Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris

What exactly does it do?

i

On 2009-02-07, Christopher Tidy wrote:
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris


--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

Ignoramus24392 fired this volley
in :

What exactly does it do?


Iggy, that conformation will only be a flail or a reel mower. Given the
drive ratios for the traction drive vs. the cutter drive, it appears to
be a reel mower.

The OP was wrong. There are several good gas powered reel mowers
available today. They use them to mow golf greens.

LLoyd

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Ignoramus24392 fired this volley
in :


What exactly does it do?



Iggy, that conformation will only be a flail or a reel mower. Given the
drive ratios for the traction drive vs. the cutter drive, it appears to
be a reel mower.

The OP was wrong. There are several good gas powered reel mowers
available today. They use them to mow golf greens.

I've seen most of them. At least, most which are available in England.
They're mostly the descendants of this machine. They're good. Very good
compared to everything else in production today (and for the record,
they're not the mowers I was talking about in my original post). But not
quite great, in the way that this mower is an example of the finest and
most durable craftsmanship. The manufacturers compromise more with the
latest machines, even the high end ones, and they aren't built with the
same classic style. If you don't believe me, do you think they'll still
be around in 62 years?

Best wishes,

Chris

Nice pix, Chris. Nice neighbour to just give it to you! British engineering IS great. Hats off to
GB for giving us the steam engine and Rolls razor.

Bob Swinney
"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris

Christopher Tidy fired this volley in
:

I've seen most of them. At least, most which are available in
England.
They're mostly the descendants of this machine. They're good. Very
good
compared to everything else in production today (and for the record,
they're not the mowers I was talking about in my original post). But
not
quite great, in the way that this mower is an example of the finest
and
most durable craftsmanship. The manufacturers compromise more with
the
latest machines, even the high end ones, and they aren't built with
the
same classic style. If you don't believe me, do you think they'll
still
be around in 62 years?


Chris, there are _necessary_ tradeoffs for specific applications. You
can't mow a golf green with a 700-lb behemoth using a crimping roller
for the traction drive. It would carve the green to ribbons!

Yes, I agree. Some old technology was better built, if only because
they didn't know or didn't have the materials to build lighter,
smaller, tighter. But metallurgy is MUCH better today than when that
was built. When's the last time you saw a car that needed a valve job
every 40K miles?

LLoyd

Robert Swinney wrote:
Nice pix, Chris. Nice neighbour to just give it to you! British engineering IS great. Hats off to
GB for giving us the steam engine and Rolls razor.

This machine certainly dates from that era. Those two big forged clutch
levers operate cone clutches. You can see them under the cover next to
the gearbox and 600 cc engine. They feel like something off a steam
engine. Each of the clutches must weigh a good 10 pounds. You've really
got to see this machine to appreciate it. If you're ever in England, let
me know... :-).

The neighbour said I was doing him a favour as he had so many. Once it's
running, I'm going to invite him over to see it in action.

Best wishes,

Chris

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:

Chris, there are _necessary_ tradeoffs for specific applications. You
can't mow a golf green with a 700-lb behemoth using a crimping roller
for the traction drive. It would carve the green to ribbons!

Are golf greens that much different to cricket pitches? I've seen this
exact type of mower in use on cricket pitches.

Yes, I agree. Some old technology was better built, if only because
they didn't know or didn't have the materials to build lighter,
smaller, tighter. But metallurgy is MUCH better today than when that
was built. When's the last time you saw a car that needed a valve job
every 40K miles?

Sure, technology improves. Hardened valve seats are great. It's just a
shame we don't seem to be able to have all the good stuff at the same time!

Best wishes,

Chris

Christopher Tidy fired this volley in
:

Are golf greens that much different to cricket pitches?

The entire surface (if well done) is hard-packed sand with a scant 1/8"
to 3/16" of grass thickness above. That "ravioli maker" on the back of
the Dennis would indent the base further than the height of the grass,
and make putting "interesting" to say the least.

G
LLoyd

On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 17:56:13 -0600, the infamous Ignoramus24392
scrawled the following:

What exactly does it do?

Silly wabbit. It appears to be a self-powered, self-bagging reel type
mower on steroids. Don't you know?


On 2009-02-07, Christopher Tidy wrote:
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris


--
Never tell people how to do things. Tell them what
to do and they will surprise you with their ingenuity.
-- George S. Patton

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven of
them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the compression
is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris


http://www.lockemower.com/Products/WalkBehindMower.aspx

Christopher Tidy writes:


It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.


It takes a VERY brave man to use the terms "British engineering" "great"
and "carburetor" in the same paragraph.

I still recall the SU's.....


--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

When you said 'ultimate mower', I thought of this gem:
http://www.toro.com/grounds/docs/Bro...5910_Specs.pdf
99 hp Cummins diesel, mows an entire 18 hole golf course rough in one 8
hour shift.

But here is the current replacement for Christopher's unit:
http://www.toro.com/golf/docs/ceg/gr_1600.pdf
Comes in at svelte 230 pounds.

Christopher Tidy wrote:
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris

On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 18:03:04 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Ignoramus24392 fired this volley
in :

What exactly does it do?


Iggy, that conformation will only be a flail or a reel mower. Given the
drive ratios for the traction drive vs. the cutter drive, it appears to
be a reel mower.

The OP was wrong. There are several good gas powered reel mowers
available today. They use them to mow golf greens.

LLoyd
Like senior son's electric mower in the other London, it appears to
have front discharge. The only way to mow close to an object is to mow
alongside it, and heaven help you in the corners.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

"Gerald Miller" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 18:03:04 -0600, "Lloyd E. Sponenburgh"
lloydspinsidemindspring.com wrote:

Ignoramus24392 fired this volley
in :

What exactly does it do?


Iggy, that conformation will only be a flail or a reel mower. Given the
drive ratios for the traction drive vs. the cutter drive, it appears to
be a reel mower.

The OP was wrong. There are several good gas powered reel mowers
available today. They use them to mow golf greens.

LLoyd
Like senior son's electric mower in the other London, it appears to
have front discharge. The only way to mow close to an object is to mow
alongside it, and heaven help you in the corners.
Gerry :-)}
London, Canada

The ultimate mower was the one Dennis (the neighbor from hell) Quaid had in
the Richard Pryor movie "Moving"

On Feb 8, 1:45*pm, David Lesher wrote:

It takes a VERY brave man to use the terms "British engineering" "great"
and "carburetor" in the same paragraph.

I still recall the SU's.....

And remember the Titanic, that was a triumph of British engineering
too - old British bikes and cars are only owned by enthusiasts because
of the constant maintenance required - and you do have a set of
Whitworth spanners, dont you? - and, being English, there will be some
absolutely horrible way of fitting a part that is not designed to be
removed, ever....even using the specified special tool....

Still, "Charisma" justifies a multitude of bad engineering.......

Andrew VK3BFA.

(who occasionally has to fix "things", mainly LUCAS, on his elderly
friends Mk2 Jaguar......)

On Sat, 7 Feb 2009 18:36:15 -0600, "Robert Swinney"
wrote:

Nice pix, Chris. Nice neighbour to just give it to you! British engineering IS great. Hats off to
GB for giving us the steam engine and Rolls razor.

And Lucas Electrics.....

chortle....



Bob Swinney
"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris

"Not so old as to need virgins to excite him,
nor old enough to have the patience to teach one."

On Sat, 7 Feb 2009 21:20:39 -0500, "ATP*"
wrote:


"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven of
them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the compression
is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris


http://www.lockemower.com/Products/WalkBehindMower.aspx

http://www.mclanemower.com/reelmowers.asp
"Not so old as to need virgins to excite him,
nor old enough to have the patience to teach one."

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
David Lesher wrote:
Christopher Tidy writes:



It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing
season.



It takes a VERY brave man to use the terms "British engineering" "great"
and "carburetor" in the same paragraph.

I still recall the SU's.....

To be fair, the Amal concentric carburettor wasn't great. It was probably
the worst part of a very good mower.

Funnily enough, I've seen a Dennis mower with an SU carburettor fitted in
place of the Amal.

Chris


hey, let's be fair to the SU - they work really well until the jet wears
out, then you just replace two parts - they never plug up, and the variable
venturi keeps the mixture pretty close for a carburetted car.

Christopher Tidy fired this volley in
:

I always assumed a golf green was just a well-kept lawn. Is
the idea of the sand to improve drainage?

Hardness, so the ball rolls as if on a billiards table.

Then, then only "issues" a putter has are break (l/r slopes),
longitudinal slope (uphill-downhill), and the very grain of the grass,
which lays flat in one direction on a well-mowed green, thus
inhibiting roll in one direction, and allowing it in the other, like a
bunch of miniature pawls against a sprocket (the ball). And of
course, moisture, wind, stupid noises, ball marks from other players,
footprints, etc, etc.... G


LLoyd

On 2009-02-08, Calif Bill wrote:

The ultimate mower was the one Dennis (the neighbor from hell) Quaid had in
the Richard Pryor movie "Moving"

The ultimate one is the lawnmower showin in the "Rehabilitation"
program in movie Idiocracy. The movie is hilarious and is highly
recommended. Available from your nearby torrent site.

--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
andy wrote:

Pretty Cool! I wouldn't want to put it in the trunk of the car to go
mow (insert other person that you cut the lawn for) lawn.

I just found some pictures of early Locke mowers online. Interesting
machines.

One of the big advantages of the Dennis design is that the chassis is mild
steel rather than cast iron. Many of the early mowers were cast iron, and
so got cracked when they were dropped or suffered impacts.

Chris

I had a Locke triple. Nice machine but your lawn has to be very evenly
graded. Currently using a 48" Scag with a 22 HP Tecumseh V-Twin.

"Bill Noble" wrote in message
...

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
David Lesher wrote:
Christopher Tidy writes:



It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing
season.



It takes a VERY brave man to use the terms "British engineering" "great"
and "carburetor" in the same paragraph.

I still recall the SU's.....

To be fair, the Amal concentric carburettor wasn't great. It was probably
the worst part of a very good mower.

Funnily enough, I've seen a Dennis mower with an SU carburettor fitted in
place of the Amal.

Chris


hey, let's be fair to the SU - they work really well until the jet wears
out, then you just replace two parts - they never plug up, and the
variable venturi keeps the mixture pretty close for a carburetted car.


SU stood for Standard Urination. They almost always leaked.

" I still recall the SU's.....

To be fair, the Amal concentric carburettor wasn't great. It was
probably the worst part of a very good mower.

Funnily enough, I've seen a Dennis mower with an SU carburettor fitted
in place of the Amal.

Chris


hey, let's be fair to the SU - they work really well until the jet wears
out, then you just replace two parts - they never plug up, and the
variable venturi keeps the mixture pretty close for a carburetted car.


SU stood for Standard Urination. They almost always leaked.

maybe YOUR SU carbs leaked, mine did not, at least not if I replaced the
required gaskets once per decade. my +4 was probably as abusive an
installation as you will see - they worked well.

Lloyd E. Sponenburgh wrote:
Christopher Tidy fired this volley in
:


I always assumed a golf green was just a well-kept lawn. Is
the idea of the sand to improve drainage?


Hardness, so the ball rolls as if on a billiards table.

Then, then only "issues" a putter has are break (l/r slopes),
longitudinal slope (uphill-downhill), and the very grain of the grass,
which lays flat in one direction on a well-mowed green, thus
inhibiting roll in one direction, and allowing it in the other, like a
bunch of miniature pawls against a sprocket (the ball). And of
course, moisture, wind, stupid noises, ball marks from other players,
footprints, etc, etc.... G

Thanks, Lloyd. That's interesting. I didn't know the science of grass
was so sophisticated.

Chris

ATP* wrote:
"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...

andy wrote:


Pretty Cool! I wouldn't want to put it in the trunk of the car to go
mow (insert other person that you cut the lawn for) lawn.

I just found some pictures of early Locke mowers online. Interesting
machines.

One of the big advantages of the Dennis design is that the chassis is mild
steel rather than cast iron. Many of the early mowers were cast iron, and
so got cracked when they were dropped or suffered impacts.

Chris


I had a Locke triple. Nice machine but your lawn has to be very evenly
graded. Currently using a 48" Scag with a 22 HP Tecumseh V-Twin.

How did a mower come to be called Scag? I was sure I'd heard that word
before, so I looked it up:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=scag

Now you've put an image in my head of a guy riding a lawnmower and
singing "One Toke Over the Line" :-).

Chris

"Bill Noble" wrote in message
...

" I still recall the SU's.....

To be fair, the Amal concentric carburettor wasn't great. It was
probably the worst part of a very good mower.

Funnily enough, I've seen a Dennis mower with an SU carburettor fitted
in place of the Amal.

Chris


hey, let's be fair to the SU - they work really well until the jet wears
out, then you just replace two parts - they never plug up, and the
variable venturi keeps the mixture pretty close for a carburetted car.


SU stood for Standard Urination. They almost always leaked.

maybe YOUR SU carbs leaked, mine did not, at least not if I replaced the
required gaskets once per decade. my +4 was probably as abusive an
installation as you will see - they worked well.


My buddy raced a TR-3 and TR-4 and every other SU carbed racecar had leak
problems. Since I raced a Vette did not have the SU problems. SCCA racing.

Calif Bill wrote:
"Bill Noble" wrote in message
...

" I still recall the SU's.....

To be fair, the Amal concentric carburettor wasn't great. It was
probably the worst part of a very good mower.

Funnily enough, I've seen a Dennis mower with an SU carburettor fitted
in place of the Amal.

Chris


hey, let's be fair to the SU - they work really well until the jet wears
out, then you just replace two parts - they never plug up, and the
variable venturi keeps the mixture pretty close for a carburetted car.


SU stood for Standard Urination. They almost always leaked.

maybe YOUR SU carbs leaked, mine did not, at least not if I replaced the
required gaskets once per decade. my +4 was probably as abusive an
installation as you will see - they worked well.



My buddy raced a TR-3 and TR-4 and every other SU carbed racecar had leak
problems. Since I raced a Vette did not have the SU problems. SCCA racing.



Possibly running too high a fuel pressure, IIRC the SU requires about
2-3 psi and other carbs such as Weber side draughts require 4-5 psi and
can cause issues with float chamber flooding if the wrong pump pressure
is used on the SU. The SUs I have used never leaked although I did
change them for Dellorto side draughts as they seemed to perform better
and stay in tune.

On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 20:23:46 +0000, Christopher Tidy
wrote:

Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris

what you'll find over time is that the vibrations passing through the
large roller compact the soil and stuff up the grass.

I've used two of them over the years. (they're made by Rover and
Scott-Bonnar in Australia) After the last work over with the pitch
fork to undo the compression and aerate the soil I swapped to a Victa
and havent needed to aerate again.

ymmv
Stealth Pilot

If you don't believe me, do you think they'll still
be around in 62 years?

It's not like it's been mowing grass for 62 years. It's been sitting
in a barn for most of it's life.

"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...
ATP* wrote:
"Christopher Tidy" wrote in message
...

andy wrote:


Pretty Cool! I wouldn't want to put it in the trunk of the car to go
mow (insert other person that you cut the lawn for) lawn.

I just found some pictures of early Locke mowers online. Interesting
machines.

One of the big advantages of the Dennis design is that the chassis is
mild steel rather than cast iron. Many of the early mowers were cast
iron, and so got cracked when they were dropped or suffered impacts.

Chris


I had a Locke triple. Nice machine but your lawn has to be very evenly
graded. Currently using a 48" Scag with a 22 HP Tecumseh V-Twin.

How did a mower come to be called Scag? I was sure I'd heard that word
before, so I looked it up:
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=scag

Now you've put an image in my head of a guy riding a lawnmower and singing
"One Toke Over the Line" :-).

Chris

I was thinking more of the skanked out whore meaning:-)

Pirateer guy wrote:
If you don't believe me, do you think they'll still

be around in 62 years?


It's not like it's been mowing grass for 62 years. It's been sitting
in a barn for most of it's life.

Apparently it was mowing grass at a cricket club into the 1990s. That's
a lot of work in 50 years.

Chris

Stealth Pilot wrote:
On Sat, 07 Feb 2009 20:23:46 +0000, Christopher Tidy
wrote:


Hi folks,

Just thought you might like to see some pictures of a particularly cool
lawnmower. A neighbour kindly gave me this machine because he had seven
of them...

1947 Dennis Bros. "Z Type" lawnmower:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/1384939...57613449106181

It dates from the days when British engineering truly was great. Weighs
almost 700 lbs. Needs a new carburettor and a repaint, but the
compression is good so I'm hoping to have it working for the mowing season.

I'm looking forward to it. Modern mowers can't touch this monster :-).

Enjoy!

Chris


what you'll find over time is that the vibrations passing through the
large roller compact the soil and stuff up the grass.

I've used two of them over the years. (they're made by Rover and
Scott-Bonnar in Australia) After the last work over with the pitch
fork to undo the compression and aerate the soil I swapped to a Victa
and havent needed to aerate again.

On the other hand, if you don't roll your grass at all, it gets uneven.

Chris