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Metalworking (rec.crafts.metalworking) Discuss various aspects of working with metal, such as machining, welding, metal joining, screwing, casting, hardening/tempering, blacksmithing/forging, spinning and hammer work, sheet metal work. |
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#1
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Air powered booster pump?
Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system
set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks gary |
#3
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Air powered booster pump?
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 08:29:29 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote: fired this volley in news:5a2906ad-fe9a-44a7-ac2f- : Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? A simple "air amplifier" booster consisting of two cylinders of different diameters and some valving would do what you want. You only need boost for the last 20psi, or so, and your tailing volume is small compared to what it takes to fill the tire. Pre-assembled commercial versions exist. I owned an old DeVilbiss air-powered 'airless' paint sprayer that pumps paint at 1000psi from 80psi air. It consisted of a 2" cylinder direct- driving a 1/2" pump cylinder, and a couple of end-of-travel valves to reverse the direction the big one. Lloyd The Air Force used to use a simple double cylinder "air booster" that would pump a thousand PSI (for landing gear shock struts) using a conventional 100 PSI air compressor. -- Cheers, John B. |
#4
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Air powered booster pump?
Probably, and that's exactly what I did when I owned the truck I was
driving. Now being a driver, no longer an owner, as well as this vehicle being the property of the leasing company, I can't make any kind of mods to it. |
#6
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Air powered booster pump?
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#7
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Air powered booster pump?
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 20:19:48 -0600, Martin Eastburn
wrote: On 12/14/2014 8:07 AM, wrote: Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks gary A long hose with small center hole is a high resistance. If you have joint leaks, the pressure will drop before you get to use it. You are dropping (maybe ) 20 PSI in the hose. Try a larger ID hose with fewer connections. Martin, the resistance in the hose is only during full flow. Give it 5 seconds and the full pressure hits the far end. It's the law! Does the pump put out 120 really ? Good question. Gauge error? -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#8
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Air powered booster pump?
"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
... On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 20:19:48 -0600, Martin Eastburn wrote: On 12/14/2014 8:07 AM, wrote: Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks gary A long hose with small center hole is a high resistance. If you have joint leaks, the pressure will drop before you get to use it. You are dropping (maybe ) 20 PSI in the hose. Try a larger ID hose with fewer connections. Martin, the resistance in the hose is only during full flow. Give it 5 seconds and the full pressure hits the far end. It's the law! Does the pump put out 120 really ? Good question. Gauge error? The tire pressure is 30PSI when the gauge on my inflater shows 35PSI, with its trigger handle off. The inflater gauge has a non-standard thread, else I would have replaced it. As a cross check I measure and record tread depth when I swap winter and summer tires, and keep track of which position they came off last time with rf, lf, rr, lr marked inside the center hole cap. -jsw |
#9
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Air powered booster pump?
On 12/15/2014 9:18 AM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 20:19:48 -0600, Martin Eastburn wrote: On 12/14/2014 8:07 AM, wrote: Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks gary A long hose with small center hole is a high resistance. If you have joint leaks, the pressure will drop before you get to use it. You are dropping (maybe ) 20 PSI in the hose. Try a larger ID hose with fewer connections. Martin, the resistance in the hose is only during full flow. Give it 5 seconds and the full pressure hits the far end. It's the law! Does the pump put out 120 really ? Good question. Gauge error? -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford If there is flow the restriction will drop pressure. If you measure static pressure you should read 120. If you measure dynamic pressure (at use flow) it will be lower. You might read 20 if the use of the air is great. The tank is to far away to help the out rush. A local tank would be of better use - e.g. fill it and use from it while refiling from the long hose. Martin |
#10
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Air powered booster pump?
On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 21:49:54 -0600, Martin Eastburn
wrote: On 12/15/2014 9:18 AM, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 20:19:48 -0600, Martin Eastburn wrote: On 12/14/2014 8:07 AM, wrote: Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks gary A long hose with small center hole is a high resistance. If you have joint leaks, the pressure will drop before you get to use it. You are dropping (maybe ) 20 PSI in the hose. Try a larger ID hose with fewer connections. Martin, the resistance in the hose is only during full flow. Give it 5 seconds and the full pressure hits the far end. It's the law! Does the pump put out 120 really ? Good question. Gauge error? If there is flow the restriction will drop pressure. HIGH flow. How much flow is going to happen between 90 and 105psi, though? Some, but low. There should be very little pressure drop. If you measure static pressure you should read 120. If you measure dynamic pressure (at use flow) it will be lower. You might read 20 if the use of the air is great. Of course, but we're talkin' airing tires on a truck from a pump on the vehicle. The tank is to far away to help the out rush. A local tank would be of better use - e.g. fill it and use from it while refiling from the long hose. For a flat, yes, but to go from 100 to 115? -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#11
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Air powered booster pump?
On 12/16/2014 9:53 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 21:49:54 -0600, Martin Eastburn wrote: On 12/15/2014 9:18 AM, Larry Jaques wrote: On Sun, 14 Dec 2014 20:19:48 -0600, Martin Eastburn wrote: On 12/14/2014 8:07 AM, wrote: Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks gary A long hose with small center hole is a high resistance. If you have joint leaks, the pressure will drop before you get to use it. You are dropping (maybe ) 20 PSI in the hose. Try a larger ID hose with fewer connections. Martin, the resistance in the hose is only during full flow. Give it 5 seconds and the full pressure hits the far end. It's the law! Does the pump put out 120 really ? Good question. Gauge error? If there is flow the restriction will drop pressure. HIGH flow. How much flow is going to happen between 90 and 105psi, though? Some, but low. There should be very little pressure drop. If there are no connectors or If the connectors are 'air tight'. They are likely leaking on both ends and in the middle if there is one. A local tank on the end would be best - have the long hose fill it and then start to use it from the local tank - as it refills but the tank supplies the inrush flows and the big squirts setting the connector onto the valve. If you measure static pressure you should read 120. If you measure dynamic pressure (at use flow) it will be lower. You might read 20 if the use of the air is great. Of course, but we're talkin' airing tires on a truck from a pump on the vehicle. The tank is to far away to help the out rush. A local tank would be of better use - e.g. fill it and use from it while refiling from the long hose. For a flat, yes, but to go from 100 to 115? -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#12
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Air powered booster pump?
Martin Eastburn writes:
A long hose with small center hole is a high resistance. If you have joint leaks, the pressure will drop before you get to use it. You are dropping (maybe ) 20 PSI in the hose. Try a larger ID hose with fewer connections. You have pressure drop only when there's flow. -- A host is a host from coast to & no one will talk to a host that's close.......................... Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433 is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433 |
#13
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Air powered booster pump?
I'm using a connection from the gladhands, as that's the easiest.
No promises as to the accuracy of the gauge, it's certainly not a precision instrument. At least no more than the rest of the truck. And I would have to call a freightliner a small(very small) step better than an Intrashational. Found the following on ebay. Can anyone suggest what the tube/hoses and unidentified unit hooked to the amplifier is/does? thanks gary http://www.ebay.com/itm/Haskel-air-a...04767 5.l2557 |
#14
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Air powered booster pump?
On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 06:21:51 -0800 (PST), wrote:
I'm using a connection from the gladhands, as that's the easiest. No promises as to the accuracy of the gauge, it's certainly not a precision instrument. At least no more than the rest of the truck. And I would have to call a freightliner a small(very small) step better than an Intrashational. So get a better gauge and pop a QD on the end so you can tell. Found the following on ebay. Can anyone suggest what the tube/hoses and unidentified unit hooked to the amplifier is/does? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Haskel-air-a...04767 5.l2557 That listing is expired/unavailable. The header says it's a piloted device, so you're probably looking at feedback and control tubes. -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#15
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Air powered booster pump?
wrote in message ... Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_law |
#16
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Air powered booster pump?
"PrecisionmachinisT" fired this
volley in : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_law PT, you seem to be implying that the pressure will be equal in both parts of the air amplifier because they are both connected to the source supply -- which would be the case, if the prior were the case. But the source only serves to fill the smaller cylinder when it is fully retracted. It possesses a check valve so that as soon as its pressure rises above supply, it's cut off from that source, and free to build pressure to whatever level the ratio of areas between it and the 'driving' cylinder allow. LLoyd |
#17
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Air powered booster pump?
"PrecisionmachinisT" wrote in
message ... wrote in message ... Trucks, Freightliner, Volvo, Kenworth, etc, normally have air system set @120psi or so. I've found the highest I can inflate the tires using the truck air system & a 50' hose is 97-98psi. Need a bit more. Looking for 115psi on the steers(cold) & 105psi on the drives. Was wondering if an air powered booster pump would be possible? Say, 50% of the airstream as high-pressure supply, and the rest to drive the booster? If not practical, any easier/better way? thanks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal%27s_law The steam injector is a clever booster pump without moving parts that uses steam at boiler pressure to force feed water in at a -higher- pressure. http://www.steamlocomotive.com/appliances/injectors.php http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Giffard-02.jpg http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henri_Giffard I was tediously making tapered drill bits until I realized that these would drill nozzles:: http://www.dynamitetoolco.com/snappy.../snp-49409.htm -jsw |
#18
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Air powered booster pump?
On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 12:48:45 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote: I was tediously making tapered drill bits until I realized that these would drill nozzles:: http://www.dynamitetoolco.com/snappy.../snp-49409.htm Drilling steel or decarbonizing nozzles? Don't forget these, usually used for wood screws. http://www.pinterest.com/pin/547046685961351587/ Oops, wrong clipboard snippet... http://tinyurl.com/289kq5r I just made a lemon creme pudding pie. Time for dessert. -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#19
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Air powered booster pump?
"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
... On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 12:48:45 -0500, "Jim Wilkins" wrote: I was tediously making tapered drill bits until I realized that these would drill nozzles:: http://www.dynamitetoolco.com/snappy.../snp-49409.htm Drilling steel or decarbonizing nozzles? Don't forget these, usually used for wood screws. http://www.pinterest.com/pin/547046685961351587/ Oops, wrong clipboard snippet... http://tinyurl.com/289kq5r I just made a lemon creme pudding pie. Time for dessert. The Snappy bits are HSS, my convergent nozzles are aluminum. -jsw |
#20
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Air powered booster pump?
On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 23:40:39 -0500, "Jim Wilkins"
wrote: "Larry Jaques" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 15 Dec 2014 12:48:45 -0500, "Jim Wilkins" wrote: I was tediously making tapered drill bits until I realized that these would drill nozzles:: http://www.dynamitetoolco.com/snappy.../snp-49409.htm Drilling steel or decarbonizing nozzles? Don't forget these, usually used for wood screws. http://www.pinterest.com/pin/547046685961351587/ Oops, wrong clipboard snippet... http://tinyurl.com/289kq5r I just made a lemon creme pudding pie. Time for dessert. The Snappy bits are HSS, my convergent nozzles are aluminum. I have a set of straight Snappys. Love 'em. I just got another 21 billdrits from HF yesterday for $2.97. 1/16", the size I break most often. -- Obstacles are those frightful things you see when you take your eyes off your goal. --Henry Ford |
#21
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Air powered booster pump?
Here's a link to the jpg that was posted on ebay. http://s677.photobucket.com/user/gar...askel.jpg.html |
#22
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Air powered booster pump?
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#23
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Air powered booster pump?
Brian Lawson fired this volley in
: 50 foot of hose will have a fair loss. This is just silly. Two THOUSAND feet of hose would have zero loss, unless it had leaks! As PT aptly pointed out, the gas laws prohibit any pressure in a closed system from being any different anywhere. If you cannot get more than 98lb at the end of a 50' hose headed by 120psi, then you are A) not waiting until the pressure finally reaches its asymptotic limit [which it MUST, absent leaks], or B) have leaks -- major leaks. Lloyd |
#24
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Air powered booster pump?
On 2014-12-18, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
Brian Lawson fired this volley in : 50 foot of hose will have a fair loss. This is just silly. Two THOUSAND feet of hose would have zero loss, unless it had leaks! As PT aptly pointed out, the gas laws prohibit any pressure in a closed system from being any different anywhere. Correct!!! If you cannot get more than 98lb at the end of a 50' hose headed by 120psi, then you are A) not waiting until the pressure finally reaches its asymptotic limit [which it MUST, absent leaks], or B) have leaks -- major leaks. I think that there is a pressure loss at the Schrader valve or some such, like a spring that needs to be pushed by air. i |
#25
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Air powered booster pump?
Ignoramus11878 fired this volley in
: I think that there is a pressure loss at the Schrader valve or some such, like a spring that needs to be pushed by air. Not when a chuck is engaged on a Schrader, no. Both the chuck's valve and the Schrader valve are fully opened when fully engaged. More likely is a bad face washer in the chuck, causing a leak. An expanding-collar lock-on chuck can solve that, and make the job easier, too. Lloyd |
#26
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Air powered booster pump?
On 2014-12-18, Lloyd E. Sponenburgh lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:
Ignoramus11878 fired this volley in : I think that there is a pressure loss at the Schrader valve or some such, like a spring that needs to be pushed by air. Not when a chuck is engaged on a Schrader, no. Both the chuck's valve and the Schrader valve are fully opened when fully engaged. More likely is a bad face washer in the chuck, causing a leak. An expanding-collar lock-on chuck can solve that, and make the job easier, too. Lloyd, I had the same problem as the OP, the last 10 PSI are very difficult to push into a tire. i |
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