I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block. The block is
7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The volume is sufficient to
automate the job and I need good, consistent accuracy. Two holes go in each
non-parallel face. One thought I had was to jig and clamp the block with one face
parallel to the table and the opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to
the first face. Two small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the
table could drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top face. All
four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the quills until a limit
switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

"Tom Gardner" w@w wrote in message
...
I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block.
The block is 7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The
volume is sufficient to automate the job and I need good, consistent
accuracy. Two holes go in each non-parallel face. One thought I had was
to jig and clamp the block with one face parallel to the table and the
opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to the first face. Two
small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the table could
drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top
face. All four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the
quills until a limit switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

You had me at the subject line! I'm sitting here thinking "Man... If this
guy has high enough volume, I can absolutely help him!" ...then I noticed it
was you who posted the message and figured you would have called me first
anyhow. LOL.

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

They should operate just fine. Just consider going to a collet-style chuck
if it is a long term project as the chips will fall right into the key-type
chuck by way of gravity and eventually ruin it.

Yes, I can make you collet chucks for the machine.

Much success! ...And take photos.

Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://tinyurl.com/AutoDrill-Facebook

V8013-R

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 02:56:52 -0500, "Tom Gardner" w@w wrote:

I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block. The block is
7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The volume is sufficient to
automate the job and I need good, consistent accuracy. Two holes go in each
non-parallel face. One thought I had was to jig and clamp the block with one face
parallel to the table and the opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to
the first face. Two small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the
table could drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top face. All
four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the quills until a limit
switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?


The bearings in the spindle motor are likely designed for upright use.
Check it out. If true cobble your drill press so the motor is still
right side up. Shouldn't take more than a bracket and an extra long
belt.

Karl

I expect this to work just fine. The motor should not care. The
spindle bearings are designed to cope with the spindle pushing upwards
due to resistance of the material being drilled. So having the head
upside down is nothing truly unusual. Your plan is sound, just keep
going through cheap drill presses if you use them a lot. Joe mentioned
chips getting in the chuck, but you can wrap its business end with
insulation tape or duct tape.

I would make sure, though, to use totally enclosed motors, as a lot of
crud will be falling down. Also watch out for the motor fan clogging
with wood dust.

This whole approach reminds of of WWII production.

i

On 2011-03-10, Tom Gardner w@w wrote:
I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block. The block is
7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The volume is sufficient to
automate the job and I need good, consistent accuracy. Two holes go in each
non-parallel face. One thought I had was to jig and clamp the block with one face
parallel to the table and the opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to
the first face. Two small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the
table could drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top face. All
four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the quills until a limit
switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 02:56:52 -0500, "Tom Gardner" w@w wrote:

I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block. The block is
7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The volume is sufficient to
automate the job and I need good, consistent accuracy. Two holes go in each
non-parallel face. One thought I had was to jig and clamp the block with one face
parallel to the table and the opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to
the first face. Two small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the
table could drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top face. All
four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the quills until a limit
switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

They should work fine that way, just as they do in Oz. And they'll
look nice next to those little brushes wearing top-hats, Tawm.

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.

--
Life is full of obstacle illusions.
-- Grant Frazier

Tom Gardner wrote:
I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block. The block is
7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The volume is sufficient to
automate the job and I need good, consistent accuracy. Two holes go in each
non-parallel face. One thought I had was to jig and clamp the block with one face
parallel to the table and the opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to
the first face. Two small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the
table could drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top face. All
four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the quills until a limit
switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?



How deep are the holes?
What is the spacing?
What accuracy, is needed?

Can you turn this 90 deg. and mount the drills at 17 deg.
Would a die grinder, hand piece (like a foredom), air drill, work.

Maybe I'm looking at this wrong.
I've seen gang drills, like this, but I don't remember where.

--
Gary A. Gorgen | "From ideas to PRODUCTS"
| Tunxis Design Inc.
| Cupertino, Ca. 95014

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 02:56:52 -0500, "Tom Gardner" w@w wrote:

I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block. The block is
7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The volume is sufficient to
automate the job and I need good, consistent accuracy. Two holes go in each
non-parallel face. One thought I had was to jig and clamp the block with one face
parallel to the table and the opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to
the first face. Two small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the
table could drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top face. All
four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the quills until a limit
switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

They should work fine that way, just as they do in Oz. And they'll
look nice next to those little brushes wearing top-hats, Tawm.

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

i

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 09:45:38 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

Bearings might hold the armature solid. Otherwise, some sort of
thrust bushings have to be there to keep it from moving.

--
Life is full of obstacle illusions.
-- Grant Frazier

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 09:45:38 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

Bearings might hold the armature solid. Otherwise, some sort of
thrust bushings have to be there to keep it from moving.


Larry, take apart and electric motor and see for yourself.

i

"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message
...
Nothing a bit of creativity with duct tape won't solve... G

I was thinking more along the lines fo a washer or disc with a drill-sized hole dead
center to "sling" the chips away. But I like yours better. Gives more color
options.
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.

When I have to drill a hole in a ceiling for something, I poke a hole in the bottom of
a paper cup for the drill bit. All the dust goes in the cup.

--Sounds like a fun project; I wonder if Snow Manufacturing is still
around? They used to sell modules to build stuff like this for the Big Guys;
some of it was really complex and quite innovative. Used to work for a
company that built custom automated manufacturing equipment and turning a
drillpress upside down or sideways is pretty ordinary. I have a vague
recollection of someone turning one upside down and mounting the base to a
ceiling rafter, then turning the head around so that quill pointed down
again. This allowed really huge pieces to be drilled anywhere on their
surface.

--
"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Steel, Stainless, Titanium:
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : Guaranteed Uncertified Welding!
www.nmpproducts.com
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

On 3/10/2011 11:24 AM, Joe AutoDrill wrote:

I was thinking more along the lines fo a washer or disc with a drill-sized
hole dead center to "sling" the chips away. But I like yours better. Gives
more color options.

Well that's what I started typing, then wondered if over time, lighter
airborne dust might still find a way into the chuck and lock it up.

Duct tape to the rescue!


Jon

On 3/10/2011 1:49 PM, steamer wrote:

I have a vague recollection of someone turning one upside down and
mounting the base to a ceiling rafter, then turning the head around
so that quill pointed down again. This allowed really huge pieces to
be drilled anywhere on their surface.

I've seen this in a book somewhere in what looked like a WWII era
factory, IIRC. Thought it was a pretty danged clever idea.


Jon

Thought I'd try and find the picture. It's not in the book I was
thinking of, but did find a picture of two guys working with drill
presses inverted on the columns, caption saying this was done for
reaming and (de)burring, with operators simply pushing parts down onto
the tool.

Another picture shows one with the quill mounted horizontal to the
column via a custom adapter. The base is fitting with retractable
castors. It appears the head is raised and lowered by rack and pinion
operated by handwheel. Two pulleys over the top of the column support a
cable for a counterweight that looks to run inside a vertical
rectangular box. I'd guess the bottom of said box has additional weight
to stabilize when being moved. All this, to bring a drill to the work
for side holes.

These are in the Lindsay reprint of Standard and Emergency Shop Methods.


Jon

Joe AutoDrill wrote:

"Tom Gardner" w@w wrote in message
...
I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block.
The block is 7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The
volume is sufficient to automate the job and I need good, consistent
accuracy. Two holes go in each non-parallel face. One thought I had was
to jig and clamp the block with one face parallel to the table and the
opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to the first face. Two
small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the table could
drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top
face. All four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the
quills until a limit switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

You had me at the subject line! I'm sitting here thinking "Man... If this
guy has high enough volume, I can absolutely help him!" ...then I noticed it
was you who posted the message and figured you would have called me first
anyhow. LOL.

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

They should operate just fine. Just consider going to a collet-style chuck
if it is a long term project as the chips will fall right into the key-type
chuck by way of gravity and eventually ruin it.


Use one of these in the righ size to cover the open end of the chuck
after making a hole for the drill. It will keep everything out of the
chuck.

http://www.endcaps.net/pvc-cable-end-sealing-caps.htm


Yes, I can make you collet chucks for the machine.

Much success! ...And take photos.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a Band-Aid™ on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

Ignoramus15362 wrote:
On 2011-03-10, Larry wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 09:45:38 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry wrote:

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

Bearings might hold the armature solid. Otherwise, some sort of
thrust bushings have to be there to keep it from moving.


Larry, take apart and electric motor and see for yourself.

i


Motors made to be mounted with the spindle in a vertical position have
angular contact bearings to compensate for the weight of the rotor
pushing along the motor rotor axis.


John

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 14:48:41 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 09:45:38 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

Bearings might hold the armature solid. Otherwise, some sort of
thrust bushings have to be there to keep it from moving.


Larry, take apart and electric motor and see for yourself.

I have. Several: sewing machines, vacuums, washing machines, old 1/3
to 3/4hp AC motors, etc. Only the ones with pressed-on bearings didn't
have some kind of thrust washer and/or oil-impregnated felt.
I haven't been inside any multi-horse motors, though.

--
Life is full of obstacle illusions.
-- Grant Frazier

On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 16:07:19 -0500, "Tom Gardner" w@w wrote:


"Joe AutoDrill" wrote in message
...
Nothing a bit of creativity with duct tape won't solve... G

I was thinking more along the lines fo a washer or disc with a drill-sized hole dead
center to "sling" the chips away. But I like yours better. Gives more color
options.
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.

When I have to drill a hole in a ceiling for something, I poke a hole in the bottom of
a paper cup for the drill bit. All the dust goes in the cup.

Shop vac works well, too. (during is better, but after works)


--
Life is full of obstacle illusions.
-- Grant Frazier

On 2011-03-11, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 14:48:41 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 09:45:38 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

Bearings might hold the armature solid. Otherwise, some sort of
thrust bushings have to be there to keep it from moving.


Larry, take apart and electric motor and see for yourself.

I have. Several: sewing machines, vacuums, washing machines, old 1/3
to 3/4hp AC motors, etc. Only the ones with pressed-on bearings didn't
have some kind of thrust washer and/or oil-impregnated felt.
I haven't been inside any multi-horse motors, though.



And, come to think of it, I only took apart horizontal mount motors.

i

"Michael A. Terrell" wrote in message
...

Joe AutoDrill wrote:

"Tom Gardner" w@w wrote in message
...
I have a project that involves drilling four 1/8" holes in a wood block.
The block is 7.5" long x 3" wide but has a trapezoid cross section. The
volume is sufficient to automate the job and I need good, consistent
accuracy. Two holes go in each non-parallel face. One thought I had was
to jig and clamp the block with one face parallel to the table and the
opposite face would have a 34 degree angle compared to the first face. Two
small cheepie drill presses were mounted upside down under the table could
drill those two holes and two more drill presses would be mounted
right-side up but at a 34 degree angle would drill the two holes on the top
face. All four drill presses would have an air cylinder to extent the
quills until a limit switch is hit. (Joe Autodrill.........STOP laughing!)

You had me at the subject line! I'm sitting here thinking "Man... If this
guy has high enough volume, I can absolutely help him!" ...then I noticed it
was you who posted the message and figured you would have called me first
anyhow. LOL.

Will the drill presses operate OK upside-down?

They should operate just fine. Just consider going to a collet-style chuck
if it is a long term project as the chips will fall right into the key-type
chuck by way of gravity and eventually ruin it.


Use one of these in the righ size to cover the open end of the chuck
after making a hole for the drill. It will keep everything out of the
chuck.

http://www.endcaps.net/pvc-cable-end-sealing-caps.htm


Yes, I can make you collet chucks for the machine.

Much success! ...And take photos.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a Band-AidT on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

They look like prophylactics for Threshing Machine accident victims.

"Ignoramus15362" wrote in message
...
On 2011-03-11, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 14:48:41 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 09:45:38 -0600, Ignoramus15362
wrote:

On 2011-03-10, Larry Jaques wrote:

The only thing I'd worry about is whether or not the motors have the
same thrust bearings top and bottom. You might be able to reverse
their mounting position and flip the pulley over, though. I guess it'd
depend on the shaft length.


Motors usually do not have thrust bearings.

Bearings might hold the armature solid. Otherwise, some sort of
thrust bushings have to be there to keep it from moving.


Larry, take apart and electric motor and see for yourself.

I have. Several: sewing machines, vacuums, washing machines, old 1/3
to 3/4hp AC motors, etc. Only the ones with pressed-on bearings didn't
have some kind of thrust washer and/or oil-impregnated felt.
I haven't been inside any multi-horse motors, though.



And, come to think of it, I only took apart horizontal mount motors.

i

I think it will be important for me to take the motors apart and inspect. I don't
think of these things so I ask!

Tom Gardner wrote:

Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Use one of these in the righ size to cover the open end of the chuck
after making a hole for the drill. It will keep everything out of the
chuck.

http://www.endcaps.net/pvc-cable-end-sealing-caps.htm

They look like prophylactics for Threshing Machine accident victims.


Smaller ones are used to seal the ends of elecrtical wire & coax.
they are similar to the molded rubber caps for vacuum lines, but they
don't dryrot. I have some that are over 25 years old that are still
good.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a Band-Aid™ on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

Shop vac works well, too. (during is better, but after works)

Not if it's a powerful one with a long hose that lets the canister be in
another room... and you forget to install the filter after a water removal
process a few weeks earlier.

....don't ask how I know this.
--


Regards,
Joe Agro, Jr.
(800) 871-5022
01.908.542.0244
Automatic / Pneumatic Drills: http://www.AutoDrill.com
Multiple Spindle Drills: http://www.Multi-Drill.com
Production Tapping: http://Production-Tapping-Equipment.com/
Flagship Site: http://www.Drill-N-Tap.com
VIDEOS: http://www.youtube.com/user/AutoDrill
TWITTER: http://twitter.com/AutoDrill
FACEBOOK: http://tinyurl.com/AutoDrill-Facebook

V8013-R

On 2011-03-11, Tom Gardner w@w wrote:

"Ignoramus15362" wrote in message
...

[ ... ]

And, come to think of it, I only took apart horizontal mount motors.

[ ... ]

I think it will be important for me to take the motors apart and inspect. I don't
think of these things so I ask!

Perhaps -- but don't take apart stepper motors or permanent
magnet motors. You can significantly degauss the permanent magnets by
doing that -- same as for magnetic chucks.

Why not just push and pull on the motor shaft to see how well it
handles the gravity loads?

Enjoy,
DoN.

--
Remove oil spill source from e-mail
Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---

"DoN. Nichols" wrote in message
...
On 2011-03-11, Tom Gardner w@w wrote:

"Ignoramus15362" wrote in message
...

[ ... ]

And, come to think of it, I only took apart horizontal mount motors.

[ ... ]

I think it will be important for me to take the motors apart and inspect. I don't
think of these things so I ask!

Perhaps -- but don't take apart stepper motors or permanent
magnet motors. You can significantly degauss the permanent magnets by
doing that -- same as for magnetic chucks.

Why not just push and pull on the motor shaft to see how well it
handles the gravity loads?

Enjoy,
DoN.


Ah, good point!