Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

wrote

On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!

I hope you are billing your electric company for the power you are obviously
putting back into the grid .

Phil

On Dec 11, 11:10*am, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It's been wired up wrong.

Should be:
Live (In)
Neutral (In)
Neutral (Out)
Live (out)

But, I'm amazed it runs backwards. Almost all manufacturers have a
mechanism to prevent that happening, as a deterrent against fraud.

Jon.

which meter is it from which company...
i want one!

[g]



Tournifreak wrote:
On Dec 11, 11:10 am, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It's been wired up wrong.

Should be:
Live (In)
Neutral (In)
Neutral (Out)
Live (out)

But, I'm amazed it runs backwards. Almost all manufacturers have a
mechanism to prevent that happening, as a deterrent against fraud.

Jon.

On Dec 11, 2:01*pm, "george (dicegeorge)"
wrote:
which meter is it from which company...
i want one!

[g]

Tournifreak wrote:
On Dec 11, 11:10 am, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It's been wired up wrong.

Should be:
Live (In)
Neutral (In)
Neutral (Out)
Live (out)

But, I'm amazed it runs backwards. Almost all manufacturers have a
mechanism to prevent that happening, as a deterrent against fraud.

Jon.



Certainly not one of ours! (Actaris)
www.actaris.com
Presumably a mechanical meter too, which I would have thought is
unusual for a new-fit these days, in the UK.

Jon.

On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow down
the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to beat
the dodge.

"george (dicegeorge)" wrote in message
...
which meter is it from which company...
i want one!


Do they prevent top posting then?

mark


[g]



Tournifreak wrote:
On Dec 11, 11:10 am, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It's been wired up wrong.

Should be:
Live (In)
Neutral (In)
Neutral (Out)
Live (out)

But, I'm amazed it runs backwards. Almost all manufacturers have a
mechanism to prevent that happening, as a deterrent against fraud.

Jon.

Osprey wrote:
On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow down
the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to beat
the dodge.

There was a distinctly dodgy gadget being sold around 20 years ago (maybe
longer). It was a black box with 2 insulated leads coming out of it -
rather like the probes on a multi meter.

My mate had one on his factory. The probes were pushed up next to the
cables (don't know which ones) & the meter did run backwards. Got the
impression the black box contained a large coil of copper wire?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

On Thu, 11 Dec 2008 04:24:31 -0800, Tournifreak wrote:

On Dec 11, 11:10Â*am, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading. On further
investigation our meter is now running backwards!! We dont have solar
power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted with new tails to
the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking at the
cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4 wires run as
follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve. Is this
correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on? Would mis wiring a meter
make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered whether
anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It's been wired up wrong.

Should be:
Live (In)
Neutral (In)
Neutral (Out)
Live (out)

But, I'm amazed it runs backwards. Almost all manufacturers have a
mechanism to prevent that happening, as a deterrent against fraud.

Jon.

I agree with the connection order.

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

"The Medway Handyman" wrote in message
...
Osprey wrote:
On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow down
the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to beat
the dodge.

There was a distinctly dodgy gadget being sold around 20 years ago (maybe
longer). It was a black box with 2 insulated leads coming out of it -
rather like the probes on a multi meter.

My mate had one on his factory. The probes were pushed up next to the
cables (don't know which ones) & the meter did run backwards. Got the
impression the black box contained a large coil of copper wire?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

If attempting to minimise leccy costs, don't do what an aquaintance did.
He reckoned there was a small hole (or he made a small hole) underneath the
hands so that he could tweak the pointers to a lesser value. Problem was,
one of the hands came off its spindle

On 11 Dec, 17:59, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:
Osprey wrote:
On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow down
the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to beat
the dodge.

There was a distinctly dodgy gadget being sold around 20 years ago (maybe
longer). *It was a black box with 2 insulated leads coming out of it -
rather like the probes on a multi meter.

My mate had one on his factory. *The probes were pushed up next to the
cables (don't know which ones) & the meter did run backwards. *Got the
impression the black box contained a large coil of copper wire?

--
Dave - The Medway Handymanwww.medwayhandyman.co.uk- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

'Twas usually a wall-wart supplying a current to the two probes at a
low voltage. Pushing the probes up alongside the outer two tails made
contact with the meter Lin and Lout then the wall wart injected a
current into the current coil of the meter. If you got them wrong way
round the meter ran faster. Greed was the usual tell-tale when
consumption suddenly dropped to rididiculously low levels or even
became negative if the wind-back exceeded the disc wind-forward of
normal usage. The other tell-tale was a 13A socket newly installed
next to the meter to power the cheatbox

Modern meters are modified to stop the scam working although some
utility companies re-use old recalibrated kit which may give you the
opportunity to cheat in the above manner

"The Medway Handyman" wrote in message
...
Osprey wrote:
On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow down
the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to beat
the dodge.

There was a distinctly dodgy gadget being sold around 20 years ago (maybe
longer). It was a black box with 2 insulated leads coming out of it -
rather like the probes on a multi meter.

My mate had one on his factory. The probes were pushed up next to the
cables (don't know which ones) & the meter did run backwards. Got the
impression the black box contained a large coil of copper wire?


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman

They were called "Meter Beaters" in Yorkshire.

They did work.

Adam

cynic wrote:
On 11 Dec, 17:59, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:
Osprey wrote:
On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow
down the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to
beat the dodge.

There was a distinctly dodgy gadget being sold around 20 years ago
(maybe longer). It was a black box with 2 insulated leads coming out
of it - rather like the probes on a multi meter.

My mate had one on his factory. The probes were pushed up next to the
cables (don't know which ones) & the meter did run backwards. Got the
impression the black box contained a large coil of copper wire?

--
Dave - The Medway Handymanwww.medwayhandyman.co.uk- Hide quoted text
-

- Show quoted text -

'Twas usually a wall-wart supplying a current to the two probes at a
low voltage. Pushing the probes up alongside the outer two tails made
contact with the meter Lin and Lout then the wall wart injected a
current into the current coil of the meter. If you got them wrong way
round the meter ran faster. Greed was the usual tell-tale when
consumption suddenly dropped to rididiculously low levels or even
became negative if the wind-back exceeded the disc wind-forward of
normal usage. The other tell-tale was a 13A socket newly installed
next to the meter to power the cheatbox

I don't recall it being pluged in anywhere, didn't seem to need any external
power.



--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

On Dec 11, 9:06*pm, cynic wrote:
On 11 Dec, 17:59, "The Medway Handyman"



wrote:
Osprey wrote:
On 11 Dec, 11:10, wrote:
Hi All,

We had a new elec bill yesterday.
Their estimated was way off the actual reading.
On further investigation our meter is now running backwards!!
We dont have solar power or any other elecricity generating means.

About 18 months ago we had a new consumer unit fitted
with new tails to the meter from the main incoming fuse.

I wondered whether this had been wired incorrectly. Looking
at the cabling at the bottom of the meter left to right the 4
wires run as follows;
(from consumer unit) +ve, -ve, (from main fuse) -ve, +ve.
Is this correct? Anybody any ideas what is going on?
Would mis wiring a meter make it run backwards even?

They are coming to have a look in a fortnight but just wondered
whether anybody has any ideas?
Its very wierd...

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards -
then they out a ratchet mechanism in place to prevent this, so
surprised it's doing that.

Other scam used to be to place a magnet on side of meter to slow down
the horizontal disc .... but then they changed to Aluminium to beat
the dodge.

There was a distinctly dodgy gadget being sold around 20 years ago (maybe
longer). *It was a black box with 2 insulated leads coming out of it -
rather like the probes on a multi meter.

My mate had one on his factory. *The probes were pushed up next to the
cables (don't know which ones) & the meter did run backwards. *Got the
impression the black box contained a large coil of copper wire?

--
Dave - The Medway Handymanwww.medwayhandyman.co.uk-Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

'Twas usually a wall-wart supplying a current to the two probes at a
low voltage. Pushing the probes up alongside the outer two tails made
contact with the meter Lin and Lout then the wall wart injected a
current into the current coil of the meter. If you got them wrong way
round the meter ran faster. Greed was the usual tell-tale when
consumption suddenly dropped to rididiculously low levels or even
became negative if the wind-back exceeded the disc wind-forward of
normal usage. The other tell-tale was a 13A socket newly installed
next to the meter to power the cheatbox

Modern meters are modified to stop the scam working although some
utility companies re-use old recalibrated kit which may give you the
opportunity to cheat in the above manner

The next generation of smart meters that will be installed in the UK
in the next 5 years or so are a *lot* harder to beat. They have hall
sensors to detect if a magnet is used near them. They can detect
reverse current, bypass conditions. The readings are taken via GPRS or
PLC. Many also have contactors built-in so that the supplier can cut
you off remotely if you don't pay your bill on time.

Jon.

On Fri, 12 Dec 2008 01:24:37 -0800 (PST), Tournifreak wrote:

The readings are taken via GPRS or PLC.

The only false reading I've ever had taken by a meter reader was one taken
electronically by the reader holding his gismo up to the circular
indentation on the meter.

Many also have contactors built-in so that the supplier can cut you off
remotely if you don't pay your bill on time.

I can see that being fun to sort out when (not if) a typo on data entry of
meter number to account association means that some innocent person gets
cut off. True computers never lie, but garbage in garbage out. The utility
companies barely manage to administer migration from one supplier to
another with anything approaching acceptable error levels.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 11 Dec, 16:56, Osprey wrote:

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards

Nope, trad mechanical meters just don't care (unless you get inside
the meter case and swap some of the internal wiring).

The "gadget" was an inductor that messed with the power factor of the
load, thus confusing the meter. It didn't make them go backwards, but
it did slow them down. Most of these were made up in little back
street electrical shops (like City Surplus in Liverpool) then sold to
their end users. As the end user often isn't the sharpest square wave
on the 'scope, they were freqently caught by meter reader's
inspection, then persuaded to name the supplier to lighten their own
fine.

Mechanical meters have also been deliberately resistant to running
backwards (ratchets etc.) since the '20s at least - there are many
patent mechanisms for this.

I don't believe this story of "swapped wires made the meter reverse".
Certainly not from an OP talking of positive and negative connections.

On Dec 12, 10:35*am, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Fri, 12 Dec 2008 01:24:37 -0800 (PST), Tournifreak wrote:
The readings are taken via GPRS or PLC.

The only false reading I've ever had taken by a meter reader was one taken
electronically by the reader holding his gismo up to the circular
indentation on the meter.

That shouldn't happen! The encoding system should pretty much
guarantee error-free readings. (CRCs etc) I can only think he read the
wrong register or something. There's a lot of data stored by meters
these days, and it's easy to pull out the wrong field.

Many also have contactors built-in so that the supplier can cut you off
remotely if you don't pay your bill on time.

I can see that being fun to sort out when (not if) a typo on data entry of
meter number to account association means that some innocent person gets
cut off. True computers never lie, but garbage in garbage out. The utility
companies barely manage to administer migration from one supplier to
another with anything approaching acceptable error levels.

Yes, I know. Scary isn't it? If you think billing is complicated now
though...man you should see some of the stuff the utilities are asking
for in the next generation. I can see a time when everyone has unique
tarrifs. You will be charged different rates at different times of
day, depending on how much power you've used in the last few hours, or
days. Readings are taken every few seconds and stored, then
transmitted back to the utility every few hours. Making comparisons
between suppliers will becoem impossible. (Not just rather difficult
as it is at present.)

Jon.

On 12 Dec, 11:42, Andy Dingley wrote:
On 11 Dec, 16:56, Osprey wrote:

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards

Nope, trad mechanical meters just don't care (unless you get inside
the meter case and swap some of the internal wiring).


The little wheel (disc) is acted upon by the product of the voltage
coil and the current coil alternating magnetic fields.
It did make the disc run slow when I saw one of these things some
years ago and tried it on an old mechanical kWh meter which I had on
stock at the time.

If it had not worked there would have been nothing for the RDOs to
gain by fitting solid block input connectors or the current range of
sleeves to their meters. The mere fact they did at some cost should
tell you something.



The "gadget" was an inductor that messed with the power factor of the
load, thus confusing the meter. It didn't make them go backwards, but
it did slow them down. Most of these were made up in little back
street electrical shops (like City Surplus in Liverpool) then sold to
their end users. As the end user often isn't the sharpest square wave
on the 'scope, they were freqently caught by meter reader's
inspection, then persuaded to name the supplier to lighten their own
fine.

Mechanical meters have also been deliberately resistant to running
backwards (ratchets etc.) since the '20s at least - there are many
patent mechanisms for this.

I don't believe this story of "swapped wires made the meter reverse".
Certainly not from an OP talking of positive and negative connections.

Andy Dingley wrote:
On 11 Dec, 16:56, Osprey wrote:

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards

Nope, trad mechanical meters just don't care (unless you get inside
the meter case and swap some of the internal wiring).

The "gadget" was an inductor that messed with the power factor of the
load, thus confusing the meter. It didn't make them go backwards, but
it did slow them down.

Now you mention it, thats what happened. You could see the meter slow
down - it was a long time ago :-)


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

On Dec 12, 12:51*pm, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:
Andy Dingley wrote:
On 11 Dec, 16:56, Osprey wrote:

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards

Nope, trad mechanical meters just don't care (unless you get inside
the meter case and swap some of the internal wiring).

The "gadget" was an inductor that messed with the power factor of the
load, thus confusing the meter. It didn't make them go backwards, but
it did slow them down.

Now you mention it, thats what happened. *You could see the meter slow
down - it was a long time ago :-)

--
Dave - The Medway Handymanwww.medwayhandyman.co.uk

But, was it an inductor? The load in a house is largely inductive
anyway so by adding more inductive load should increase the meter
rate. I would have expected that the device was actually a capacitor
to perform power factor correction and correct the phase relationship
between the voltage and current. (I think that it used to be that the
meter rate was determined by the phase relationship of voltage and
current - the more that current lag the voltage, the faster it spins).
A larger capacitance should be able to make the meter reverse but it
would be a huge capacitor!

Never seen any of this in action ... just recalling power factor
correction from college some 20 odd years ago

On 12 Dec, 14:30, " wrote:
The load in a house is largely inductive anyway

Well it might be in my house (certainly the workshop), but
_typically_ ? Hairdriers and incandescents aren't.

In article ,
Tournifreak writes:
On Dec 12, 10:35*am, "Dave Liquorice"
wrote:
On Fri, 12 Dec 2008 01:24:37 -0800 (PST), Tournifreak wrote:
The readings are taken via GPRS or PLC.

The only false reading I've ever had taken by a meter reader was one taken
electronically by the reader holding his gismo up to the circular
indentation on the meter.
That shouldn't happen! The encoding system should pretty much
guarantee error-free readings. (CRCs etc) I can only think he read the
wrong register or something. There's a lot of data stored by meters
these days, and it's easy to pull out the wrong field.

Remote meter reading has been around for 25 years.
It has however consistently failed to deliver, and
that's certainly not from want of trying. That's
not to say it will always fail, but it's starting
with a track record of 25 years of complete failures.
This is not just a UK issue either. Indeed some other
countries have done substantial roll-outs of remote
meter reading, only to abandon it all. The reasons
tend to be social and commercial, rather than techincal.

Many also have contactors built-in so that the supplier can cut you off
remotely if you don't pay your bill on time.

I can see that being fun to sort out when (not if) a typo on data entry of
meter number to account association means that some innocent person gets
cut off. True computers never lie, but garbage in garbage out. The utility
companies barely manage to administer migration from one supplier to
another with anything approaching acceptable error levels.
Yes, I know. Scary isn't it? If you think billing is complicated now
though...man you should see some of the stuff the utilities are asking
for in the next generation. I can see a time when everyone has unique
tarrifs. You will be charged different rates at different times of
day, depending on how much power you've used in the last few hours, or
days. Readings are taken every few seconds and stored, then
transmitted back to the utility every few hours. Making comparisons
between suppliers will becoem impossible. (Not just rather difficult
as it is at present.)

It also opens the possibility to have different suppliers
at different times of day, or to change your supplier on
a minute by minute basis, based for example on their current
rates, as is currently done by the grid itself, or on your
environmental beliefs e.g. expensive wind power when the wind
is blowing, but cheapest non-carbon source at other times.
The suppliers are not so keen to see this happen, of course,
but it may (and should) be forced upon them when the technical
infrastructure is in place.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

wrote:
On Dec 12, 12:51 pm, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:
Andy Dingley wrote:
On 11 Dec, 16:56, Osprey wrote:

It used to be a scam to reverse leads to make them run backwards

Nope, trad mechanical meters just don't care (unless you get inside
the meter case and swap some of the internal wiring).

The "gadget" was an inductor that messed with the power factor of
the load, thus confusing the meter. It didn't make them go
backwards, but it did slow them down.

Now you mention it, thats what happened. You could see the meter slow
down - it was a long time ago :-)

--
Dave - The Medway Handymanwww.medwayhandyman.co.uk

But, was it an inductor? The load in a house is largely inductive
anyway so by adding more inductive load should increase the meter
rate. I would have expected that the device was actually a capacitor
to perform power factor correction and correct the phase relationship
between the voltage and current. (I think that it used to be that the
meter rate was determined by the phase relationship of voltage and
current - the more that current lag the voltage, the faster it spins).
A larger capacitance should be able to make the meter reverse but it
would be a huge capacitor!

Never seen any of this in action ... just recalling power factor
correction from college some 20 odd years ago

No idea how it worked. It was about half the size of a bag of sugar &
heavy, which made me suspect a coil of copper wire.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk