The message
from (Andrew Gabriel) contains these words:

Oh yes it has. Dribble (or Adam as he was then) didn't arrive on the
scene until much later. 2000 at a guess but it might have been even
later.

He started off as John Burns-Curtis.

I don't think he ever posted in this ng under that name and I am sure
Adam denied any connection but as the silly bugger actually e-mailed me
under that name within a few weeks of surfacing as Adam I am sure it
really is he. Whether that is his real name is another question
entirely.

A google seach brings up only 7 hits and one of these is his fawning
review of 'Who owns Britain'.

--
Roger Chapman

On Mar 7, 9:58 am, Mark wrote:
On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 11:13:20 +0000, John Rumm

wrote:
Bob Eager wrote:

Cor, the year after I left school ;-)

Oops, found one for when you were at school!

http://tinyurl.com/22ty8d

A blast from the past... my Internode ltd co-director for wrote a BCPL
compiler many years ago (in basic on an Atari 800). It worked but was
rather slow, so he then re-wrote it in BCPL and used it to compile
itself etc.

IME that's the "normal" way to write compilers.

But not the normal way to port a BCPL compiler. If I remember
correctly, there was a (portable) front end that produced an
intermediate code, and all you had to do was write a tool to turn the
intermediate code into machine code. The trick was that actually
there were /two/ intermediate codes - a very simple one that was easy
to interpret, and a more complex one that was easier to optimize.

Your "BCPL porting kit" contained a version of the compiler compiled
to the simple code, and you had to write a machine code generator for
the simple code in whatever tool was to hand (eg basic). That gave
you a working BCPL compiler, with which you could write a machine code
generator for the complex code - in BCPL.

See http://www.gtoal.com/languages/bcpl/...pl/booting.txt for
more details than one might reasonably want :-)

(Sigh: I still wish DMR had include VALOF in C ...)

On Fri, 7 Mar 2008 13:23:45 UTC, Martin Bonner
wrote:

On Mar 7, 9:58 am, Mark wrote:
On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 11:13:20 +0000, John Rumm

wrote:
Bob Eager wrote:

Cor, the year after I left school ;-)

Oops, found one for when you were at school!

http://tinyurl.com/22ty8d

A blast from the past... my Internode ltd co-director for wrote a BCPL
compiler many years ago (in basic on an Atari 800). It worked but was
rather slow, so he then re-wrote it in BCPL and used it to compile
itself etc.

IME that's the "normal" way to write compilers.

But not the normal way to port a BCPL compiler. If I remember
correctly, there was a (portable) front end that produced an
intermediate code, and all you had to do was write a tool to turn the
intermediate code into machine code. The trick was that actually
there were /two/ intermediate codes - a very simple one that was easy
to interpret, and a more complex one that was easier to optimize.

Your "BCPL porting kit" contained a version of the compiler compiled
to the simple code, and you had to write a machine code generator for
the simple code in whatever tool was to hand (eg basic). That gave
you a working BCPL compiler, with which you could write a machine code
generator for the complex code - in BCPL.

Yup, done it more times than I care to remember!

See http://www.gtoal.com/languages/bcpl/...pl/booting.txt for
more details than one might reasonably want :-)

I forgot about Graham (he and I are both involved in a computer history
project)

(Sigh: I still wish DMR had include VALOF in C ...)

I concur.
--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
http://www.diybanter.com

In message , Andrew Gabriel
writes
In article ,
Roger writes:
The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

LOL. Looking at the first archived post for '95, nothing has changed.

Oh yes it has. Dribble (or Adam as he was then) didn't arrive on the
scene until much later. 2000 at a guess but it might have been even
later.

He started off as John Burns-Curtis.

Ask Cynic - he answered dIMM's first post IIRC


--
geoff

Mark wrote:
On Thu, 06 Mar 2008 11:13:20 +0000, John Rumm
wrote:

Bob Eager wrote:

Cor, the year after I left school ;-)
Oops, found one for when you were at school!

http://tinyurl.com/22ty8d
A blast from the past... my Internode ltd co-director for wrote a BCPL
compiler many years ago (in basic on an Atari 800). It worked but was
rather slow, so he then re-wrote it in BCPL and used it to compile
itself etc.

IME that's the "normal" way to write compilers.

Yup, partly why he did it ;-)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Martin Bonner wrote:

SNIP


(Sigh: I still wish DMR had include VALOF in C ...)

Thats what I love/hate about computers. People who understand them & speak
a language I simply don't understand.

:-)


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Martin Bonner wrote:

SNIP

(Sigh: I still wish DMR had include VALOF in C ...)

Thats what I love/hate about computers. People who understand them & speak
a language I simply don't understand.

:-)

Translation:

He wishes that Denis Macalister Richie (co-inventor of the C programming
language) had included an operator that carried out the same function as
one present in the BCPL programming language called VALOF.

VALOF in an operator which can be used to evaluate an expression and
find its result. Often used to define the inner workings of a user
defined function in BCPL[1]

[1] Speaking as a non BCPL programmer, this in itself does not sound
particularly exciting, but it may be that you can do other clever stuff
like evaluate expressions not defined at compile time - something
traditionally quite difficult to do in most compiled languages. Perhaps
someone could confirm?

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 01:39:00 UTC, John Rumm
wrote:

VALOF in an operator which can be used to evaluate an expression and
find its result. Often used to define the inner workings of a user
defined function in BCPL[1]

[1] Speaking as a non BCPL programmer, this in itself does not sound
particularly exciting, but it may be that you can do other clever stuff
like evaluate expressions not defined at compile time - something
traditionally quite difficult to do in most compiled languages. Perhaps
someone could confirm?

Yes.

For example:

let func(x) = valof
{ /* arbitrary code, including other function calls,
leaving final result in
(say) a variable called 'fred' */

resultis fred
}


--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
http://www.diybanter.com

"Bob Eager" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 01:39:00 UTC, John Rumm
wrote:

VALOF in an operator which can be used to evaluate an expression and
find its result. Often used to define the inner workings of a user
defined function in BCPL[1]

[1] Speaking as a non BCPL programmer, this in itself does not sound
particularly exciting, but it may be that you can do other clever stuff
like evaluate expressions not defined at compile time - something
traditionally quite difficult to do in most compiled languages. Perhaps
someone could confirm?

Yes.

For example:

let func(x) = valof
{ /* arbitrary code, including other function calls,
leaving final result in
(say) a variable called 'fred' */

resultis fred
}

Which I'm guessing needs a compiler (or at least subset thereof) in your
runtime, hence unpopularity? Definitely not 'C' at all.

(nowadays of course you have scripting languages accessible from your
compiled code to do this..)

cheers,
clive

Bob Eager wrote:
On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 01:39:00 UTC, John Rumm
wrote:

VALOF in an operator which can be used to evaluate an expression and
find its result. Often used to define the inner workings of a user
defined function in BCPL[1]

[1] Speaking as a non BCPL programmer, this in itself does not sound
particularly exciting, but it may be that you can do other clever stuff
like evaluate expressions not defined at compile time - something
traditionally quite difficult to do in most compiled languages. Perhaps
someone could confirm?

Yes.

For example:

let func(x) = valof
{ /* arbitrary code, including other function calls,
leaving final result in
(say) a variable called 'fred' */

resultis fred
}

Perhaps I am missing your point, but that still looks like a definition
of a static function at compile time.

I was thinking more along the lines of "eval" type operators that can
parse and evaluate the contents of a string read from file or the UI etc.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

John Rumm wrote:
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Martin Bonner wrote:

SNIP

(Sigh: I still wish DMR had include VALOF in C ...)

Thats what I love/hate about computers. People who understand them
& speak a language I simply don't understand.

:-)

Translation:

He wishes that Denis Macalister Richie (co-inventor of the C
programming language) had included an operator that carried out the
same function as one present in the BCPL programming language called
VALOF.
VALOF in an operator which can be used to evaluate an expression and
find its result. Often used to define the inner workings of a user
defined function in BCPL[1]

[1] Speaking as a non BCPL programmer, this in itself does not sound
particularly exciting, but it may be that you can do other clever
stuff like evaluate expressions not defined at compile time -
something traditionally quite difficult to do in most compiled
languages. Perhaps someone could confirm?


Thanks John its clear now. As mud :-)

I thought London Ambulance were bad for acronyms.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 01:52:36 UTC, "Clive George"
wrote:

For example:

let func(x) = valof
{ /* arbitrary code, including other function calls,
leaving final result in
(say) a variable called 'fred' */

resultis fred
}

Which I'm guessing needs a compiler (or at least subset thereof) in your
runtime, hence unpopularity? Definitely not 'C' at all.

No, not at all. Merely syntactic sugar. No penalty whatsoever. It's just
another way of expressing a function.

--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
http://www.diybanter.com

On Sat, 8 Mar 2008 02:00:36 UTC, John Rumm
wrote:

let func(x) = valof
{ /* arbitrary code, including other function calls,
leaving final result in
(say) a variable called 'fred' */

resultis fred
}

Perhaps I am missing your point, but that still looks like a definition
of a static function at compile time.

It is. But you can use it in other places:

x = valof { some code }

anywhere in the program.
--
The information contained in this post is copyright the
poster, and specifically may not be published in, or used by
http://www.diybanter.com

Don't know... John S was about then, he might...

Uh? Eh? [wakes with start]

not me, I'm a newbie, only been here since the mid-90s :-)

--
John Stumbles

A: Because it messes up the order in which people read text.
Q: Why is top-posting a bad thing?

John Stumbles wrote:
Don't know... John S was about then, he might...

Uh? Eh? [wakes with start]

not me, I'm a newbie, only been here since the mid-90s :-)

that is when uk.d-i-y started ;-)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Wed, 05 Mar 2008 08:37:44 GMT
"The Medway Handyman" wrote:

As a relative newbie to this group, I was wondering, how did it all start?

Who got it off the ground in the first place?

I understand it pre dates e- groups like Yahoo?

Just interested.



Come back Barry Bucknell, all is forgiven.

R.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Roger
writes
The message
from geoff contains these words:


So can anyone find my first post?

it would have been as and it was spam

16/2/98

"We recondition PCBs fans, time clocks and actuators (and descale heat
exchangers) for central heating boilers. Compare the prices with new
items. We also give a 12 month guarantee. We have been trading for five
years and have built up a good reputation and provide a professional
service"

Apologies for reposting spam. :-)

Ah - that's the one

so that's my 10th anniversary in 10 days time then ...

scary !

Maxie, amazing. You have been pestering people for 10 years.

"Roger" wrote in message
k...
The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

LOL. Looking at the first archived post for '95, nothing has changed.

Oh yes it has. Dribble (or Adam as he was then) didn't arrive on the
scene until much later. 2000 at a guess but it might have been even
later.

Mine was 18 July 2005.

Doctor Drivel wrote:

"Roger" wrote in message
k...
The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

LOL. Looking at the first archived post for '95, nothing has changed.

Oh yes it has. Dribble (or Adam as he was then) didn't arrive on the
scene until much later. 2000 at a guess but it might have been even
later.

Mine was 18 July 2005.

Your what was 2005?

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...c96d8117e3af2b

and before that we had:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.p...fdd4110d5cf778

Don't know who you posted as before that...

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

Doctor Drivel wrote:

Mine was 18 July 2005.

But Google records your famous question

"Is this linear speed in cubic metres per second?"

as having been posted on 12th January 2000.
[http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...8822125a4b4ec]

--
Andy

"Andy Wade" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Mine was 18 July 2005.

But Google records your famous question

"Is this linear speed in cubic metres per second?"

as having been posted on 12th January 2000.
[http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...8822125a4b4ec]

--
Andy

I am Doctor Drivel, it says so. Cor! What do you expect from a Lecky nerd!!

In message , John Rumm
writes
Doctor Drivel wrote:
"Roger" wrote in message
.uk...
The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

LOL. Looking at the first archived post for '95, nothing has changed.

Oh yes it has. Dribble (or Adam as he was then) didn't arrive on the
scene until much later. 2000 at a guess but it might have been even
later.
Mine was 18 July 2005.

Your what was 2005?

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...a06cb7cc6996d2
f8/4fc96d8117e3af2b?hl=en#4fc96d8117e3af2b

and before that we had:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.p...se_frm/thread/
750d3252bfe1ab16/5ffdd4110d5cf778?hl=en&lnk=st&q=#5ffdd4110d5cf778

Don't know who you posted as before that...

There was some basic thermodynamics question which he asked Cynic -
which was the first one that he (C) recalls

even more basic than not using a hacksaw in an inappropriate manner

--
geoff

In message , Doctor Drivel
writes

"Andy Wade" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Mine was 18 July 2005.

But Google records your famous question

"Is this linear speed in cubic metres per second?"

as having been posted on 12th January 2000.
[http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...8822125a4b4ec]

-- Andy

I am Doctor Drivel, it says so.

I think you need to ask the specialist about that medication you're on


--
geoff

In message , Doctor Drivel
writes

"Andy Wade" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Mine was 18 July 2005.

But Google records your famous question

"Is this linear speed in cubic metres per second?"

as having been posted on 12th January 2000.
[http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...8822125a4b4ec]

-- Andy

I am Doctor Drivel,


One thing's for sure

You're too frit to post using your true identity anymore

--
geoff

John Rumm wrote:

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

the first post that I can find under the "Adam" persona here was 28 Nov
1999.

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...81cb7c879371f0

And the first one showing in any group was to alt.history.british

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.h...683b3c1eb03b36

Anyway a bit of research suggests that Drivel is in fact Adam
Lester-George who used to crib homework from anyone stupid enough to
answer his questions (both Adam and Adam L-G shared domain names and IP
addresses from the same block).

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.animals.dog/msg/2c59d124d26e5374
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.b.../bce369385e13a
811

The worrying thing is that means that it is likely that nowadays Mr
Lester-George is a psychology student. If that's true, I'd like to meet
him and kick his balls into mush, if I could find them, that is.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Doctor Drivel
writes

"Andy Wade" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Mine was 18 July 2005.

But Google records your famous question

"Is this linear speed in cubic metres per second?"

as having been posted on 12th January 2000.
[http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...8822125a4b4ec]

-- Andy

I am Doctor Drivel, it says so.

I think you need to ask the specialist about that medication you're on

Maxie, I did. And he said the Rennes from Boots are OK.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Doctor Drivel
writes

"Andy Wade" wrote in message
...
Doctor Drivel wrote:

Mine was 18 July 2005.

But Google records your famous question

"Is this linear speed in cubic metres per second?"

as having been posted on 12th January 2000.
[http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...8822125a4b4ec]

-- Andy

I am Doctor Drivel,


One thing's for sure

You're too frit to post using your true identity anymore

Maxie, I am Doctor Drivel. Maxie, you must behave.

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , John Rumm
writes
Doctor Drivel wrote:
"Roger" wrote in message
k...
The message

from "Man at B&Q" contains these words:

LOL. Looking at the first archived post for '95, nothing has changed.

Oh yes it has. Dribble (or Adam as he was then) didn't arrive on the
scene until much later. 2000 at a guess but it might have been even
later.
Mine was 18 July 2005.

Your what was 2005?

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...a06cb7cc6996d2
f8/4fc96d8117e3af2b?hl=en#4fc96d8117e3af2b

and before that we had:

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.p...se_frm/thread/
750d3252bfe1ab16/5ffdd4110d5cf778?hl=en&lnk=st&q=#5ffdd4110d5cf778

Don't know who you posted as before that...

There was some basic thermodynamics question which he asked Cynic - which
was the first one that he (C) recalls

even more basic than not using a hacksaw in an inappropriate manner

Maxie, what do you do with hacksaws? Do you cut the branches away so you
can climb up the trees on the beach?

"Steve Firth" wrote in message
. ..
John Rumm wrote:

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

the first

This man is clearly mad. All sorts of post about his insanity all over the
Internet. And he hasn't been locked up yet.

In message , Steve Firth
writes
John Rumm wrote:

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

the first post that I can find under the "Adam" persona here was 28 Nov
1999.

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...81cb7c879371f0

And the first one showing in any group was to alt.history.british

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.h...683b3c1eb03b36

Anyway a bit of research suggests that Drivel is in fact Adam
Lester-George

not Burns-Curtiss?


who used to crib homework from anyone stupid enough to
answer his questions (both Adam and Adam L-G shared domain names and IP
addresses from the same block).

The worrying thing is that means that it is likely that nowadays Mr
Lester-George is a psychology student.

you mean case study ?

If that's true, I'd like to meet
him and kick his balls into mush, if I could find them, that is.

--
geoff

"geoff" wrote in message
...
In message , Steve Firth
writes
John Rumm wrote:

Two combis made an appearance long before that:

the first post that I can find under the "Adam" persona here was 28 Nov
1999.

http://groups.google.com/group/uk.d-...81cb7c879371f0

And the first one showing in any group was to alt.history.british

http://groups.google.com/group/alt.h...683b3c1eb03b36

Anyway a bit of research suggests that Drivel is in fact Adam
Lester-George

not Burns-Curtiss?


who used to crib homework from anyone stupid enough to
answer his questions (both Adam and Adam L-G shared domain names and IP
addresses from the same block).

The worrying thing is that means that it is likely that nowadays Mr
Lester-George is a psychology student.

you mean case study ?

If that's true, I'd like to meet
him and kick his balls into mush, if I could find them, that is.

Maxie, do you think the dog should be set on this plantpot? One that chews
his googlies?