We're renting out a house on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement. The
initial period was 6 months but the tenants have stayed on on a rolling
1 month basis and we now need to increase the rent at the end of the
first 12 months.

There's nothing in the agreement about automatic increases so do I just
send them a letter or do I need to send them a copy of Form 4b -
'Landlord’s Notice proposing a new rent under an Assured Periodic
Tenancy of premises situated in England'?

TIA

--
F

"F" news@nowhere wrote in message
news:1rWdnU9lQfU0zOzVnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@plusnet...
We're renting out a house on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement. The
initial period was 6 months but the tenants have stayed on on a rolling
1 month basis and we now need to increase the rent at the end of the
first 12 months.

There's nothing in the agreement about automatic increases so do I just
send them a letter or do I need to send them a copy of Form 4b -
'Landlord’s Notice proposing a new rent under an Assured Periodic
Tenancy of premises situated in England'?

TIA

--
F


Once a tenancy has been created it cannot be changed to another type of
tenancy by or on renewal.

At the end of the fixed-term, therefore, there is no legal requirement for
either party to do anything - the tenancy can continue on indefinitely on a
periodic basis and on exactly the same terms as the original agreement,
which still fully applies.

In message 1rWdnU9lQfU0zOzVnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@plusnet, F
writes
We're renting out a house on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement.
The initial period was 6 months but the tenants have stayed on on a
rolling 1 month basis and we now need to increase the rent at the end
of the first 12 months.

There's nothing in the agreement about automatic increases so do I just
send them a letter or do I need to send them a copy of Form 4b -
'Landlords Notice proposing a new rent under an Assured Periodic
Tenancy of premises situated in England'?

TIA


Can fix it with an angle grinder ... probably not.
uk.rec.tenancy ... possibly (if it existed).
uk.legal.moderated ... almost certainly (and it does).
Someone

On Mon, 7 Jul 2008 02:00:16 +0100, somebody
wrote:

In message 1rWdnU9lQfU0zOzVnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@plusnet, F
writes
We're renting out a house on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement.
The initial period was 6 months but the tenants have stayed on on a
rolling 1 month basis and we now need to increase the rent at the end
of the first 12 months.

There's nothing in the agreement about automatic increases so do I just
send them a letter or do I need to send them a copy of Form 4b -
'Landlord’s Notice proposing a new rent under an Assured Periodic
Tenancy of premises situated in England'?

TIA


Can fix it with an angle grinder ... probably not.
uk.rec.tenancy ... possibly (if it existed).
uk.legal.moderated ... almost certainly (and it does).
Someone


They should be members of the landlord association which for a small
fee offers expert advice on all sorts of landlord issues.
--
http://www.freedeliveryuk.co.uk
http://www.holidayunder100.co.uk

On 7 Jul, 00:13, F news@nowhere wrote:
We're renting out a house on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement. The
initial period was 6 months but the tenants have stayed on on a rolling
1 month basis and we now need to increase the rent at the end of the
first 12 months.

There's nothing in the agreement about automatic increases so do I just
send them a letter or do I need to send them a copy of Form 4b -
'Landlord’s Notice proposing a new rent under an Assured Periodic
Tenancy of premises situated in England'?

Definitely the wrong place, you want the forums at landlordzone.com
which are very helpful.

For what it's worth I did this a while ago using a form under s.13 of
the Housing Act 1988 which I downloaded for nothing from somewhere or
other. Judging from the name you've quoted, the form 4b which you're
suggesting is the same thing, but I would guess that's the name given
it by someone who's going to charge you for it.

Cheers!

Martin

On 07/07/2008 09:08 Martin Pentreath wrote:

Definitely the wrong place

No, not the wrong place, but probably not the best: there have been
quite a few landlord/tenant related discussions on here before.

We could pay someone to be our agent but we're doing-it-ourselves. Hence
uk.d-i-y.

you want the forums at landlordzone.com
which are very helpful.

Thanks, I'll have a look over there.

For what it's worth I did this a while ago using a form under s.13 of
the Housing Act 1988 which I downloaded for nothing from somewhere or
other.

That's the form - I got it for free too. It just seems a little over
formal when a simple letter would do.

--
F

On 7 Jul, 10:16, F news@nowhere wrote:

That's the form - I got it for free too. It just seems a little over
formal when a simple letter would do.

Hi F,

If your letter complies with the requirements of s.13 of the Act then
a letter is fine. The only reason to use the form is to make sure that
all the s.13 boxes are ticked.

(By the way, interesting interpretation of the scope of uk.d-i-y, but
on that basis we'd be discussing everything.)

Chreers!

Martin

On 07/07/2008 15:01 Martin Pentreath wrote:

If your letter complies with the requirements of s.13 of the Act then
a letter is fine. The only reason to use the form is to make sure that
all the s.13 boxes are ticked.

Letter and form then, just to make sure and to try to take out some of
the formality of just the form.

(By the way, interesting interpretation of the scope of uk.d-i-y,

It's not all angle grinders and car body filler!

but
on that basis we'd be discussing everything.)

But we do, and some of it is really off topic!

--
F

On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 00:13:44 +0100, F wrote:

We're renting out a house on an Assured Shorthold Tenancy Agreement. The
initial period was 6 months but the tenants have stayed on on a rolling
1 month basis and we now need to increase the rent at the end of the
first 12 months.

There's nothing in the agreement about automatic increases so do I just
send them a letter or do I need to send them a copy of Form 4b -
'Landlords Notice proposing a new rent under an Assured Periodic
Tenancy of premises situated in England'?

TIA

The best way to do this is by informal negotiation to begin with.

You explain that you would like a rent increase in =3 months time [1].
If they agree then you draw up a new tenancy agreement to start in 3
months time[1].

If they disagree then they get served a section 21 notice explaining that
they are on notice to leave. There may even be a form to state to convey
this information but you'll need 3 months [1].


HOWEVER a bird in the hand is worth .... etc. etc.
Reasonable tenants who are paying regularly should not be provoked into
leaving. It never costs less than two full months rent to change tenants.
Not only are there direct expenses but all the indirect hassles and time
consuming activities. Furthermore the new ones might just be in the small
percentage of tenants that you don't want.

Really the only reason to put the rent up is if the market for renting
has significantly changed in 12 months in your area, why? Perhaps you did
not set the correct rent initially?

HTH

[1] 2 months but rounded up to the exact date of the month in which the
original agrement came into force.
--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

On 07/07/2008 21:52 Ed Sirett wrote:

The best way to do this is by informal negotiation to begin with.

If only! English is a second language for one of the tenants (but her
command of English is far superior to my command of her language!) and
for her husband thinking seems to be a problem. Any conversation seems
to revolve around them telling me what the other one thinks and then
them blaming each other for what was said. It's really not very
efficient or rewarding.

You explain that you would like a rent increase in =3 months time [1].
If they agree then you draw up a new tenancy agreement to start in 3
months time[1].

I've spent quite some time on this today following Martin's response
above and it seems that I don't need a new tenancy agreement and, in
fact, I should avoid that route as everything is reset to a new fixed
period which will then run out into the current position.

I don't want to be locked into a new six month period as I might need to
give them notice and sell up sooner.

[snip]

HOWEVER a bird in the hand is worth .... etc. etc.

Oh, I understand that!

Reasonable tenants who are paying regularly should not be provoked into
leaving.

They usually pay at the last minute or a couple or three days late. I've
asked for payments by standing order but cash delivered to my front door
seems to be the only way they'll do it. Which is a nuisance. Not only
because I've got to be in when they call, but because it means I've got
to go and pay it into the bank account and then wait over a week until
it's treated as cleared.

It never costs less than two full months rent to change tenants.
Not only are there direct expenses but all the indirect hassles and time
consuming activities. Furthermore the new ones might just be in the small
percentage of tenants that you don't want.

And I understand that too!

Really the only reason to put the rent up is if the market for renting
has significantly changed in 12 months in your area, why? Perhaps you did
not set the correct rent initially?

The rent is used to subsidise my father's nursing home fees. It was set
correctly a year ago but, since then, his fees have risen by over £100 a
week. I need to recoup some of that and, in view of the way rents have
gone up in this area, a 4% rise is very reasonable.

--
F

On 07/07/2008 23:40 Owain wrote:

On 07/07/2008 21:52 Ed Sirett wrote:

Reasonable tenants who are paying regularly should not be provoked
into leaving.

I very much agree with this point.

As do I. I really don't want the hassle of a change of tenant, which is
why I've tried to be very patient when dealing with some of the little
'problems' they've thrown at me.

Payment by standing order should be in the tenancy agreement if that is
what you wanted.

The letting agent we used said that we couldn't dictate the use of a
standing order as not everyone had a suitable bank account. I wish I had
pushed harder at the time. As far as I can see, it would take a new
tenancy agreement to get this now and they probably wouldn't play.

--
F

F wrote:
On 07/07/2008 23:40 Owain wrote:

On 07/07/2008 21:52 Ed Sirett wrote:

Reasonable tenants who are paying regularly should not be provoked
into leaving.

I very much agree with this point.

As do I. I really don't want the hassle of a change of tenant, which is
why I've tried to be very patient when dealing with some of the little
'problems' they've thrown at me.

Payment by standing order should be in the tenancy agreement if that
is what you wanted.

The letting agent we used said that we couldn't dictate the use of a
standing order as not everyone had a suitable bank account. I wish I had
pushed harder at the time. As far as I can see, it would take a new
tenancy agreement to get this now and they probably wouldn't play.


In the current climate I'd certainly stick with tenants that are paying
4% below what you expect.
It's a shame care homes aren't subject to the same kind of market
fluctuations

"stuart noble" wrote in message
...
F wrote:
On 07/07/2008 23:40 Owain wrote:

On 07/07/2008 21:52 Ed Sirett wrote:

Reasonable tenants who are paying regularly should not be provoked
into leaving.

I very much agree with this point.

As do I. I really don't want the hassle of a change of tenant, which is
why I've tried to be very patient when dealing with some of the little
'problems' they've thrown at me.

Payment by standing order should be in the tenancy agreement if that is
what you wanted.

The letting agent we used said that we couldn't dictate the use of a
standing order as not everyone had a suitable bank account. I wish I had
pushed harder at the time. As far as I can see, it would take a new
tenancy agreement to get this now and they probably wouldn't play.


In the current climate I'd certainly stick with tenants that are paying 4%
below what you expect.
It's a shame care homes aren't subject to the same kind of market
fluctuations

Well they are of course! If there weren't enough older people
wanting/needing/being encouraged to enter such homes, the price would drop -
but there are more than enough so it stays high. They are both "free"
markets with *all* that entails.


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

On 08/07/2008 11:05 Bob Mannix wrote:

If there weren't enough older people
wanting/needing/being encouraged to enter such homes, the price would drop -
but there are more than enough so it stays high.

Unfortunately, he has to be there as he has vascular dementia and needs
nursing care. Because he had two jobs most of his life and was able to
buy his own house and save some money, he has to pay.

If he had had a full blown stroke rather than his succession of
relatively minor ones, his fees would be paid, in full, by the NHS.
Perhaps there's a lesson the he should have enjoyed himself more and
spent it all and then let the State (ie, you and me) pay for his care.

Perhaps I need to re-think what I'm doing with current assets...

--
F

"F" news@nowhere wrote in message
et...
On 08/07/2008 11:05 Bob Mannix wrote:

If there weren't enough older people wanting/needing/being encouraged to
enter such homes, the price would drop - but there are more than enough
so it stays high.

Unfortunately, he has to be there as he has vascular dementia and needs
nursing care. Because he had two jobs most of his life and was able to buy
his own house and save some money, he has to pay.

If he had had a full blown stroke rather than his succession of relatively
minor ones, his fees would be paid, in full, by the NHS. Perhaps there's a
lesson the he should have enjoyed himself more and spent it all and
then let the State (ie, you and me) pay for his care.

Perhaps I need to re-think what I'm doing with current assets...

My point was not about your or your relative's predicament, for which I am
sorry and feel for you. It was a point I have made elsewhere - the "free"
market is applauded (by some) when it makes house prices drop - (hooray for
the fluctuations!) but it is precisely and exactly the same "free" market
that is keeping the care home costs high. As I said elsewhere, there are
many who applaud the "free" market as A Good Thing....until it isn't, when
they complain. To avoid hypocrisy you have to say the "free" market is A
Good Thing whatever happens or say it's A Bad Thing and accept that our
markets shouldn't be "free".


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)
--
F

On 08/07/2008 11:53 Bob Mannix wrote:

My point was not about your or your relative's predicament

Don't worry, I didn't take as such. I just needed to get something off
my chest!

--
F

On 08/07/2008 13:02 Owain wrote:

Are you insured for handling cash? My former landlord/agent refused to
accept payments in cash as the risks and costs were too high.

On my household insurance: lost cash? Probably not then.

I'm too soft with them, but, as I said above, I don't want the hassle of
finding someone else.

--
F

On 7 Jul, 22:16, F news@nowhere wrote:

You explain that you would like a rent increase in =3 months time [1].
If they agree then you draw up a new tenancy agreement to start in 3
months time[1].

I've spent quite some time on this today following Martin's response
above and it seems that I don't need a new tenancy agreement and, in
fact, I should avoid that route as everything is reset to a new fixed
period which will then run out into the current position.

I don't want to be locked into a new six month period as I might need to
give them notice and sell up sooner.

Hi again F, I went through the same process as you and reached the
same conclusion. If all you're changing is the rent and you want to
stay on a periodic tenancy then a s.13 notice is the way ahead.

On 08/07/2008 16:09 Martin Pentreath wrote:

Hi again F, I went through the same process as you and reached the
same conclusion. If all you're changing is the rent and you want to
stay on a periodic tenancy then a s.13 notice is the way ahead.

Thanks for the confirmation. They got the letter and form by Special
Delivery this morning but I've not had the phone call yet...

--
F

F news@nowhere wrote:
[...] It was set correctly a year ago but, since then, his fees
have risen by over £100 a week. I need to recoup some of that
and, in view of the way rents have gone up in this area, a 4%
rise is very reasonable.

A rent increase after only 12 months /could/ be interperted as breach
of right to "quiet enjoyment". It certainly hints at bad forward
planning. An increase in rent in order to meet /your/ increased
outgoings sounds decidedly dodgy.

I review my rents every five years, and give my tenents 6 months
notice
of the review, and the review gives 6 months notice of the new rent
level,
effectively a 12 month warning, using a form letter drawn up by my
solicitor which is business-related expenses and is deduced from
taxable
trading profit.

--
JGH

On Tue, 8 Jul 2008 08:55:14 -0700 (PDT) Jgharston wrote :
I review my rents every five years, and give my tenents 6 months
notice of the review, and the review gives 6 months notice of the
new rent level, effectively a 12 month warning, using a form letter
drawn up by my solicitor which is business-related expenses and is
deduced from taxable trading profit.

That's pretty generous and keeping a tenant in place at a lower rent is
generally going to be more remunerative than having them move out and
reletting at a slightly higher rent with void and other costs in the
meantime. The downside is that if inflation increases significantly, at
the end of five years you've probably got a big catch-up which may not be
well received.

--
Tony Bryer SDA UK 'Software to build on' http://www.sda.co.uk

On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:34:17 +0100, F wrote:

On 08/07/2008 13:02 Owain wrote:

Are you insured for handling cash? My former landlord/agent refused to
accept payments in cash as the risks and costs were too high.

On my household insurance: lost cash? Probably not then.

I'm too soft with them, but, as I said above, I don't want the hassle of
finding someone else.

For 4% you really need to say to yourself. Putting up the rent /might/
work. More likely they will not understand and you will then be forced to
explain that they are leaving - having now lost a few months more.

Frankly, possibly, changing tenants for 4% you are looking at two-four
years pay back period. In all likely hood the tenancy won't last that
long.

I have only ever had to ask one set of tenants to leave. I did this at a
time that suited me as I had a block of time for the refurbishments.

Any one or two problems could have been weathered but all of them
together was too much.

1) Paying rent by cash (having cancelled the standing order).
2) Paying up to three weeks late.
3) paying up to £5 short.
4) playing loud music at unsocial hours, annoying other occupants of the
building.
5) Objecting that a solid functional (and well hidden) repair to a bed
frame they broke was unsatisfactory.
6) Insisting that I organize the cleaning of the sofa cushions becasue
they 'smelt'. Likewise the carpets.
7) Zero housework.
8) Cooking solely by means of the destructive distillation of cooking oil.
9) Requesting a rent holiday for Ramadan.

Turned out that there were three on the agreement, four on the electoral
register, and post came for six names, and the bailiffs had to be
redirected for one.



--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

On 08/07/2008 16:55 jgharston wrote:

A rent increase after only 12 months /could/ be interperted as breach
of right to "quiet enjoyment".

If that was the case then we're all suffering from the right to 'quiet
enjoyment'. Increases in mortgage rates and the price of petrol, food
and everything else are certainly spoiling the 'quiet enjoyment' of much
of what most of us do. I can see no reason why a tenant should be
surprised that their rent, like all other outgoings, should increase on
an annual basis.

It certainly hints at bad forward
planning.

No, the rent was initially set at quite a conservative/reasonable level
and the plan was always for a review every 12 months. The tenants were
the first to view and signed up as quickly as they could. They were not
recommended as suitable by the letting agent once their rental history
was checked but, after speaking to them and receiving assurances from
them, I wanted to help.

An increase in rent in order to meet /your/ increased
outgoings sounds decidedly dodgy.

If a manufacturer of widgets finds his outgoings increased he's going to
increase his prices similarly. Unless he wants to be an ex manufacturer.

I'm 'selling' something to 'buy' something. My 'purchase' costs have
gone up so I see no need to insulate my tenants from the real world by
not increasing my 'selling' price. I've put on a 4% increase; RPI is up
4.3%. Rentals in general have gone up significantly more than 4% in this
area.

I cannot see why the rental element of the tenants' outgoings should be
the only element which should not increase in line with (it's actually
slightly less than) inflation. To be blunt, it's not my job to provide
them with subsidised housing.

I review my rents every five years, and give my tenents 6 months
notice
of the review, and the review gives 6 months notice of the new rent
level,
effectively a 12 month warning, using a form letter drawn up by my
solicitor which is business-related expenses and is deduced from
taxable
trading profit.

Which results in a large five year catch up for the tenant and a
significant loss of income for the landlord over that period. Unless the
rent was set at an artificially high level in the first place.

--
F

On 08/07/2008 18:49 Ed Sirett wrote:

For 4% you really need to say to yourself. Putting up the rent /might/
work. More likely they will not understand and you will then be forced to
explain that they are leaving - having now lost a few months more.

I'm not sure there's not a misunderstanding he I *don't* want them out...

--
F

On Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:58:50 +0100, Owain wrote:

Ed Sirett wrote:
9) Requesting a rent holiday for Ramadan.

That's chutzpa!
^^^^^^^
Wrong faith group there.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember jgharston
saying something like:

A rent increase after only 12 months /could/ be interperted as breach
of right to "quiet enjoyment". It certainly hints at bad forward
planning. An increase in rent in order to meet /your/ increased
outgoings sounds decidedly dodgy.

Utter cock. A yearly rent increase is perfectly normal in a lot of
places, to keep it in line with inflation.
--
Dave
GS850x2 XS650 SE6a

"It's a moron working with power tools.
How much more suspenseful can you get?"
- House

On Jul 7, 11:40*pm, Owain wrote:
F wrote:
On 07/07/2008 21:52 Ed Sirett wrote:
If only! English is a second language for one of the tenants (but her
command of English is far superior to my command of her language!) and
for her husband thinking seems to be a problem. Any conversation seems
to revolve around them telling me what the other one thinks and then
them blaming each other for what was said. It's really not very
efficient or rewarding.

Can you get your own interpreter to go with you?

I don't want to be locked into a new six month period as I might need to
give them notice and sell up sooner.

If they're on the periodic notice period and you give them two months
notice, and they don't remove, then you have to give them further notice
of your intention to seek a court order, then wait for a court hearing,
then hope you've got grounds for possession as stated in the lease and
notified to the tenant before they signed. The court will probably allow
another 28 days in the order. If they don't comply with the order, go
back to court again.......

WTF? Serve a Section 21 (4)(a) - this is mandatory posession. If you
serve a S28 if there are rent arrears or other reasons (Ground 17 -
lying on a tenancy application form for example) it may not be
mandatory and they are in fact easy to beat by bringing arrears to
below two months owed. If your Section 21 the judge (in theory) has
to grant posssession. [1]

You never need to state a reason to the court for Section 21 notice.

If the tenancy is not periodic (eg during the fixed term) the notice
has to be Section 21 (1)(b). Get the dates right as it is easy to
screw it up.

[1] In theory. There is a case going through at the moment where the
tenant became disabled and lost their job. LL served section 21 and
it has been argued that the S21 is not valid as it discriminates (eg
the only reason the tenant was being asked to leave was not paying the
rent, which only happened because they became disabled). This could
have an impact on notices to quit, even thought you do not need to
give a reason for a S21 notice.

Owain wrote:
Ed Sirett wrote:
9) Requesting a rent holiday for Ramadan.
That's chutzpa!
^^^^^^^ Wrong faith group there.

I know :-)


I'm told that it's easy to comply with both halal and kosher rules at
the same time. :-)

--
Rod

Hypothyroidism is a seriously debilitating condition with an insidious
onset.
Although common it frequently goes undiagnosed.
www.thyromind.info www.thyroiduk.org www.altsupportthyroid.org

On Jul 9, 8:14*pm, ST wrote:
On Jul 7, 11:40*pm, Owain wrote:



F wrote:
On 07/07/2008 21:52 Ed Sirett wrote:
If only! English is a second language for one of the tenants (but her
command of English is far superior to my command of her language!) and
for her husband thinking seems to be a problem. Any conversation seems
to revolve around them telling me what the other one thinks and then
them blaming each other for what was said. It's really not very
efficient or rewarding.

Can you get your own interpreter to go with you?

I don't want to be locked into a new six month period as I might need to
give them notice and sell up sooner.

If they're on the periodic notice period and you give them two months
notice, and they don't remove, then you have to give them further notice
of your intention to seek a court order, then wait for a court hearing,
then hope you've got grounds for possession as stated in the lease and
notified to the tenant before they signed. The court will probably allow
another 28 days in the order. If they don't comply with the order, go
back to court again.......

WTF? *Serve a Section 21 (4)(a) - this is mandatory posession. *If you
serve a S28 if there are rent arrears or other reasons (Ground 17 -
lying on a tenancy application form for example) it may not be
mandatory and they are in fact easy to beat by bringing arrears to
below two months owed. *If your Section 21 the judge (in theory) has
to grant posssession. *[1]

You never need to state a reason to the court for Section 21 notice.

If the tenancy is not periodic (eg during the fixed term) the notice
has to be Section 21 (1)(b). *Get the dates right as it is easy to
screw it up.

[1] *In theory. *There is a case going through at the moment where the
tenant became disabled and lost their job. *LL served section 21 and
it has been argued that the S21 is not valid as it discriminates (eg
the only reason the tenant was being asked to leave was not paying the
rent, which only happened because they became disabled). *This could
have an impact on notices to quit, even thought you do not need to
give a reason for a S21 notice.

Feck. - that should be S8, not S28 (not sure how I hit "2" as it
isn't even close on the keyboard)

On Wed, 09 Jul 2008 20:27:29 +0100, Rod wrote:

Owain wrote:
Ed Sirett wrote:
9) Requesting a rent holiday for Ramadan.
That's chutzpa!
^^^^^^^ Wrong faith group there.

I know :-)


I'm told that it's easy to comply with both halal and kosher rules at
the same time. :-)

Indeed so, but don't tell either lot that.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html