My boiler seems to be leaking from the heat exchanger.

Is replacement within the DIY capability - no areas of gas control are
involved in the job as far as I can tell.


Ta Richard



--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

"rjs" wrote in message
...
My boiler seems to be leaking from the heat exchanger.

Is replacement within the DIY capability - no areas of gas control are
involved in the job as far as I can tell.


Ta Richard

Very probably, see if you can source the part on the web first, assuming it
is the heat exchanger that is corroded, and not just a loose nut. You will
need
to drain the primary loop first, as water will gush out when you remove the
exchanger, and fill it back up + corrosion inhibitor when finished.

Eyeball the job before you start, make sure you know what needs to be done,
make the boiler safe i.e. switch off the electricity supply to it if it uses
one etc.

If you give the details of your boiler someone might be able to offer more
specific info.

Andy.

andrewpreece wrote:


Very probably, see if you can source the part on the web first, assuming it
is the heat exchanger that is corroded, and not just a loose nut. You will
need
to drain the primary loop first, as water will gush out when you remove the
exchanger, and fill it back up + corrosion inhibitor when finished.

Eyeball the job before you start, make sure you know what needs to be done,
make the boiler safe i.e. switch off the electricity supply to it if it uses
one etc.

If you give the details of your boiler someone might be able to offer more
specific info.

Andy.






Thanks Andy.

It's a Potterton Suprima 100. I did post this info in another thread a
few hours before this one and wondered if the 'P' word had put potential
respondents off!

Looking at the unit and the installation/service instructions it seems
that *all* I have to do is remove; fan then burner then heat exchanger.
Then reverse the process. The gas control system is located away from
the area to be disturbed and is not touched.



I have found the heat exchanger at HRPC for £230 ish plus VAT.

I wonder if the leak would account for the steady but gradual drop in
pressure in the 5 years that the unit has been installed? I can't
believe so because I have topped up the system (via the pressure vessel)
with enough water, so it seems, to flood the room containing the boiler.
The only evidence of the leak is a very small pool in the bottom of
the case and a few drops outside. Any thoughts on this? There are no
ominous damp patches on ceilings anywhere in the house.

Cheers


Richard




--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

In message , rjs
writes
andrewpreece wrote:

Very probably, see if you can source the part on the web first,
assuming it
is the heat exchanger that is corroded, and not just a loose nut. You will
need
to drain the primary loop first, as water will gush out when you remove the
exchanger, and fill it back up + corrosion inhibitor when finished.
Eyeball the job before you start, make sure you know what needs to
be done,
make the boiler safe i.e. switch off the electricity supply to it if it uses
one etc.
If you give the details of your boiler someone might be able to
offer more
specific info.
Andy.



Thanks Andy.

It's a Potterton Suprima 100. I did post this info in another thread
a few hours before this one and wondered if the 'P' word had put
potential respondents off!

Looking at the unit and the installation/service instructions it seems
that *all* I have to do is remove; fan then burner then heat exchanger.
Then reverse the process. The gas control system is located away from
the area to be disturbed and is not touched.


Actually, with a new Suprima PCB costing a tad over £200 now, there are
probably a number of people ripping them out and replacing them with
something more reliable

You could be lucky


--
geoff

raden wrote:

In message , rjs



Actually, with a new Suprima PCB costing a tad over £200 now, there are
probably a number of people ripping them out and replacing them with
something more reliable

You could be lucky



The HRPC price for the heat exchanger does not seem excessive. I remade
all the joints on the PCB last year - so no more lock out problems. On
balance I'd rather fit a new HE rather than a secondhand one with
unknown lifespan or previous treatment.

Richard

--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

In message , rjs
writes
raden wrote:

In message , rjs




Actually, with a new Suprima PCB costing a tad over £200 now, there
are probably a number of people ripping them out and replacing them
with something more reliable
You could be lucky


The HRPC price for the heat exchanger does not seem excessive. I
remade all the joints on the PCB last year - so no more lock out
problems.

You think ?

ha ha


--
geoff

On Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:08:54 +0100, rjs wrote:






Thanks Andy.


I have found the heat exchanger at HRPC for £230 ish plus VAT.

I wonder if the leak would account for the steady but gradual drop in
pressure in the 5 years that the unit has been installed? I can't
believe so because I have topped up the system (via the pressure vessel)
with enough water, so it seems, to flood the room containing the boiler.
The only evidence of the leak is a very small pool in the bottom of
the case and a few drops outside. Any thoughts on this? There are no
ominous damp patches on ceilings anywhere in the house.


It's surprising how much water can leak from a fitting without making a
flood, this especially so in a boiler where there is extra heat and
ventilation to dry up any puddles.

IIRC the heat exchangers on Suprimas are Cast Iron and they are _heavy_.


--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at http://www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

"Ed Sirett" wrote in message
news
On Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:08:54 +0100, rjs wrote:






Thanks Andy.


I have found the heat exchanger at HRPC for £230 ish plus VAT.

I wonder if the leak would account for the steady but gradual drop in
pressure in the 5 years that the unit has been installed? I can't
believe so because I have topped up the system (via the pressure vessel)
with enough water, so it seems, to flood the room containing the boiler.
The only evidence of the leak is a very small pool in the bottom of
the case and a few drops outside. Any thoughts on this? There are no
ominous damp patches on ceilings anywhere in the house.


It's surprising how much water can leak from a fitting without making a
flood, this especially so in a boiler where there is extra heat and
ventilation to dry up any puddles.

IIRC the heat exchangers on Suprimas are Cast Iron and they are _heavy_.

I would ditch the Sprima, poor boilers, and get a good condensing boiler.

In article .uk,
Ed Sirett wrote:
IIRC the heat exchangers on Suprimas are Cast Iron and they are _heavy_.

Is it a one piece heat exchanger, or sections like Potterton used in some
models? I can't imagine a one piece type actually rusting through unless
badly abused, so perhaps it's gasket failure?

--
*Few women admit their age; fewer men act it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

raden wrote:


You think ?

ha ha



Well, a year on an no lock out since the resoldering compared with a
permanent fault seems fairly conclusive to me. Do you disagree?

And if it hasn't then at least I have postponed serious pocket damage by
a year.

Richard

--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article .uk,
Ed Sirett wrote:

IIRC the heat exchangers on Suprimas are Cast Iron and they are _heavy_.


Is it a one piece heat exchanger, or sections like Potterton used in some
models? I can't imagine a one piece type actually rusting through unless
badly abused, so perhaps it's gasket failure?



Thanks Ed, Dave


Yes, the heat exchanger is (apparently) a one piece cast iron item. The
thought of struggling that out and in of the enclosure has given me
pause for thought.

Having stared at the exchanger and gingerlly slid fingers around it I
can say that the third lobe (suitable name?) from the front is wet along
the bottom edge. There (appear) to be no leaks from the inlet and
outlet connections.

Any other checks before I splash the cash?

The possible source of abuse is the fact that the installer did not see
the need for inhibitor and I was stupid enough to go with his x years of
plumbing experience (and he's a CORGI bod).

TIA


Richard
--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

"rjs" wrote in message
...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article .uk,
Ed Sirett wrote:

IIRC the heat exchangers on Suprimas are Cast Iron and they are _heavy_.


Is it a one piece heat exchanger, or sections like Potterton used in some
models? I can't imagine a one piece type actually rusting through unless
badly abused, so perhaps it's gasket failure?



Thanks Ed, Dave


Yes, the heat exchanger is (apparently) a one piece cast iron item. The
thought of struggling that out and in of the enclosure has given me pause
for thought.

Having stared at the exchanger and gingerlly slid fingers around it I can
say that the third lobe (suitable name?) from the front is wet along the
bottom edge. There (appear) to be no leaks from the inlet and outlet
connections.

Any other checks before I splash the cash?

The possible source of abuse is the fact that the installer did not see
the need for inhibitor and I was stupid enough to go with his x years of
plumbing experience (and he's a CORGI bod).


The presence or lack of inhibitor in a cast iron heat exchanger is not
likely to have caused the problem. On the other hand any casting has a
potential for an imperfection which may reveal itself quite some time later.
I had an Ideal Classic which suffered a holed heat exchanger last year,
after three years running perfectly. Even though out of guarantee Ideal were
quite happy to provide a replacement, together with refractories, seals etc.
at no cost pending examination. They also agreed a standard replacement
labour charge of £150 to cover the job.
A few weeks after the leaking unit was returned to them they advised the
failure to have been a blow hole in the casting which had been plugged with
casting sand until lately and confirmed they would stand the costs.
I assume any presence of scale within the unit would have resulted in a
different answer as would signs of running "dry" (and I had flushed with
X400 then used Sentinel X100 inhibitor)

Depending on how old your unit is and the mood of the manufacturer you may
have some redress?

John wrote:



The presence or lack of inhibitor in a cast iron heat exchanger is not
likely to have caused the problem. On the other hand any casting has a
potential for an imperfection which may reveal itself quite some time later.
I had an Ideal Classic which suffered a holed heat exchanger last year,
after three years running perfectly. Even though out of guarantee Ideal were
quite happy to provide a replacement, together with refractories, seals etc.
at no cost pending examination. They also agreed a standard replacement
labour charge of £150 to cover the job.
A few weeks after the leaking unit was returned to them they advised the
failure to have been a blow hole in the casting which had been plugged with
casting sand until lately and confirmed they would stand the costs.
I assume any presence of scale within the unit would have resulted in a
different answer as would signs of running "dry" (and I had flushed with
X400 then used Sentinel X100 inhibitor)

Depending on how old your unit is and the mood of the manufacturer you may
have some redress?



Hi John

Potterton wouldn't even consider the possibility that their parts could
be faulty - Them: '1 year guarantee sir, can I transfer you to our
service dept' Me: 'click brrrrrrrrr'

After my Kickspace heater, having the narrowest pipework in the system,
stopped heating during winter 2003/4 I flushed the CH system twice and
extracted about two egg cups full of rusty particles (some quite large),
I then added X400 with a large dose of prayer.

I might send the duff unit to them when I have replaced it. sigh

Richard




--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

rjs wrote:


After my Kickspace heater, having the narrowest pipework in the system,
stopped heating during winter 2003/4 I flushed the CH system twice and
extracted about two egg cups full of rusty particles (some quite large),
I then added X400 with a large dose of prayer.


Sorry, should read X100 (or whatever Fernox inhibitor I used)

Richard

--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM

In message , rjs
writes
raden wrote:

You think ?
ha ha


Well, a year on an no lock out since the resoldering compared with a
permanent fault seems fairly conclusive to me. Do you disagree?

It's only waiting for winter to start


And if it hasn't then at least I have postponed serious pocket damage
by a year.

It's only a matter of time ...

--
geoff

"rjs" wrote in message
...
John wrote:



The presence or lack of inhibitor in a cast iron heat exchanger is not
likely to have caused the problem. On the other hand any casting has a
potential for an imperfection which may reveal itself quite some time
later. I had an Ideal Classic which suffered a holed heat exchanger last
year, after three years running perfectly. Even though out of guarantee
Ideal were quite happy to provide a replacement, together with
refractories, seals etc. at no cost pending examination. They also agreed
a standard replacement labour charge of £150 to cover the job.
A few weeks after the leaking unit was returned to them they advised the
failure to have been a blow hole in the casting which had been plugged
with casting sand until lately and confirmed they would stand the costs.
I assume any presence of scale within the unit would have resulted in a
different answer as would signs of running "dry" (and I had flushed with
X400 then used Sentinel X100 inhibitor)

Depending on how old your unit is and the mood of the manufacturer you
may have some redress?



Hi John

Potterton wouldn't even consider the possibility that their parts could be
faulty - Them: '1 year guarantee sir, can I transfer you to our service
dept' Me: 'click brrrrrrrrr'

Any item "should" have a reasonable life expectancy and a civil action in
small claims court might just crystallise their thoughts.


After my Kickspace heater, having the narrowest pipework in the system,
stopped heating during winter 2003/4 I flushed the CH system twice and
extracted about two egg cups full of rusty particles (some quite large), I
then added X400 with a large dose of prayer.

I might send the duff unit to them when I have replaced it. sigh

I'd send them photos but retain possession for future evidence

John wrote:


Any item "should" have a reasonable life expectancy and a civil action in
small claims court might just crystallise their thoughts.

Yep. It took SWMBO nearly 2 years to recover a full refund from Peugeot
when she rejected her *new* 309 that would only start if she parked it
on a slope that was steep enough for her to bump start it! They
initially offered to extend her warranty!!!!!



I'd send them photos but retain possession for future evidence



Good idea


Richard



--
Real email address is RJSavage at BIGFOOT dot COM