I know you all love to keep up with world events (for the 97% of you who
dont know about things that happen outside of the USA). One of the two
Australians kidnapped by US forces in Afghanistan and then tortured in Egypt
and Cuba has finally been released and sent home to his family in Sydney
after 3 years. No charges, no apologies, even to the last his persecutors
tormented him saying he was being flown back to Egypt to undergo another
round of torture.

The poor sod has lost about half his body weight and needs drugs to
stabilise his mental condition and will need extensive help in returning to
his life.

Still it will be a field day for lawyers lining up in droves to seek multi
million dollar compensation law suits from the US.

Interestingly the Australian Government is trying to stop him/his family
from selling their story to the media, Bush's Poodle (PM Howard) is till
trying to say that he is a criminal and should not be allowed to profit from
his "crimes" - and there's me thinking that he had been kidnapped and
tortured.

Then too, like that American captured in Afghanistan, he could have
unwisely chosen to play ball for the wrong team out of misguided
motives, and thus deserved whatever treatment he received.

Without more factual information there is no way of knowing what the
real situation actually is.


Harry C.

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 00:39:13 GMT, "Roger Martin"
wrote:

I know you all love to keep up with world events (for the 97% of you who
dont know about things that happen outside of the USA). One of the two
Australians kidnapped by US forces in Afghanistan and then tortured in Egypt
and Cuba has finally been released and sent home to his family in Sydney
after 3 years. No charges, no apologies, even to the last his persecutors
tormented him saying he was being flown back to Egypt to undergo another
round of torture.

The poor sod has lost about half his body weight and needs drugs to
stabilise his mental condition and will need extensive help in returning to
his life.

Still it will be a field day for lawyers lining up in droves to seek multi
million dollar compensation law suits from the US.

Interestingly the Australian Government is trying to stop him/his family
from selling their story to the media, Bush's Poodle (PM Howard) is till
trying to say that he is a criminal and should not be allowed to profit from
his "crimes" - and there's me thinking that he had been kidnapped and
tortured.



What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Gunner

"Considering the events of recent years,
the world has a long way to go to regain
its credibility and reputation with the US."
unknown

What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Gunner

Same questions crossed my mind. Same questions crossed a lot of minds down
here in Aus as well. Dammed if we didn't charter a plane to bring the
******* home. I'd have let him swim!
Tom

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 21:42:29 +1100, "Tom Miller"
wrote:

===
===
=== What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
=== Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
=== Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?
===
=== Inquiring minds want to know.
===
=== Gunner
===
===Same questions crossed my mind. Same questions crossed a lot of minds down
===here in Aus as well. Dammed if we didn't charter a plane to bring the
===******* home. I'd have let him swim!
===Tom
===


I would not have even given the ******* the option to swim, unless he
could do it with some logging chains wrapped around his
ankles..........makes no difference if he was Aussie, German, Brit or
American..............or any other nationality.....You get caught in
the wrong place on the wrong side doing the wrong thing and you get
what you deserve. Well sort of, I would have shot the ****wit between
the eyes and not taken any prisoners!

REMEMBER: "This is worth repeating for benefit of al newbies!
Jo Ann asked Dr. Sooooooooooooooooolow to remind people that while she has retired from selling GF (and sold
the business to Ken Fischer http://dandyorandas.com/) she has NOT retired from
helping people with sick GF and koi FOR FREE. 251-649-4790 phoning is best for
diagnosis. but, can try email put "help sick fish" in subject. Get your fish at Dandy Orandas
Dandy Orandas Dandy Orandas........you guys got that DANDY ORANDAS

In article ,
(Roy) wrote:

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 21:42:29 +1100, "Tom Miller"
wrote:

===
===
=== What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
=== Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
=== Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?
===
=== Inquiring minds want to know.
===
=== Gunner
===
===Same questions crossed my mind. Same questions crossed a lot of minds
down
===here in Aus as well. Dammed if we didn't charter a plane to bring the
===******* home. I'd have let him swim!
===Tom
===


I would not have even given the ******* the option to swim, unless he
could do it with some logging chains wrapped around his
ankles..........makes no difference if he was Aussie, German, Brit or
American..............or any other nationality.....You get caught in
the wrong place on the wrong side doing the wrong thing and you get
what you deserve. Well sort of, I would have shot the ****wit between
the eyes and not taken any prisoners!

Certainly if he were accused of some unnamed dastardly deed he should
not be entitled to a trial

--
Free men own guns, slaves don't
www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/

In , on 01/31/05
at 09:42 PM, "Tom Miller" said:





What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Gunner

Same questions crossed my mind. Same questions crossed a lot of minds
down here in Aus as well. Dammed if we didn't charter a plane to bring
the ******* home. I'd have let him swim!
Tom

Yes, we've got 4 of the ****s I've had to pay to get home. What's wrong
with the Yanks, why the hell didn't they just shoot 'em in combat in
Afghanistan? Cheap & effective. They've scored the biggest own goal for
years with Guantanamo bay.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
John Lloyd - Cymru/Wales

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

wrote:

Yes, we've got 4 of the ****s I've had to pay to get home. What's wrong
with the Yanks, why the hell didn't they just shoot 'em in combat in
Afghanistan? Cheap & effective. They've scored the biggest own goal for
years with Guantanamo bay.

The one released was never in Afghanistan. He was taken into custody in
Pakistan after telephoning his wife to say "that something big was going
to happen in the USA". According to Australian consular officials, this
was "common knowledge" in Pakistan.

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:12:43 UTC, Gunner
wrote:

What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Since you ask.. he wasn't in Afganistan.

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Chris


Gunner

"Considering the events of recent years,
the world has a long way to go to regain
its credibility and reputation with the US."
unknown


--

Chris Lasdauskas wrote:

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Make that two. An Australian citizen (born here one) with a mental
illness was picked up in Brisbane by the police and suddenly found
themselves in an illegal immigrant centre in middle Australia. Took 8
(?) months before they were located. ****ing fridge magnets.

"Terry Collins" wrote in message
...
Chris Lasdauskas wrote:

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Make that two. An Australian citizen (born here one) with a mental
illness was picked up in Brisbane by the police and suddenly found
themselves in an illegal immigrant centre in middle Australia. Took 8
(?) months before they were located. ****ing fridge magnets.

You get what you vote for.

Amanda Vanstone, Phillip Ruddock and cough! John Howard are doing
*exactly* what the majority of Australians want them to do, as shown in the
elections.

If you want a policy change, vote for Kim.

Sorry. Thats the way it goes.

--
Jeff R/

On 6 Feb 2005 15:55:36 +0700, "Chris Lasdauskas"
wrote:

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 09:12:43 UTC, Gunner
wrote:

What was the poor mistreated fellow doing in Afghanistan? Aid worker?
Piano player in a whore house? Opium qualitiy control tester?
Armed combatant in the ranks of the Taliban?

Inquiring minds want to know.

Since you ask.. he wasn't in Afganistan.

Really? Where was he?

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Chris

Must suck to have a non caring government hey?
Now on the other hand, if it were really a kangaroo court, they would
have simply taken him out and shot him. No small loss. $0.25USD bullet
and a dead Aussie tango sympathizer.

Gunner



Gunner

"Considering the events of recent years,
the world has a long way to go to regain
its credibility and reputation with the US."
unknown



" We have all heard that a million monkeys banging on a million
typewriters will eventually reproduce the entire works of
Shakespeare...Thanks to AOL and WebTv, we know this is not possible."

"Jeff R." wrote:

You get what you vote for.

Amanda Vanstone, Phillip Ruddock and cough! John Howard are doing
*exactly* what the majority of Australians want them to do, as shown in the
elections.

If you want a policy change, vote for Kim.

Sorry. Thats the way it goes.

ROFL. Kim is just the other side of the mirror. At least I can
understand what the little sheriff is saying, but kim just goes on and
on and on and on and zzzzzzzzzzzz..........

Gunner wrote:

On 6 Feb 2005 15:55:36 +0700, "Chris Lasdauskas"

Since you ask.. he wasn't in Afganistan.

Really? Where was he?

On a bus in Pakistan.

.....snip......

Must suck to have a non caring government hey?

I think they are going to find that they better start caring very soon.
He was an immigrant from Egypt (fine, immigrants have made this country
great), so most people don't give too much of a rats arse. But, now they
locked up a true blue aussie for 10 months because they couldn't
identify her (slight mental illness). That will cause enough people to
start saying "Whoa, wtf is going on here?".

On the other hand, I could be totally wrong as Joh survived in QLD for
decades, but he was a bible thumper in a land of sun crazed drongos.
"Now don't you worry about that" {:-).

"Terry Collins" wrote in message
...
"Jeff R." wrote:

You get what you vote for.

Amanda Vanstone, Phillip Ruddock and cough! John Howard are doing
*exactly* what the majority of Australians want them to do, as shown in
the
elections.

If you want a policy change, vote for Kim.

Sorry. Thats the way it goes.

ROFL. Kim is just the other side of the mirror.


Uh huh.
Then the choice is ......(fill in the blank).........


..At least I can
understand what the little sheriff is saying, but kim just goes on and
on and on and on and zzzzzzzzzzzz..........

Then you approve of his policies (?)
Or not?

Either way, public opinion sets the agenda and determines the policy, not the
suits at the Lodge.

Don't like it?
Change it.

Can't change it?
Tough.
You're outvoted.

--
Jeff R.
(no more politics now...)

"Terry Collins" wrote in message
...
Gunner wrote:

On 6 Feb 2005 15:55:36 +0700, "Chris Lasdauskas"

Since you ask.. he wasn't in Afganistan.

Really? Where was he?

On a bus in Pakistan.

"Looking for a school for his children"
Yeah - right.


....snip......

Must suck to have a non caring government hey?

I think they are going to find that they better start caring very soon.
He was an immigrant from Egypt

....who advocated the violent overthrow of democartic governments, including
his own adopted one.

(fine, immigrants have made this country
great), so most people don't give too much of a rats arse. But, now they
locked up a true blue aussie for 10 months because they couldn't
identify her (slight mental illness).

"Slight" ?
She couldn't/ wouldn't identify herself, spoke in a foreign language, and was
demonstrably irrational. Immigration detention seems logical. The above
description fits most of the current detainees.

That will cause enough people to
start saying "Whoa, wtf is going on here?".

No - its obviously simple SNAFU.
You suggesting she was detained with deliberate maliciousness - malice
aforethought?
Ha!
It was the inefficiency of an underfunded gov't agency - simple as that.



On the other hand, I could be totally wrong as Joh survived in QLD for
decades, but he was a bible thumper in a land of sun crazed drongos.
"Now don't you worry about that" {:-).

That's Qld.
I'm talking about Australia, in the 21st century.
;-)

--
Jeff R.

On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 01:09:46 +1100, Terry Collins
wrote:

Gunner wrote:

On 6 Feb 2005 15:55:36 +0700, "Chris Lasdauskas"

Since you ask.. he wasn't in Afganistan.

Really? Where was he?

On a bus in Pakistan.

hey! Great catch! Seems the intel agencies are finally getting their
acts together.

....snip......

Must suck to have a non caring government hey?

I think they are going to find that they better start caring very soon.
He was an immigrant from Egypt (fine, immigrants have made this country
great), so most people don't give too much of a rats arse. But, now they
locked up a true blue aussie for 10 months because they couldn't
identify her (slight mental illness). That will cause enough people to
start saying "Whoa, wtf is going on here?".

Doesnt say much about your system does it?

On the other hand, I could be totally wrong as Joh survived in QLD for
decades, but he was a bible thumper in a land of sun crazed drongos.
"Now don't you worry about that" {:-).

Joh? Isnt that a Chinese board game?

Gunner



" We have all heard that a million monkeys banging on a million
typewriters will eventually reproduce the entire works of
Shakespeare...Thanks to AOL and WebTv, we know this is not possible."

Not true. Cornelia Rau was born in Germany.

"Terry Collins" wrote in message
...
Chris Lasdauskas wrote:

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Make that two. An Australian citizen (born here one) with a mental
illness was picked up in Brisbane by the police and suddenly found
themselves in an illegal immigrant centre in middle Australia. Took 8
(?) months before they were located. ****ing fridge magnets.

What an excellent reason for all Ozzies to have a microchip Aust. card
implanted (with backup tattoo?). Then mis-ID's will never happen again, we
can all rest easier, especially our Aust. govt who want to regulate more
and more all the time. Naturally, as our Govt says, only those with
something to hide would object...



Tom Miller wrote:

Not true. Cornelia Rau was born in Germany.

"Terry Collins" wrote in message
...
Chris Lasdauskas wrote:

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Make that two. An Australian citizen (born here one) with a mental
illness was picked up in Brisbane by the police and suddenly found
themselves in an illegal immigrant centre in middle Australia. Took 8
(?) months before they were located. ****ing fridge magnets.

Ya! We went through that **** with the Australia Card a few years ago. It
didn't float then & it won't float now. Somebody would have dyslexia of the
keyboard & I'd end up wearing Chopper Reed's chip.

Tom
"Pieter Moerkerken" wrote in message
...
What an excellent reason for all Ozzies to have a microchip Aust. card
implanted (with backup tattoo?). Then mis-ID's will never happen again, we
can all rest easier, especially our Aust. govt who want to regulate more
and more all the time. Naturally, as our Govt says, only those with
something to hide would object...



Tom Miller wrote:

Not true. Cornelia Rau was born in Germany.

"Terry Collins" wrote in message
...
Chris Lasdauskas wrote:

And what ever he was doing, there wasn't even enough evidence for
your
'kangaroo court' military tribunal to try him, so your government
finally let him go; much to the discgust of the Austrailan
Government
who are now desperately trying to cover their arses for not having
protected one of their citizens.

Make that two. An Australian citizen (born here one) with a mental
illness was picked up in Brisbane by the police and suddenly found
themselves in an illegal immigrant centre in middle Australia. Took 8
(?) months before they were located. ****ing fridge magnets.

On Mon, 7 Feb 2005 21:49:01 +1100, "Jeff R."
wrote:


You get what you vote for.

I did not


If you want a policy change, vote for Kim.

No bloody thanks, Fat Boy is supposedly my local member of
Parliament, he is moving to Sydney, the other side of the country.
How the hell can he "represent" me from there.


Alan
in beautiful Golden Bay, Western Oz, South 32.25.42, East 115.45.44 GMT+8
VK6 YAB ICQ 6581610 to reply, change oz to au in address

You get what you vote for.

I did not

"You" is a collective term for "all of us" in this case.
"We" voted Mr Howard back - even if You or I personally didn't.



If you want a policy change, vote for Kim.

No bloody thanks, Fat Boy is supposedly my local member of
Parliament, he is moving to Sydney, the other side of the country.
How the hell can he "represent" me from there.

Uh huh.
So who do you vote for to register your protest?

The Democrats?
Greens?
Pauline?

Maybe Mamdouh Habib (sp?) will stand for parliament. He seems to have a few
followers.

BTW, whaddya mean "other side of the country"?
I just got home from dropping the boy off at the SCG for the one-dayer.
Will be back there in a few hours to pick him up.
"Other side" indeed!

;-)

--
Jeff R.
in sunny, central, convenient, cosmopolital Sydney.
(ex VK2, now lapsed)
33.44 S 151.4 E GMT +11 (DST)



Alan
in beautiful Golden Bay, Western Oz, South 32.25.42, East 115.45.44 GMT+8
VK6 YAB ICQ 6581610 to reply, change oz to au in address

"Jeff R." wrote in message
...


You get what you vote for.

I did not

"You" is a collective term for "all of us" in this case.
"We" voted Mr Howard back - even if You or I personally didn't.



If you want a policy change, vote for Kim.

No bloody thanks, Fat Boy is supposedly my local member of
Parliament, he is moving to Sydney, the other side of the country.
How the hell can he "represent" me from there.

Uh huh.
So who do you vote for to register your protest?

The Democrats?
Greens?
Pauline?

Maybe Mamdouh Habib (sp?) will stand for parliament. He seems to have a
few
followers.

BTW, whaddya mean "other side of the country"?
I just got home from dropping the boy off at the SCG for the one-dayer.
Will be back there in a few hours to pick him up.
"Other side" indeed!

;-)

--
Jeff R.
in sunny, central, convenient, cosmopolital Sydney.
(ex VK2, now lapsed)
33.44 S 151.4 E GMT +11 (DST)



Alan
in beautiful Golden Bay, Western Oz, South 32.25.42, East 115.45.44
GMT+8
VK6 YAB ICQ 6581610 to reply, change oz to au in address



Hey, it sounds like you guys are playing the same video game that we're
playing in the US. Playstation or X-Box?

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
"Jeff R." wrote in message
...

Hey, it sounds like you guys are playing the same video game that we're
playing in the US. Playstation or X-Box?

--
Ed Huntress

Sigghhhhh...

Would that it were so, Ed.
Sadly, its real life.

--
Jeff R.
(its *life*, Jim, but not as we know it...)

"Jeff R." wrote in message
u...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...
"Jeff R." wrote in message
...

Hey, it sounds like you guys are playing the same video game that we're
playing in the US. Playstation or X-Box?

--
Ed Huntress

Sigghhhhh...

Would that it were so, Ed.
Sadly, its real life.

--
Jeff R.
(its *life*, Jim, but not as we know it...)


Well, for us, too. But it helps one's digestion to pretend it isn't so. g

Think about how much worse it could be. You could have George Bush. How's
that for a nightmare?

--
Ed Huntress

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

Think about how much worse it could be. You could have George Bush. How's
that for a nightmare?


(I shouldn't prolong this thread, but):

Have you seen John Howard in action?

Dubya may (!) have faults (and lots of "issues"), but at least he has the
courage of his convictions.

Our PM lies down and lets public opinion polls and other country's leaders
walk all over him.

;-(

Must stop whinging..

--
Jeff R.

"Jeff R." wrote in message
...

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

Think about how much worse it could be. You could have George Bush.
How's
that for a nightmare?


(I shouldn't prolong this thread, but):

Have you seen John Howard in action?

Unfortunately, unless we go looking for it, all we hear of him is an
occassional and superficial quote or snapshot. I really should take a closer
look.


Dubya may (!) have faults (and lots of "issues"), but at least he has the
courage of his convictions.

True enough.


Our PM lies down and lets public opinion polls and other country's leaders
walk all over him.

;-(

Hmm. I didn't realize that. I guess the grass is always greener...

--
Ed Huntress

On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:02:50 +1100, the inscrutable "Jeff R."
spake:

"Ed Huntress" wrote in message
...

Think about how much worse it could be. You could have George Bush. How's
that for a nightmare?

(I shouldn't prolong this thread, but):

Have you seen John Howard in action?

Dubya may (!) have faults (and lots of "issues"), but at least he has the
courage of his convictions.

So he had convictions. Manson and Mussolini did, too, and that didn't
make them right, either. He also has strong religious convictions, the
likes of which brought us the Crusades, etc. So is this "courage of
his convictions" or just blind faith and ego? My greatest fear is the
latter pair.

--
Vidi, Vici, Veni
---
http://diversify.com Comprehensive Website Development

"Jeff R." wrote:

So who do you vote for to register your protest?


Pauline

Yep, whatever nut case was representing her cause, he(always) got a
number before Lib 0r Lab, who occupy last and second last. I now believe
in changing your pollie often.

Greens?

Yep. At least I can join and influence local policy, although "green
very naive" is a more apt description and it really beggars belief about
how someone of some age can be so stupid (just like a.c.m {:-).
Unfortunately, most of the high profile candidates are essentially party
aparatchics (Like labor ).

The Democrats?

Our local Demo candidate is whomever is stupid enough to put up the
money. Usually young and stupid (even the Greens sound intelligent
against them).


BTW, whaddya mean "other side of the country"?

Yep, stupid moove Kim.


And on a metal related note. I installed two handrails for the olds on
the weekend. Thanks all for the tips on pipe bending.