT

On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 23:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Tabby
wrote:

On Apr 26, 6:20*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:
On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:


Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Cleaning_sinks


If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.



I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose.

Wont achieve anything, theres no airflow in a blind hole, and even
less when its blocked by a drill bit.


My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'.

How on earth are yuo going to achieve that?

Apply G-clamps across the work top, with a piece of wood to spread the
clamping force. If the underside of the vinyl can "give" a little, due
to the honeycomb or Aero effect I've imparted with a small drill bit,
then the bubbled area should disappear. Note that the *bubbles* are
not the vinyl itself lifting, but the underlying *chipboard* having
swelled a bit from the water ingress and pushing up the vinyl.

MM

On Apr 26, 8:45*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 23:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Tabby
wrote:



On Apr 26, 6:20*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:
On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:

Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Cleaning_sinks

If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.

I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose.

Wont achieve anything, theres no airflow in a blind hole, and even
less when its blocked by a drill bit.

My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'.

How on earth are yuo going to achieve that?

Apply G-clamps across the work top, with a piece of wood to spread the
clamping force. If the underside of the vinyl can "give" a little, due
to the honeycomb or Aero effect I've imparted with a small drill bit,
then the bubbled area should disappear. Note that the *bubbles* are
not the vinyl itself lifting, but the underlying *chipboard* having
swelled a bit from the water ingress and pushing up the vinyl.

MM

Let us know if it works. I'll admit to having doubts.


NT

On Apr 26, 8:45*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 23:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Tabby
wrote:



On Apr 26, 6:20*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:
On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:

Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Cleaning_sinks

If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.

I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose.

Wont achieve anything, theres no airflow in a blind hole, and even
less when its blocked by a drill bit.

My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'.



.................................................. ........................

How on earth are yuo going to achieve that?

Apply G-clamps across the work top, with a piece of wood to spread the
clamping force. If the underside of the vinyl can "give" a little, due
to the honeycomb or Aero effect I've imparted with a small drill bit,
Note that the *bubbles* are
not the vinyl itself lifting, but the underlying *chipboard* having
swelled a bit from the water ingress and pushing up the vinyl.

MM

Ok ,, If you are certain the vinyl is forced up by swelling..

I see what you are trying to do..
Are you planning to drill in from the side or underneath or both,,
It is a pretty solid looking bit of board and the water damage is
probably in the top layers,,
the rest will be sound I expect..

Another idea to consider might be drilling in from the side about
centre of top half..
And use a plunge cut jigsaw to undermine the area underneath the
swelling with two short slots,,
If you can get at it that is,, experiment on an old piece first...
Leave for a day or two to allow any moisture to escape,,

PVA has a wonderful affinity with chipboard to bind and seal,,
but there might be spirit based sealers to soak in deeper without
swelling ..
with a drop of that buffalo glue to finish and fill the gaps again..

Trouble is the whole carry on is gonna be a rite niusance if you do
not have another sink nearby..
Or an old spare short one you can slap in on temp..

I note there is only one hold down fixing on that end of the sink,,
Looks like the probable if it has always been that way..


Youl get a buzz if you mange to fix it like reaching that awkward
itchy bit with a stick..

.................................................. ............

On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 05:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:

On Apr 26, 8:45*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 23:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Tabby
wrote:



On Apr 26, 6:20*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:
On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:

Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy.

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Cleaning_sinks

If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.

I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose.

Wont achieve anything, theres no airflow in a blind hole, and even
less when its blocked by a drill bit.

My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'.



................................................. ........................

How on earth are yuo going to achieve that?

Apply G-clamps across the work top, with a piece of wood to spread the
clamping force. If the underside of the vinyl can "give" a little, due
to the honeycomb or Aero effect I've imparted with a small drill bit,
Note that the *bubbles* are
not the vinyl itself lifting, but the underlying *chipboard* having
swelled a bit from the water ingress and pushing up the vinyl.

MM

Ok ,, If you are certain the vinyl is forced up by swelling..

I see what you are trying to do..
Are you planning to drill in from the side or underneath or both,,
It is a pretty solid looking bit of board and the water damage is
probably in the top layers,,
the rest will be sound I expect..

If I did do the drilling I would drill into the vertical (cut) face of
the chipboard in the region of the bubbled up surface. It might,
however, be sufficient just to use clamping force to press the top,
vinyl layer down again.

Another idea to consider might be drilling in from the side about
centre of top half..
And use a plunge cut jigsaw to undermine the area underneath the
swelling with two short slots,,
If you can get at it that is,, experiment on an old piece first...
Leave for a day or two to allow any moisture to escape,,

PVA has a wonderful affinity with chipboard to bind and seal,,
but there might be spirit based sealers to soak in deeper without
swelling ..
with a drop of that buffalo glue to finish and fill the gaps again..

Buffalo glue? Never heard of it!

Trouble is the whole carry on is gonna be a rite niusance if you do
not have another sink nearby..
Or an old spare short one you can slap in on temp..

Yeah, that is certainly true. Perhaps the first thing to do is find
that ruddy replacement sink!


I note there is only one hold down fixing on that end of the sink,,
Looks like the probable if it has always been that way..

Yes, I noticed that as well. In fact, the installer left off TWO of
the possible fixings. These are little studs that poke out of the
sink, fixed with the special clips. Maybe if all the clips had been
fitted the work top would have been sealed much better.

Youl get a buzz if you mange to fix it like reaching that awkward
itchy bit with a stick..

Indeed.

MM

On Apr 26, 1:51*pm, MM wrote:
On Tue, 26 Apr 2011 05:31:02 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear



wrote:
On Apr 26, 8:45*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 23:36:34 -0700 (PDT), Tabby
wrote:

On Apr 26, 6:20*am, MM wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2011 13:57:53 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Bear
wrote:
On Apr 25, 6:39*pm, MM wrote:

Best thing is to show you a pic first:

http://www.littletyke.myzen.co.uk/sink/

The work surface around the sink is slightly raised, i.e. bubbled up,
at the points shown in the top picture. When the house was built six
years ago the kitchen installer did not take enough care to seal the
sink thoroughly against the work surface. Even though I have been
careful to minimise water ingress these past six years I obviously
haven't been careful enough. A few weeks ago I noticed the uneven work
surface near the edge of the sink. Looking underneath the sink, one
can just make out (though perhaps not on the second picture) where
some seepage has found its way underneath and thus into the chipboard.

Remedies:

1. Replace the work surface. This would be very costly and messy..

2. Remove the sink, undermine the chipboard VERY SLIGHTLY in the
region in question (e.g. drill very small "wormholes"), so that the
top vinyl layer "gives" a little. Then compress the vinyl layer back
down on to the chipboard with G-clamps and a strip of wood, having
impregnated the chipboard with waterproof woodworking glue so that any
possible water ingress in future cannot soak in.

3. Slightly lift the sink in the region and force in some more
sealant, e.g. from a sealant gun. Use the woodworking glue
impregnation as well.

4. Don't lift the sink at all, but from underneath, apply more sealant
between sink and chipboard as a barrier. Possibly also wetting the
chipboard first with diluted waterproof woodworking glue and allowing
to dry to solidify the chipboard. This method would not get rid of the
raised bubbles, but at least the problem won't get any worse.

5. Fit a larger (longer) sink and make sure it's properly sealed this
time!

Any comments on the above? Suggestions?

Thanks.

MM

Shame about that,, it looks like it was a tidy job..
Love little teasers like this though..

From underneath,, the damp stain does not seem so very significant,,,
I wonder if the vynil laminate has just lifted off the the surface of
chipboard...
Can you tell...

Not without removing the sink. However, I had planned on replacing the
sink anyway, at some point, since it's the horrid Astralux material
that is a right PITA to clean (compared to ceramic or stainless
steel). Trouble is, so far I haven't found a replacement stainless
steel one that is longer, i.e. long enough to cover the bubbled up
bit. Well, I DID find one sink, but it is from the top end of kitchen
design and costs about £600 or something!

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...Cleaning_sinks

If ultimately you are preparred to take step 5,, then I think that
gives you leeway to at least attempt a cure..

Yes, I'm going to carry on looking for a suitable replacement anyway.
I just want to try and find a way of stopping any further bubbling up
in the meantime.

I would be very reluctant to do any drilling activities that might
result in trapping sawdust betweeen the two surfaces..

Well, I could run the vacuum cleaner on full tilt while drilling, I
suppose.

Wont achieve anything, theres no airflow in a blind hole, and even
less when its blocked by a drill bit.

My idea would be to turn the chipboard in the bubbled up area
into a Crunchy bar, i.e. kind of honeycombed, then when I apply
moderate clamping force, the vinyl layer would compress down and push
the honeycomb together, which would 'give'.

................................................. .........................

How on earth are yuo going to achieve that?

Apply G-clamps across the work top, with a piece of wood to spread the
clamping force. If the underside of the vinyl can "give" a little, due
to the honeycomb or Aero effect I've imparted with a small drill bit,
*Note that the *bubbles* are
not the vinyl itself lifting, but the underlying *chipboard* having
swelled a bit from the water ingress and pushing up the vinyl.

MM

Ok ,, If you are certain the vinyl is forced up by swelling..

I see what you are trying to do..
Are you planning to drill in from the side or underneath or both,,
It is a pretty solid looking bit of board and the water damage is
probably in the top layers,,
the rest will be sound I expect..

If I did do the drilling I would drill into the vertical (cut) face of
the chipboard in the region of the bubbled up surface. It might,
however, be sufficient just to use clamping force to press the top,
vinyl layer down again.

Another idea to consider might be drilling in from the side about
centre of top half..
And use a plunge cut jigsaw to undermine the area underneath the
swelling with two short *slots,,
If you can get at it that is,, experiment on an old piece first...
Leave for a *day or two to allow any moisture to escape,,


.................................................. ............................................
PVA has a wonderful affinity with chipboard to bind and seal,,
but there might be spirit based sealers to soak in deeper without
swelling ..
with a drop of that buffalo glue to finish and fill the gaps again..



Buffalo glue? Never heard of it!

Oops.
I think I got they beasts in the wrong pens,,

It should have been Gorilla Glue..

it expands in the cavities same as filler foam,,
you could use to fill and glue drill holes ..

I think your idea will work,,, you know..


Im convinced
The fix can be done,, believe it...an do it..


.................................................. ...................