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UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions. |
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#1
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired,
and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. |
#2
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"john hamilton" wrote in message ... Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. I have a Panasonic with Freesat HD built in, Panasonic always seem to be "Best Buys" in reviews. Personally would not buy a new TV without a Freesat HD or Freeview HD built in. I doubt my Panasonic was any much dearer than the equivalent non Freesat model, but I did shop around and priced matched at Comet with the Richerr Sounds price. Regards David |
#3
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In article ,
"David" writes: "john hamilton" wrote in message ... Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. I have a Panasonic with Freesat HD built in, Panasonic always seem to be "Best Buys" in reviews. Personally would not buy a new TV without a Freesat HD or Freeview HD built in. I doubt my Panasonic was any much dearer than the equivalent non Freesat model, but I did shop around and priced matched at Comet with the Richerr Sounds price. Check out Costco too, if you have a card, or are eligable for one. A couple of friends ended up buying TVs on my card last year, as they were over £100 cheaper than high street for a £500 TV, and that included a 5 year guarantee. High street shops probably won't price-match Costco. -- Andrew Gabriel [email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup] |
#4
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes In article , "David" writes: "john hamilton" wrote in message ... Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. I have a Panasonic with Freesat HD built in, Panasonic always seem to be "Best Buys" in reviews. Personally would not buy a new TV without a Freesat HD or Freeview HD built in. I doubt my Panasonic was any much dearer than the equivalent non Freesat model, but I did shop around and priced matched at Comet with the Richerr Sounds price. Check out Costco too, if you have a card, or are eligable for one. A couple of friends ended up buying TVs on my card last year, as they were over £100 cheaper than high street for a £500 TV, and that included a 5 year guarantee. High street shops probably won't price-match Costco. Seconded, the TV I bought last year (or was it the year before, maybe I should join the silversurfers ...) from Richer Sounds was cheaper and had a longer warranty in Costco -- geoff |
#5
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers, uk.tech.digital-tv, uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"David" wrote in message : "john hamilton" wrote in message ... Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. I have a Panasonic with Freesat HD built in, Panasonic always seem to be "Best Buys" in reviews. Personally would not buy a new TV without a Freesat HD or Freeview HD built in. One problem with built in tuners is that, as far as I am aware, most of those sets don't have a hard drive and recording facility built in, thus necessitating another box as well. Similarly, if the tuner "breaks" for any reason, you need to buy the whole new TV. Another problem is that if (more likely when) there are new technological developments you have to get a new TV set to upgrade, whereas a separate box is cheaper and easier to change. Perhaps the best way at the moment is to have a TV set with Freeview HD built in, and a separate Freesat box. I'd do it that way as most new developments are likely to be available on satellite first, and in most areas (unless you're in a very good terrestrial reception area) the HD picture will most likely be better on satellite. My set only has an ordinary terrestrial tuner built in (HD terrestrial didn't exist when I bought it) but it makes a useful backup (and gives you a few more channels) on the very rare occasions (exceptionally heavy rain or snow) when satellite reception is not 100%. Back to John's original question as to which brand of TV, I think the same applies as to most things, you get what you pay for. I would always go for the best brand that I could afford. I picked a Samsung, but would have bought Panasonic or Sony (the latter somewhat overpriced) if not. I paid a little more for mine by buying from John Lewis, but got a five year guarantee for free, making it more or less the same as the cheaper suppliers with a guarantee added. The satellite PVR is a Humax Foxsat. Regards, Bob |
#6
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
Bob Henson wrote:
"David" wrote in message : "john hamilton" wrote in message ... Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. I have a Panasonic with Freesat HD built in, Panasonic always seem to be "Best Buys" in reviews. Personally would not buy a new TV without a Freesat HD or Freeview HD built in. One problem with built in tuners is that, as far as I am aware, most of those sets don't have a hard drive and recording facility built in, thus necessitating another box as well. Similarly, if the tuner "breaks" for any reason, you need to buy the whole new TV. Another problem is that if (more likely when) there are new technological developments you have to get a new TV set to upgrade, whereas a separate box is cheaper and easier to change. Perhaps the best way at the moment is to have a TV set with Freeview HD built in, and a separate Freesat box. I'd do it that way as most new developments are likely to be available on satellite first, and in most areas (unless you're in a very good terrestrial reception area) the HD picture will most likely be better on satellite. My set only has an ordinary terrestrial tuner built in (HD terrestrial didn't exist when I bought it) but it makes a useful backup (and gives you a few more channels) on the very rare occasions (exceptionally heavy rain or snow) when satellite reception is not 100%. Back to John's original question as to which brand of TV, I think the same applies as to most things, you get what you pay for. I would always go for the best brand that I could afford. I picked a Samsung, but would have bought Panasonic or Sony (the latter somewhat overpriced) if not. I paid a little more for mine by buying from John Lewis, but got a five year guarantee for free, making it more or less the same as the cheaper suppliers with a guarantee added. The satellite PVR is a Humax Foxsat. Regards, Bob Having a built in tuner doesn't prevent you from having an external box, or boxes. -- Adrian |
#7
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In message , Adrian
writes Having a built in tuner doesn't prevent you from having an external box, or boxes. My experience with 4 Freeview boxes and a Sony TV and Sony recorder might be relevant. The bunch of no-marks who "planned" the digital changeover have stuck Welsh TV onto a mast designed to face the opposite way and provide the sheltered-from-Winter Hill, Mersey shores of Liverpool with English TV. This mast is now pointing Welsh at the mainly English speaking Welsh banks of the Dee and in the process has made reception in this part of Cheshire pretty weird. Polarisation and channels of these backward facing Welsh are virtually the same as WH, so this is a real test of the logic of tuner set up procedures. The 2 Sony devices have different channel setup logic, one set itself up automatically, the other needed simple human input. All 4 Freeview boxes are different and all are almost impossible to set up. We eventually gave up on my sis-in-law's unit and I wrote out a small chart saying things like BBC1 = 57, BBC2 = 73 (numbers made up, but similar, as I can't remember). My PVR from Maplin can and has been set up, but it involved many passes through the set up procedure and I can't be bothered going beyond Channel 5. One other didn't work at all (money back after 2 samples tried). The final one is in a box in the loft and I can't remember the problem, but it was something to do with channel allocations. All these were dubious makes, badged things like Nikkai. The moral is.... Buy a known make and make sure you can return it. -- Bill |
#8
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sunday, July 25th, 2010 16:10:49 +0100, Bill explained:
so this is a real test of the logic of tuner set up procedures. If you have a digital converter box which allows you to reposition the LCN of stations on the EPG such as the Sony VTX-D800U, then any such problem of receiving stations from multiple transmitters can readily be solved, except for the annoyance of when having to do the regular re-scan for changes to the EPG. This allows you for example to ensure the Channel 4 is on 4, and instead of having a duplicate Channel 4 on 8, you can put S4C there and continue to enjoy Pobol y Cwm each weeknight at 20:00h (with English sub-titles). "Pobol y Cwm has beaten off competition from EastEnders and Doctors to win a Mental Health in the Media Award in the soaps and continuing drama category." |
#9
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
Bill wrote:
The bunch of no-marks who "planned" the digital changeover have stuck Welsh TV onto a mast designed to face the opposite way and provide the sheltered-from-Winter Hill, Mersey shores of Liverpool with English TV. This mast is now pointing Welsh at the mainly English speaking Welsh banks of the Dee and in the process has made reception in this part of Cheshire pretty weird. Polarisation and channels of these backward facing Welsh are virtually the same as WH, so this is a real test of the logic of tuner set up procedures. All verrrry interesting... See also http://www.wrightsaerials.tv/article...at-retunes.pdf Bill |
#10
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In message , Bob Henson
writes "David" wrote in message : "john hamilton" wrote in message ... Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. One problem with built in tuners is that, as far as I am aware, most of those sets don't have a hard drive and recording facility built in, thus necessitating another box as well. Similarly, if the tuner "breaks" for any reason, you need to buy the whole new TV. Most come with tuners built in nowadays Back to John's original question as to which brand of TV, I think the same applies as to most things, you get what you pay for. I would always go for the best brand that I could afford. I picked a Samsung, but would have bought Panasonic or Sony (the latter somewhat overpriced) if not. I paid a little more for mine by buying from John Lewis, but got a five year guarantee for free, making it more or less the same as the cheaper suppliers with a guarantee added. The satellite PVR is a Humax Foxsat. I think in these throwaway days, where greenwash is paid no more than lipservice, very little is economically repairable, unless it is a really trivial problem You might be surprised to know that even central heating boilers are expected to only have a 5-7- year life now So much for conserving resources Don't buy too big if you are watching it in a small room An important consideration is what inputs it has. If, for example, you have only a SCART output from a video and your TV doesn't you would be a bit buggered Panasonic are I think good TVs, I have a Sharp, and while the picture is good, I find it slow and it's response to the remote clumsy. -- geoff |
#11
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers, uk.tech.digital-tv, uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"geoff" wrote in message : You might be surprised to know that even central heating boilers are expected to only have a 5-7- year life now I'm not that surprised. Mine has been running for 20 years, and I'm resisting all attempts to persuade me to change it until it goes altogether. On something as low-tech and yet as highly priced as a boiler it's a disgrace that the expected life is so short. Regards, Bob |
#12
Posted to uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 15:03:40 +0000, Bob Henson wrote:
You might be surprised to know that even central heating boilers are expected to only have a 5-7- year life now I'm not that surprised. Mine has been running for 20 years, and I'm resisting all attempts to persuade me to change it until it goes altogether. On something as low-tech and yet as highly priced as a boiler it's a disgrace that the expected life is so short. Modern boilers are no longer low-tech as in BFO burner and lump of cast iron through which water circulates possibly under nothing more than the influence of gravity. Modern boilers have modulating burners, several safety interlocks and their sensors, complex low capacity ali heat exchangers that *must* have water flow for a while after the burner cuts out, etc etc and recover heat from the flu gases. Far to many bits to go wrong these days. -- Cheers Dave. |
#13
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 15:03:40 +0000, "Bob Henson"
wrote: "geoff" wrote in message : You might be surprised to know that even central heating boilers are expected to only have a 5-7- year life now I'm not that surprised. Mine has been running for 20 years, and I'm resisting all attempts to persuade me to change it until it goes altogether. On something as low-tech and yet as highly priced as a boiler it's a disgrace that the expected life is so short. Ours lasted about ten years, according to the memory of the previous owners. I was hoping the new one would do better as we installed a water softener. The fitter reckoned this was about an average life nowadays and although they may be repairable with varying amounts of difficulty the price would be such as to make replacement more worthwhile. |
#14
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In article , Bob Henson
writes On something as low-tech and yet as highly priced as a boiler it's a disgrace that the expected life is so short. They have become a lot more complicated in recent times. -- Mike Tomlinson |
#15
Posted to uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
Bob Henson wrote:
Back to John's original question as to which brand of TV, I think the same applies as to most things, you get what you pay for. I would always go for the best brand that I could afford. I'm always puzzled when I see that statement. What does it mean, to be able to afford something? Does it mean spend the maximum you can before going without food this month? I could afford to buy a Rolls Royce, in the sense that I have sufficient liquid assets, but I wouldn't dream of it. Surely there's always some sort of balancing of cost and reward, i.e. value for money, going on? |
#16
Posted to uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
Bob Henson wrote:
One problem with built in tuners is that, as far as I am aware, most of those sets don't have a hard drive and recording facility built in, thus necessitating another box as well. It's just more convenient to have everything available on the TV set's remote. I prefer not to have the TV set reliant on an external box. Bill |
#17
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
CRT TVs were invariably repairable.
A CRT TV has a lot of discrete components. A component failure did not write-off the TV despite a bit of labour involved particularly having to resolder everything in sight. LCD & Plasma TVs are invariably not repairable. An LCD TV is Panel + Processing + Backlight + PSU, and that is about it. Of those PSU & backlight are replaceable if you have a branded unit - on cheaper TVs it can prove difficult to source the parts rendering it landfill.. So look for a TV with free 3yr or 5yr warranty, I say free to the extent of paying £29 or £75 - but not the overpriced high street warranties. A flip side is that in 5yrs it may be out of date, but alternatively not everyone wants to spend £300-500 every 5yrs. Panel type matters if you are viewing from below the TV or around a room. TN panels do 6-bit colour with limited viewing angle (contrast lost & colours go AWOL), whereas (S-)PVA & (S-)IPS do 8-bit colour with wider viewing angle before suffering degradation. If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement - the top ones are good on foliage & particularly sea scenes, but not so good on dark scenes & human face colours. In particular the cheaper panels can do quite poorly re dark scenes & suffer backlight "spotlight casts". Plasma do a lot better, there used to be a good Hitachi unit quite cheaply at Richer Sounds. On plasma you really do want a free 5yr warranty - they run hotter, consumer more power, more dependent on active cooling (fans). Check Online, Richer Sounds, John Lewis, even the local supermarket. Samsung have good picture, the smaller end models can have diabolical sound (3W mono cassette recorder). Toshiba have good picture, not so good sound. Hitachi a bit better. Sony & Panasonic better. Now gone Pioneer plasma the best at a price to match. No-name can be variable. The better models have better sound, not just better picture BTW. Shop LCD are rarely set up correctly. The most immediate thing to change is the noise reduction & sharpness settings, too high a sharpness setting and it looks like a jaggy grainy jiggery computer image. If you can see motion judder you need a better TV, some cheap TVs suffer it quite badly on motion and even the major names can suffer it slightly on slow panning of foliage scenes. Some people are very sensitive to it and once pointed out to them or noticed they do not like it. Look for Freeview HD if you want to avoid another box. You can often pick up last years models very cheaply, eg, Asda & Sainsburys, however check what the specs are. A while back the typical cost-cutting was a cheaper panel or cheap sound or one HDMI input. Today another item to check is no Freeview HD built-in. Tesco Direct is another good source - and check on Ebay because they have a refurbished store. I think they do various LG & other TVs are heavily discounted prices, refurbished, 12 months warranty. LG are Lucky Goldstar of Tottenham Court road fame in the early 1980s and slightly below Samsung, although both LG & Samsung PSU designs are a weak point (on anything). Amazon UK website is a good place to read reviews, just read the bad ones first because they are often from people who can tell the difference between a junk TN panel and IPS panel rather than someone who just stuck an Xbox on it. |
#18
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Jul 25, 2:25*pm, "js.b1" wrote:
If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? We still have a CRT. I hope it keeps going because all the LCDs I've seen have been pretty poor in comparison. |
#19
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In message
, mike writes On Jul 25, 2:25*pm, "js.b1" wrote: If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? Life moves on Have you tried buying a camera that takes emulsion film lately, or an IDE hard drive? We still have a CRT. I hope it keeps going because all the LCDs I've seen have been pretty poor in comparison. -- geoff |
#20
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In article ,
geoff writes: In message , mike writes On Jul 25, 2:25*pm, "js.b1" wrote: If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? Life moves on Have you tried buying a camera that takes emulsion film lately, or an IDE hard drive? The last factory mass producing TV tubes closed down. There is still a small requirement for CRTs for other purposes, but apparently the price of such tubes has jumped almost 10 fold. BTW, I bought a 250GB IDE drive about a year ago, and they are still around, even though SATA overtook IDE (PATA) in 2004 in terms of quantities manufacturered. -- Andrew Gabriel [email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup] |
#21
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Jul 25, 6:37*pm, (Andrew Gabriel)
wrote: In article , * * * * geoff writes: In message , mike writes On Jul 25, 2:25*pm, "js.b1" wrote: If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? Life moves on Price depends on volume, and as LCDs became popular and CRT sales volume fell, CRT prices go north. Manufacturers wantt o get into LCDs before that point so they can keep up with ongoing product development rather than being left behind. CRT sets are easy to buy of course, they're just all used sets now. Have you tried buying a camera that takes emulsion film lately, or an IDE hard drive? there's no shortage of either, but why would a manufacturer invest in an obsolescent technology like fim cameras. Most HDD sellers still have IDEs The last factory mass producing TV tubes closed down. There is still a small requirement for CRTs for other purposes, but apparently the price of such tubes has jumped almost 10 fold. BTW, I bought a 250GB IDE drive about a year ago, and they are still around, even though SATA overtook IDE (PATA) in 2004 in terms of quantities manufacturered. As was said a few posts up, CRTs still win in every respect bar one, ie that LCDs look better when off. I wouldnt rule out CRT TVs yet. NT |
#22
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"mike" wrote in message ... On Jul 25, 2:25 pm, "js.b1" wrote: If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement - Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come - so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? Flat panels are that much cheaper and more convenient to ship, warehouse and display in the showroom. Certainly for the equivalent size screen, The same may go for manufacturing costs. And so any "benefits" are pushed to the exclusion of everything else. Exactly the same applies with portable computers. 20 years ago anyone with any knowledge of ergonomics would have explained that the relative position of the keyboard and screen in laptops means that anyone using one for extended periods could expect serious neck problems after about 10 years of use. For executives travelling on planes or trains that was no problem. But now they're the preferred choice of home computer for almost everyone. Simply because they take up that much lesss space in a container, warehouse or showroom. So they're promoted to the exclusion of almost everything else - We still have a CRT. I hope it keeps going because all the LCDs I've - seen have been pretty poor in comparison. Indeed. The only incontestable benefit of all flat panels is however the much smaller footprint. To fit an equivalent size of CRT to the larger flat panels into many smaller modern rooms, would mean almost having the viewers knees touching the screen. So its often more a case of never mind the quality feel the width. michael adams .... |
#23
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
CRT are gone due to component count, assembly cycle time, profit
margins. CRT are still made for a lot of the rest-of-world, but quality is someway down (or rather calibration is someway down). LCD are winning due to economy of scale, particularly "sweet spot size", driving down cost & maintaining profit margins. A case of a cash-cow replacing cash-dog where CRT are concerned. |
#24
Posted to uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 15:56:39 +0100, michael adams wrote:
Indeed. The only incontestable benefit of all flat panels is however the much smaller footprint. To fit an equivalent size of CRT to the larger flat panels into many smaller modern rooms, would mean almost having the viewers knees touching the screen. If you have the TV in the middle of a wall and not, like most people, in a corner. A flat panel across a corner takes just as much room space as a CRT. -- Cheers Dave. |
#25
Posted to uk.tech.digital-tv,uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 06:36:41 -0700 (PDT), mike
wrote: Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? I was told it was due to weight. CRTs are heavy so it costs more to ship them halfway around the world. LCDs and plasmas are lighter and also thinner, so they can fit more in a container too. There is also the WEEE regulations whereby (IIRC) manufacturers are charged the cost of disposing old electrical equipment and they are charged by weight, so CRTs would attract a higher charge than LCDs. So it's all about money, not necessarily quality of picture. One disappointing thing is that you used to be able to get small TVs (~14 inch) quite cheaply to use in the kitchen/bedroom/wherever but I haven't seen anything small and cheap yet. |
#26
Posted to uk.d-i-y,uk.people.silversurfers,uk.tech.digital-tv
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Fri, 30 Jul 2010 19:59:33 +0100, Fred wrote:
I was told it was due to weight. CRTs are heavy so it costs more to ship them halfway around the world. LCDs and plasmas are lighter and also thinner, so they can fit more in a container too. There isn't a lot in the weight between our old 28" CRT and 42" plasma... Packaged volume is another matter, the box for the CRT made a great play house for the kids for quite a while, the plasma box is only 9" deep, useless as a playhouse. B-) One disappointing thing is that you used to be able to get small TVs (~14 inch) quite cheaply to use in the kitchen/bedroom/wherever but I haven't seen anything small and cheap yet. A 14" widescreen would be very small... Think you'd need 16" or greater 16:9 to get the same vertical height as a 14" 4:3 set. 16" WS TVs are about but not sub £100 but then most 16" or greater computer monitors are also above £100. -- Cheers Dave. |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message ll.co.uk... A 14" widescreen would be very small... Think you'd need 16" or greater 16:9 to get the same vertical height as a 14" 4:3 set. 16" WS TVs are about but not sub £100 but then most 16" or greater computer monitors are also above £100. No but you can buy a 19" for £125. You would have to provide your own usb stick to record stuff onto for that price. |
#28
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sat, 31 Jul 2010 11:17:17 +0100 (BST), "Dave Liquorice"
wrote: On Fri, 30 Jul 2010 19:59:33 +0100, Fred wrote: I was told it was due to weight. CRTs are heavy so it costs more to ship them halfway around the world. LCDs and plasmas are lighter and also thinner, so they can fit more in a container too. There isn't a lot in the weight between our old 28" CRT and 42" plasma... Packaged volume is another matter, the box for the CRT made a great play house for the kids for quite a while, the plasma box is only 9" deep, useless as a playhouse. B-) Useful for a cat though at least the LCD box fits into the attic |
#29
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In article , Fred fred@no-
email.here.invalid writes One disappointing thing is that you used to be able to get small TVs (~14 inch) quite cheaply to use in the kitchen/bedroom/wherever but I haven't seen anything small and cheap yet. You can't compare the size of CRT TVs and LCD TVs directly. If you had a 28" CRT and bought a 28" LCD to replace it, you'd be disappointed. A 19" LCD is about right for the viewing distance for a 14" CRT, and there are plenty of these around, most of them have Freeview built in. -- Mike Tomlinson |
#30
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Fred wrote: On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 06:36:41 -0700 (PDT), mike wrote: Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? I was told it was due to weight. CRTs are heavy so it costs more to ship them halfway around the world. LCDs and plasmas are lighter and also thinner, so they can fit more in a container too. Thus using less of society's resources. And they may well consume less lecky, too, another reason for switching. Having said that, I suspect I shall miss the excellent picture on my 21" Panny when it finally goes tits-up. No you won't, believe me. Once you've had a wide screen LCD, especially if linked to a digital recorder, you'll never go back to your old 4:3 system which will always seem to have something missing. I know because I had what you describe and now have an excellent 26" LCD Panny that isn't the size and weight of a house. I can now watch 'Look East' with Suzi Fowler-Watt rather than 'uzi Fowler-Wa'. |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"Norman Wells" wrote in message news:xZG4o.4136$Rv5.2540@hurricane: Tim Streater wrote: In article , Fred wrote: On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 06:36:41 -0700 (PDT), mike wrote: Given that, until a few years ago, we were all used to CRT, how come so many have gone over to LCD and CRT are now impossible to buy new? I was told it was due to weight. CRTs are heavy so it costs more to ship them halfway around the world. LCDs and plasmas are lighter and also thinner, so they can fit more in a container too. Thus using less of society's resources. And they may well consume less lecky, too, another reason for switching. Having said that, I suspect I shall miss the excellent picture on my 21" Panny when it finally goes tits-up. No you won't, believe me. Once you've had a wide screen LCD, especially if linked to a digital recorder, you'll never go back to your old 4:3 system which will always seem to have something missing. I know because I had what you describe and now have an excellent 26" LCD Panny that isn't the size and weight of a house. I can now watch 'Look East' with Suzi Fowler-Watt rather than 'uzi Fowler-Wa'. Couldn't agree more, Norman. My old 28" CRT Sony was, I thought, a good set, until I changed it for a widescreen Samsung 39" LCD. Especially on HD, it's difficult to believe the all-round improvement in viewing. The Sony was tiring a tad, with some signs of shaded areas appearing on the screen, but we changed mainly to recover several square metres in the corner of our lounge and to get a larger picture. Anyone unconvinced should watch Planet Earth on Blu-ray on a decent-sized, good quality LCD. It restored my flagging interest in watching TV - even the rubbish repeats take on a new attractiveness. Regards, Bob |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In message
, js.b1 writes CRT TVs were invariably repairable. A CRT TV has a lot of discrete components. A component failure did not write-off the TV despite a bit of labour involved particularly having to resolder everything in sight. It does in most cases - all the TV repair shops around here have gone. Unless you know what you are doing, TV repair is becoming a thing of the past -- geoff |
#33
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In article , geoff
scribeth thus In message , js.b1 writes CRT TVs were invariably repairable. A CRT TV has a lot of discrete components. A component failure did not write-off the TV despite a bit of labour involved particularly having to resolder everything in sight. It does in most cases - all the TV repair shops around here have gone. Unless you know what you are doing, TV repair is becoming a thing of the past Don't think its knowing what your doing, its just Joe Publicke doesn't want to pay anything to have anything repaired any longer... -- Tony Sayer |
#34
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
"tony sayer" wrote in message ... In article , geoff scribeth thus In message , js.b1 writes CRT TVs were invariably repairable. A CRT TV has a lot of discrete components. A component failure did not write-off the TV despite a bit of labour involved particularly having to resolder everything in sight. It does in most cases - all the TV repair shops around here have gone. Unless you know what you are doing, TV repair is becoming a thing of the past Don't think its knowing what your doing, its just Joe Publicke doesn't want to pay anything to have anything repaired any longer... -- Tony Sayer Not always true. I took my Makita drill in for repair. The final repair bill was more than the cost of a new drill. I told them to keep the drill and walked out of the shop. I did get a letter threatening me with court action over non payment but nothing ever happened. I suspect that the repairer was working on a "lets see if swapping this part will fix it" basis instead of finding the fault and swapping the faulty part. When one of my computer monitors packed in I found it cheaper to buy a bigger and better second hand one from ebay for less than a repair would have cost. Cheers Adam |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
js.b1
wibbled on Sunday 25 July 2010 14:25 Panel type matters if you are viewing from below the TV or around a room. TN panels do 6-bit colour with limited viewing angle (contrast lost & colours go AWOL), whereas (S-)PVA & (S-)IPS do 8-bit colour with wider viewing angle before suffering degradation. If you are used to CRT, no LCD is a perfect replacement - the top ones are good on foliage & particularly sea scenes, but not so good on dark scenes & human face colours. In particular the cheaper panels can do quite poorly re dark scenes & suffer backlight "spotlight casts". Agree. Half the quality is to do with the Panel. Sony Bravia panels are brilliant, but many Samsungs have the same panel - do some reading and know what's in the set. Panel is everything for vibrance, contrast (blacks on LCDs are sometimes not actually very black - look for the contrast ratio figures). And as js says, viewing angle. I have 2 Samsungs. One 42" decent on with a Sony panel and it is brilliant. And one little cheap one that is OK until you look at it from the floor and it blacks out fast below 0 degrees. snip Samsung have good picture, the smaller end models can have diabolical sound (3W mono cassette recorder). Toshiba have good picture, not so good sound. Hitachi a bit better. Sony & Panasonic better. Now gone Pioneer plasma the best at a price to match. No-name can be variable. The better models have better sound, not just better picture BTW. The other thing you get with a decent make is more likely a decent decoder. It's not just about reception and picture anymore - with DTV it's aboout how good the MPEG decoder is. Some are bloody awful with rapid degeneration to artifacts and motion blur, and coupled with a poor tuner that takes ages to lock on and present the multiplexes, leads to a crap viewing experience. OK for a kitchen table TV, but you'd want to avoid such nastinesses on your main set. -- Tim Watts Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer. |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
In article
s.com, js.b1 writes An LCD TV is Panel + Processing + Backlight + PSU, and that is about it. Of those PSU & backlight are replaceable if you have a branded unit - on cheaper TVs it can prove difficult to source the parts rendering it landfill.. I had a devil of a time finding the chopper control IC for a LG 19" monitor power supply a couple years ago. The chip ID was 2AS01. Found a UK supplier who claimed to have stock but wanted 15 quid apiece. Ebay turned up a seller in Florida who sold me one for $3 delivered. It arrived in three days and fixed the problem. -- Mike Tomlinson |
#37
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 06:25:18 -0700 (PDT), "js.b1"
wrote: CRT TVs were invariably repairable. A CRT TV has a lot of discrete components. A component failure did not write-off the TV despite a bit of labour involved particularly having to resolder everything in sight. Is that still true though? CRT TVs used to have a lot of discrete components that could be individually replaced but in recent years hasn't everything miniaturized and been integrated into chips? I didn't think there was much inside the box these days and even if it could be replaceable, can you order spare parts and can you find someone who knows how to replace them? If you can, are you likely to be told their labour cost will be more than a new tv? |
#38
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On Sun, 25 Jul 2010 13:41:35 +0100, "john hamilton"
wrote: Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? [snip] My impression is that 'Japanese' sets are usually assembled in eastern Europe. My Sony was assembled in Slovakia. |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
john hamilton wrote:
Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. Panasonic from Richer Sounds |
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New televisions from China or Taiwan
On 25/07/2010 13:41, john hamilton wrote:
Have now given up on the idea of having our old crt television set repaired, and am looking at the televisions listed in Argos etc, the sheer choice seems a bit daunting. We thought we would go for a new 40 or 42" LCD flat screen. Sometime in the future we would get a FreeSat digital box, so I guess that means we would benefit from the 1080p resolution spec on the set to take advantage of future high definition broadcasts. Am I right in thinking that most of these sets, whatever the brand name are probably manufactured in China or Taiwan? If so I guess its not worth paying extra for a Japanese name? Grateful for any advice on what you might think is a good buy of reasonable quality around at the moment, bearing in mind I would prefer to keep the price down if possible. Many thanks for any advice. looking for the 'made in' label can be like the bran tub. you just do not know, and these days it can be anywhere at all. one thing though, each manufacturer, whilst using foreign labour and expertise to assemble, have their own specifications. chances are that the components all come from the same source. I should think that it is as it always has been with these things, each Brand has it's own quality, some better than others |
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