UK diy (uk.d-i-y) For the discussion of all topics related to diy (do-it-yourself) in the UK. All levels of experience and proficency are welcome to join in to ask questions or offer solutions.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 418
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20 x10 cm
blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use kiln dried
sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement mixture and deprive
weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without digging out all
the sand.

Any comments?

Tim


  #2   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 100
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20 x10 cm
blocks).


Sorry cannot answer your Q.
but did you do the job yourself? is it easy for a competent DIY'er?
--
Vass


  #3   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 418
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?



Vass wrote:
"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20
x10 cm blocks).


Sorry cannot answer your Q.
but did you do the job yourself?


All but sawing the main trunk of the tree I felled. (Had to get a man in
with a chainsaw).

http://www.zen31010.zen.co.uk/images/rowan.jpg

is it easy for a competent DIY'er?


Doubt I qualify as "competant". I'll post some pictures at the end and you
can make your own judgement. ;-)

Tim


  #4   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 229
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

On Jun 5, 10:30 am, "Tim Downie"
wrote:
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20 x10 cm
blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use kiln dried
sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement mixture and deprive
weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without digging out all
the sand.

Any comments?

Tim



try pavingexpert.com?

One problem with cement is the potential for staining but I guess it
depends what blocks you have.

  #5   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 418
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

adder1969 wrote:
On Jun 5, 10:30 am, "Tim Downie"
wrote:
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20
x10 cm blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is
the ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use
kiln dried sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement
mixture and deprive weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without
digging out all the sand.

Any comments?

Tim



try pavingexpert.com?


Thanks. I've just been looking at that link but it makes no mention of
sand/cement mixtures which, on reflection, don't really fit with the concept
of "flexibility" which is kind of inherent in any domestic blockpaving that
*isn't* laid on a solid base. Maybe I'll have to think again.


One problem with cement is the potential for staining but I guess it
depends what blocks you have.


Would a gallon of brick acid sloshed about deal with that?

Tim




  #6   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,045
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

Tim Downie wrote:
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20 x10 cm
blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use kiln dried
sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement mixture and deprive
weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without digging out all
the sand.

I used that, but the weeds still come.

But at least you can as you say pressure wash..

Any comments?

Tim


  #7   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,045
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

Tim Downie wrote:
adder1969 wrote:
On Jun 5, 10:30 am, "Tim Downie"
wrote:
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20
x10 cm blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is
the ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use
kiln dried sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement
mixture and deprive weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without
digging out all the sand.

Any comments?

Tim


try pavingexpert.com?


Thanks. I've just been looking at that link but it makes no mention of
sand/cement mixtures which, on reflection, don't really fit with the concept
of "flexibility" which is kind of inherent in any domestic blockpaving that
*isn't* laid on a solid base. Maybe I'll have to think again.


I used about 6:1 sand - sharp sand - and white cement - matches
sandstone quite well. It became equivalent to grouting tiles in methodology.

A couple of places have moved and cracked - when I get round tuit I'll
repack the cracks..



One problem with cement is the potential for staining but I guess it
depends what blocks you have.


Would a gallon of brick acid sloshed about deal with that?


Yup. Unless you used limestone slabs..

Tim


  #8   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,122
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

On 2007-06-05 10:30:17 +0100, "Tim Downie"
said:

I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20 x10 cm
blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use kiln dried
sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement mixture and deprive
weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without digging out all
the sand.

Any comments?

Tim


I think that if you read the oracles at pavingexpert.com, they will
tell you that if you are making a flexible drive (meaning MOT type 1
plus sand then blocks) that the gaps should be filled with sand only
and not with sand/cement.

There is a different procedure entirely for making a rigid drive.
This is where the base is something firm such as concrete. Then the
blocks are laid and pointed. As much as anything, this is to keep
water away from the concrete base. This is not a common technique at
all for domestic drives.

Having said all of that, I had a new drive laid just before Christmas
using handmade bricks. This has been done on a flexible basis and
has worked very well indeed. A few points on this -

- The jointing sand must be completely dry before use. If water
penetrates the bag, it's useless because you need the sand to trickle
finely into the gaps.

- Likewise the blocks themselves. They need to be dry, so a good 2-3
days without rain before jointing is good.

One issue that I have had is that there is a soldier course of bricks
(approx 250mm) immediately in front of the garage door. In front of
it, across the whole width, there is an Arco drain (strip drain) to
prevent water reaching the garage from the slope of the drive.
However, when it rains heavily against the door, wuit a bit of water
tends to flow from the door side towards the drain along the joins of
the soldier course, as a result tending to wash out the sand. In
order to address this, when I refilled the gaps I mixed in a little
cement with the jointing sand. This was poured very carefully into
the joints using a cakemaking icing bag so that none would appear on
the surface.
I then made a couple of very light passes with a plant sprayer. This
has worked well in that the material has not washed out. However,
doing this on the scale of an entire drive would be several days work
and not a good idea anyway.

As to the weeds.... I have found that a spraying of the whole drive
with Pathclear in mid March has worked well. It's supposed to last for
the season, but I don't mind doing it again if not.

I wouldn't want to pressure wash a drive anyway - destroys the character.





  #9   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,230
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

Tim Downie wrote:
adder1969 wrote:
On Jun 5, 10:30 am, "Tim Downie"
wrote:
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20
x10 cm blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is
the ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use
kiln dried sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement
mixture and deprive weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without
digging out all the sand.

Any comments?

Tim


try pavingexpert.com?


Thanks. I've just been looking at that link but it makes no mention of
sand/cement mixtures which, on reflection, don't really fit with the concept
of "flexibility" which is kind of inherent in any domestic blockpaving that
*isn't* laid on a solid base. Maybe I'll have to think again.

One problem with cement is the potential for staining but I guess it
depends what blocks you have.


Would a gallon of brick acid sloshed about deal with that?

Tim



All depends on the size of the gaps. Cement isn't going to set with any
strength in small cracks.
  #10   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 25,191
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

I used that, but the weeds still come.


They will grow in the crud that falls onto the paving over time anyway...

But at least you can as you say pressure wash..


You can do that with sand fill so long as you keep the angle of
application shallow.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/


  #11   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
LSR LSR is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 129
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

Tim Downie wrote:
... Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps....

Tim


Does anyone make a fine-powdered persistent weedkiller that you could
"dilute" with kiln-dried sand and brush in to the gaps? That would be much
more useful than sprays like Pathclear; most of that gets wasted on the
blocks.

--
LSR


  #12   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 418
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

LSR wrote:
Tim Downie wrote:
... Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving
is the ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps....

Tim


Does anyone make a fine-powdered persistent weedkiller that you could
"dilute" with kiln-dried sand and brush in to the gaps?


Salt?

Probably too soluble and biblical though. ;-)

Tim


  #13   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 25
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?


"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20 x10 cm
blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.

I know that the recommended way of "setting" the blocks in to use kiln
dried sand but is there any reason not to use a sand/cement mixture and
deprive weeds of a chance to get rooted in the gaps?

This would also mean I could pressure wash the drive without digging out
all the sand.

Any comments?

Tim


Sand only, sand/cement *WILL* stain concrete blocks
Brick acid will clean the cement stains off, but will also etch the surface
of the blocks and expose the aggregate - highly variable results, and it
will affect the colour.

Use weedkiller annually, or a stiff broom to remove the weeds & crud. They
only grow in the surface of the joints, as the blocks shoudl be too tightly
fitted to allow weed growth from below.

SalesGuy


  #14   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8,319
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

Tim Downie wrote:
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20
x10 cm blocks).

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.


http://www.wickes.co.uk/invt/227769


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257


  #15   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,560
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

Tim Downie wrote:

Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.


There are 2 types of adhesive sand for this. One sticks to itself
only, and the much more expensive type also sticks to the blocks, and
lasts much better.


NT



  #17   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 9,560
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?

On 6 Jun, 11:55, Stuart Noble wrote:
wrote:
Tim Downie wrote:


Something that has always annoyed me about the old block paving is the
ability of weeds to set up home in all the gaps.


There are 2 types of adhesive sand for this. One sticks to itself
only, and the much more expensive type also sticks to the blocks, and
lasts much better.


NT


Never heard of adhesive sand. Details?


You brush it in, and it sets like glued sand. Its just a more durable
replacement for sand, and doesnt stain like cement.

http://www.pavingexpert.com/point02.htm


NT

  #18   Report Post  
Posted to uk.d-i-y
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 418
Default Block paving question. Sand or sand/cement for the gaps?



Vass wrote:
"Tim Downie" wrote in message
...
I'm widening my driveway and laying more block paving (standard 20
x10 cm blocks).


Sorry cannot answer your Q.
but did you do the job yourself? is it easy for a competent DIY'er?


Based on my experience today, I'd say - Get a man in!

Getting everything levelled & smoothed off is *much* harder than I thought
it was going to be. Cutting blocks is a pain.

Part of the problem is that I'm adding to an existing driveway and the drive
has both positive and negative curves (i.e. humps and hollows). In an ideal
world I would rip the whole lot up and re-lay it all flat but that's more
work than I'm prepared to do.

Tim


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules

Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Sand:Cement:Lime mix paul UK diy 12 July 31st 06 09:19 PM
Block paving - in between the gaps icornish UK diy 11 August 25th 05 11:18 AM
cement and river sand??? Steve UK diy 9 May 1st 05 10:22 AM
sand cement render Tim Smith UK diy 13 April 11th 05 12:55 PM
Sand or Cement? Pet @ www.gymratz.co.uk UK diy 0 March 27th 05 07:34 PM


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:46 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2023 DIYbanter.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about DIY & home improvement"