Fuming today...

http://photos.dionic.net/v/public/bu...5_001.jpg.html

Shows what a builder did for me, in order to move a doorway along. That's
one half-width column of celcon blocks holding a lintel up. Granted there
is no real load on the lintel beyond a few bricks.

Anyway, I hacked that little bit of plaster off (it was a test set to see
how it handled with the blocks - badly as the suckage was high). Then
noticed the block column was wobbling. Then discovered I could rotate the
top half of the column by a good half cm without trying too hard. Light use
of a chisel had broken the side bond and half the block to block joins. I
stress, this was a hand chisel, not an SDS.

I concluded that it *should* have been done out of brick and keyed in
properly with the wall to the left, which is how i would have done it.

Next door neighbours agreed (retired brickie and his son, who has worked as
a builder, now more into carpentry).

Anyway, the builder refused to fix it, claiming that "it'll be alright with
a bit of plaster on it". Must be from the school of structural plastering.
To be honest, it I'd done that, I would class it as an incompetent failure.

I'll run it past the BCO, under Part A of the BNA stuff, just to feel more
justified, then redo it properly. But so far no other experienced person
whose seen it thinks it's good enough and I certainly don't.

---

I had a moan about the floor - more in the Arsecarrots... thread.

---

Didn't even get round to moaning about the pathetic attempt to make a floor
slab (2.5" thick concrete on DPM with no sand, DPM punctured to buggery,
earth not compacted etc).

Stupid thing is I was going to offer his partner a load of plastering work
(big room, appearance matters, mine bearable but not good enough for large
areas). Needless to say that won;t be happening...

Sigh. Seems to be the state of Britain these days...

On Jul 1, 7:36*pm, Tim S wrote:
Fuming today...

http://photos.dionic.net/v/public/bu...mg_0025_001.jp...

Shows what a builder did for me, in order to move a doorway along. That's
one half-width column of celcon blocks holding a lintel up. Granted there
is no real load on the lintel beyond a few bricks.

Anyway, I hacked that little bit of plaster off (it was a test set to see
how it handled with the blocks - badly as the suckage was high). Then
noticed the block column was wobbling. Then discovered I could rotate the
top half of the column by a good half cm without trying too hard. Light use
of a chisel had broken the side bond and half the block to block joins. I
stress, this was a hand chisel, not an SDS.

I concluded that it *should* have been done out of brick and keyed in
properly with the wall to the left, which is how i would have done it.

Next door neighbours agreed (retired brickie and his son, who has worked as
a builder, now more into carpentry).

Anyway, the builder refused to fix it, claiming that "it'll be alright with
a bit of plaster on it". Must be from the school of structural plastering..
To be honest, it I'd done that, I would class it as an incompetent failure.

I'll run it past the BCO, under Part A of the BNA stuff, just to feel more
justified, then redo it properly. But so far no other experienced person
whose seen it thinks it's good enough and I certainly don't.

---

I had a moan about the floor - more in the Arsecarrots... thread.

---

Didn't even get round to moaning about the pathetic attempt to make a floor
slab (2.5" thick concrete on DPM with no sand, DPM punctured to buggery,
earth not compacted etc).

Stupid thing is I was going to offer his partner a load of plastering work
(big room, appearance matters, mine bearable but not good enough for large
areas). Needless to say that won;t be happening...

Sigh. Seems to be the state of Britain these days...


You get a better result employing someone that knows nothing about
building but wants to learn. If youre around to show them anyway.


NT

NT wibbled:


You get a better result employing someone that knows nothing about
building but wants to learn. If youre around to show them anyway.


Yes - the chap working for me for the last few weeks doesn't object to being
instructed to do something my way, and comes over as pretty smart anyway
(not sue why he's still doing random jobs - sure he could do better). But
he's confident and can get on with minimal help once the plan's been laid
out. I don't normally like working with people in such a close linked way
(I hate constant management duties - not my thing), but this bloke is worth
every penny and is a joy.

I could have probably done everything the builder did minus the plastering
for a lot less cost and better with this chap, but I was working full time
at the time and subbing out the initial work seemed like a good idea...

I think general purpose builders are alright with day to day work, but they
can't seem to cope with problem jobs IME.

Cheers

Tim

Tim S wrote:

I concluded that it *should* have been done out of brick and keyed in
properly with the wall to the left, which is how i would have done it.

Block would have been ok, but he should have used a stainless "starter"
strip. That fixes to the existing wall, and is then tied into the new
blockwork as it is built. Its a strong and accepted way of keying new
stuff to old.

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Stru.../sd2797/p85866


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm coughed up some electrons that declared:

Tim S wrote:

I concluded that it *should* have been done out of brick and keyed in
properly with the wall to the left, which is how i would have done it.

Block would have been ok, but he should have used a stainless "starter"
strip. That fixes to the existing wall, and is then tied into the new
blockwork as it is built. Its a strong and accepted way of keying new
stuff to old.


http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Stru.../sd2797/p85866



There's something in there, but not at the top block (cos I can see right
past that), but it's not protecting it much against torsional loads on the
end.

Don't know if it's installed wrong, but I could get +/- 0.5cm movement out
of the column light hand pressure. Heavy hand pressure would have got
more - certainly felt like I could have broken it off it I wanted.

When I've got the acrow in I'll see how much it takes to actually break it.
I certainly can't accept 1/2 the horizontal bonds breaking and the entire
vertical one showing light through - especially on a lintel support.

Cheers

Tim

On 3 July, 08:38, Tim S wrote:
John Rumm coughed up some electrons that declared:

Tim S wrote:

I concluded that it *should* have been done out of brick and keyed in
properly with the wall to the left, which is how i would have done it.

Block would have been ok, but he should have used a stainless "starter"
strip. That fixes to the existing wall, and is then tied into the new
blockwork as it is built. Its a strong and accepted way of keying new
stuff to old.

http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Stru...alwork/Wall+St...



There's something in there, but not at the top block (cos I can see right
past that), but it's not protecting it much against torsional loads on the
end.

Don't know if it's installed wrong, but I could get +/- 0.5cm movement out
of the column light hand pressure. Heavy hand pressure would have got
more - certainly felt like I could have broken it off it I wanted.

When I've got the acrow in I'll see how much it takes to actually break it.
I certainly can't accept 1/2 the horizontal bonds breaking and the entire
vertical one showing light through - especially on a lintel support.

Cheers

Tim

Yeah, if someone barged into the edge of the opening by accident (2
people passing in doorway etc), I would be concerned the whole thing
could come down. I've seen builders use nails banged into the mortar
courses to hold new additions, which really does a poor job - maybe he
did something like that.
Simon.

Simon coughed up some electrons that declared:



Yeah, if someone barged into the edge of the opening by accident (2
people passing in doorway etc), I would be concerned the whole thing
could come down. I've seen builders use nails banged into the mortar
courses to hold new additions, which really does a poor job - maybe he
did something like that.
Simon.

Or just banging the door. Even if the plaster firms it up, I personally
would be concerned about cracking the plaster in both cases.

I really hate celcon (etc) blocks. I've never seen ones where the mortar
actually bonds well to them, unlike brick.

With a whole wall, there's plenty of overlap and friction to mitigate but
for random bits like this, bricks wouldn't have taken much more effort...

Cheers

Tim

Every time the door slams with the wind the plaster will crack
vertically over the brick/block joint. If there is wallpaper on it
then it will end up as a "crunchy-ripply-distorted mess" and will
eventually tear the wallpaper leaving a very visible & obvious
"crack". You then get people trying to fill in the crack without
addressing the real problem.

Realise this can happen on both sides of the wall - which could get
expensive if the other side is a wallpaper hallway.

So D-I-Y the repair properly - the wall starter kit is the proper
solution (or key in bricks since D-I-Y labour is "free").

js.b1 wibbled:

Every time the door slams with the wind the plaster will crack
vertically over the brick/block joint. If there is wallpaper on it
then it will end up as a "crunchy-ripply-distorted mess" and will
eventually tear the wallpaper leaving a very visible & obvious
"crack". You then get people trying to fill in the crack without
addressing the real problem.

Realise this can happen on both sides of the wall - which could get
expensive if the other side is a wallpaper hallway.

So D-I-Y the repair properly - the wall starter kit is the proper
solution (or key in bricks since D-I-Y labour is "free").

There be tiles going on the back... And emulsion on the front.

The BCO was down looking at random things like the fireplace, and my new
windows... I showed it to him. He didn't think it was good enough. He's
agreed on replacing with bricks interleved into the old wall said not to
bother with a DPC under the bottom brick as it's only one in order to get a
stronger bond with the floor.

I'm certainly agreed that DIY will be better here - already got a pile of
random but quite good quality bricks.

I feel vindicated now he's seen it - so I shall write the builder in
question a stinky letter telling him what I think of some of his work
(remember 2/3rds was done OK but I've had to redo random bits). It was his
attitude to being asked politely to remedy the problem that wound me up.
He's been offered the chance to fix it, refused and I'm not inclined to
waste time going through "due process" any further.

Life's too short to sue, and the rectification costs will be around 600 quid
of materials (mostly the front room floor) and a week of my time plus a
labourer assisting covering the 3 main cock ups. So best to get on and just
do it. So I'll leave it as a stinky letter and some negative press to his
other customers who happen to be friends of mine.


Cheers

Tim

In message
,
js.b1 writes


Every time the door slams with the wind the plaster will crack
vertically over the brick/block joint. If there is wallpaper on it
then it will end up as a "crunchy-ripply-distorted mess" and will
eventually tear the wallpaper leaving a very visible & obvious
"crack". You then get people trying to fill in the crack without
addressing the real problem.

Realise this can happen on both sides of the wall - which could get
expensive if the other side is a wallpaper hallway.

So D-I-Y the repair properly - the wall starter kit is the proper
solution (or key in bricks since D-I-Y labour is "free").


Err ...

js.b1 or whoever you are - if you completely snip what you are referring
to, those of us who are not paying particular attention, don't have the
slightest clue what the **** you are on about

--
bumsnase

Tim S wrote:
js.b1 wibbled:

Every time the door slams with the wind the plaster will crack
vertically over the brick/block joint. If there is wallpaper on it
then it will end up as a "crunchy-ripply-distorted mess" and will
eventually tear the wallpaper leaving a very visible & obvious
"crack". You then get people trying to fill in the crack without
addressing the real problem.

Realise this can happen on both sides of the wall - which could get
expensive if the other side is a wallpaper hallway.

So D-I-Y the repair properly - the wall starter kit is the proper
solution (or key in bricks since D-I-Y labour is "free").

There be tiles going on the back... And emulsion on the front.

The BCO was down looking at random things like the fireplace, and my new
windows... I showed it to him. He didn't think it was good enough. He's
agreed on replacing with bricks interleved into the old wall said not to
bother with a DPC under the bottom brick as it's only one in order to get a
stronger bond with the floor.

I'm certainly agreed that DIY will be better here - already got a pile of
random but quite good quality bricks.

I feel vindicated now he's seen it - so I shall write the builder in
question a stinky letter telling him what I think of some of his work
(remember 2/3rds was done OK but I've had to redo random bits). It was his
attitude to being asked politely to remedy the problem that wound me up.
He's been offered the chance to fix it, refused and I'm not inclined to
waste time going through "due process" any further.

Life's too short to sue, and the rectification costs will be around 600 quid
of materials (mostly the front room floor) and a week of my time plus a
labourer assisting covering the 3 main cock ups. So best to get on and just
do it. So I'll leave it as a stinky letter and some negative press to his
other customers who happen to be friends of mine.

You could at least threaten him with legal action but name a
(reasonable) price at which you would be happy to settle. Send it
recorded delivery and give him a deadline to respond and he may be
suitibly worried enough to hand over the cash. Worth a try and won't
waste any time as you intend to write him a letter anyway.


Cheers

Tim