I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works well
even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a dozen channels
or so, some duplicates. Small tower and outdoor antenna is planned for
future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on the TV,
connect to my home network. My WinTV board was for Windows Media Center
edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR receiver, remote, and IR
transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? Any recommendations? Do
video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows desktop on
one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just work as using the
TV instead of a monitor? I thought maybe I could use UltraVNC from my
laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

RogerN wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works
well even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a
dozen channels or so, some duplicates. Small tower and outdoor
antenna is planned for future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on
the TV, connect to my home network. My WinTV board was for Windows
Media Center edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR
receiver, remote, and IR transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Can't help ya with the MCE problem , but I do have a comp set up with a
wireless keyboard and mouse . I'm running Vista Ultimate , with a vid card
that outputs for a std monitor connection and s-video . They make adapters
from s-vid to RCA plug if your teevee doesn't have that input jack . I have
another card , not using it right now , that puts out VGA , DVID (I think
that's what it's called , for LCD flatscreen) , and RCA . Audio is plugged
into the teevee , y'ed to my stereo too . I don't have a tuner card - yet .
Probably will soon though , I'd like to drop the sat receivers and save that
money every month .

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? Any recommendations?
Do video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows
desktop on one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just
work as using the TV instead of a monitor? I thought maybe I could
use UltraVNC from my laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

My video card sets it up as a dual-monitor , but normal computer-type
windows don't show up well on the teevee . BTW , I'm using a CRT unit that's
at least 15 years old . My card uses ATI catalyst control center , I'm sure
there are other driver programs that will perform the same function .
As far as content , my DVR (directv) is hooked to my home network , and
it's supposed to play content from computer storage - but doesn't work worth
a crap . I D/L and save pretty much whatever content I want ; another option
is HULU and similar sites that stream content .
HTH !
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

On Jan 9, 1:28*pm, "RogerN" wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works well
even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a dozen channels
or so, some duplicates. *Small tower and outdoor antenna is planned for
future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on the TV,
connect to my home network. *My WinTV board was for Windows Media Center
edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR receiver, remote, and IR
transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? *Any recommendations? *Do
video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows desktop on
one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just work as using the
TV instead of a monitor? *I thought maybe I could use UltraVNC from my
laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

I built a barely satisfactory one with XP and a decent one with Win7.

The tuner is a Hauppauge HVR-950, mostly because it was on sale for
$50. AFAIK it doesn't tune channels that showed significant multipath
on analog. The CD software was functional but unimpressive.

The XP machine is a 2.2 GHz Dell with a Radeon s9250 graphics card,
because the mobo has only PCI slots.
Process Explorer showed the CPU running at over 90% and it couldn't
capture rapid motion at 1080i. The program hung up if a passing plane
caused a dropout.

The 7 machine is a 3GHz single-core Dell with an Asus EAH4350 card in
its AGP slot. 7 Media Center loaded the Hauppauge drivers from the CD
and lived happily ever after, so far. ProcExp shows ~30% CPU load and
~0.5G of RAM in use.

I use a 22" HDTV for the monitor, placed close enough that I don't
need or have a remote. It's connected with an HDMI cable, audio goes
to the PC's speakers. Unless I'm recording I plug the cable into the
HDTV, which draws 30W with the brightness at 0, compared to ~180W for
the PC. Since 1/1/11 it's used $0.19 of electricity

My 1980's outdoor antenna was damaged in a storm so I made a new UHF
dipole from two 6"x 1/2" aluminum rods stuck into plastic hose
insulator, copying the dimensions of the broken original. I
straightened and salvaged the director and reflector.

I back up C: occasionally with Acronis, so it's only a 40GB that's
about 1/4 full and all recordings go to an added 1T internal drive,
wth an external 2T as backup.

There are several ways to configure multiple monitors. I usually
Extend My Desktop onto the second and third ones, and arrange them in
Display PropertiesSettings to match their physical positions so the
mouse slides smoothly between them. Be careful to keep critical icons
on the primary display, sometimes Windows doesn't realize that a
display is off.

Good luck. Both computers needed substantial fussing to make them
work.

"Snag" wrote in message
...
RogerN wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works
well even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a
dozen channels or so, some duplicates. Small tower and outdoor
antenna is planned for future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on
the TV, connect to my home network. My WinTV board was for Windows
Media Center edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR
receiver, remote, and IR transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Can't help ya with the MCE problem , but I do have a comp set up with a
wireless keyboard and mouse . I'm running Vista Ultimate , with a vid card
that outputs for a std monitor connection and s-video . They make
adapters from s-vid to RCA plug if your teevee doesn't have that input
jack . I have another card , not using it right now , that puts out VGA ,
DVID (I think that's what it's called , for LCD flatscreen) , and RCA .
Audio is plugged into the teevee , y'ed to my stereo too . I don't have a
tuner card - yet . Probably will soon though , I'd like to drop the sat
receivers and save that money every month .

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? Any recommendations?
Do video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows
desktop on one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just
work as using the TV instead of a monitor? I thought maybe I could
use UltraVNC from my laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

My video card sets it up as a dual-monitor , but normal computer-type
windows don't show up well on the teevee . BTW , I'm using a CRT unit
that's at least 15 years old . My card uses ATI catalyst control center ,
I'm sure there are other driver programs that will perform the same
function .
As far as content , my DVR (directv) is hooked to my home network , and
it's supposed to play content from computer storage - but doesn't work
worth a crap . I D/L and save pretty much whatever content I want ;
another option is HULU and similar sites that stream content .
HTH !
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

Thanks for the info. I'd like to output to the TV screen but have a second
video port for a PC monitor. That way one screen can be used for computer
functions, selecting what video file to play, etc, while the other screen is
the TV displaying TV tuner or videos.

Part of this idea comes from my work, we have PC's running equipment running
Siemens soft PLC's. We don't have any keyboard or monitor connected to the
control pc PLCs. We have UltraVNC on the PC's and connect remotely, the
remote computer becomes the monitor, keyboard, and mouse for the control pc
plc.

I'd like to have my DVR and tuner functions run off the remote to the TV,
and use remote access through the network to handle the computer functions
of the media center PC.

I got rid of Dish Network so I'd like to spend a little to make my free
antenna TV and movies convenient to record and play back.

RogerN

RogerN wrote:
"Snag" wrote in message
...
RogerN wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it
works well even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting
around a dozen channels or so, some duplicates. Small tower and
outdoor antenna is planned for future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have
a digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play
video, install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will
play on the TV, connect to my home network. My WinTV board was for
Windows Media Center edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the
IR receiver, remote, and IR transmitter doesn't work with Windows
XP Pro.

Can't help ya with the MCE problem , but I do have a comp set up
with a wireless keyboard and mouse . I'm running Vista Ultimate ,
with a vid card that outputs for a std monitor connection and s-video .
They make adapters from s-vid to RCA plug if your teevee
doesn't have that input jack . I have another card , not using it
right now , that puts out VGA , DVID (I think that's what it's
called , for LCD flatscreen) , and RCA . Audio is plugged into the
teevee , y'ed to my stereo too . I don't have a tuner card - yet .
Probably will soon though , I'd like to drop the sat receivers and
save that money every month .

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? Any
recommendations? Do video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor
setup with windows desktop on one monitor and TV on the other
monitor, or does it just work as using the TV instead of a monitor?
I thought maybe I could use UltraVNC from my laptop to select
movies to play on the TV. RogerN

My video card sets it up as a dual-monitor , but normal
computer-type windows don't show up well on the teevee . BTW , I'm
using a CRT unit that's at least 15 years old . My card uses ATI
catalyst control center , I'm sure there are other driver programs
that will perform the same function .
As far as content , my DVR (directv) is hooked to my home network ,
and it's supposed to play content from computer storage - but
doesn't work worth a crap . I D/L and save pretty much whatever
content I want ; another option is HULU and similar sites that
stream content . HTH !
--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

Thanks for the info. I'd like to output to the TV screen but have a
second video port for a PC monitor. That way one screen can be used
for computer functions, selecting what video file to play, etc, while
the other screen is the TV displaying TV tuner or videos.

OK , maybe I wasn't very clear - that is how my setup works . The monitor
shows all the icons just like a regular desktop , while the tv shows a movie
or tv episode - if your processor/system can handle the load , you can surf
the web on the monitor while the kids or wife watch tv . When I open media
player I have to drag & drop that window over into the tv screen . Basically
a dual-monitor setup . On my system that's a function of the video card and
it's software .

Part of this idea comes from my work, we have PC's running equipment
running Siemens soft PLC's. We don't have any keyboard or monitor
connected to the control pc PLCs. We have UltraVNC on the PC's and
connect remotely, the remote computer becomes the monitor, keyboard,
and mouse for the control pc plc.

I have most of my comps set up with XP Pro so I can remote them , just as
you're describing .

I'd like to have my DVR and tuner functions run off the remote to the
TV, and use remote access through the network to handle the computer
functions of the media center PC.

Sounds like tuner/DVR stuff will be a function of whatever tuner card you
use . I have no experience with a setup like that . Again , remoting that
comp from another will be a function of the OS you choose . I prefer XP Pro
, Vista sucks and I've never played with 7 .

I got rid of Dish Network so I'd like to spend a little to make my
free antenna TV and movies convenient to record and play back.

RogerN

I can relate . Right now , we've got a Directv DVR hooked to the living
room tv . When I want to watch content from the comp I put the tv into
"s-vhs" mode , and select/start/stop the content from the comp with a
wireless keyboard/mouse . It would be easier with a handheld remote ... but
yanno , I'm not sure that would let me access the stuff I have saved on the
various comps in the house - I've got movies/series episodes saved on 3
different machines .

--
Snag
Learning keeps
you young !

On Jan 9, 11:28*am, "RogerN" wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works well
even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a dozen channels
or so, some duplicates. *Small tower and outdoor antenna is planned for
future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on the TV,
connect to my home network. *My WinTV board was for Windows Media Center
edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR receiver, remote, and IR
transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? *Any recommendations? *Do
video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows desktop on
one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just work as using the
TV instead of a monitor? *I thought maybe I could use UltraVNC from my
laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

If you want HD, you're probably going to have to scare up a video card
with an HDMI output, or at least DVI. These generally are PCIe, so a
somewhat newer PC is needed. Some HD content won't work without the
latest MS OS, either, DRM is the order of the day and native HDMI is
called for, too. If you want OTA HD, the old WinTV isn't going to cut
it, analog is dead and the thing is old enough it won't do digital.
The Windows software Hauppauge supplies is rather finicky to set up.
I've been using a old 150 card, on a 3 GHz box, WinTV 2000 sucks 50%
of the processor just idling along. Some versions run 25-30%, but
aren't stable or produce artifacts when recording. See www.shspvr.com
for a bunch of software versions and forums on Hauppauge cards. I'm
using S-video input from the satellite box, it's not HD but good
enough on the monitor I have. The analog tuner on the 150 is just
dead weight anymore. I have to program the box scheduler to coincide
with the PVR card scheduler. It works, but it's not the handiest
thing.

The 150 replaced an even older PVR PCI card, that used to run at most
5% of CPU, too bad it died.

Generally the TV-out video cards can be set up to either be an
extension of your desktop or echoing what the current one does. It's
done in the Desktop video setup. There might have to be an app
running to convert PC video to TV video, just depends on the card and
what hardware is on board. Some have hardware converters, cheaper
cards depend on software. Don't underestimate CPU requirements. Same
goes for power requirements, newer display cards take an amazing
amount of 12v power, some up to 50 amps. You can't go by overall PS
wattage anymore, you have to look at the supply's individual output
current ratings for each voltage.

MythTV is Linux-based, you need a front end box and a backend for it
to do its stuff. Networked, naturally. I've looked into it, best
results seem to be with purpose-made boxes with components selected
for compatibility. There are a few outfits that have dual-digital
tuner cards for Linux, not outrageously priced for what they are, but
not pocket-money either. I'm slowly accumulating parts, haven't
invested in the tuner yet.

Stan

On Jan 10, 8:02*am, wrote:
...
If you want HD, you're probably going to have to scare up a video card
with an HDMI output, or at least DVI. *These generally are PCIe, so a
somewhat newer *PC is needed.
...Same
goes for power requirements, newer display cards take an amazing
amount of 12v power, some up to 50 amps. *You can't go by overall PS
wattage anymore, you have to look at the supply's individual output
current ratings for each voltage.
...
Stan-

Oops, the Asus EAH4350 is PCIe, not AGP, that card is in a different
PC. I'd read warnings about the driver shipped with it and let Win7
load its own, which works well though without HDMI support, but it
runs a VGA and a DVI monitor fine. I didn't load and haven't needed
the Catalyst Control Center, which didn't do much good on the XP
machine.

I like multiple monitors too, but didn't see much use for the second
one in 7 MC. On an HDTV a window is still a large image and if I'm
typing into another window I'm not staring at the TV picture. So I
plugged the second 19" monitor into this laptop and use it for
webpages while the laptop display shows connection status and open
files and folders, like the temporary one where Youtube videos go and
can be copied to *.flv files the VLC player will open.

This program saves and restores the locations of icons, which
otherwise jump around when you switch between one and two monitors:
http://www.midiox.com/index.htm?http...toprestore.htm

jsw

"Jim Wilkins" wrote in message
...
On Jan 9, 1:28 pm, "RogerN" wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works well
even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a dozen
channels
or so, some duplicates. Small tower and outdoor antenna is planned for
future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on the
TV,
connect to my home network. My WinTV board was for Windows Media Center
edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR receiver, remote, and IR
transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? Any recommendations? Do
video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows desktop
on
one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just work as using the
TV instead of a monitor? I thought maybe I could use UltraVNC from my
laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

I built a barely satisfactory one with XP and a decent one with Win7.

The tuner is a Hauppauge HVR-950, mostly because it was on sale for
$50. AFAIK it doesn't tune channels that showed significant multipath
on analog. The CD software was functional but unimpressive.

The XP machine is a 2.2 GHz Dell with a Radeon s9250 graphics card,
because the mobo has only PCI slots.
Process Explorer showed the CPU running at over 90% and it couldn't
capture rapid motion at 1080i. The program hung up if a passing plane
caused a dropout.

The 7 machine is a 3GHz single-core Dell with an Asus EAH4350 card in
its AGP slot. 7 Media Center loaded the Hauppauge drivers from the CD
and lived happily ever after, so far. ProcExp shows ~30% CPU load and
~0.5G of RAM in use.

I use a 22" HDTV for the monitor, placed close enough that I don't
need or have a remote. It's connected with an HDMI cable, audio goes
to the PC's speakers. Unless I'm recording I plug the cable into the
HDTV, which draws 30W with the brightness at 0, compared to ~180W for
the PC. Since 1/1/11 it's used $0.19 of electricity

My 1980's outdoor antenna was damaged in a storm so I made a new UHF
dipole from two 6"x 1/2" aluminum rods stuck into plastic hose
insulator, copying the dimensions of the broken original. I
straightened and salvaged the director and reflector.

I back up C: occasionally with Acronis, so it's only a 40GB that's
about 1/4 full and all recordings go to an added 1T internal drive,
wth an external 2T as backup.

There are several ways to configure multiple monitors. I usually
Extend My Desktop onto the second and third ones, and arrange them in
Display PropertiesSettings to match their physical positions so the
mouse slides smoothly between them. Be careful to keep critical icons
on the primary display, sometimes Windows doesn't realize that a
display is off.

Good luck. Both computers needed substantial fussing to make them
work.


*****

Thanks for the info Jim,

I'm wanting to get my hands on a suitable PC, without dismantling my desktop
PC, and try windows 7 and MythBuntu linux DVR. I have saved money by no
longer paying for satellite TV so I figure I can spend a little on a DVR and
media center. The idea is to record what few interesting programs come in
by antenna and watch them when nothing good is on. Also I would like to
save my DVD movies to watch without changing disks every movie.

RogerN

wrote in message
...
On Jan 9, 11:28 am, "RogerN" wrote:
I made the home made antenna to receive digital TV for free, it works well
even though I have it inside the house, I'm getting around a dozen
channels
or so, some duplicates. Small tower and outdoor antenna is planned for
future project.

I've been thinking about setting up a media center PC so I can have a
digital video recorder, digitize old video tapes, and play movies.

So far my plan is to get a cheap PC that's good enough to play video,
install my Hauppauge WinTV card, get a video card that will play on the
TV,
connect to my home network. My WinTV board was for Windows Media Center
edition, I don't have on my desktop PC, so the IR receiver, remote, and IR
transmitter doesn't work with Windows XP Pro.

Anyone here done similar with windows or Linux? Any recommendations? Do
video cards with TV out work like a 2 monitor setup with windows desktop
on
one monitor and TV on the other monitor, or does it just work as using the
TV instead of a monitor? I thought maybe I could use UltraVNC from my
laptop to select movies to play on the TV.

RogerN

If you want HD, you're probably going to have to scare up a video card
with an HDMI output, or at least DVI. These generally are PCIe, so a
somewhat newer PC is needed. Some HD content won't work without the
latest MS OS, either, DRM is the order of the day and native HDMI is
called for, too. If you want OTA HD, the old WinTV isn't going to cut
it, analog is dead and the thing is old enough it won't do digital.
The Windows software Hauppauge supplies is rather finicky to set up.
I've been using a old 150 card, on a 3 GHz box, WinTV 2000 sucks 50%
of the processor just idling along. Some versions run 25-30%, but
aren't stable or produce artifacts when recording. See www.shspvr.com
for a bunch of software versions and forums on Hauppauge cards. I'm
using S-video input from the satellite box, it's not HD but good
enough on the monitor I have. The analog tuner on the 150 is just
dead weight anymore. I have to program the box scheduler to coincide
with the PVR card scheduler. It works, but it's not the handiest
thing.

The 150 replaced an even older PVR PCI card, that used to run at most
5% of CPU, too bad it died.

Generally the TV-out video cards can be set up to either be an
extension of your desktop or echoing what the current one does. It's
done in the Desktop video setup. There might have to be an app
running to convert PC video to TV video, just depends on the card and
what hardware is on board. Some have hardware converters, cheaper
cards depend on software. Don't underestimate CPU requirements. Same
goes for power requirements, newer display cards take an amazing
amount of 12v power, some up to 50 amps. You can't go by overall PS
wattage anymore, you have to look at the supply's individual output
current ratings for each voltage.

MythTV is Linux-based, you need a front end box and a backend for it
to do its stuff. Networked, naturally. I've looked into it, best
results seem to be with purpose-made boxes with components selected
for compatibility. There are a few outfits that have dual-digital
tuner cards for Linux, not outrageously priced for what they are, but
not pocket-money either. I'm slowly accumulating parts, haven't
invested in the tuner yet.

Stan

Thanks for the information!

I should have clarified, the WinTV card I have is the Hauppauge 1600, it has
one analog tuner and 1 digital tuner. The digital tuner tunes in the local
digital channels from the homemade antenna and is supposed to be able to
record 1080i although I just have an old fashioned analog TV that doesn't
display HDTV... for now. I'm saving a decent amount of money by not having
a TV bill so I don't mind spending some to get a good enough media center.

RogerN

I know squat about other internet viewing of TV/movie programming, other
than what I've heard about, such as Hulu or other options that typically
require installation of some particular software on a PC.

Like some others here in RCM, my TV viewing began with B/W TV (and often
weak signals), so the clarity of newer digital broadcast (cable or over-air)
TV on an LCD screen is HD to me (and maybe many others).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HD...esolutions.png

One thing to consider about these images, is that they're still-shots,
regardless of what they were captured from. With moving images, the
distinction is different, and clarity depends upon the electronics utilized,
and that old addage.. but instead, clarity is in the eye of the beholder
(and various other factors such as room lighting).

When I was doing consumer electronic servicing/repair, I could not believe
some of the weird settings people chose to change the TV image from sharp,
natural colors, to something else. The same is evident when visiting others'
homes.

I don't know if I'd actually see much difference between the various HD
standards available today.
I'm apparently not an average consumer, or certainly not the target of
marketing strategists, when it comes to new products. It's very unlikely
that I'd spend several thousand for a latest-version TV.. I'd rather watch a
standard LCD, or even a large CRT (which aren't generally available in new
models).

Decent quality projectors are becoming commonly available as used (govt,
corporate, etc) surplus at reasonable/cheap prices for setting up a home
theater-type viewing experience for those interested in a huge picture.
Yep, projection equipment/boxes have some issues.

--
WB
..........


"Steve Ackman" wrote in message
...

The Wii also does Netflix. (Since all our computers
are 'nix, they can't do the proprietary streaming
format Netflix uses.) Wii is also wireless, but only
has A/V out and since we only have a 1.4 mbps ADSL
connection, so only get standard digital resoltion anyway.

Matter of fact, Netflix is available on a wide
variety of devices... even some "netcast" TVs.
http://www.netflix.com/NetflixReadyDevices

Lots of current and older TV shows as well, and
985 titles from Starzplay.

Anything we might want to see in HD, we have to
get the snailmailed DVD anyway.

Torchwood and Dr. Who for instance. Lots of others.

straight thru, or individual episodes, or stop anywhere, and resume at
the
same place at my leisure.

I think that's true with any "internet tv" isn't it?

On Wed, 12 Jan 2011 22:08:09 -0500, "Wild_Bill"
wrote:

I know squat about other internet viewing of TV/movie programming, other
than what I've heard about, such as Hulu or other options that typically
require installation of some particular software on a PC.

Like some others here in RCM, my TV viewing began with B/W TV (and often
weak signals), so the clarity of newer digital broadcast (cable or over-air)
TV on an LCD screen is HD to me (and maybe many others).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HD...esolutions.png

One thing to consider about these images, is that they're still-shots,
regardless of what they were captured from. With moving images, the
distinction is different, and clarity depends upon the electronics utilized,
and that old addage.. but instead, clarity is in the eye of the beholder
(and various other factors such as room lighting).

When I was doing consumer electronic servicing/repair, I could not believe
some of the weird settings people chose to change the TV image from sharp,
natural colors, to something else. The same is evident when visiting others'
homes.

I don't know if I'd actually see much difference between the various HD
standards available today.
I'm apparently not an average consumer, or certainly not the target of
marketing strategists, when it comes to new products. It's very unlikely
that I'd spend several thousand for a latest-version TV.. I'd rather watch a
standard LCD, or even a large CRT (which aren't generally available in new
models).

Decent quality projectors are becoming commonly available as used (govt,
corporate, etc) surplus at reasonable/cheap prices for setting up a home
theater-type viewing experience for those interested in a huge picture.
Yep, projection equipment/boxes have some issues.
Just installed a wide-throw HD compatible projector in the
Media/training room at the office - on a 12 foot screen.

Impressive, but not nearly as sharp as a 60 inch 1080P plasma

In the past few years, I've noticed various flat, big screen TVs with many
prices being in excess of $2k.

I haven't gone to the effort to go look up the actual specs of TVs in a very
long time. I realize that there are essentially two different types.. LCD
and plasma displays, but newer technologies are being added such as LED
backlighting and full-color LEDs.

I do know that LCDs aren't generally capable of reproducing fast motion..
CRT phosphors were better for that.
I don't know if true motion representation is a matter of the price of the
LCD, or what the most recent advances are.

Since the early days of filming western-type movies, where the wagon wheels
appeared to be rotating backwards, there have always been certain
characteristics which the viewer needs to adapt to.

In a recent thread in another newsgroup, wrt good/better sound from a flat
screen TV, I immediately thought of Bose.. and wouldn't ya know it, yep,
they offer their own brand of TVs with Bose Sound.. for as much as $5k (46"
LCD).

http://www.pcworld.com/article/20651...literally.html

http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2010/09/...rnal-speakers/

--
WB
..........


"Steve Ackman" wrote in message
...

Yeah, until you see the Blueray version on a 1080p
screen @ 5' away. Sitting 15' away watching on a 32"
screen does tend to blur the distinction though.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HD...esolutions.png

This one shows it better:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...esolutions.png

Screen size and distance from it would be two major
ones also.

I don't know if I'd actually see much difference between the various HD
standards available today.

I recently had a DVD and a Netflix download (@ ~1mbps)
of the same movie, and showed my wife that she could
read the street signs and taxi cab numbers, license
plates, etc., when up close to the DVD version... stuff
that was all blurry on the Netflix version. Back to
the couch, and the difference was barely noticeable.
Guess that only proves our eyes are getting to the point
of needing a much larger screen than 32". ;-)


I don't even know what a "latest-version TV" is,
especially one that costs several thousand! Are you
referring to the trillions-of-colors available with
RGBY, or is there something even newer and more
expensive?

On Jan 16, 6:12*pm, "Wild_Bill" wrote:
In the past few years, I've noticed various flat, big screen TVs with many
prices being in excess of $2k.

I haven't gone to the effort to go look up the actual specs of TVs in a very
long time. I realize that there are essentially two different types.. LCD
and plasma displays, but newer technologies are being added such as LED
backlighting and full-color LEDs.

I do know that LCDs aren't generally capable of reproducing fast motion..
CRT phosphors were better for that.
I don't know if true motion representation is a matter of the price of the
LCD, or what the most recent advances are.

Since the early days of filming western-type movies, where the wagon wheels
appeared to be rotating backwards, there have always been certain
characteristics which the viewer needs to adapt to.

In a recent thread in another newsgroup, wrt good/better sound from a flat
screen TV, I immediately thought of Bose.. and wouldn't ya know it, yep,
they offer their own brand of TVs with Bose Sound.. for as much as $5k (46"
LCD).

*http://www.pcworld.com/article/20651...good_literally....

http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2010/09/...romises-theate...

--
WB
- Show quoted text -

Prices have dropped a bunch since you've looked at flat panels,
apparently. You can get a 42" LCD for what a 27" CRT used to sell for
and it looks a hell of a lot better. LCDs have upped refresh rate and
lowered response time so motion artifacts aren't noticible, 120Hz is
quite affordable these days. Prices have dropped like a rock this
last year or so. LED backlighting adds a couple of hundred to the
cost, not worth the extra cost, IMO, right at this time. Maybe later
this year. A lot of sets above the bargain level can be networked to
a video server and can display a number of video and still photo
formats, so more than just a TV set anymore. And the benefits have
slopped over onto the computer monitor market, response times on those
flat panels has dropped as well and they're CHEAP. I've run the b-in-
l's LG TV from my laptop as a second display, so that's another
bennie. Has a VGA connector built-in.

You can spend several thousand on a flat panel, but you have to work
at it. One in that price range will probably be 5' or larger and have
all the name-brand audio goodies, probably 3D as well.

Stan

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:08:48 -0800 (PST), wrote:

--snip--
Prices have dropped a bunch since you've looked at flat panels,
apparently. You can get a 42" LCD for what a 27" CRT used to sell for
and it looks a hell of a lot better. LCDs have upped refresh rate and
lowered response time so motion artifacts aren't noticible, 120Hz is
quite affordable these days. Prices have dropped like a rock this
last year or so. LED backlighting adds a couple of hundred to the
cost, not worth the extra cost, IMO, right at this time. Maybe later
this year. A lot of sets above the bargain level can be networked to
a video server and can display a number of video and still photo
formats, so more than just a TV set anymore. And the benefits have
slopped over onto the computer monitor market, response times on those
flat panels has dropped as well and they're CHEAP. I've run the b-in-
l's LG TV from my laptop as a second display, so that's another
bennie. Has a VGA connector built-in.

My neighbor is looking to replace her 1960 television set and doesn't
know what to look for with all the new tech. I haven't bought a set
(tube) since I move here in '02 and I'm out of the loop. She's looking
for cheapest possible, possibly with a DVD built into it. In an hour
of research (I may need a new set some day, too) I've stumbled into
the horrors of plasma (expensive to run), etc. Stan, can you (or
anyone here) give me an update into the 21st century TV standards? I
think it might be well received by many.

It looks like a 720p 32" will work for her, but I'm not sure about the
60hz figure. She watches tennis, so there's some need for quick pixel
changes. Will these lower level sets work OK for her? She's 72 and
refuses to get new glasses.


You can spend several thousand on a flat panel, but you have to work
at it. One in that price range will probably be 5' or larger and have
all the name-brand audio goodies, probably 3D as well.

3-D? What a gimmick!

--
Live in the sunshine, swim the sea, drink the wild air...
-- Ralph Waldo Emerson

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:54:38 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:08:48 -0800 (PST), wrote:

--snip--
Prices have dropped a bunch since you've looked at flat panels,
apparently. You can get a 42" LCD for what a 27" CRT used to sell for
and it looks a hell of a lot better. LCDs have upped refresh rate and
lowered response time so motion artifacts aren't noticible, 120Hz is
quite affordable these days. Prices have dropped like a rock this
last year or so. LED backlighting adds a couple of hundred to the
cost, not worth the extra cost, IMO, right at this time. Maybe later
this year. A lot of sets above the bargain level can be networked to
a video server and can display a number of video and still photo
formats, so more than just a TV set anymore. And the benefits have
slopped over onto the computer monitor market, response times on those
flat panels has dropped as well and they're CHEAP. I've run the b-in-
l's LG TV from my laptop as a second display, so that's another
bennie. Has a VGA connector built-in.

My neighbor is looking to replace her 1960 television set and doesn't
know what to look for with all the new tech. I haven't bought a set
(tube) since I move here in '02 and I'm out of the loop. She's looking
for cheapest possible, possibly with a DVD built into it. In an hour
of research (I may need a new set some day, too) I've stumbled into
the horrors of plasma (expensive to run), etc. Stan, can you (or
anyone here) give me an update into the 21st century TV standards? I
think it might be well received by many.

It looks like a 720p 32" will work for her, but I'm not sure about the
60hz figure. She watches tennis, so there's some need for quick pixel
changes. Will these lower level sets work OK for her? She's 72 and
refuses to get new glasses.


You can spend several thousand on a flat panel, but you have to work
at it. One in that price range will probably be 5' or larger and have
all the name-brand audio goodies, probably 3D as well.

3-D? What a gimmick!
The new plasma sets are not nearly as bad as some would have you
believe. Testing by the local TV shop before christmas showed with an
"average" picture, a 42" Panasonic Plasma drew 90 watts, the same
sized Panasonic LCD drew 80 watts, and a competitor's 42" LED drew 70
watts.

My 28" LCD draws 56 watts
My 42" Panasonic Plasma draws an average of right around the 90 watts.
With Plasma the current draw goes up with brighter screen - so
watching skiing or hockey can draw about twice what watching a night
scene in a movie will draw.

Larry Jaques wrote:

My neighbor is looking to replace her 1960 television set and doesn't
know what to look for with all the new tech. I haven't bought a set
(tube) since I move here in '02 and I'm out of the loop. She's looking
for cheapest possible, possibly with a DVD built into it.


A combo that that will be lucky to last a couple years, let alone 50.


It looks like a 720p 32" will work for her, but I'm not sure about the
60hz figure. She watches tennis, so there's some need for quick pixel
changes. Will these lower level sets work OK for her? She's 72 and
refuses to get new glasses.


Take her to a store like Best buy and let her see how a tennis game
looks on the sets she likes.


--
You can't fix stupid. You can't even put a band-aid on it, because it's
Teflon coated.

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 14:10:12 -0500, wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:54:38 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:08:48 -0800 (PST), wrote:

--snip--
Prices have dropped a bunch since you've looked at flat panels,
apparently. You can get a 42" LCD for what a 27" CRT used to sell for
and it looks a hell of a lot better. LCDs have upped refresh rate and
lowered response time so motion artifacts aren't noticible, 120Hz is
quite affordable these days. Prices have dropped like a rock this
last year or so. LED backlighting adds a couple of hundred to the
cost, not worth the extra cost, IMO, right at this time. Maybe later
this year. A lot of sets above the bargain level can be networked to
a video server and can display a number of video and still photo
formats, so more than just a TV set anymore. And the benefits have
slopped over onto the computer monitor market, response times on those
flat panels has dropped as well and they're CHEAP. I've run the b-in-
l's LG TV from my laptop as a second display, so that's another
bennie. Has a VGA connector built-in.

My neighbor is looking to replace her 1960 television set and doesn't
know what to look for with all the new tech. I haven't bought a set
(tube) since I move here in '02 and I'm out of the loop. She's looking
for cheapest possible, possibly with a DVD built into it. In an hour
of research (I may need a new set some day, too) I've stumbled into
the horrors of plasma (expensive to run), etc. Stan, can you (or
anyone here) give me an update into the 21st century TV standards? I
think it might be well received by many.

It looks like a 720p 32" will work for her, but I'm not sure about the
60hz figure. She watches tennis, so there's some need for quick pixel
changes. Will these lower level sets work OK for her? She's 72 and
refuses to get new glasses.


You can spend several thousand on a flat panel, but you have to work
at it. One in that price range will probably be 5' or larger and have
all the name-brand audio goodies, probably 3D as well.

3-D? What a gimmick!
The new plasma sets are not nearly as bad as some would have you
believe. Testing by the local TV shop before christmas showed with an
"average" picture, a 42" Panasonic Plasma drew 90 watts, the same
sized Panasonic LCD drew 80 watts, and a competitor's 42" LED drew 70
watts.

My 28" LCD draws 56 watts
My 42" Panasonic Plasma draws an average of right around the 90 watts.
With Plasma the current draw goes up with brighter screen - so
watching skiing or hockey can draw about twice what watching a night
scene in a movie will draw.

OK, what about LCD (or plasma) screen refresh rates?
Is 60 so bad?


Oh, and while we're on the subject of respecting women, he

Equality NOW!
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pkp

Heidi also makes her point:
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pgb

--
Live in the sunshine, swim the sea, drink the wild air...
-- Ralph Waldo Emerson

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 19:46:37 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 14:10:12 -0500, wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:54:38 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:08:48 -0800 (PST), wrote:

--snip--
Prices have dropped a bunch since you've looked at flat panels,
apparently. You can get a 42" LCD for what a 27" CRT used to sell for
and it looks a hell of a lot better. LCDs have upped refresh rate and
lowered response time so motion artifacts aren't noticible, 120Hz is
quite affordable these days. Prices have dropped like a rock this
last year or so. LED backlighting adds a couple of hundred to the
cost, not worth the extra cost, IMO, right at this time. Maybe later
this year. A lot of sets above the bargain level can be networked to
a video server and can display a number of video and still photo
formats, so more than just a TV set anymore. And the benefits have
slopped over onto the computer monitor market, response times on those
flat panels has dropped as well and they're CHEAP. I've run the b-in-
l's LG TV from my laptop as a second display, so that's another
bennie. Has a VGA connector built-in.

My neighbor is looking to replace her 1960 television set and doesn't
know what to look for with all the new tech. I haven't bought a set
(tube) since I move here in '02 and I'm out of the loop. She's looking
for cheapest possible, possibly with a DVD built into it. In an hour
of research (I may need a new set some day, too) I've stumbled into
the horrors of plasma (expensive to run), etc. Stan, can you (or
anyone here) give me an update into the 21st century TV standards? I
think it might be well received by many.

It looks like a 720p 32" will work for her, but I'm not sure about the
60hz figure. She watches tennis, so there's some need for quick pixel
changes. Will these lower level sets work OK for her? She's 72 and
refuses to get new glasses.


You can spend several thousand on a flat panel, but you have to work
at it. One in that price range will probably be 5' or larger and have
all the name-brand audio goodies, probably 3D as well.

3-D? What a gimmick!
The new plasma sets are not nearly as bad as some would have you
believe. Testing by the local TV shop before christmas showed with an
"average" picture, a 42" Panasonic Plasma drew 90 watts, the same
sized Panasonic LCD drew 80 watts, and a competitor's 42" LED drew 70
watts.

My 28" LCD draws 56 watts
My 42" Panasonic Plasma draws an average of right around the 90 watts.
With Plasma the current draw goes up with brighter screen - so
watching skiing or hockey can draw about twice what watching a night
scene in a movie will draw.

OK, what about LCD (or plasma) screen refresh rates?
Is 60 so bad?


Plasma is inherently faster than LCD, regardless of the refresh rate.
60 "strobes" when you turn your head with a flourescent light on
nearby.
Oh, and while we're on the subject of respecting women, he

Equality NOW!
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pkp

Heidi also makes her point:
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pgb

Larry Jaques wrote:

Oh, and while we're on the subject of respecting women, he

Equality NOW!
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pkp

Ewww! Creepae!

Maybe if they want to be respected they shouldn't go around flashing
all that cleavage in everybody's face.

Thanks,
Rich

You want off 60 since it will flicker with the xxx lights.
Martin

On 1/17/2011 9:46 PM, Larry Jaques wrote:
On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 14:10:12 -0500, wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:54:38 -0800, Larry Jaques
wrote:

On Mon, 17 Jan 2011 07:08:48 -0800 (PST), wrote:

--snip--
Prices have dropped a bunch since you've looked at flat panels,
apparently. You can get a 42" LCD for what a 27" CRT used to sell for
and it looks a hell of a lot better. LCDs have upped refresh rate and
lowered response time so motion artifacts aren't noticible, 120Hz is
quite affordable these days. Prices have dropped like a rock this
last year or so. LED backlighting adds a couple of hundred to the
cost, not worth the extra cost, IMO, right at this time. Maybe later
this year. A lot of sets above the bargain level can be networked to
a video server and can display a number of video and still photo
formats, so more than just a TV set anymore. And the benefits have
slopped over onto the computer monitor market, response times on those
flat panels has dropped as well and they're CHEAP. I've run the b-in-
l's LG TV from my laptop as a second display, so that's another
bennie. Has a VGA connector built-in.

My neighbor is looking to replace her 1960 television set and doesn't
know what to look for with all the new tech. I haven't bought a set
(tube) since I move here in '02 and I'm out of the loop. She's looking
for cheapest possible, possibly with a DVD built into it. In an hour
of research (I may need a new set some day, too) I've stumbled into
the horrors of plasma (expensive to run), etc. Stan, can you (or
anyone here) give me an update into the 21st century TV standards? I
think it might be well received by many.

It looks like a 720p 32" will work for her, but I'm not sure about the
60hz figure. She watches tennis, so there's some need for quick pixel
changes. Will these lower level sets work OK for her? She's 72 and
refuses to get new glasses.


You can spend several thousand on a flat panel, but you have to work
at it. One in that price range will probably be 5' or larger and have
all the name-brand audio goodies, probably 3D as well.

3-D? What a gimmick!
The new plasma sets are not nearly as bad as some would have you
believe. Testing by the local TV shop before christmas showed with an
"average" picture, a 42" Panasonic Plasma drew 90 watts, the same
sized Panasonic LCD drew 80 watts, and a competitor's 42" LED drew 70
watts.

My 28" LCD draws 56 watts
My 42" Panasonic Plasma draws an average of right around the 90 watts.
With Plasma the current draw goes up with brighter screen - so
watching skiing or hockey can draw about twice what watching a night
scene in a movie will draw.

OK, what about LCD (or plasma) screen refresh rates?
Is 60 so bad?


Oh, and while we're on the subject of respecting women, he

Equality NOW!
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pkp

Heidi also makes her point:
http://FunnyOrDie.com/m/3pgb

--
Live in the sunshine, swim the sea, drink the wild air...
-- Ralph Waldo Emerson