We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs room
and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel. As you
can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going upstairs to turn
the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to install a
switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no thermostats and
the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is either heating on or off
(apart from varying the water temperature sent to the rads by turning the
dial on the front panel). What i would like to do is to install a switch
downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i would imagine i could
disconnect the original switch and run a cable down through the ceiling to
the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be more convenient for us. I
have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339 which is a Siemans RWB30E would
do the trick. This now gives me a few questions.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not please
could someone recommend an alternative?
2) I assume i would need a 3 core cable to run the feed, what type should i
use?
3) To complicate things further SWMBO has asked if the switch on the boiler
to turn the heating on or off can be left active, i don't think this will be
possible.

If anyone has done a similar job and can advise it would be much
appreciated.

Thanks,
Tom

Tom wrote:

We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs room
and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel. As you
can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going upstairs to turn
the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to install a
switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no thermostats and
the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is either heating on or off
(apart from varying the water temperature sent to the rads by turning the
dial on the front panel). What i would like to do is to install a switch
downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i would imagine i could
disconnect the original switch and run a cable down through the ceiling to
the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be more convenient for us. I
have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339 which is a Siemans RWB30E would
do the trick. This now gives me a few questions.


Its seems to me that you have a system with very poor controls. Rather
than trying to replicate the exact same thing, you have an opportunity
here to make things very much better for no extra effort.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not please
could someone recommend an alternative?

It may well, however it would make far more sense to user a thermostat
(preferably a programmable one) in the new location. That way you could
save the requirement to keep manually controlling the heating.

With a prog stat it does the job of both timer and stat. You simply tell
it what temperatures you require, and at what times of day (so it can
vary through the day) and it runs the heating as required to achieve
what you asked for.

Something like:

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/12157/...oom-Thermostat

Is a posh 7 day version.

2) I assume i would need a 3 core cable to run the feed, what type should i
use?

Most battery operated stats like above will run on two wires. The older
electromechanical type often require three wires (live, switched live,
and a neutral). So to allow most flexibility it may be wise to use three
core and earth cable.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=Cables#3.26E

3) To complicate things further SWMBO has asked if the switch on the boiler
to turn the heating on or off can be left active, i don't think this will be
possible.

Can't see why not. Do you want it to have override control (i.e. it can
force the heating on regardless of what the stat is doing) or veto
control, i.e. it can turn it off even if the stat is calling for heat?

If anyone has done a similar job and can advise it would be much
appreciated.

Incomplete article, but may give you some further pointers:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...rmostat_wiring



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In message , Tom
writes
We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs room
and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel. As you
can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going upstairs to turn
the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to install a
switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no thermostats and
the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is either heating on or off
(apart from varying the water temperature sent to the rads by turning the
dial on the front panel). What i would like to do is to install a switch
downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i would imagine i could
disconnect the original switch and run a cable down through the ceiling to
the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be more convenient for us. I
have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339 which is a Siemans RWB30E would
do the trick.

The RWB30E is, to put it bluntly, a pile of ****e. There are plenty of
proper modern programmers available - someone else will, I'm sure,
recommend one


This now gives me a few questions.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not please
could someone recommend an alternative?
2) I assume i would need a 3 core cable to run the feed, what type should i
use?

5A would be sufficient, the pcb has a (well two) 2A fuse

3) To complicate things further SWMBO has asked if the switch on the boiler
to turn the heating on or off can be left active, i don't think this will be
possible.

The manual has, IIRC, details for installing an external programmer, it
controls the heating, that's what it does, it's function in life, as
they say



If anyone has done a similar job and can advise it would be much
appreciated.

Thanks,
Tom



--
geoff

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:

We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs
room and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel.
As you can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going upstairs
to turn the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to
install a switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no
thermostats and the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is either
heating on or off (apart from varying the water temperature sent to the
rads by turning the dial on the front panel). What i would like to do is
to install a switch downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i would
imagine i could disconnect the original switch and run a cable down
through the ceiling to the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be more
convenient for us. I have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339 which
is a Siemans RWB30E would do the trick. This now gives me a few
questions.


Its seems to me that you have a system with very poor controls. Rather
than trying to replicate the exact same thing, you have an opportunity
here to make things very much better for no extra effort.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not
please could someone recommend an alternative?

It may well, however it would make far more sense to user a thermostat
(preferably a programmable one) in the new location. That way you could
save the requirement to keep manually controlling the heating.

With a prog stat it does the job of both timer and stat. You simply tell
it what temperatures you require, and at what times of day (so it can vary
through the day) and it runs the heating as required to achieve what you
asked for.

Something like:

http://www.screwfix.com/prods/12157/...oom-Thermostat

Is a posh 7 day version.

2) I assume i would need a 3 core cable to run the feed, what type should
i use?

Most battery operated stats like above will run on two wires. The older
electromechanical type often require three wires (live, switched live, and
a neutral). So to allow most flexibility it may be wise to use three core
and earth cable.

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?title=Cables#3.26E

3) To complicate things further SWMBO has asked if the switch on the
boiler to turn the heating on or off can be left active, i don't think
this will be possible.

Can't see why not. Do you want it to have override control (i.e. it can
force the heating on regardless of what the stat is doing) or veto
control, i.e. it can turn it off even if the stat is calling for heat?

If anyone has done a similar job and can advise it would be much
appreciated.

Incomplete article, but may give you some further pointers:

http://wiki.diyfaq.org.uk/index.php?...rmostat_wiring



--
Cheers,

John.

Thanks for your input John. I assume that if i install a Thermostat and run
it from the main switch on the boiler, when the current switch is positioned
to heating on, the thermostat will override this, for instance i would just
turn it down to 6c in order to turn the heating off, would the pump or fan
keep running? One other problem, when the heating is switched on it is much
much warmer upstairs than downstairs, is it possible to have 2 zones on a
combi system? If so how much is it likely to cost to make the changes?
Money is tight at the moment and i am not to good a plumbing!

Thanks again.

Tom

In message , Tom
writes
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:

We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs
room and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel.
As you can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going upstairs
to turn the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to
install a switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no
thermostats and the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is either
heating on or off (apart from varying the water temperature sent to the
rads by turning the dial on the front panel). What i would like to do is
to install a switch downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i would
imagine i could disconnect the original switch and run a cable down
through the ceiling to the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be more
convenient for us. I have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339 which
is a Siemans RWB30E would do the trick. This now gives me a few
questions.


Its seems to me that you have a system with very poor controls. Rather
than trying to replicate the exact same thing, you have an opportunity
here to make things very much better for no extra effort.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not
please could someone recommend an alternative?

It may well, however it would make far more sense to user a thermostat
(preferably a programmable one) in the new location. That way you could
save the requirement to keep manually controlling the heating.


Thanks for your input John. I assume that if i install a Thermostat and run
it from the main switch on the boiler,

There are a dedicated pair of connector pins on the 24i pcb for a room
stat, as are there for a programmer

look in the installation manual

--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Tom
writes
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:

We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs
room and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel.
As you can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going
upstairs
to turn the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to
install a switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no
thermostats and the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is
either
heating on or off (apart from varying the water temperature sent to the
rads by turning the dial on the front panel). What i would like to do
is
to install a switch downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i
would
imagine i could disconnect the original switch and run a cable down
through the ceiling to the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be
more
convenient for us. I have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339
which
is a Siemans RWB30E would do the trick. This now gives me a few
questions.


Its seems to me that you have a system with very poor controls. Rather
than trying to replicate the exact same thing, you have an opportunity
here to make things very much better for no extra effort.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not
please could someone recommend an alternative?

It may well, however it would make far more sense to user a thermostat
(preferably a programmable one) in the new location. That way you could
save the requirement to keep manually controlling the heating.


Thanks for your input John. I assume that if i install a Thermostat and
run
it from the main switch on the boiler,

There are a dedicated pair of connector pins on the 24i pcb for a room
stat, as are there for a programmer

look in the installation manual

--
geoff

thanks Geoff, i do not have the manual as the boiler was in the house when
we bought it. I'll see what i can find online.

Tom

In message , Tom
writes
"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Tom
writes
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:

We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an upstairs
room and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front panel.
As you can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going
upstairs
to turn the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to
install a switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have no
thermostats and the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is
either
heating on or off (apart from varying the water temperature sent to the
rads by turning the dial on the front panel). What i would like to do
is
to install a switch downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i
would
imagine i could disconnect the original switch and run a cable down
through the ceiling to the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be
more
convenient for us. I have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339
which
is a Siemans RWB30E would do the trick. This now gives me a few
questions.


Its seems to me that you have a system with very poor controls. Rather
than trying to replicate the exact same thing, you have an opportunity
here to make things very much better for no extra effort.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not
please could someone recommend an alternative?

It may well, however it would make far more sense to user a thermostat
(preferably a programmable one) in the new location. That way you could
save the requirement to keep manually controlling the heating.


Thanks for your input John. I assume that if i install a Thermostat and
run
it from the main switch on the boiler,

There are a dedicated pair of connector pins on the 24i pcb for a room
stat, as are there for a programmer

look in the installation manual

--
geoff

thanks Geoff, i do not have the manual as the boiler was in the house when
we bought it. I'll see what i can find online.

The installation manual should have been left with the boiler

Ask Worcester-Bosch for one

I might be able to fax / email a couple of relevant pages - phone me on
tuesday (details at www.cetltd.com)


--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Tom
writes
"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Tom
writes
"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
Tom wrote:

We have a Worchester 24i combi boiler that is installed in an
upstairs
room and it has a mechanical dial timer and switch on the front
panel.
As you can probably imagine it is a complete pain to keep going
upstairs
to turn the heating on or off in the winter so SWMBO has asked me to
install a switch downstairs to control the heating. Our rooms have
no
thermostats and the radiators have no TRVs so the only control is
either
heating on or off (apart from varying the water temperature sent to
the
rads by turning the dial on the front panel). What i would like to
do
is
to install a switch downstairs (ideally not mains a powered one), i
would
imagine i could disconnect the original switch and run a cable down
through the ceiling to the Dinning room or Kitchen where it would be
more
convenient for us. I have looked in Screwfix and think item 33339
which
is a Siemans RWB30E would do the trick. This now gives me a few
questions.


Its seems to me that you have a system with very poor controls. Rather
than trying to replicate the exact same thing, you have an opportunity
here to make things very much better for no extra effort.

1) Would this switch be ok to use for the above application, if not
please could someone recommend an alternative?

It may well, however it would make far more sense to user a thermostat
(preferably a programmable one) in the new location. That way you
could
save the requirement to keep manually controlling the heating.


Thanks for your input John. I assume that if i install a Thermostat and
run
it from the main switch on the boiler,

There are a dedicated pair of connector pins on the 24i pcb for a room
stat, as are there for a programmer

look in the installation manual

--
geoff

thanks Geoff, i do not have the manual as the boiler was in the house when
we bought it. I'll see what i can find online.

The installation manual should have been left with the boiler

Ask Worcester-Bosch for one

I might be able to fax / email a couple of relevant pages - phone me on
tuesday (details at www.cetltd.com)


--
geoff

Thanks Geoff, i found the manual online from Worchester-Bosch (Both
Tech/Spec and User guide), it says nothing about where to connect a
thermostat to. After some thought i think i should get some TRV's installed
on the rads upstairs and a thermostat in the living room. Do you have any
idea how much a plumber is likely to charge? I would guess to supply and
install 3 TRVs and a thermostat i would be looking at around £200, please
let me know your thoughts before i start ringing around on Tuesday - i am
located on the outskirts of Chester BTW.

Thanks

Tom

In message , Tom
writes

The installation manual should have been left with the boiler

Ask Worcester-Bosch for one

I might be able to fax / email a couple of relevant pages - phone me on
tuesday (details at www.cetltd.com)


--
geoff

Thanks Geoff, i found the manual online from Worchester-Bosch (Both
Tech/Spec and User guide),

No - you want the installation manual, not either of the above

it says nothing about where to connect a
thermostat to.

Because they are both the wrong publications for what you require


--
geoff

Tom wrote:

Thanks for your input John. I assume that if i install a Thermostat and run
it from the main switch on the boiler, when the current switch is positioned
to heating on, the thermostat will override this, for instance i would just
turn it down to 6c in order to turn the heating off, would the pump or fan
keep running? One other problem, when the heating is switched on it is much

With most combis the boiler controls the pump and the fan as required.
So if the timer is on, and the stat is not calling for heat then the
bolier, pump and fan will be off. When the stat calls for heat the
voiler will fire and bring up the pump and fan as required.

much warmer upstairs than downstairs, is it possible to have 2 zones on a
combi system? If so how much is it likely to cost to make the changes?
Money is tight at the moment and i am not to good a plumbing!

You can have two zones with pretty much any type of boiler including
combis. Each zone could be controlled by its own stat and /or programmer.

However it seems like you may be able to fix the problem with a bit of
balancing. This is just a process of tweaking the flow through the rads
in the hotter rooms to even out the heating such that it is more even.

Thermostatic rad valves in the hot rooms would also be easier to fit
than zoning the whole system probably.



--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/