I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.


Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 10:07:37 -0500, tnik
wrote:

I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

In the larger sense, this is on topic. The efforts to
implement the closure of the virtual commons means an
attempt to prevent the spread of Linux, EMC, and the other
freeware programs as well as censoring the internet and
choking off the free flow of information.



Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Indeed, and these two acts appear to be yet more examples of
the 1% (0.1%?) attempting to high jack the new virtual
common out from under everyone else for their own profit.
While they may indeed high jack this particular portion of
the common, in doing so they will "kill" the activity that
would make it profitable for them, while denying it to
everyone else.

For a hard read, but to understand what is occurring and has
occurred, which goes far beyond SOPA and PIPA, see
http://www.amazon.com/Commonwealth-M...6906740&sr=1-2

Be warned the author is "hard left" but he has many useful
insights, along with the B/S.

also see
http://www.amazon.com/Silent-Theft-P.../dp/0415932645



--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

On 1/18/2012 12:32 PM, F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 10:07:37 -0500, tnik
wrote:

I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

In the larger sense, this is on topic. The efforts to
implement the closure of the virtual commons means an
attempt to prevent the spread of Linux, EMC, and the other
freeware programs as well as censoring the internet and
choking off the free flow of information.



Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Indeed, and these two acts appear to be yet more examples of
the 1% (0.1%?) attempting to high jack the new virtual
common out from under everyone else for their own profit.
While they may indeed high jack this particular portion of
the common, in doing so they will "kill" the activity that
would make it profitable for them, while denying it to
everyone else.

For a hard read, but to understand what is occurring and has
occurred, which goes far beyond SOPA and PIPA, see
http://www.amazon.com/Commonwealth-M...6906740&sr=1-2

Be warned the author is "hard left" but he has many useful
insights, along with the B/S.

also see
http://www.amazon.com/Silent-Theft-P.../dp/0415932645




What really surprises me George is that you were the only one that
replied to this. BUT if these two bills pass, can you imagine how many
people will bitch and moan? I don't know about you, but I have emailed
and called my so called representatives.

Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet.

On Jan 19, 9:53*am, tnik wrote:
On 1/18/2012 12:32 PM, F. George McDuffee wrote:





On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 10:07:37 -0500, tnik
*wrote:

I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

In the larger sense, this is on topic. *The efforts to
implement the closure of the virtual commons means an
attempt to prevent the spread of Linux, EMC, and the other
freeware programs as well as censoring the internet and
choking off the free flow of information.

Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Indeed, and these two acts appear to be yet more examples of
the 1% (0.1%?) attempting to high jack the new virtual
common out from under everyone else for their own profit.
While they may indeed high jack this particular portion of
the common, in doing so they will "kill" the activity that
would make it profitable for them, while denying it to
everyone else.

For a hard read, but to understand what is occurring and has
occurred, which goes far beyond SOPA and PIPA, see
http://www.amazon.com/Commonwealth-M...4060288/ref=sr....

Be warned the author is "hard left" but he has many useful
insights, along with the B/S.

also see
http://www.amazon.com/Silent-Theft-P.../dp/0415932645

What really surprises me George is that you were the only one that
replied to this. BUT if these two bills pass, can you imagine how many
people will bitch and moan? I don't know about you, but I have emailed
and called my so called representatives.

Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet

I, too, have called my representatives and emailed them. I also posted
a link:
http://act.credoaction.com/campaign/.../?rc=fb_share1
on my facebook page.

On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 09:53:17 -0500, tnik wrote:

On 1/18/2012 12:32 PM, F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 10:07:37 -0500, tnik
wrote:

I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

In the larger sense, this is on topic. The efforts to
implement the closure of the virtual commons means an
attempt to prevent the spread of Linux, EMC, and the other
freeware programs as well as censoring the internet and
choking off the free flow of information.



Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Indeed, and these two acts appear to be yet more examples of
the 1% (0.1%?) attempting to high jack the new virtual
common out from under everyone else for their own profit.
While they may indeed high jack this particular portion of
the common, in doing so they will "kill" the activity that
would make it profitable for them, while denying it to
everyone else.

For a hard read, but to understand what is occurring and has
occurred, which goes far beyond SOPA and PIPA, see
http://www.amazon.com/Commonwealth-M...6906740&sr=1-2

Be warned the author is "hard left" but he has many useful
insights, along with the B/S.

also see
http://www.amazon.com/Silent-Theft-P.../dp/0415932645




What really surprises me George is that you were the only one that
replied to this. BUT if these two bills pass, can you imagine how many
people will bitch and moan? I don't know about you, but I have emailed
and called my so called representatives.

I caught up with my newspapers yesterday and now know what you're
talking about. Yeah, we can't let the CONgresscritters take away the
Internet from us in the interest of the Left. Wikipedia was blacked
out yesterday to make people aware of the bills.


Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet.

You bet. Since nothing else -yet- has created the critical mass in
the American people, if something like that passed, it just might. I
dare them to try it. g

--
The human brain is unique in that it is the only container of which
it can be said that the more you put into it, the more it will hold.
-- Glenn Doman

On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 07:14:02 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

snip
Yeah, we can't let the CONgresscritters take away the
Internet from us in the interest of the Left.
snip

While it may appear that the left is out front on this,
IMNSHO it is the corporations and corporationism that are
bankrolling and pushing this effort. When we follow the
money we seen that while the left may push PC and be able to
censor Gunner's posts, it is the corporations that stand to
make a boat load of money, and in the worlds of Vanderbilt
"the public be dammed.

You should also remember that SOPA/PIPA are only a small
part of the accelerating effort by the corporate interests
to privatize everything from the air we breathe and the
water we drink, to seeds and cells, to language for their
"fun and profit." Can you hear me now? -- There's an app
for that...


--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 09:53:17 -0500, tnik wrote:

On 1/18/2012 12:32 PM, F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 10:07:37 -0500, tnik
wrote:

I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

In the larger sense, this is on topic. The efforts to
implement the closure of the virtual commons means an
attempt to prevent the spread of Linux, EMC, and the other
freeware programs as well as censoring the internet and
choking off the free flow of information.



Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Indeed, and these two acts appear to be yet more examples of
the 1% (0.1%?) attempting to high jack the new virtual
common out from under everyone else for their own profit.
While they may indeed high jack this particular portion of
the common, in doing so they will "kill" the activity that
would make it profitable for them, while denying it to
everyone else.

For a hard read, but to understand what is occurring and has
occurred, which goes far beyond SOPA and PIPA, see
http://www.amazon.com/Commonwealth-M...6906740&sr=1-2

Be warned the author is "hard left" but he has many useful
insights, along with the B/S.

also see
http://www.amazon.com/Silent-Theft-P.../dp/0415932645




What really surprises me George is that you were the only one that
replied to this. BUT if these two bills pass, can you imagine how many
people will bitch and moan? I don't know about you, but I have emailed
and called my so called representatives.

Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet.


Well said! Very well stated!!

Gunner

One could not be a successful Leftwinger without realizing that,
in contrast to the popular conception supported by newspapers
and mothers of Leftwingers, a goodly number of Leftwingers are
not only narrow-minded and dull, but also just stupid.
Gunner Asch

On Jan 18, 9:07*am, tnik wrote:
I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Good post.

Very important subject.

TMT

On Jan 19, 9:14*am, Larry Jaques
wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 09:53:17 -0500, tnik wrote:
On 1/18/2012 12:32 PM, F. George McDuffee wrote:
On Wed, 18 Jan 2012 10:07:37 -0500, tnik
*wrote:

I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

In the larger sense, this is on topic. *The efforts to
implement the closure of the virtual commons means an
attempt to prevent the spread of Linux, EMC, and the other
freeware programs as well as censoring the internet and
choking off the free flow of information.

Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

Indeed, and these two acts appear to be yet more examples of
the 1% (0.1%?) attempting to high jack the new virtual
common out from under everyone else for their own profit.
While they may indeed high jack this particular portion of
the common, in doing so they will "kill" the activity that
would make it profitable for them, while denying it to
everyone else.

For a hard read, but to understand what is occurring and has
occurred, which goes far beyond SOPA and PIPA, see
http://www.amazon.com/Commonwealth-M...4060288/ref=sr....

Be warned the author is "hard left" but he has many useful
insights, along with the B/S.

also see
http://www.amazon.com/Silent-Theft-P.../dp/0415932645

What really surprises me George is that you were the only one that
replied to this. BUT if these two bills pass, can you imagine how many
people will bitch and moan? I don't know about you, but I have emailed
and called my so called representatives.

I caught up with my newspapers yesterday and now know what you're
talking about. *Yeah, we can't let the CONgresscritters take away the
Internet from us in the interest of the Left. Wikipedia was blacked
out yesterday to make people aware of the bills.

Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet.

You bet. *Since nothing else -yet- has created the critical mass in
the American people, if something like that passed, it just might. I
dare them to try it. *g

--
The human brain is unique in that it is the only container of which
it can be said that the more you put into it, the more it will hold.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *-- Glenn Doman- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

"... in the interest of the Left."

WTF?

The bills are being pressed by companies that want your money...and
the bills have both Republican and Democratic authors.

Quit using Faux News as your news source.

TMT

On Jan 19, 9:52*am, F. George McDuffee gmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 07:14:02 -0800, Larry Jaques

wrote:

snipYeah, we can't let the CONgresscritters take away the
Internet from us in the interest of the Left.

snip

While it may appear that the left is out front on this,
IMNSHO it is the corporations and corporationism that are
bankrolling and pushing this effort. *When we follow the
money we seen that while the left may push PC and be able to
censor Gunner's posts, it is the corporations that stand to
make a boat load of money, and in the worlds of Vanderbilt
"the public be dammed.

You should also remember that SOPA/PIPA are only a small
part of the accelerating effort by the corporate interests
to privatize everything from the air we breathe and the
water we drink, to seeds and cells, to language for their
"fun and profit." Can you hear me now? -- There's an app
for that...

--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

SOPA has a Republican as its author.


You are correct...it is all about the money.
TMT

On Jan 19, 10:01*am, F. George McDuffee gmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 07:06:52 -0800 (PST), wrote:

snip Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet

snip

for some insight as to where this push is coming from seehttp://www.deadline.com/2012/01/exclusive-hollywood-moguls-stopping-o...

FWIW -- thats not a guard to keep you from reading, just the
ticket collector to insure you pay for reading ...

--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

So George do you consider that copyrights/patents and IP should mean
nothing?

TMT

On 1/19/2012 4:16 PM, Too_Many_Tools wrote:
On Jan 19, 10:01 am, F. George McDuffeegmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 07:06:52 -0800 (PST), wrote:

snip Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet

snip

for some insight as to where this push is coming from seehttp://www.deadline.com/2012/01/exclusive-hollywood-moguls-stopping-o...

FWIW -- thats not a guard to keep you from reading, just the
ticket collector to insure you pay for reading ...

--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

So George do you consider that copyrights/patents and IP should mean
nothing?

TMT

I'm not George, but by passing those two laws the government would have
complete control to block whatever they felt necessary. I believe that
movies, software, music, etc. should not be pirated but it has happened
forever. Ever make a copy of a cassette tape for a friend when you were
younger? How about a copy of a VHS? Or did you ever record anything off
of the TV so you can watch it later? Or even record a song from the
radio? IF they are able to block everyone from pirating music, movies,
software, do you think that all the big boys are going to say "great,
now we're making money, lets drop the price for our wonderful
consumers!" yea right..

And then, what would stop the powers to be from blocking content on
wikipedia? or any other open site where people can post facts, opinions,
etc. What would keep them from blocking newsgroups? There's just too
much power in those laws that if they pass, who knows what will happen.

Tom

On Jan 19, 4:06*pm, tnik wrote:
On 1/19/2012 4:16 PM, Too_Many_Tools wrote:





On Jan 19, 10:01 am, F. George McDuffeegmcduf...@mcduffee-
associates.us *wrote:
On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 07:06:52 -0800 (PST), *wrote:

snip *Having a censored internet will be, at least the way I look at it, just
like walking into a library, and having an armed guard standing there
telling you what books your allowed to look at. Or even worse, which
pages you are allowed to read. Our government already has too much
power, last thing we need is them telling us what we can or can't look
at on the internet

snip

for some insight as to where this push is coming from seehttp://www.deadline.com/2012/01/exclusive-hollywood-moguls-stopping-o...

FWIW -- thats not a guard to keep you from reading, just the
ticket collector to insure you pay for reading ...

--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

So George do you consider that copyrights/patents and IP should mean
nothing?

TMT

I'm not George, but by passing those two laws the government would have
complete control to block whatever they felt necessary. I believe that
movies, software, music, etc. should not be pirated but it has happened
forever. Ever make a copy of a cassette tape for a friend when you were
younger? How about a copy of a VHS? Or did you ever record anything off
of the TV so you can watch it later? Or even record a song from the
radio? IF they are able to block everyone from pirating music, movies,
software, do you think that all the big boys are going to say "great,
now we're making money, lets drop the price for our wonderful
consumers!" yea right..

And then, what would stop the powers to be from blocking content on
wikipedia? or any other open site where people can post facts, opinions,
etc. What would keep them from blocking newsgroups? There's just too
much power in those laws that if they pass, who knows what will happen.

Tom- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Hi Tom.

The Government can block the Internet at any time now.

I for one do not want censorship on the Internet...and there is plenty
of it already.

But I do understand the need for indiviuals and companies to be
compensated for their efforts.

I do not have the "magic bullet" for how that should be done.

As for companies and their pricing, if they own the product then they
have the right to set its price.

As for consumers who wish to use the product, they have the right to
purchase or refuse to purchase the product.

TMT

On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 09:52:07 -0600, F. George McDuffee
wrote:

On Thu, 19 Jan 2012 07:14:02 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

snip
Yeah, we can't let the CONgresscritters take away the
Internet from us in the interest of the Left.
snip

While it may appear that the left is out front on this,
IMNSHO it is the corporations and corporationism that are
bankrolling and pushing this effort. When we follow the
money we seen that while the left may push PC and be able to
censor Gunner's posts, it is the corporations that stand to
make a boat load of money, and in the worlds of Vanderbilt
"the public be dammed.

You should also remember that SOPA/PIPA are only a small
part of the accelerating effort by the corporate interests
to privatize everything from the air we breathe and the
water we drink, to seeds and cells, to language for their
"fun and profit." Can you hear me now? -- There's an app
for that...


Yes. Even though Larry says these laws are wanted by the left I am
hearing most of the condemnation of the proposed legislation coming
from the left. And while many folks feel Hollywood is a bunch of
lefties, and it is Hollywood in part who is pushing hard for this
legislation, the left in general is against it. Maybe here is
something that we can all agree on no matter what our political
stripes are. I don't generally post here about political stuff but
this is just too important to not say something about. Giving our
government the power to censor the way SOPA/PIPA would do is extremely
dangerous to freedom. Please let your representatives know how bad
this legislation is and tell them to vote no. They do listen if enough
of us from all sides let them know how we feel and that we vote!
Thank You,
Eric

On Jan 18, 9:07*am, tnik wrote:
I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively. SOPA is short
for the "Stop Online Piracy Act," and PIPA is an acronym for the
"Protect IP Act." ("IP" stands for "intellectual property.") In short,
these bills are efforts to stop copyright infringement committed by
foreign web sites, but, in our opinion, they do so in a way that
actually infringes free expression while harming the Internet. Detailed
information about these bills can be found in the Stop Online Piracy Act
and PROTECT IP Act articles on Wikipedia, which are available during the
blackout. GovTrack lets you follow both bills through the legislative
process: SOPA on this page, and PIPA on this one. The Electronic
Frontier Foundation, a non-profit organization dedicated to advocating
for the public interest in the digital realm, has summarized why these
bills are simply unacceptable in a world that values an open, secure,
and free Internet.

FYI..the Power of the People.

TMT

INFLUENCE GAME: Online companies win piracy fight
By ALAN FRAM | AP



WASHINGTON (AP) — Outspent but hardly outgunned, online and high-tech
companies triggered an avalanche of Internet clicks to force Congress
to shelve legislation that would curb online piracy. They
outmaneuvered the entertainment industry and other old guard business
interests, leaving them bitter and befuddled.

Before Senate and House leaders set aside the legislation Friday, the
movie and music lobbies and other Washington fixtures, including the
U.S. Chamber of Commerce, had put in play their usually reliable
tactics to rally support for the bills.

There were email campaigns, television and print ads in important
states, a Times Square billboard, and uncounted phone calls and visits
to congressional offices in Washington and around the country. That
included about 20 trips to the Capitol by leaders of the National
Songwriters Association International, often accompanied by
songwriters who performed their hits for lawmakers and their staffs.

"We bring our guitars on our backs," said songwriter Steve Bogard, the
association's president.

Such campaigns are often music to the ears of lawmakers. This time,
however, it was smothered by an online outpouring against the
legislation that culminated Wednesday. According to organizers, at
least 75,000 websites temporarily went dark that day, including the
English-language online encyclopedia Wikipedia, joined by 25,000
blogs.

"The U.S. Congress is considering legislation that could fatally
damage the free and open Internet," said a message on Wikipedia's home
page, which was shrouded in shadows and provided links to help
visitors reach their members of Congress.

Thousands of other sites posted messages protesting the bills and
urging people to contact lawmakers. Protest leaders say that resulted
in 3 million emails.

Google, its logo hidden beneath a stark black rectangle, solicited 7
million signatures on a petition opposing the bills. Craigslist
counted 30,000 phone calls to lawmakers and there were 3.9 million
tweets on Twitter about the bills, according to NetCoalition, which
represents leading Internet and high tech companies.

"It's still something we're trying to comprehend," said Google
spokeswoman Samantha Smith. "We had such an overwhelming response to
our petition that it honestly far exceeded our expectations."

As co-sponsors of the bills peeled away, Senate Majority Leader Harry
Reid, D-Nev., on Friday postponed a vote that had been set for this
Tuesday on moving to the legislation. The vote seemed doomed well
beforehand. Rep. Lamar Smith, R-Texas, chairman of the House Judiciary
Committee, also put off further work. "I have heard from the critics,"
he said.

Just weeks ago, the bills seemed headed toward quiet approval with
bipartisan backing that ranging from liberals such as Rep. Howard
Berman, D-Calif., to conservatives such as Sen. Marco Rubio, R-Fla.
The turnabout was so unexpected that some think the online world's
triumph signals a pivotal moment marking its arrival as Washington's
newest power broker.

"This does serve as a watershed moment," said Jennifer Stromer-Galley,
a communications professor at the State University of New York at
Albany who studies how political groups use high technology. "Certain
channels for communication that people routinely use have the power to
get their users to become political activists on their behalf."

Both bills are aimed at thwarting illegal downloads and sales of
thousands of American movies, songs and books, as well as counterfeit
pharmaceuticals, software and other copyrighted products. They would
do so by making it easier to stop American websites and search engines
from steering visitors to largely foreign websites that pirate the
items.

Supporters estimate that online piracy costs the U.S. at least $100
billion annually and thousands of jobs; even the bills' critics say
sales of pirated products must be stopped. But foes say the
legislation goes too far, threatening to curb Internet free speech,
stifle online innovation and burden online businesses with damaging
regulations.

"People love their Internet. They use it every day, they don't want it
to change and they don't want Washington messing with it," said Maura
Corbett, spokeswoman for NetCoalition.

Claims that "big brother" would oversee the Internet infuriate bill
supporters, who say their opponents employed fear-mongering and
distortion to foment an online frenzy.

"They've misidentified this issue as an issue about your Internet,
your Internet is being jeopardized," said Mike Nugent, executive
director of Creative America, a coalition of entertainment unions,
movie studios and television networks. "In fact their business model
is being asked to be subjected to regulation. They're misleading their
huge base."

Misleading or not, the online community had a huge impact on members
of Congress, with many saying they heard little from the entertainment
industry but plenty from Internet users.

"Everyone's online, and a lot of people online are very inclined to
complain about" new fees and other problems, said Rep. Gerald
Connolly, D-Va. "It's a culture of fairly quick mobilization."

The bills' champions said they purposely avoided hauling entertainment
celebrities to Washington, saying they preferred to focus on how the
measure would help the entire economy.

"If we brought in Hollywood stars, that would play into the other
side's narrative that this is all about Hollywood," said Steven Tepp,
who helped guide the campaign for the Chamber of Commerce. "We want to
keep the focus on the reality that this is much, much broader."

In the end, the outcome showed the lobbying world is changing, said
Kathy Garmezy, an official with the Directors Guild of America, which
supports the bills.

"Of course you say to yourself, 'What can you change?'" she said. "I
don't think we've come to conclusions or closure."

Participants say last week's online protests were spawned last fall,
as Congress was writing the bills and Internet users started chatting
and emailing about them.

The blogging service Tumblr called attention to the measures on its
website in November. Other efforts also garnered attention, including
a drive by owners to remove their domain names from GoDaddy.com, which
sells domain names and was a supporter of the anti-piracy legislation.

Among the first to publicly say they would darken their sites on
Wednesday were Reddit and Wikipedia.

"Like most things on the Internet, it was very unorganized and
chaotic," said Erik Martin, Reddit's general manager.

In terms of their Washington presence, online businesses are
adolescents compared to the well-established industries they are
battling.

According to Maplight, a nonpartisan group that analyzes money's role
in politics, current senators have received $14.4 million over the
past six years from entertainment interest groups supporting the
online piracy bills, seven times the $2 million they got from Internet
groups opposing the legislation.

The differences are also stark when it comes to lobbying.

Google, one of the Internet world's largest players in Washington,
spent $5.9 million lobbying on all issues during the first nine months
of 2011, according to data from the Center for Responsive Politics,
which tracks money in politics. The Chamber of Commerce spent $46
million, the most in town.

Even so, online businesses have been beefing up their representation
in Washington, the center's figures show.

Google's $5.9 million paid for 112 lobbyists last year, more than
double the $2.8 million it spent for 54 lobbyists in 2008. Facebook's
$910,000 for lobbying during the first three quarters of 2011 paid for
21 lobbyists, compared with two lobbyists and $351,000 it spent a year
earlier.

High tech companies are also learning the value of big names. One
Google lobbyist is former Missouri Rep. Richard Gephardt, a House
Democratic leader and presidential candidate. Last year, Facebook
hired Joe Lockhart, a press secretary for President Bill Clinton, as
vice president of global communications.

Bill supporters lost one advantage because former Democratic Sen.
Christopher Dodd, chairman of the Motion Picture Association of
America, could not personally lobby senators. The Capitol Hill veteran
retired from the Senate last year and is legally barred from lobbying
his former colleagues for two years.

___

Online:

Senate's Protect Intellectual Property Act: http://tinyurl.com/7lqbgzh

House's Stop Online Piracy Act: http://tinyurl.com/75vtcxg

NetCoalition: http://www.netcoalition.com

EDITOR'S NOTE _ An occasional look at how behind-the-scenes influence
is exercised in Washington.

On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 14:40:15 -0800 (PST), Too_Many_Tools
wrote:

snip
I don't normally post off topic, but I feel this is worth it. I also
apologize for not putting OT: in the header, I didn't want peoples
filters blocking this one.

Just browse over to wikipedia and you can find out all the information
you want about it.. But in a nut shell:

SOPA and PIPA represent two bills in the United States House of
Representatives and the United States Senate respectively.
snip

I'm from the gumment and I'm here to hep you....


--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

"F. George McDuffee" wrote in message
news

I'm from the gumment and I'm here to hep you....

Pretty much true if you are a major recording studio or Disney.

SOPA/PIPA remain a worldwide problem.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...811012,00.html

snip
The US authorities' most spectacular strike to date against
the world's booming illegal trade in copyright-protected
content comes at a highly sensitive time. The arrests took
place in the same week that saw the controversy over new
copyright legislation in the United States come to a head.
For months, a powerful lobby consisting of politicians,
Hollywood executives and music-industry representatives has
been trying to get two new laws passed, SOPA ("Stop Online
Piracy Act") and PIPA ("Protect IP Act"), which would make
it easier to prosecute data pirates like the ones behind
Megaupload.

Proponents of the anti-piracy laws argue that such pirates
have cost these industries billions in lost revenue. But,
for the laws' opponents, nothing less than the future of the
free Internet is at stake. In addition to online giants such
as Wikipedia, Google and Facebook, it is primarily the
Internet community that denounces the proposed legislation
as marking the dawn of institutionalized Internet
censorship.
snip

FWIW -- if they can do this to megaupload, why can't the US
government find the 1.2 billion $US MF Global stole from the
segregated customer accounts (and more from the general
funds / unsecured creditors) and why aren't the MF Global
officers/directors in jail and their assets frozen?


--
Unka' George

"Gold is the money of kings,
silver is the money of gentlemen,
barter is the money of peasants,
but debt is the money of slaves"

-Norm Franz, "Money and Wealth in the New Millenium"

"F. George McDuffee" wrote in message
...
SOPA/PIPA remain a worldwide problem.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...811012,00.html

FWIW -- if they can do this to megaupload, why can't the US
government find the 1.2 billion $US MF Global stole from the
segregated customer accounts (and more from the general
funds / unsecured creditors) and why aren't the MF Global
officers/directors in jail and their assets frozen?


--
Unka' George

Your gonna love this one:

Always beware of politicans pushing legislation because of a personal
experience. Declan McCullagh has the story of an astoundingly, ridiculously
broad data retention bill in Hawaii that would require anyone who provides
internet access to keep a detailed dossier on every website everyone who
uses their service visits (tied to their name). The bill includes a broad
definition of internet access provider, such that anyone who provides free
WiFi may be forced to keep this same info. Furthermore, it has no privacy
provisions at all -- such as requiring the data be encrypted or even
forbidding service providers from then selling the data.


http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20120127/10032017569

1984?

They will funnel money into every state legislature and get sopa/pipa
type legislation passed on a state level. This will be much worse than
the proposed federal laws. Its gonna get ugly.

Best Regards
Tom.
--
http://fija.org/