Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

When I requested a quote for the provision of a new gas supply, I
requested a flush-fitting meter box, which is recessed into the wall,
so it doesn't protrude 25cm into the driveway. However, it requires a
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D. If a flush-fitting box is
specified, then this must be installed by the homeowner prior to the
pipe being laid.

I am not fussed about the height element, but in hindsight I am
concerned about cutting a hole 366mm wide in the brickwork, in case it
has any structural ramifications. The wall is a cavity wall, brick
construction both sides, with render on the outside.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

Thanks
Luke

"Luke" wrote in message
...
Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

When I requested a quote for the provision of a new gas supply, I
requested a flush-fitting meter box, which is recessed into the wall,
so it doesn't protrude 25cm into the driveway. However, it requires a
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D. If a flush-fitting box is
specified, then this must be installed by the homeowner prior to the
pipe being laid.

I am not fussed about the height element, but in hindsight I am
concerned about cutting a hole 366mm wide in the brickwork, in case it
has any structural ramifications. The wall is a cavity wall, brick
construction both sides, with render on the outside.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?



No need to reinforce ... normally they build in using the box to support
brickwork until it sets ... in your case it is already set.

I would advise getting a thin TCT blade on an angle grinder and chop out
mortar & cut bricks that way .... walloping about with lump hammer & chisel
may crack adjoining mortar beds.

A 4" small grinder will be easiest to use .....

I set a date stone into my house this way.

Luke
wibbled on Tuesday 20 July 2010 11:44

Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

When I requested a quote for the provision of a new gas supply, I
requested a flush-fitting meter box, which is recessed into the wall,
so it doesn't protrude 25cm into the driveway. However, it requires a
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D. If a flush-fitting box is
specified, then this must be installed by the homeowner prior to the
pipe being laid.

I am not fussed about the height element, but in hindsight I am
concerned about cutting a hole 366mm wide in the brickwork, in case it
has any structural ramifications. The wall is a cavity wall, brick
construction both sides, with render on the outside.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

Thanks
Luke

Don't take my word for it, but I considered this for my electricity
meter[1]:

My house is a cavity wall construction, with the roof and floor load onto
the inner leaf.

The outer leaf only needs to support itself, not the entire house.

The "triangle principle" means that if you chop a hole in a brick wall, the
most that can fall off is a triangular section of brickwork above the hole.

366mm wide isn't very wide in terms of house bricks. I'd have no problems
cutting a hole like that in the outer leaf unsupported. However, I would cut
the mortar joints 2" into either side of the hole level with the top of the
opening and bang in a bit of flat 1/4" steel bar to support the brick or two
that is at risk of falling off.

If I wanted to be belt and braces, I'd do the same, but with angle iron fed
into the cavity and inserted from behind the top of the opening. Mortar
steel in place. But I think flat bar would be more than good enough. It's
what I did with my fireplace where the flat-arch was looking a bit dicey. I
did put a slight bend in the bar by placing over a couple of bricks and
jumping up and down on it - then it was was under load as soon as it went
in.


[1] Until I found the shysters at EDF wanted 600-800 quid to move the cable,
*if* I did all the digging for them.

Cheers

Tim

--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

In article ,
Tim Watts writes:

The "triangle principle" means that if you chop a hole in a brick wall, the
most that can fall off is a triangular section of brickwork above the hole.

About 1 brick, in this case.

366mm wide isn't very wide in terms of house bricks. I'd have no problems
cutting a hole like that in the outer leaf unsupported. However, I would cut
the mortar joints 2" into either side of the hole level with the top of the
opening and bang in a bit of flat 1/4" steel bar to support the brick or two
that is at risk of falling off.
If I wanted to be belt and braces, I'd do the same, but with angle iron fed
into the cavity and inserted from behind the top of the opening. Mortar
steel in place. But I think flat bar would be more than good enough. It's

The steel will go rusty, and force the brickwork to split
as it swells. You don't want it at all.

what I did with my fireplace where the flat-arch was looking a bit dicey. I
did put a slight bend in the bar by placing over a couple of bricks and
jumping up and down on it - then it was was under load as soon as it went
in.

That's OK, as that wall should be dry.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Andrew Gabriel
wibbled on Tuesday 20 July 2010 13:11

In article ,
Tim Watts writes:

The "triangle principle" means that if you chop a hole in a brick wall,
the most that can fall off is a triangular section of brickwork above the
hole.

About 1 brick, in this case.

366mm wide isn't very wide in terms of house bricks. I'd have no problems
cutting a hole like that in the outer leaf unsupported. However, I would
cut the mortar joints 2" into either side of the hole level with the top
of the opening and bang in a bit of flat 1/4" steel bar to support the
brick or two that is at risk of falling off.
If I wanted to be belt and braces, I'd do the same, but with angle iron
fed into the cavity and inserted from behind the top of the opening.
Mortar steel in place. But I think flat bar would be more than good
enough. It's

The steel will go rusty, and force the brickwork to split
as it swells. You don't want it at all.

Good point...

what I did with my fireplace where the flat-arch was looking a bit dicey.
I did put a slight bend in the bar by placing over a couple of bricks and
jumping up and down on it - then it was was under load as soon as it went
in.

That's OK, as that wall should be dry.


--
Tim Watts

Managers, politicians and environmentalists: Nature's carbon buffer.

Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

No need to reinforce ... normally they build in using the box to support
brickwork until it sets ... in your case it is already set.

I would advise getting a thin TCT blade on an angle grinder and chop out
mortar & cut bricks that way .... walloping about with lump hammer & chisel
may crack adjoining mortar beds.

A 4" small grinder will be easiest to use .....

I set a date stone into my house this way.- Hide quoted text -


Thanks, that has put my mind at rest. I have both a 4" and a 9"
grinder and was going to use the larger one, but yeah, the smaller one
makes more sense.

Luke

"Luke" wrote in message
...


Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

No need to reinforce ... normally they build in using the box to support
brickwork until it sets ... in your case it is already set.

I would advise getting a thin TCT blade on an angle grinder and chop out
mortar & cut bricks that way .... walloping about with lump hammer &
chisel
may crack adjoining mortar beds.

A 4" small grinder will be easiest to use .....

I set a date stone into my house this way.- Hide quoted text -


Thanks, that has put my mind at rest. I have both a 4" and a 9"
grinder and was going to use the larger one, but yeah, the smaller one
makes more sense.


just don't use standard carbide cutting disc, you need a TCT or even better
a diamond blade ... only about a £5 for a 4" blade.

On 20 July, 11:44, Luke wrote:
Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

When I requested a quote for the provision of a new gas supply, I
requested a flush-fitting meter box, which is recessed into the wall,
so it doesn't protrude 25cm into the driveway. However, it requires a
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D. If a flush-fitting box is
specified, then this must be installed by the homeowner prior to the
pipe being laid.

I am not fussed about the height element, but in hindsight I am
concerned about cutting a hole 366mm wide in the brickwork, in case it
has any structural ramifications. The wall is a cavity wall, brick
construction both sides, with render on the outside.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

Thanks
Luke

Additionally to the above you will need to make quite a large hole in
the inner wall. Gas meter boxes come complete with a tube that
isolates the gas pipe from the cavity. This is to stop the cavity
filling up with gas in the event of a leak. When you see a house
levelled with a gas explosion, this is often the cause.

"harry" wrote in message
...
On 20 July, 11:44, Luke wrote:
Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

When I requested a quote for the provision of a new gas supply, I
requested a flush-fitting meter box, which is recessed into the wall,
so it doesn't protrude 25cm into the driveway. However, it requires a
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D. If a flush-fitting box is
specified, then this must be installed by the homeowner prior to the
pipe being laid.

I am not fussed about the height element, but in hindsight I am
concerned about cutting a hole 366mm wide in the brickwork, in case it
has any structural ramifications. The wall is a cavity wall, brick
construction both sides, with render on the outside.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

Thanks
Luke

Additionally to the above you will need to make quite a large hole in
the inner wall. Gas meter boxes come complete with a tube that
isolates the gas pipe from the cavity. This is to stop the cavity
filling up with gas in the event of a leak.


When you see a house levelled with a gas explosion, this is often the
cause.

I'll have to look out for them. Does it happen often?

Adam

On Jul 20, 11:44*am, Luke wrote:
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D

Measure your wall thickness & cavity with a drill.
Depending on house age if it needs 160mm from the outer leaf front
face, you may find you would have to partly core-drill and breakout
part of the inner leaf too (easier to use block and cut them thinner).
If you do try to stick a lintel in the outer leaf, you would need to
use stainless flat bar or angle which is too expensive unless
salvaged.

You can get flush floor mounted gas meters, they use a different
compact meter type.

ARWadsworth wrote:

Additionally to the above you will need to make quite a large hole in
the inner wall. Gas meter boxes come complete with a tube that
isolates the gas pipe from the cavity. *This is to stop the cavity
filling up with gas in the event of a leak.

The rear outlet is one of two possible ways of routing the pipe. Our box had
a knockout for it with a label saying "Warning, do not remove unless outlet
to be made using special spigot".

The alternative way is to drill a vertical hole through the bottom of the
box frame outside the house wall and route the pipe down through that then
in through a suitably lined hole through the wall. This maintains a
gas-tight seal between the box and the cavity. That's the way National Grid
did ours last year as shown in these photos:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/rawthey/4812837049
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rawthey/4812837053

--
Mike Clarke

In article Zul1o.234928$sD7.63617@hurricane, ARWadsworth
writes

"harry" wrote in message
..
.
When you see a house levelled with a gas explosion, this is often the
cause.

I'll have to look out for them. Does it happen often?

Not often, I was hoping to post a link to pics of the Clarkston disaster
of 1971 where 22 died and 100 were injured when a shopping centre was
demolished by a gas explosion but as it was in a small burb of Glasgow
it appears not to have made it to the major news sources.

I've got vivid memories of a few single house gas explosions over the
years but who knows whether it was just a cavity wall full or a sewer,
underfloor etc, etc full of gas. The common thread is residents
complaining of strong smells of gas weeks & months before the explosion
but leaks mysteriously not being found by BG/SG. One I'm sure involved a
massive censure and fine for BG of about 0.00001% of their annual
profits so I'm sure they've tightened their act up.
--
fred
FIVE TV's superbright logo - not the DOG's, it's ********

On 20 July, 19:00, "ARWadsworth"
wrote:
"harry" wrote in message

...





On 20 July, 11:44, Luke wrote:
Hi all,
Following on from my thread regarding gas boiler sizing, I now have a
question about installing a gas meter box.

When I requested a quote for the provision of a new gas supply, I
requested a flush-fitting meter box, which is recessed into the wall,
so it doesn't protrude 25cm into the driveway. However, it requires a
cutout 366mm W * 532mm H * 160mm D. If a flush-fitting box is
specified, then this must be installed by the homeowner prior to the
pipe being laid.

I am not fussed about the height element, but in hindsight I am
concerned about cutting a hole 366mm wide in the brickwork, in case it
has any structural ramifications. The wall is a cavity wall, brick
construction both sides, with render on the outside.

Will I need to reinforce the hole over its span in any way? Or is this
impossible to tell without consulting a structural engineer?

Thanks
Luke

Additionally to the above you will need to make quite a large hole in
the inner wall. Gas meter boxes come complete with a tube that
isolates the gas pipe from the cavity. *This is to stop the cavity
filling up with gas in the event of a leak.
When you see a house levelled with a gas explosion, this is often the
cause.

I'll have to look out for them. Does it happen often?

Adam- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Nah.Not with the pipe in position.

"fred" wrote in message ...
In article Zul1o.234928$sD7.63617@hurricane, ARWadsworth
writes

"harry" wrote in message
..
.
When you see a house levelled with a gas explosion, this is often the
cause.

I'll have to look out for them. Does it happen often?

Not often, I was hoping to post a link to pics of the Clarkston disaster
of 1971 where 22 died and 100 were injured when a shopping centre was
demolished by a gas explosion but as it was in a small burb of Glasgow it
appears not to have made it to the major news sources.

I've got vivid memories of a few single house gas explosions over the
years but who knows whether it was just a cavity wall full or a sewer,
underfloor etc, etc full of gas. The common thread is residents
complaining of strong smells of gas weeks & months before the explosion
but leaks mysteriously not being found by BG/SG. One I'm sure involved a
massive censure and fine for BG of about 0.00001% of their annual profits
so I'm sure they've tightened their act up.
--
fred

The gas explosion that I remember from some years ago was a story in the
local rag. A semi had been demolished in a gas explosion and the next day BG
were looking through the rubble. When a neighbour asked if they were
investigating the explosion the reply was "No, I've come to find the meter
so we can give a final reading"

No idea if the neighbour or the editor made the story up, but I liked it.

Cheers

Adam