"DrollTroll" (clip) I would have thought some exotic-type brazing or welding
would be required
for reliable strength. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Welding a stranded cable would be virtually impossible. Brazing or silver
soldering, if done very carefully in a temperature controlled oven, might
work. If done by me, with a torch, the filler metal doesn't properly wet
all the strands, and the outer strands get so hot the strength is shot.

Swaging or "crimping," or whatever you want to call it, works because the
length of the collar has made long enough to to match or exceed the strength
of the cable itself.

"Welding a stranded cable would be virtually impossible."

Really??? Tell that to the Navy Aviation Boatswain's Mates working on
aircraft carriers who regularly weld cables together whenever it's time to
replace the purchase cables of the Arrresting Gear engines. The new
purchase cable end is welded to a smaller cable "pig tail" and the old cable
end and then the old cable is pulled until all of the new cable length has
replaced all of the old ones around the various sheaves and pulleys in the
system. The weld job needs to be precise and strong or else the cable
connection would get stuck somewhere in the system or would break causing
hours and hours worth of corrective actions rendering the aircraft carrier
virtually crippled.


"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...
|
| "DrollTroll" (clip) I would have thought some exotic-type brazing or
welding
| would be required
| for reliable strength. (clip)
| ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| Welding a stranded cable would be virtually impossible. Brazing or silver
| soldering, if done very carefully in a temperature controlled oven, might
| work. If done by me, with a torch, the filler metal doesn't properly wet
| all the strands, and the outer strands get so hot the strength is shot.
|
| Swaging or "crimping," or whatever you want to call it, works because the
| length of the collar has made long enough to to match or exceed the
strength
| of the cable itself.
|
|

"P D Fritz" wrote: Really??? Tell that to the Navy Aviation Boatswain's
Mates working on
aircraft carriers who regularly weld cables together whenever it's time to
replace the purchase cables of the Arrresting Gear engines. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Are you sure they are really *welding* the cables, or are you just using the
term to mean "joining." Welding two cables end-to-end would require fusion
of the individual strands. Why would they do something so difficult when
there are easier ways?

Yes, they were/are welding. They were/are not brazing or soldering. They use
electric arc welders using 7018 stick electrodes!!!
They do it because they find it to be the fastest, the easiest and the
strongest way to accomplish the required job.

I was one of them.



"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...
|
| "P D Fritz" wrote: Really??? Tell that to the Navy Aviation Boatswain's
| Mates working on
| aircraft carriers who regularly weld cables together whenever it's time
to
| replace the purchase cables of the Arrresting Gear engines. (clip)
| ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| Are you sure they are really *welding* the cables, or are you just using
the
| term to mean "joining." Welding two cables end-to-end would require
fusion
| of the individual strands. Why would they do something so difficult when
| there are easier ways?
|
|

"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...

"P D Fritz" wrote: Really??? Tell that to the Navy Aviation Boatswain's
Mates working on
aircraft carriers who regularly weld cables together whenever it's time
to
replace the purchase cables of the Arrresting Gear engines. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Are you sure they are really *welding* the cables, or are you just using
the term to mean "joining." Welding two cables end-to-end would require
fusion of the individual strands. Why would they do something so
difficult when there are easier ways?

I used to weld the old cable to the new when I was replacing the cables on
masonry block boom trucks. I would first weld a knob on the end of each
cable then weld the two ends together. Using the old cable to pull the new
one through, I then used a cutoff wheel on a 4" grinder and cut the old
cable off. It worked a lot better that brazing them together and I never had
one break during the threading of the new cable.
Steve

"Up North" wrote: I used to weld the old cable to the new when I was
replacing the cables on
masonry block boom trucks. I would first weld a knob on the end of each
cable then weld the two ends together. Using the old cable to pull the new
one through, I then used a cutoff wheel on a 4" grinder and cut the old
cable off. It worked a lot better that brazing them together and I never
had one break during the threading of the new cable.
Steve
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Okay, Steve, I concede. The technique you describe sounds like it would
work. Is that the way you did it, PD Fritz? I apologize for being so
skeptical. My mind was stuck on the idea that the individual strands had to
be joined.

On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 23:05:57 GMT, "Leo Lichtman"
wrote:


"Up North" wrote: I used to weld the old cable to the new when I was
replacing the cables on
masonry block boom trucks. I would first weld a knob on the end of each
cable then weld the two ends together. Using the old cable to pull the new
one through, I then used a cutoff wheel on a 4" grinder and cut the old
cable off. It worked a lot better that brazing them together and I never
had one break during the threading of the new cable.
Steve
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Okay, Steve, I concede. The technique you describe sounds like it would
work. Is that the way you did it, PD Fritz? I apologize for being so
skeptical. My mind was stuck on the idea that the individual strands had to
be joined.

It threw me for a minute, too. The trick on this weld job is that
it doesn't have to be strong or flexible, since it isn't in normal
service. It only has to hold the two ends together long enough to
pull the old cable out and the new cable into the sheave system. Then
the weld and the old cable gets cut off, and the new cable gets
properly terminated in place.

When you think about it, that makes perfect sense.

-- Bruce --

"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
news |
| "Up North" wrote: I used to weld the old cable to the new when I was
| replacing the cables on
| masonry block boom trucks. I would first weld a knob on the end of each
| cable then weld the two ends together. Using the old cable to pull the
new
| one through, I then used a cutoff wheel on a 4" grinder and cut the old
| cable off. It worked a lot better that brazing them together and I never
| had one break during the threading of the new cable.
| Steve
| ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| Okay, Steve, I concede. The technique you describe sounds like it would
| work. Is that the way you did it, PD Fritz? I apologize for being so
| skeptical. My mind was stuck on the idea that the individual strands had
to
| be joined.
|

No apology required.
Sure, it does sound basically similar. The cables I'm talking about though
are 1 7/16 inch in diameter with each single strand approximately around
1/10". The "pigtail cable" that is about 3/4" in diameter and 2 feet long is
connected(welded) in between the new cable and the old cable to allow
maximum flexibility and maneuverability during its passage through the
various pulleys and fairlead sheaves in the system. Sometimes, even chain
links are used as a pigtail instead of a cable. I prefer the chain link
method myself.

"P D Fritz" wrote in message
...



"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
news |
| "Up North" wrote: I used to weld the old cable to the new when I was
| replacing the cables on
| masonry block boom trucks. I would first weld a knob on the end of
each
| cable then weld the two ends together. Using the old cable to pull the
new
| one through, I then used a cutoff wheel on a 4" grinder and cut the
old
| cable off. It worked a lot better that brazing them together and I
never
| had one break during the threading of the new cable.
| Steve
| ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
| Okay, Steve, I concede. The technique you describe sounds like it would
| work. Is that the way you did it, PD Fritz? I apologize for being so
| skeptical. My mind was stuck on the idea that the individual strands
had
to
| be joined.
|

No apology required.
Sure, it does sound basically similar. The cables I'm talking about though
are 1 7/16 inch in diameter with each single strand approximately around
1/10". The "pigtail cable" that is about 3/4" in diameter and 2 feet long
is
connected(welded) in between the new cable and the old cable to allow
maximum flexibility and maneuverability during its passage through the
various pulleys and fairlead sheaves in the system. Sometimes, even chain
links are used as a pigtail instead of a cable. I prefer the chain link
method myself.

Dang. 1 7/16" stuff. I thought 1 1/8" derrick cable was big.

Steve

"Up North" wrote in message
...

"Leo Lichtman" wrote in message
...

"P D Fritz" wrote: Really??? Tell that to the Navy Aviation Boatswain's
Mates working on
aircraft carriers who regularly weld cables together whenever it's time
to
replace the purchase cables of the Arrresting Gear engines. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Are you sure they are really *welding* the cables, or are you just using
the term to mean "joining." Welding two cables end-to-end would require
fusion of the individual strands. Why would they do something so
difficult when there are easier ways?

I used to weld the old cable to the new when I was replacing the cables on
masonry block boom trucks. I would first weld a knob on the end of each
cable then weld the two ends together. Using the old cable to pull the new
one through, I then used a cutoff wheel on a 4" grinder and cut the old
cable off. It worked a lot better that brazing them together and I never
had one break during the threading of the new cable.
Steve

Replacing 1 1/8" cable on an oil drilling rig was interesting. The cable
came in very long rolls. The first time it was strung, it was a booger
bear. But when the required amount was on the sheaves, blocks, and drums,
the cable was just dogged off. Since the pulling point at the top of the
derrick and the drill floor level remained the same, only the cable rigged
up would travel.

Usage was computed in ton/miles. When that was reached, the cable was
pulled/threaded through all the sheaves and blocks until new replaced old,
then the old was cut and deadmanned. It was all hard dirty dangerous work,
especially the first time. After that, there was a Chinese handcuff thing
that would join the end of an old section to a new spool, so no need to take
it all off. Still, though, at times, it was necessary to start from
scratch.

Steve

Leo Lichtman wrote:
"P D Fritz" wrote: Really??? Tell that to the Navy Aviation Boatswain's
Mates working on
aircraft carriers who regularly weld cables together whenever it's time to
replace the purchase cables of the Arrresting Gear engines. (clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Are you sure they are really *welding* the cables, or are you just using the
term to mean "joining." Welding two cables end-to-end would require fusion
of the individual strands. Why would they do something so difficult when
there are easier ways?


They are probably welding the end of a new cable (on a reel) to the end
of the used one--then they will pull out the old & reel in the new.

jerry