Hello I am considering removing the upstairs portion of a Chimney
breast, it is shared with the neighbours who also want theirs
removing, I thought about Gallows brackets but I don't think they will
offer sufficient support to the remaining stack.

We both wish to keep the stack on the roof as it is a strong feature
You can see a drawing I have done of the general idea.

Would very much appreciate comments.

Cheers

Marty

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

On 14/10/09 08:42, martynduerden wrote:

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

That looks a bit top heavy, I'd probably have sleepless nights if it was
towering over my bedroom.

On 14 Oct, 08:55, Andy Burns wrote:
On 14/10/09 08:42, martynduerden wrote:

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

That looks a bit top heavy, I'd probably have sleepless nights if it was
towering over my bedroom.

Why do you say that?

The top is simply a stepped brick detail, once removed to a suitable
height it will be less than 20 course of brick.

On 14/10/09 09:12, martynduerden wrote:

On 14 Oct, 08:55, Andy wrote:
On 14/10/09 08:42, martynduerden wrote:

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

That looks a bit top heavy, I'd probably have sleepless nights if it was
towering over my bedroom.

Why do you say that?

The top is simply a stepped brick detail, once removed to a suitable
height it will be less than 20 course of brick

If your diagram is fairly accurate it looks like over 300 bricks,
knocking on a ton, balancing on two central 9" x 4" contact points on
the party wall.

If your diagram is fairly accurate it looks like over 300 bricks,
knocking on a ton, balancing on two central 9" x 4" contact points on
the party wall.

The BCO would likely recommend using gallows brackets bolted to the
wall to support the remaining mass, I came up with this design as the
load is central over the party wall, the cantilever effect would
counter balance each side thus be stronger than gallows with the
addition of not relying on bolts in the wall.

I could easily add additional steals and plate material across the
width?

On 14/10/09 09:43, martynduerden wrote:
If your diagram is fairly accurate it looks like over 300 bricks,
knocking on a ton, balancing on two central 9" x 4" contact points on
the party wall.

The BCO would likely recommend using gallows brackets bolted to the
wall to support the remaining mass, I came up with this design as the
load is central over the party wall, the cantilever effect would
counter balance each side thus be stronger than gallows with the
addition of not relying on bolts in the wall.

I could easily add additional steals and plate material across the
width?

Something like this?

http://www.blether.com/riverdocs/tes...lip_image0.jpg

your chimney seems considerable wider that the one pictured

Something like this?

http://www.blether.com/riverdocs/tes...lip_image0.jpg

your chimney seems considerable wider that the one pictured

Yeah, I'm not sure that method of support would not work for this
Chimney, mine is a shared construction over the party wall but it is
built in the opposite direction to the one you pictured, so
essentially the area on my side for example is 3 foot by 3 foot, the
entire chimney being 6 foot by 3 foot

Have you checked the BCO will take gallows brackets?
I ask because some prefer more involved supports, some don't.

3ft is a lot of overhang, just recalling the 1986? earthquake combined
with a bellied wall below - one nice horizontal crack inline with a
door lintel which left a slipped area of plaster visible behind the
wallpaper on both sides :-)

martynduerden wrote:

The BCO would likely recommend

What does the BCO recommend?


Regards
Richard

On Oct 14, 8:42*am, martynduerden wrote:
Hello I am considering removing the upstairs portion of a Chimney
breast, it is shared with the neighbours who also want theirs
removing, I thought about Gallows brackets but I don't think they will
offer sufficient support to the remaining stack.

We both wish to keep the stack on the roof as it is a strong feature
You can see a drawing I have done of the general idea.

Would very much appreciate comments.

Cheers

Marty

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

I am confused by your drawing. Does it really show the party wall at
right angles to the line of the chimney stack?

Anyway, I think you're going to need a structural engineer at some
point

On 14 Oct, 13:23, Martin Bonner wrote:
On Oct 14, 8:42*am, martynduerden wrote:

Hello I am considering removing the upstairs portion of a Chimney
breast, it is shared with the neighbours who also want theirs
removing, I thought about Gallows brackets but I don't think they will
offer sufficient support to the remaining stack.

We both wish to keep the stack on the roof as it is a strong feature
You can see a drawing I have done of the general idea.

Would very much appreciate comments.

Cheers

Marty

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

I am confused by your drawing. *Does it really show the party wall at
right angles to the line of the chimney stack?

Anyway, I think you're going to need a structural engineer at some
point

Yeah, it is as you thought it looks the wrong way around on the wall
but it is actually the way it is.

What thickness is the party wall?
I ask because some houses really did use the stack to buttress the
wall.

The problem with brackets is the wall may not like the load and some
BCO prefer RSJ/UB to some other supporting wall to provide a somewhat
more stable solution.

On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 05:23:57 -0700 (PDT), Martin Bonner wrote:

Anyway, I think you're going to need a structural engineer at some
point

Or at least some professional advice, if only to keep the BCO happy.

Personally that amount of brick work perched on a couple of "steal"
beams on top of a wall doesn't look stable enough, strong enough
provided all of the base of the stack is supported but still able to
wobble. Beams with gallows brackets under them would be better
IANASE.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 14 Oct, 15:02, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Wed, 14 Oct 2009 05:23:57 -0700 (PDT), Martin Bonner wrote:
Anyway, I think you're going to need a structural engineer at some
point

Or at least some professional advice, if only to keep the BCO happy.

Personally that amount of brick work perched on a couple of "steal"
beams on top of a wall doesn't look stable enough, strong enough
provided all of the base of the stack is supported but still able to
wobble. Beams with gallows brackets under them would be better
IANASE.

--
Cheers
Dave.

Hi Dave

I have been considering adding Gallows to the base of the steels if
only to give an area of steel against the party wall, and enable a
sufficient fixing, I don't think it would require more support than
two 8*8 steels but maybe more stability than a centre balancing
cantilever, the load we are talking about is 800Kg.

Cheers

With brackets, what happens if the neighbour decides to remove their
part of the stack above the roofline when having a re-roof? IE,
reducing or removing the counterbalance to your stack on the partywall?

On Thu, 15 Oct 2009 13:18:34 -0700 (PDT), js.b1 wrote:

With brackets, what happens if the neighbour decides to remove their
part of the stack above the roofline when having a re-roof? IE,
reducing or removing the counterbalance to your stack on the partywall?

That would be a problem with or without brackets. It would also look
bloomin' awful.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Oct 15, 10:48*pm, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Thu, 15 Oct 2009 13:18:34 -0700 (PDT), js.b1 wrote:
With brackets, what happens if the neighbour decides to remove their
part of the stack above the roofline when having a re-roof? IE,
reducing or removing the counterbalance to your stack on the partywall?

That would be a problem with or without brackets. It would also look
bloomin' awful.

It does :-)

It is something bizarre that gets done with some reroof companies -
the same ones that stand in the driveway holding up the sarking felt
and tearing it for everyone to see, repeatedly, throughout the day,
and the next day.

In article ,
martynduerden writes:
Hello I am considering removing the upstairs portion of a Chimney
breast, it is shared with the neighbours who also want theirs
removing, I thought about Gallows brackets but I don't think they will
offer sufficient support to the remaining stack.

We both wish to keep the stack on the roof as it is a strong feature
You can see a drawing I have done of the general idea.

Would very much appreciate comments.

Cheers

Marty

http://www.diynot.com/network/martyy/albums/3940/15708]

A friend's house has something similar (probably done 30 years ago).
The stack is intact down to the loft floor, where it sits on a
sodding great RSJ which runs the width of the house and transfers
the weight to the outside walls.

I have wondered how they got the RSJ in without it toppling over,
and it's an enormous stack (8 or 12 flues, IIRC).

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]