Awl--

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C, given that my
shop is surrounded by 18" stone walls (other than the rickety garage door),
altho other options seem possible--like bonafide central air! Prices to
follow, from the Klimaire company--www.acfactoryoutlet.com.

But first, how does EER compare w/ SEER?? Is there a conversion? Is one
routinely higher than the other?

Next, suppose I have three one ton units, at 8, 10, and 12 EER. What is the
relative diff. in cost to run them?

Next, I'm interested in other mfr's of mini-splits. Iny idears who makes
them?

Data on Klimaire you might find inneresting, basically comparing mini-split
w/ central air, and some other variables.

Mini-splits, all with *heat pumps*, all 10 eer:
1 ton, $499
1.5 ton, $659
2 ton, about $800

Beats the crap out of prices on PC Richards crappy portable units,
w/miserable eer's.

Now, compare central air, where the inside air handler requires ducting,
poss. minimal if you don't mind it just blowing out into the shop.
These units are Fedders, supplied by Klimaire
1.5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, $675
12 seer, no hp, 737
12 seer, w/ hp, 969
2 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 698
12 seer, no hp, 875
12 seer, w/ hp, 1018
5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 1190
12 seer, no hp, 1347
12 seer, w/ hp, 1600.
Also have 3 and 4 ton.

The difference between the central air and the mini-split is that you have a
larger floor-standing coil/air handler in the central, to which duct
attaches, whereas the inside half of the mini looks pretty much like the
front of a room A/C.
The outside halves are similar.
Given the apparent greater economy of the central air, and the greater
versatility of the inside coil/air handler, makes central a good choice for
all but the most cramped shops.
And exposed ducting inside a shop is pretty basic stuff. Could use goddamm
garbage bags/duct tape in a pinch.

But, I also want the A/C *staged* (like my rpc's!), and am wondering if
despite a higher initial cost and no air-handling options besides the grill,
a few 1-ton mini-splits isn't a better way to go.
In commercial meters, staging will also sposedly lower your demand charge.

Note that all stuff mfr'd after 01/06 must be a *13* seer.
So the above stuff is sort of going on close-out, altho 12 seer still seems
pretty good. Klimaire says the new 13 seer units will proly be 15% hgher in
price.

Curious about heat pumps:
These units use "reverse cycle" compressors, I think, which basically runs
the thermo cycle (and motor, iiuc) backwards.
Note that *any* A/C unit is a heat pump. If you simply took your window
unit and reversed it, you would have a heat pump!
Sposedly, a reverse cycle compressor spares one the duct work/physically
reversing the unit.
Is it that simple, or is there more to it?

Also, in principle, one could turn any existing window A/C into a min-split
by simply splicing the copper tubing, and re-locating the compressor/coils
outside. And you would need another fan for the outside coils, as most room
a/c's have one motor for both blowers.

Inyway, dats the state of my current homework. Innerested in other
opinions, idears, etc.
Would post this to alt.hvac, but those guys are effing weird, and they don't
like DIYers--must be the freon....
--
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll

Oh yeah, these prices are sans s&h ($150-200), and installation.
Installation can be kept minimal if you do all the mechanicals yerself, and
let an A/C guy connect the refrigerant tubing. The units come charged (R22,
I believe), but have to be vacuumed out/recharged to do the piping--soft
copper, flare fittings, I believe. Not sure what maximum distances would be
for piping.
--
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
Awl--

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C, given that my
shop is surrounded by 18" stone walls (other than the rickety garage
door), altho other options seem possible--like bonafide central air!
Prices to follow, from the Klimaire company--www.acfactoryoutlet.com.

But first, how does EER compare w/ SEER?? Is there a conversion? Is one
routinely higher than the other?

Next, suppose I have three one ton units, at 8, 10, and 12 EER. What is
the relative diff. in cost to run them?

Next, I'm interested in other mfr's of mini-splits. Iny idears who makes
them?

Data on Klimaire you might find inneresting, basically comparing
mini-split w/ central air, and some other variables.

Mini-splits, all with *heat pumps*, all 10 eer:
1 ton, $499
1.5 ton, $659
2 ton, about $800

Beats the crap out of prices on PC Richards crappy portable units,
w/miserable eer's.

Now, compare central air, where the inside air handler requires ducting,
poss. minimal if you don't mind it just blowing out into the shop.
These units are Fedders, supplied by Klimaire
1.5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, $675
12 seer, no hp, 737
12 seer, w/ hp, 969
2 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 698
12 seer, no hp, 875
12 seer, w/ hp, 1018
5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 1190
12 seer, no hp, 1347
12 seer, w/ hp, 1600.
Also have 3 and 4 ton.

The difference between the central air and the mini-split is that you have
a larger floor-standing coil/air handler in the central, to which duct
attaches, whereas the inside half of the mini looks pretty much like the
front of a room A/C.
The outside halves are similar.
Given the apparent greater economy of the central air, and the greater
versatility of the inside coil/air handler, makes central a good choice
for all but the most cramped shops.
And exposed ducting inside a shop is pretty basic stuff. Could use
goddamm garbage bags/duct tape in a pinch.

But, I also want the A/C *staged* (like my rpc's!), and am wondering if
despite a higher initial cost and no air-handling options besides the
grill, a few 1-ton mini-splits isn't a better way to go.
In commercial meters, staging will also sposedly lower your demand charge.

Note that all stuff mfr'd after 01/06 must be a *13* seer.
So the above stuff is sort of going on close-out, altho 12 seer still
seems pretty good. Klimaire says the new 13 seer units will proly be 15%
hgher in price.

Curious about heat pumps:
These units use "reverse cycle" compressors, I think, which basically runs
the thermo cycle (and motor, iiuc) backwards.
Note that *any* A/C unit is a heat pump. If you simply took your window
unit and reversed it, you would have a heat pump!
Sposedly, a reverse cycle compressor spares one the duct work/physically
reversing the unit.
Is it that simple, or is there more to it?

Also, in principle, one could turn any existing window A/C into a
min-split by simply splicing the copper tubing, and re-locating the
compressor/coils outside. And you would need another fan for the outside
coils, as most room a/c's have one motor for both blowers.

Inyway, dats the state of my current homework. Innerested in other
opinions, idears, etc.
Would post this to alt.hvac, but those guys are effing weird, and they
don't like DIYers--must be the freon....
--
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll

On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 18:48:53 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Oh yeah, these prices are sans s&h ($150-200), and installation.
Installation can be kept minimal if you do all the mechanicals yerself, and
let an A/C guy connect the refrigerant tubing. The units come charged (R22,
I believe), but have to be vacuumed out/recharged to do the piping--soft
copper, flare fittings, I believe. Not sure what maximum distances would be
for piping.

Crossposted to alt.hvac & alt.building.construction

PV: See what happens when you top-post & don't properly quote?
Cut off at the sig ....
--
Cliff

On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 18:40:51 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Awl--

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C, given that my
shop is surrounded by 18" stone walls (other than the rickety garage door),
altho other options seem possible--like bonafide central air! Prices to
follow, from the Klimaire company--www.acfactoryoutlet.com.

But first, how does EER compare w/ SEER?? Is there a conversion? Is one
routinely higher than the other?

Next, suppose I have three one ton units, at 8, 10, and 12 EER. What is the
relative diff. in cost to run them?

Next, I'm interested in other mfr's of mini-splits. Iny idears who makes
them?

Data on Klimaire you might find inneresting, basically comparing mini-split
w/ central air, and some other variables.

Mini-splits, all with *heat pumps*, all 10 eer:
1 ton, $499
1.5 ton, $659
2 ton, about $800

Beats the crap out of prices on PC Richards crappy portable units,
w/miserable eer's.

Now, compare central air, where the inside air handler requires ducting,
poss. minimal if you don't mind it just blowing out into the shop.
These units are Fedders, supplied by Klimaire
1.5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, $675
12 seer, no hp, 737
12 seer, w/ hp, 969
2 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 698
12 seer, no hp, 875
12 seer, w/ hp, 1018
5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 1190
12 seer, no hp, 1347
12 seer, w/ hp, 1600.
Also have 3 and 4 ton.

The difference between the central air and the mini-split is that you have a
larger floor-standing coil/air handler in the central, to which duct
attaches, whereas the inside half of the mini looks pretty much like the
front of a room A/C.
The outside halves are similar.
Given the apparent greater economy of the central air, and the greater
versatility of the inside coil/air handler, makes central a good choice for
all but the most cramped shops.
And exposed ducting inside a shop is pretty basic stuff. Could use goddamm
garbage bags/duct tape in a pinch.

But, I also want the A/C *staged* (like my rpc's!), and am wondering if
despite a higher initial cost and no air-handling options besides the grill,
a few 1-ton mini-splits isn't a better way to go.
In commercial meters, staging will also sposedly lower your demand charge.

Note that all stuff mfr'd after 01/06 must be a *13* seer.
So the above stuff is sort of going on close-out, altho 12 seer still seems
pretty good. Klimaire says the new 13 seer units will proly be 15% hgher in
price.

Curious about heat pumps:
These units use "reverse cycle" compressors, I think, which basically runs
the thermo cycle (and motor, iiuc) backwards.
Note that *any* A/C unit is a heat pump. If you simply took your window
unit and reversed it, you would have a heat pump!
Sposedly, a reverse cycle compressor spares one the duct work/physically
reversing the unit.
Is it that simple, or is there more to it?

Also, in principle, one could turn any existing window A/C into a min-split
by simply splicing the copper tubing, and re-locating the compressor/coils
outside. And you would need another fan for the outside coils, as most room
a/c's have one motor for both blowers.

Inyway, dats the state of my current homework. Innerested in other
opinions, idears, etc.
Would post this to alt.hvac, but those guys are effing weird, and they don't
like DIYers--must be the freon....

Crossposted to alt.hvac & alt.building.construction
--
Cliff

Cliff--

Gee thanks, I'm sure the pills on alt.hvac are going to like my DIY
comments....
--
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll

"Cliff" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 18:40:51 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Awl--

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C, given that my
shop is surrounded by 18" stone walls (other than the rickety garage
door),
altho other options seem possible--like bonafide central air! Prices to
follow, from the Klimaire company--www.acfactoryoutlet.com.

But first, how does EER compare w/ SEER?? Is there a conversion? Is one
routinely higher than the other?

Next, suppose I have three one ton units, at 8, 10, and 12 EER. What is
the
relative diff. in cost to run them?

Next, I'm interested in other mfr's of mini-splits. Iny idears who makes
them?

Data on Klimaire you might find inneresting, basically comparing
mini-split
w/ central air, and some other variables.

Mini-splits, all with *heat pumps*, all 10 eer:
1 ton, $499
1.5 ton, $659
2 ton, about $800

Beats the crap out of prices on PC Richards crappy portable units,
w/miserable eer's.

Now, compare central air, where the inside air handler requires ducting,
poss. minimal if you don't mind it just blowing out into the shop.
These units are Fedders, supplied by Klimaire
1.5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, $675
12 seer, no hp, 737
12 seer, w/ hp, 969
2 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 698
12 seer, no hp, 875
12 seer, w/ hp, 1018
5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 1190
12 seer, no hp, 1347
12 seer, w/ hp, 1600.
Also have 3 and 4 ton.

The difference between the central air and the mini-split is that you have
a
larger floor-standing coil/air handler in the central, to which duct
attaches, whereas the inside half of the mini looks pretty much like the
front of a room A/C.
The outside halves are similar.
Given the apparent greater economy of the central air, and the greater
versatility of the inside coil/air handler, makes central a good choice
for
all but the most cramped shops.
And exposed ducting inside a shop is pretty basic stuff. Could use
goddamm
garbage bags/duct tape in a pinch.

But, I also want the A/C *staged* (like my rpc's!), and am wondering if
despite a higher initial cost and no air-handling options besides the
grill,
a few 1-ton mini-splits isn't a better way to go.
In commercial meters, staging will also sposedly lower your demand charge.

Note that all stuff mfr'd after 01/06 must be a *13* seer.
So the above stuff is sort of going on close-out, altho 12 seer still
seems
pretty good. Klimaire says the new 13 seer units will proly be 15% hgher
in
price.

Curious about heat pumps:
These units use "reverse cycle" compressors, I think, which basically runs
the thermo cycle (and motor, iiuc) backwards.
Note that *any* A/C unit is a heat pump. If you simply took your window
unit and reversed it, you would have a heat pump!
Sposedly, a reverse cycle compressor spares one the duct work/physically
reversing the unit.
Is it that simple, or is there more to it?

Also, in principle, one could turn any existing window A/C into a
min-split
by simply splicing the copper tubing, and re-locating the compressor/coils
outside. And you would need another fan for the outside coils, as most
room
a/c's have one motor for both blowers.

Inyway, dats the state of my current homework. Innerested in other
opinions, idears, etc.
Would post this to alt.hvac, but those guys are effing weird, and they
don't
like DIYers--must be the freon....

Crossposted to alt.hvac & alt.building.construction
--
Cliff

Too bad you didn't do all of your homework..... 10 and 12 SEER equipment
isn't manufactured any more, and hasn't been made since Sept 2005. Since
January 18, 2006, the *MINIMUM* SEER currently manufactured for sale in the
US for residential use is 13 SEER.
The new equipment is not DIY friendly, and in only 3 1/2 years, the
manufacture of R-22 equipment will cease completely.

"Proctologically Violated©®" wrote in message
...
Awl--

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C,

I've had no problems with older Mitsubishi splits, but recently had trouble
with some EMI units turning into icemakers. Service is expensive and so are
the parts. Use an externally mounted, conventional condensate pump. The new
mini pumps that sit inside the unit are really troublesome.

On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 18:40:51 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C, given that my
shop is surrounded by 18" stone walls (other than the rickety garage door),
altho other options seem possible--like bonafide central air! Prices to
follow, from the Klimaire company--www.acfactoryoutlet.com.

Stone walls are one good reason to choose a Mini-Split HP, rather
than a wall unit or Packaged Terminal AC unit (PTAC and PTHP are the
big slide-out wall units used at motels) - but there are other
considerations to be made. For one thing, if you need a lot of heat
and you are in the snow belt, a Heat Pump isn't the best choice versus
a furnace.

Heat pumps are frustratingly slow - you can't crank the thermostat
up 20 degrees when you walk in and expect instant response - The air
is 65F going in and 68F coming out, and with the airflow it feels like
nothing is happening for quite a while. If your work hours vary a lot
you'll spend a lot of extra money with a normal setback thermostat
cranking it up automatically from 9-5 every Mon-Fri, even if you
aren't coming in to the shop till Noon...

You could rig an Internet interface and turn the heat up when you
leave the house to drive to the shop, but that gets complex. Not that
there's anything wrong with that, of course... ;-)

What fuels or heat sources do you have available besides
electricity? Natural gas is golden, Propane or fuel oil OK, a steam
or hot water boiler can work...

How much heat do you need in the winter and how cold does it
regularly get? Heat pumps start losing efficiency at around 45F and
are chancy below 25F - 35F because the outside coils ice up trying to
extract heat from outside air. You have to set up a two-stage
thermostat and switch to a backup heat source - either Propane or Oil,
or electric resistance heat.

Next, I'm interested in other mfr's of mini-splits. Iny idears who makes
them?

Dozens - do some searching. And if some of them look the same, they
are - Carrier also makes Bryant, Day & Night and Payne, so they can
have 4 dealers in a small town with "different brands" - only the
nameplates are changed to protect the innocent. Other mfgrs play the
same game.

The difference between the central air and the mini-split is that you have a
larger floor-standing coil/air handler in the central, to which duct
attaches, whereas the inside half of the mini looks pretty much like the
front of a room A/C.
The outside halves are similar.
Given the apparent greater economy of the central air, and the greater
versatility of the inside coil/air handler, makes central a good choice for
all but the most cramped shops.
And exposed ducting inside a shop is pretty basic stuff. Could use goddamm
garbage bags/duct tape in a pinch.

I would mount the air handler horizontally in the attic space, get
it up above the normal working area. If you have Propane or Natural
Gas available and you can punch a vent stack up through the roof, get
a furnace rather than a heat pump - higher efficiency, much lower
operating cost for heat.

And if your fuel source is intermittent, you can use a Heat Pump
A-coil behind a fuel furnace, and switch over if the fuel runs dry.

The ducting doesn't have to be insulated if it is in the conditioned
space and exposed - just get simple knock-down round sheetmetal
ducting, hang it from flat strapping, and cut in a saddle register box
aimed where you need it.

If the ducts are in an attic over an insulated space, just get
flexible insulated ducting. Cut in a Tee-Y and a register box where
needed. You start with a 16" round duct at the furnace plenum box,
then a 16-14-6 Tee-Y and drop to a 6" register, then continue the
trunk line with 14" duct and the next stop is a 14-12-6...

And don't discount packaged units if you don't want the air handler
unit in the attic or hanging overhead - you can put a curb-mount
package on the roof (heat pump or furnace heat) and the ducts go down
inside the curb into the conditioned space - makes for a neat and tidy
install, with very low chances of the roof leaking. The only big
bugaboo is getting a crane to plop the unit on the roof.

But, I also want the A/C *staged* (like my rpc's!), and am wondering if
despite a higher initial cost and no air-handling options besides the grill,
a few 1-ton mini-splits isn't a better way to go.
In commercial meters, staging will also sposedly lower your demand charge.

I don't think the difference between a single 4-ton condensing unit
compressor starting and two 2-ton mini-split compressors starting will
amount to much, even under demand metering situations - piston
compressors don't have that nasty a start surge, and the Scroll style
are even better. You are much more liable to get hit hard by the
demand surge of a 500A welder when you start making big arcs & sparks.

Curious about heat pumps:
These units use "reverse cycle" compressors, I think, which basically runs
the thermo cycle (and motor, iiuc) backwards.
Note that *any* A/C unit is a heat pump. If you simply took your window
unit and reversed it, you would have a heat pump!
Sposedly, a reverse cycle compressor spares one the duct work/physically
reversing the unit.
Is it that simple, or is there more to it?

A lot more to it - the compressor keeps running the same way
(Suction line in, Discharge line out), but there's a 4-way Reversing
Valve that decides whether it's in Forward or Reverse. Whether to
send the hot gas from the compressor discharge to the inside coil or
the outside first, and which coil the suction line pulls from. The
line between the two coils stays the same, but the flow does reverse
in them.

And the refrigerant filter/drier you use has to be a special
bi-directional one meant for use in a HP, or it would catch dirt one
way and let it go when the system reverses. Imagine a 'diode bridge'
of check valves around the filter element 'In' and 'Out' ports...

Also, in principle, one could turn any existing window A/C into a min-split
by simply splicing the copper tubing, and re-locating the compressor/coils
outside. And you would need another fan for the outside coils, as most room
a/c's have one motor for both blowers.

No, much simpler and cheaper to buy the right equipment. There are
lots of little details to making a heat pump work, like metering
orifices that are also spring loaded check valves and pop out of the
way when that coil is the condenser rather than the evaporator. Then
you got your defrost controllers, head pressure regulators,
low-pressure and high-pressure cut-outs, lots of odd stuff.

Unless you want to earn your PhD in HVAC, you don't try converting a
regular unit into a heat pump by yourself.

Inyway, dats the state of my current homework. Innerested in other
opinions, idears, etc.
Would post this to alt.hvac, but those guys are effing weird, and they don't
like DIYers--must be the freon....

People in the HVAC-R business have a Sword Of Damocles hanging over
their heads in the form of the EPA - if they say you vented
refrigerant deliberately (the system was improperly modified) they can
whack you for anywhere from $10K to a half million in fines, cash.

No insurance allowed, you can't buy personal liability or business
insurance to cover your ass. The odds of them actually doing it to
you are vanishingly slim, but not impossible. (And with my luck...)
Even so, IMHO that tends to put a bit of a damper on experimentation
and creativity.

-- Bruce --

--
Bruce L. Bergman, Woodland Hills (Los Angeles) CA - Desktop
Electrician for Westend Electric - CA726700
5737 Kanan Rd. #359, Agoura CA 91301 (818) 889-9545
Spamtrapped address: Remove the python and the invalid, and use a net.

Too bad you can't read too well.
--
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Noon-Air" wrote in message
...

"Cliff" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 18:40:51 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Awl--

Sorta seems like mini-split is the solution to my shop A/C, given that my
shop is surrounded by 18" stone walls (other than the rickety garage
door),
altho other options seem possible--like bonafide central air! Prices to
follow, from the Klimaire company--www.acfactoryoutlet.com.

But first, how does EER compare w/ SEER?? Is there a conversion? Is one
routinely higher than the other?

Next, suppose I have three one ton units, at 8, 10, and 12 EER. What is
the
relative diff. in cost to run them?

Next, I'm interested in other mfr's of mini-splits. Iny idears who makes
them?

Data on Klimaire you might find inneresting, basically comparing
mini-split
w/ central air, and some other variables.

Mini-splits, all with *heat pumps*, all 10 eer:
1 ton, $499
1.5 ton, $659
2 ton, about $800

Beats the crap out of prices on PC Richards crappy portable units,
w/miserable eer's.

Now, compare central air, where the inside air handler requires ducting,
poss. minimal if you don't mind it just blowing out into the shop.
These units are Fedders, supplied by Klimaire
1.5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, $675
12 seer, no hp, 737
12 seer, w/ hp, 969
2 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 698
12 seer, no hp, 875
12 seer, w/ hp, 1018
5 ton:
10 seer, no heat pump, 1190
12 seer, no hp, 1347
12 seer, w/ hp, 1600.
Also have 3 and 4 ton.

The difference between the central air and the mini-split is that you
have a
larger floor-standing coil/air handler in the central, to which duct
attaches, whereas the inside half of the mini looks pretty much like the
front of a room A/C.
The outside halves are similar.
Given the apparent greater economy of the central air, and the greater
versatility of the inside coil/air handler, makes central a good choice
for
all but the most cramped shops.
And exposed ducting inside a shop is pretty basic stuff. Could use
goddamm
garbage bags/duct tape in a pinch.

But, I also want the A/C *staged* (like my rpc's!), and am wondering if
despite a higher initial cost and no air-handling options besides the
grill,
a few 1-ton mini-splits isn't a better way to go.
In commercial meters, staging will also sposedly lower your demand
charge.

Note that all stuff mfr'd after 01/06 must be a *13* seer.
So the above stuff is sort of going on close-out, altho 12 seer still
seems
pretty good. Klimaire says the new 13 seer units will proly be 15% hgher
in
price.

Curious about heat pumps:
These units use "reverse cycle" compressors, I think, which basically
runs
the thermo cycle (and motor, iiuc) backwards.
Note that *any* A/C unit is a heat pump. If you simply took your window
unit and reversed it, you would have a heat pump!
Sposedly, a reverse cycle compressor spares one the duct work/physically
reversing the unit.
Is it that simple, or is there more to it?

Also, in principle, one could turn any existing window A/C into a
min-split
by simply splicing the copper tubing, and re-locating the
compressor/coils
outside. And you would need another fan for the outside coils, as most
room
a/c's have one motor for both blowers.

Inyway, dats the state of my current homework. Innerested in other
opinions, idears, etc.
Would post this to alt.hvac, but those guys are effing weird, and they
don't
like DIYers--must be the freon....

Crossposted to alt.hvac & alt.building.construction
--
Cliff

Too bad you didn't do all of your homework..... 10 and 12 SEER equipment
isn't manufactured any more, and hasn't been made since Sept 2005. Since
January 18, 2006, the *MINIMUM* SEER currently manufactured for sale in
the US for residential use is 13 SEER.
The new equipment is not DIY friendly, and in only 3 1/2 years, the
manufacture of R-22 equipment will cease completely.

On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 20:14:47 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Cliff--

Gee thanks, I'm sure the pills on alt.hvac are going to like my DIY
comments....

Happy to help G.
--
Cliff

See "looking for cheap cooling..." perty inneresting, in a few aspects.
Proof that sniffing refrigerant is bad for you.
--
Mr. P.V.'d
formerly Droll Troll
"Cliff" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 25 Apr 2006 20:14:47 -0400, "Proctologically Violated©®"
wrote:

Cliff--

Gee thanks, I'm sure the pills on alt.hvac are going to like my DIY
comments....

Happy to help G.
--
Cliff