We moved into a new -build house almost two years ago. The trim around
the glass panel on the front door has started to yellow, I assume from
sunlight. The door itself is fine.
As we are still within our 2 year snagging period we have contacted
the builder' Customer Care only to be told this is can be rectified by
"under-coatingand painting over the trim with gloss paint"

We are not convinced that this is correct and that it is a fault with
whatever door company supplied the doors---------we have noticed some
doors on the estate are the same.

We would be grateful for any comments from anyone who is familiar with
external UPVC doors!!
Elizabeth in Renfrewshire, Scotland.
Removex to reply

In article , Elizabeth
writes
We moved into a new -build house almost two years ago. The trim around
the glass panel on the front door has started to yellow, I assume from
sunlight. The door itself is fine.
As we are still within our 2 year snagging period we have contacted
the builder' Customer Care only to be told this is can be rectified by
"under-coatingand painting over the trim with gloss paint"

We are not convinced that this is correct and that it is a fault with
whatever door company supplied the doors---------we have noticed some
doors on the estate are the same.

We would be grateful for any comments from anyone who is familiar with
external UPVC doors!!

UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

The builders are trying it on and hoping you will go away quietly.
--
Tim Mitchell

Tim Mitchell wrote:

UPVC should not yellow

True.


that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

No, it stands for unplasticised. This has nothing to do with it not
yellowing - PVC is very UV stable.


--
Grunff

In article , Grunff
writes
Tim Mitchell wrote:

UPVC should not yellow

True.


that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet stabilised or something
like that)

No, it stands for unplasticised. This has nothing to do with it not
yellowing - PVC is very UV stable.

I stand corrected on that point.

I still think the builders are trying it on.
--
Tim Mitchell

"Grunff" wrote in message
...
Tim Mitchell wrote:

UPVC should not yellow

True.


that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

No, it stands for unplasticised. This has nothing to do with it not
yellowing - PVC is very UV stable.


You have a legitimate complaint.

Althouhgh the "U" does indeed stand for "unplasticised", PVC intrinsically
has rather poor UV stability and will yellow easily. It has to be formulatd
with stabilising additives to give it yellowing resistance.

Its quite common for people to use high quality PVC formulations for frames
etc, then spoil the job by using a lower grade trim material which goes
yellow (or pink sometimes) in sunlight.

Tim Mitchell wrote:
UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

As far as I am aware, it used to be (Greek letter Mu)PVC - as
this was difficult to deal with, it changed to uPVC, subsequently
and even more inaccurately called UPVC. Nothing to do with "U.V.
stabilised".

In article ,
Tim Mitchell writes:
In article , Elizabeth
writes
We moved into a new -build house almost two years ago. The trim around
the glass panel on the front door has started to yellow, I assume from
sunlight. The door itself is fine.
As we are still within our 2 year snagging period we have contacted
the builder' Customer Care only to be told this is can be rectified by
"under-coatingand painting over the trim with gloss paint"

Sorry, but the main benefit of uPVC is no painting required,
so I regard that as a non-starter. Once you've done it, you
would have to repaint it just as for a traditional window.

We are not convinced that this is correct and that it is a fault with
whatever door company supplied the doors---------we have noticed some
doors on the estate are the same.

We would be grateful for any comments from anyone who is familiar with
external UPVC doors!!

Is this the PVC itself, or are you referring to the rubber sealing
strips against the glass? When I was choosing the options for my
uPVC windows, white rubber seals was one option. My fitter warned
me off because you always get a line of black dirt forming where
it contacts the glass which you can't see with the black rubber,
and because it discolours.

UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

Actually it stands for unplasticised, i.e. the more solid form
of PVC as opposed to that used for making cables.

The builders are trying it on and hoping you will go away quietly.

--
Andrew Gabriel

On Mon, 01 Aug 2005 14:47:16 +0100,it is alleged that Chris Bacon
spake thusly in uk.d-i-y:

Tim Mitchell wrote:
UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

As far as I am aware, it used to be (Greek letter Mu)PVC - as
this was difficult to deal with, it changed to uPVC, subsequently
and even more inaccurately called UPVC. Nothing to do with "U.V.
stabilised".

I was under the (possibly false?) impression it stood for
"Unplasticised" (IE no plasticiser added such as is the case with
cable insulation). I have also seen it written PVC-U or PVC(u).

--
While theoretically and technically television may be feasible,
commercially and financially it is an impossibility.
- Lee DeForest

In article , Tim Mitchell
wrote:

UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)


That's a new one. Is it not urea polyvinyl chloride then?

--
AJL Electronics (G6FGO) Ltd : Satellite and TV aerial systems
http://www.classicmicrocars.co.uk : http://www.ajlelectronics.co.uk

In article , "Andy Luckman
(AJL Electronics)" writes
In article , Tim Mitchell
wrote:

UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)


That's a new one. Is it not urea polyvinyl chloride then?

Well I'm glad it's not just me that didn't know what it stands for.
--
Tim Mitchell

Chip wrote:
Chris Bacon spake thusly in uk.d-i-y:
Tim Mitchell wrote:
UPVC should not yellow, that's what the "U" stands for (ultra violet
stabilised or something like that)

As far as I am aware, it used to be (Greek letter Mu)PVC - as
this was difficult to deal with, it changed to uPVC, subsequently
and even more inaccurately called UPVC. Nothing to do with "U.V.
stabilised".

I was under the (possibly false?) impression it stood for
"Unplasticised" (IE no plasticiser added such as is the case with
cable insulation). I have also seen it written PVC-U or PVC(u).

That's right.

Andy Luckman (AJL Electronics) wrote:
Is it not urea polyvinyl chloride then?

Yes, it is not.

On 01 Aug 2005 13:49:34 GMT, andrew@a17 (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:



Is this the PVC itself, or are you referring to the rubber sealing
strips against the glass? When I was choosing the options for my
uPVC windows, white rubber seals was one option. My fitter warned
me off because you always get a line of black dirt forming where
it contacts the glass which you can't see with the black rubber,
and because it discolours.

Thanks to all for their comments.

Andrew, it is the "supposed" white trim around the glass panel that
has yellowed not the sealant.

We will again do battle with "Customer care" (sigh)!!!!
Elizabeth in Renfrewshire, Scotland.
Removex to reply

In article ,
says...
On 01 Aug 2005 13:49:34 GMT, andrew@a17 (Andrew Gabriel) wrote:



Is this the PVC itself, or are you referring to the rubber sealing
strips against the glass? When I was choosing the options for my
uPVC windows, white rubber seals was one option. My fitter warned
me off because you always get a line of black dirt forming where
it contacts the glass which you can't see with the black rubber,
and because it discolours.

Thanks to all for their comments.

Andrew, it is the "supposed" white trim around the glass panel that
has yellowed not the sealant.

We will again do battle with "Customer care" (sigh)!!!!
Elizabeth in Renfrewshire, Scotland.
Removex to reply

Elizabeth

With respect, you have not answered Andrew's question.

Is it the EPDM (rubber) gasket or the hard PVCu glazing bead that has
yellowed?

Since the glazing bead is (almost) always on the inside of the door I am
going to assume that it is the rubber gasket on the outside. Andrew is
absolutely right to suggest that a black gasket is better, for the reason
that he has stated. In this case you could go to a local fabricator and
buy 6 metres of black gasket for less than a fiver if he can match the
profile of your yellow one.

If your problem is with a yellowed external glazing bead (the hard one)
then a replacement is the only viable option. The suggested paint job is
utter nonsense and would only last for months rather than years.

--
Ziggur

"S'ils te mordent, mords-les"

On Tue, 2 Aug 2005 21:03:09 +0100, Ziggur wrote:


Elizabeth

With respect, you have not answered Andrew's question.

Is it the EPDM (rubber) gasket or the hard PVCu glazing bead that has
yellowed?

Since the glazing bead is (almost) always on the inside of the door I am
going to assume that it is the rubber gasket on the outside. Andrew is
absolutely right to suggest that a black gasket is better, for the reason
that he has stated. In this case you could go to a local fabricator and
buy 6 metres of black gasket for less than a fiver if he can match the
profile of your yellow one.

If your problem is with a yellowed external glazing bead (the hard one)
then a replacement is the only viable option. The suggested paint job is
utter nonsense and would only last for months rather than years.


Sorry, should have made myself clearer, it is the external hard
glazing bead that has yellowed ( only the part that catches sunlight )
not the rubber gasket which seems to be covered by the glazing bead

BTW there is also a glazing bead on the inside.

If we were to get a second opinion from someone to give us more clout
with the builders is there a uPVC "ombudsman" so to speak who we could
contact?


Elizabeth in Renfrewshire, Scotland.
Removex to reply

In article ,
says...

Sorry, should have made myself clearer, it is the external hard
glazing bead that has yellowed ( only the part that catches sunlight )
not the rubber gasket which seems to be covered by the glazing bead

BTW there is also a glazing bead on the inside.

If we were to get a second opinion from someone to give us more clout
with the builders is there a uPVC "ombudsman" so to speak who we could
contact?


Elizabeth in Renfrewshire, Scotland.
Removex to reply

Elizabeth

You could contact The Glass and Glazing Federation, they have a web site.

Take a look at - http://www.thewindowman.co.uk/offcolourpanel.htm

If you can ignore all of the Screwfix adverts there are links to sections
at the left of the page which you can browse for good information.

Good luck

--
Ziggur

"S'ils te mordent, mords-les"

On Wed, 3 Aug 2005 20:51:05 +0100, Ziggur wrote:



You could contact The Glass and Glazing Federation, they have a web site.

Take a look at - http://www.thewindowman.co.uk/offcolourpanel.htm

If you can ignore all of the Screwfix adverts there are links to sections
at the left of the page which you can browse for good information.

Good luck


Thanks Ziggur for your reply
Acted upon!
Elizabeth in Renfrewshire, Scotland.
Removex to reply