As my regular readers (?!) will know, recently I decided to set up the
airing cupboard as a laundry-drying cupboard by installing a
dehumidifier in there.

It only arrived this morning so it's still in its 24-hr limbo before I'm
allowed to fire it up, or apparently the compressor will explode. Or
something.

Anyway, am a bit disapppointed in the size of the water reservoir, which
looks like it will take about half a cupful of water. The machine was
advertised as a "10-litre" model which sounded plenty - however, if I'd
stopped to think about it, I'd have realised that's a couple of gallons
which is a larger volume than occupied by the dehumidifier itself. Duh.
Apparently "10-litre" means it will suck 10 litres of water per day
out of the atmosphere. Of course.

Getting to the point now... Since this model has the facility for
continuous draining, it would be nice to make use of that, wouldn't it?
Now, right next to the dehumdifier is my unvented HW cylinder,
complete with its safety valve/tundish arrangement which connects to the
exterior, across the landing, via a 22mm copper piper. So, I'm just
wondering if there is any way I'd be able to make use of this without
breaking regs or compromising the safety of the HW cylinder?

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.

So, would this be allowed? It would be much easier than ripping up the
landing carpet/floor to run a dedicated drain...

David




overflow from cylinder ________
| | SIDE |
| | VIEW |
x existing tundish position |________|
|
|
|
|
| drain point for
| dehumidifier
x proposed new tundish |
| |
| |
|---------------------------------
|
|
|
| common drain to exterior.

Lobster wrote:

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.

Not quite sure I follow that - whay would you need to move the tundish
in order to tee into the pipe below it?


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:
Lobster wrote:

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m
high to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a
tee into the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short
vertical run into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the
dehumidifier would be tucked. Diagram below.

Not quite sure I follow that - whay would you need to move the tundish
in order to tee into the pipe below it?

Well, just that the dehumdifier, sitting on the floor, will need to
drain into a receptacle no more than about 40 cm off the floor, and if
boiling water were ever to be pouring at a high rate into the
currently-positioned tundish, then the dehumidifier drain could
presumably be an alternative route for the water to emerge rather than
routing it safely outside. So I was thinking, tundish should at least
be lower than the dehumidifier drain.

Lobster formulated on Monday :
As my regular readers (?!) will know, recently I decided to set up the airing
cupboard as a laundry-drying cupboard by installing a dehumidifier in there.

1. Could you not raise the dehumidifier to a height where it can drain
directly into the tun-dish?

Failing that..

2. An a/c condensate pump would be able to pump the water from the
dehumidifier level up to the tun-dish.

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.


ISTR there's regulations about the distance from the PT relief valve down to the tundish.
Let me look up my megaflo installation manual...

G3 GUIDANCE SECTION 3.9
The discharge pipe (D1) from the vessel up to and including the tundish is generally supplied by the
manufacturer of the hot water storage system. Where otherwise, the installation should include the
discharge pipe(s) (D1) from the safety device(s). In either case the tundish should be vertical,
located in the same space as the unvented hot water storage system and be fitted as close as
possible and within 500mm of the safety device e.g. the temperature relief valve.

--
Ron

On 12 May, 18:20, "Ron Lowe" ronATlowe-famlyDOTmeDOTukSPURIOUS
wrote:
To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. *Diagram below.

ISTR there's regulations about the distance from the PT relief valve down to the tundish.
Let me look up my megaflo installation manual...

G3 GUIDANCE SECTION 3.9

D1 is the pipe from pressure relief valves (PRV) to the tundish.
D2 is the pipe from tundish.

D2 should have a minimum of 300mm straight vertical drop after the
tundish before the first bend.

Bear in mind that if the PRV or T&PRV operates (very unlikely, God
forbid, etc..) it has mains water pressure and flow rates behind it.
It is very like opening a valve on the mains, mainly because it is a
valve on the mains. The tundish should convey the discharge of any one
valve at full-bore safely to outside without flooding chez Lobster.
The valves should be proved by opening them, at full-bore, during
commissioning. Not many do. Sticking things in the tundish won't help.

Ron Lowe wrote:

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.

ISTR there's regulations about the distance from the PT relief valve
down to the tundish.

tundish should be* vertical,
located in the same space as the unvented hot water storage system and
be fitted as close as
possible and *within 500mm of the safety device* e.g. the temperature
relief valve.

OK, so if I moved the tundish downwards, it'd fail the above spec, so
that's out.

Harry's suggestion about the a/c pump is interesting though - I know
nothing about them but if that worked it would mean I could leave the
tundish where it is, and interpose my tee below it. (But wouldn't the
dehumidifier object to the head of pressure on its output?)

Given that the dehumidifier spec is 10L/day, that's 7 ml/min which could
potentially already be trickling down the discharge pipe at such time
when I have my proverbial catastrophic failure, and end up with
mains-pressure boiling water (20 L/min?) pouring down the tundish (ie,
~3,000 times as much as produced ny the dehumidifier) - ie the presence
of the dehumidifier output is totally trivial, right?

So it looks to me that providing I don't alter the height of the
tundish, my idea should be OK...???

David

Lobster wrote :
Ron Lowe wrote:

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.

ISTR there's regulations about the distance from the PT relief valve down
to the tundish.

tundish should be* vertical,
located in the same space as the unvented hot water storage system and be
fitted as close as
possible and *within 500mm of the safety device* e.g. the temperature
relief valve.

OK, so if I moved the tundish downwards, it'd fail the above spec, so that's
out.

Harry's suggestion about the a/c pump is interesting though - I know nothing
about them but if that worked it would mean I could leave the tundish where
it is, and interpose my tee below it. (But wouldn't the dehumidifier object
to the head of pressure on its output?)

Given that the dehumidifier spec is 10L/day, that's 7 ml/min which could
potentially already be trickling down the discharge pipe at such time when I
have my proverbial catastrophic failure, and end up with mains-pressure
boiling water (20 L/min?) pouring down the tundish (ie, ~3,000 times as much
as produced ny the dehumidifier) - ie the presence of the dehumidifier output
is totally trivial, right?

So it looks to me that providing I don't alter the height of the tundish, my
idea should be OK...???

The amount from the dehumidifier is trivial by comparison, a slow drip.
The pipe from a pump could be simply clipped onto the tun-dish.

There are various types of condensate pump with differing methods of
them being turned on...

Some simply pump all the time they have a supply, some sense when a
probe senses water (in a tray), some have a built in float switch and
require the water to be able to fill up their chamber with water
-gravity feed, some can self prime - pump situated higher than the
water level.

--
Regards,
Harry (M1BYT) (L)
http://www.ukradioamateur.co.uk

On 12 May, 20:29, Harry Bloomfield
wrote:

The amount from the dehumidifier is trivial by comparison, a slow drip.
The pipe from a pump could be simply clipped onto the tun-dish.

I meant that a pipe might cause an obstruction, not the liquid.

So, I'm just
wondering if there is any way I'd be able to make use of this without
breaking regs or compromising the safety of the HW cylinder?

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.


Do not move existing tun dish. Max 500mm from cylinder to tundish is a
reg.

Without checking I suspect there are a number of regs that would be
breached.

what about a condensate pump and share the existing tundish?


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

On 12 May, 21:00, Ed Sirett wrote:
*So, I'm just

wondering if there is any way I'd be able to make use of this without
breaking regs or compromising the safety of the HW cylinder?

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. *Diagram below.

Do *not move existing tun dish. Max 500mm from cylinder to tundish is a
reg.

Without checking I suspect there are a number of regs that would be
breached.

what about a condensate pump and share the existing tundish?

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is athttp://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ *http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQhttp://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html
Choosing a Boiler FAQhttp://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/BoilerChoice.html

To avoid any possibility of boiling water backing up AND avoid the
result of discharging 10 litres an hour of water out of the D2 pipe
onto a path, soil etc why not use the aircon condensate pump and pump
the condensate into a soil stack via a washing machine trap?

"Ed Sirett" wrote in message
...
So, I'm just
wondering if there is any way I'd be able to make use of this without
breaking regs or compromising the safety of the HW cylinder?

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run
into which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be
tucked. Diagram below.


Do not move existing tun dish. Max 500mm from cylinder to tundish is a
reg.

Without checking I suspect there are a number of regs that would be
breached.

If the T&P valve opened scalding water could work its way back to the
humidifier. I can't see anything wrong with a tundish and HepVO trap on the
unvented cylinder and one also on the humidifier and a wider bore plastic
pipe after the tee. Then no backflow.

My mate installed a dehunifier in his airing cupboard, vented to landing, as
he suffered horrendous condensation upstairs due to having stairs enter
directly into the lounge.

He initially thought I will empty as necessary, but it soon filled so set
about piping it. In the end he managed to get a 19mm overflow sized pipe
through rear of airing cuboard through narrow roof space and empties out
into a gutter. Worked well.

However the biggest problem was the noise keeping everyone awake. Put it on
a time clock and condensation returned.

However he replaced it with an Amber Dry Absorption dehumidifier (about
£200) and it is silent as well as using considerably less electricity I
think is available with a pump so you can feed the waste water through a
trap made out of 19mm pipe thus preventing cold outside are entering via the
waste pipe.

Anyway doesn't need it now, as he had all the house windows replaced, all
now with trickle vents and now doesn't suffer any condensation at all.

ian

"Lobster" wrote in message
...
As my regular readers (?!) will know, recently I decided to set up the
airing cupboard as a laundry-drying cupboard by installing a dehumidifier
in there.

It only arrived this morning so it's still in its 24-hr limbo before I'm
allowed to fire it up, or apparently the compressor will explode. Or
something.

Anyway, am a bit disapppointed in the size of the water reservoir, which
looks like it will take about half a cupful of water. The machine was
advertised as a "10-litre" model which sounded plenty - however, if I'd
stopped to think about it, I'd have realised that's a couple of gallons
which is a larger volume than occupied by the dehumidifier itself. Duh.
Apparently "10-litre" means it will suck 10 litres of water per day out of
the atmosphere. Of course.

Getting to the point now... Since this model has the facility for
continuous draining, it would be nice to make use of that, wouldn't it?
Now, right next to the dehumdifier is my unvented HW cylinder, complete
with its safety valve/tundish arrangement which connects to the exterior,
across the landing, via a 22mm copper piper. So, I'm just wondering if
there is any way I'd be able to make use of this without breaking regs or
compromising the safety of the HW cylinder?

To do so, I'd have to bring the existing tundish down from about 1m high
to 30 cm off the floor (is that in itself allowed?), and add a tee into
the 22mm copper below the tundish, connected to a short vertical run into
which the 0.5" plastic drain hose from the dehumidifier would be tucked.
Diagram below.

So, would this be allowed? It would be much easier than ripping up the
landing carpet/floor to run a dedicated drain...

David




overflow from cylinder ________
| | SIDE |
| | VIEW |
x existing tundish position |________|
|
|
|
|
| drain point for
| dehumidifier
x proposed new tundish |
| |
| |
|---------------------------------
|
|
|
| common drain to exterior.

"Ian_m" wrote in message
...
My mate installed a dehunifier in his airing cupboard, vented to landing,
as he suffered horrendous condensation upstairs due to having stairs enter
directly into the lounge.

He initially thought I will empty as necessary, but it soon filled so set
about piping it. In the end he managed to get a 19mm overflow sized pipe
through rear of airing cuboard through narrow roof space and empties out
into a gutter. Worked well.

However the biggest problem was the noise keeping everyone awake. Put it
on a time clock and condensation returned.

However he replaced it with an Amber Dry Absorption dehumidifier (about
£200) and it is silent as well as using considerably less electricity I
think is available with a pump so you can feed the waste water through a
trap made out of 19mm pipe thus preventing cold outside are entering via
the waste pipe.

Anyway doesn't need it now, as he had all the house windows replaced, all
now with trickle vents and now doesn't suffer any condensation at all.

He should have had sealed windows with no trickle venst and fit a heat
recovery and vent unit in the loft. Fresh air coming in pre-heated from
outgoing air, with no cross contamination, using a 40w fan motor.