We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here,
I'm assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for
the stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

What I need to know is:

1. Is this a good approach?
1a. How do quarries sift their rock?
1b. Is there something out there that I can get my hands on that does
this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think will work, it just
needs to separate the rock from the crap.
2. Anyone have any suggestions for screen? I'm considering expanded
metal, but it looks like I can't get really thick expanded metal with
1/4" holes. I'm afraid that the 18 gauge that it seems I can get will
wear too quickly, particularly if I get a big rock bonking around in there.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/

"Tim Wescott" wrote in message
...
We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't spread
out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just about exactly
the right size for causing problems with horses feet (according to SWMBO,
at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here, I'm
assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for the
stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

What I need to know is:

1. Is this a good approach?
1a. How do quarries sift their rock?
1b. Is there something out there that I can get my hands on that does
this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think will work, it just
needs to separate the rock from the crap.
2. Anyone have any suggestions for screen? I'm considering expanded
metal, but it looks like I can't get really thick expanded metal with 1/4"
holes. I'm afraid that the 18 gauge that it seems I can get will wear too
quickly, particularly if I get a big rock bonking around in there.

I would spread it and then run through the area with a Harley rake if you
have a skid steer or drag it with a York rake behind a tractor after it
dries. Any material that is sticky or wet, similar to compost, is going to
have a tendency to bridge and clog . If time is no object, maybe set a few
bucketfuls at a time on top of a suitable horizontal screen and let the rain
wash it through.

"Tim Wescott" wrote: (clip) Is there something out there that I can get my
hands on that does this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think
will work, it just needs to separate the rock from the crap.(clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
If you have horses, maybe you have a watering trough that's not in use.
Consider floating the manure and sinking the rocks. I'm pretty sure manure
will float, but you could double check with David Letterman ;-)

In article ,
Tim Wescott wrote:

We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

How did those get _in_ there?

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here,
I'm assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for
the stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

You could offer to deliver it, and warn about the rocks. Mind you, I do
try to go dig mine from the place that's given me the least rocks (and
weird plastic trash), but I have a truck. Even they are not rock-free,
but it's pretty occasional and usually large - they can't be bothered to
build a proper flat raised area to start the pile on, so they scoop up
crap from the (mucky) ground when rearranging it. The rocks show up in
the garden or in processing (ala rake and shovel) from truck to garden,
and get hurled in the pile with the rocks that started life in the
garden. Not such a big deal when expensive, delicate animules are not
going to step on it.

Someone else will have better details of the small rock sorting process
- big rock seem to be removed at the local gravel pit by dumping a
front-end-loader-bucketload onto a 45 degree "screen". This is quite
similar to the hand-powered screening we did at home when I was a kid,
as we dug up the garden beds and got the rocks and other detritus out
with a considerably smaller screen (of expanded metal mesh).

You idea sounds basically OK, but I suspect that it may require
considerably more engineering and investment to pull off (in a manner
that won't break in the first 5 minutes, and every 15 minutes
thereafter) than simply dumping the current pile in a horse-free-zone,
and keeping the rocks out of the next pile. Add a few pumpkin seeds to
the dumping zone and have a happy halloween...

If you have a brush pile anywhere, dump the manure pile on top of it,
and you'll save burning the brush pile if you can give it a few years.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by

Your rotary drum is called a trummel. They very common in placer mining
for gold. I have seen huge plate steel trummels with three inch holes in
them. Obviously they were for big operations.
I would expect that unless the manure is very fine and dry it will plug
up the holes.
The other alternative is a screen deck. It is a large steel box with one
or more layers of woven steel mesh or perforated sheet steel. The box is
slanted slightly and hung on springs. A shaft with counterweights is
rotated by a small gas engine via a long flexible Vee belt. The whole box
vibrates working the material down the slope. You might look up gravel
screening equipment websites for ideas.
I worked for a guy who built these units regularly... Any size and
screen spacing the customer wanted. Part of gold fever is the need to have
bigger and better screen decks and bigger, longer and better sluice boxes.
Randy




"Tim Wescott" wrote in message
...
We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here,
I'm assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for
the stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

What I need to know is:

1. Is this a good approach?
1a. How do quarries sift their rock?
1b. Is there something out there that I can get my hands on that does
this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think will work, it just
needs to separate the rock from the crap.
2. Anyone have any suggestions for screen? I'm considering expanded
metal, but it looks like I can't get really thick expanded metal with
1/4" holes. I'm afraid that the 18 gauge that it seems I can get will
wear too quickly, particularly if I get a big rock bonking around in there.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/

Get a cannon, load in black powder, wad material (maybe not necessary)
manure and rocks, touch off the powder. The rocks will be at the longest
range an the 'sifted' manure will be close to the cannon. With a few
practice shots, a few well placed blue tarps will collect the sifted manure
and the rocks will land on your road.

Get the neighbors involved and let'em touch off the cannon for a few buck.



--
J Miller
"R. Zimmerman" wrote in message
news:nLJUf.176416$H%4.88867@pd7tw2no...
Your rotary drum is called a trummel. They very common in placer mining
for gold. I have seen huge plate steel trummels with three inch holes in
them. Obviously they were for big operations.
I would expect that unless the manure is very fine and dry it will plug
up the holes.
The other alternative is a screen deck. It is a large steel box with
one
or more layers of woven steel mesh or perforated sheet steel. The box is
slanted slightly and hung on springs. A shaft with counterweights is
rotated by a small gas engine via a long flexible Vee belt. The whole box
vibrates working the material down the slope. You might look up gravel
screening equipment websites for ideas.
I worked for a guy who built these units regularly... Any size and
screen spacing the customer wanted. Part of gold fever is the need to
have
bigger and better screen decks and bigger, longer and better sluice boxes.
Randy




"Tim Wescott" wrote in message
...
We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here,
I'm assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for
the stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

What I need to know is:

1. Is this a good approach?
1a. How do quarries sift their rock?
1b. Is there something out there that I can get my hands on that does
this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think will work, it just
needs to separate the rock from the crap.
2. Anyone have any suggestions for screen? I'm considering expanded
metal, but it looks like I can't get really thick expanded metal with
1/4" holes. I'm afraid that the 18 gauge that it seems I can get will
wear too quickly, particularly if I get a big rock bonking around in
there.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/

In article ,
Tim Wescott wrote:

We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here,
I'm assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for
the stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

What I need to know is:

1. Is this a good approach?

Sort of... It's a "bad" variation on a unit called a Trommel-screen.

1a. How do quarries sift their rock?

Trommel-screen... Often a series of several of them with graduated size
elements.

1b. Is there something out there that I can get my hands on that does
this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think will work, it just
needs to separate the rock from the crap.

Trommel-screen. But unless you home-brew it, it's gonna be *REAL* pricey
- The smallest "ready-made" one I've ever personally laid eyes on was
used by the Mackinac Island dump/recycling center for *ALMOST* exactly
what you're looing to do - They started up a recycling/composting
operation there a few years back - Basic concept: Trash separation is
mandatory - You've got three containers: "Landfill", "recyclable", and
"compostable". You're welcome to buy only "Landfill" containers - at a
price intentionally set to "over the moon and then some" specifically to
discourage their use. Compost & recycle containers are practically free.
Misuse of compost or recycle containers for landfill means you get *NO*
garbage service whatsoever, and are legally obligated to transport it
all yourself (at exhorbitant prices) to get it off the island. Anyway,
long story shorter, "compost" bags get opened, spot-checked for
"illegal" trash, then run through a grinder. The output of the grinder
then gets mixed with some of the output from the 500-odd horses that
populate the island in the summer months, and stuffed into composting
frames. Once it's "cooked" enough (about 6 weeks from start to finish)
it gets fed to the trommel-screen, where any "chunks" that didn't
compost down nice the first time through get sent back through the
grinder for a repeat processing, and the "final product" that comes
through the side of the barrel gets sterilized and bagged for sale as
landscaping/topsoil material. (at premium prices, I might add! Even
though expensive, it is worthwhile if your're in the market for such
stuff)

2. Anyone have any suggestions for screen? I'm considering expanded
metal, but it looks like I can't get really thick expanded metal with
1/4" holes. I'm afraid that the 18 gauge that it seems I can get will
wear too quickly, particularly if I get a big rock bonking around in there.

There's where your plan goes bad...

Trommel-screens are more or less like the barrel of a cement mixer, only
tubular instead of conical, and open at both ends, with the size screen
needed to let "OK" stuff fall out along the length, while keeping the
"too big" stuff inside the barrel until it falls all the way to, and
eventually out through, the lower end, where it can either be loaded out
to a dump-site, or run into another Trommel-screen with a different
sized mesh for further size-grading if desired.

Basically, take your idea of the drum, make both ends open, cut out the
sides of the drum leaving a framework of "spokes" to suppot your screen,
and line the inside with plain old quarter-inch hardware cloth. Mount it
slanted so that the barrel can be spun on its long axis (doesn't need to
be very fast) and start shoveling stuff in at the top. "Clean" stuff
falls out through the screen, oversize "stuff" ends up piled at the
bottom end - Continuous cycle - As long as you keep feeding it, you keep
producing sifted stuff to be used, and oversized chunks to be disposed
of, with no need to stop to empty the barrel, and litle problem with
"big chunks" beating it to death, since they're only inside for as long
as it takes them to fall thorugh the barrel to the other end.

--
Don Bruder - - If your "From:" address isn't on my whitelist,
or the subject of the message doesn't contain the exact text "PopperAndShadow"
somewhere, any message sent to this address will go in the garbage without my
ever knowing it arrived. Sorry... http://www.sonic.net/~dakidd for more info

Ecnerwal wrote:
In article ,
Tim Wescott wrote:


We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.


How did those get _in_ there?

From the paddock. Either from the native soil or because the previous
owner was confused about the right stuff to floor a paddock with. At
any rate, the paddock is essentially 1 minus, with some bigger things
thrown in. That's the other part of the project -- stripping the old
manure, covering the too-big stuff with road cloth, and covering _that_
with 1/4 minus ("rock dust" if you're on the east coast).

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/

"Tim Wescott" wrote in message
...
We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't spread
out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just about exactly
the right size for causing problems with horses feet (according to SWMBO,
at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here, I'm
assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for the
stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

Tim do a little Googling on the types of vibratory sifters that
archaeologists use to find artifacts in 'dig' soil.

They're simple to build, and easy to use. You might check out the College
of William and Mary. They have an active site right now in the Jamestown
area, digging a civil war escarpment.

LLoyd

Tim, I read the header and assumed it was about all the political posts
here. No help to your poop problem, sorry.

Leo Lichtman wrote:

"Tim Wescott" wrote: (clip) Is there something out there that I can get my
hands on that does this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think
will work, it just needs to separate the rock from the crap.(clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
If you have horses, maybe you have a watering trough that's not in use.
Consider floating the manure and sinking the rocks. I'm pretty sure manure
will float, but you could double check with David Letterman ;-)




We work with topsoil places that do the float method...float off sticks
and such that need to be ground so the rocks don't get into the grinder.
It's just a tank with water flowing on one end (flume) and a conveyor
bottom that pulls the rocks out in the opposite direction of the water flow.

The same thing is used to de-rock potatoes on a volume basis.

Of course the thought of wet sloppy manure is probably not appealing so
I would just sift. Not sure how big a "big ol'" pile is but a simple
screen set at a slope is easy to shovel through by hand. Bigger volumes
than that and I'd go rotary or vibratory, scabbed together from whatever
you can get your hands on.

Koz wrote:



Leo Lichtman wrote:

"Tim Wescott" wrote: (clip) Is there something out there that I can
get my hands on that does this task? It doesn't have to look like
what I think will work, it just needs to separate the rock from the
crap.(clip)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
If you have horses, maybe you have a watering trough that's not in
use. Consider floating the manure and sinking the rocks. I'm pretty
sure manure will float, but you could double check with David
Letterman ;-)



We work with topsoil places that do the float method...float off sticks
and such that need to be ground so the rocks don't get into the grinder.
It's just a tank with water flowing on one end (flume) and a conveyor
bottom that pulls the rocks out in the opposite direction of the water
flow.

The same thing is used to de-rock potatoes on a volume basis.

Of course the thought of wet sloppy manure is probably not appealing so
I would just sift. Not sure how big a "big ol'" pile is but a simple
screen set at a slope is easy to shovel through by hand. Bigger volumes
than that and I'd go rotary or vibratory, scabbed together from whatever
you can get your hands on.

The pile is probably four yards, and we'll be generating at least a yard
a year unless we let it compost longer (these things do eventually reach
equilibrium).

My intention is to compost it first, and well-done manure compost is
reasonably dry and quite crumbly. So I really don't like the idea of
floating it. I thought of doing a vibratory trummel* but I think I can
hack together a rotary one easier than a vibratory one, and I think a
rotary one will be more reliable.

Now I just need to inventory my round tuits.

* Well, vibratory thingie -- but now I know the name.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/

Dunno, but I ask myself the same question when reading this newsgroup


"Tim Wescott" wrote in message
...
We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out back, which we can't
spread out in the pasture because it is full of rocks that are just
about exactly the right size for causing problems with horses feet
(according to SWMBO, at least). The sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

Since clean, rock-free horse manure is pretty easy to get around here,
I'm assuming I cannot give it away. So I'd like to build a sifter for
the stuff, to separate the good rocks from the good fertilizer.

I'm considering making a big drum with a 1/4" screen, rotating it with
either an electric motor or a Vibration & Stratton engine. I'll load in
dirty manure in one end with my loader, get clean manure out the bottom,
and occasionally dump slightly odiferous rocks out of the drum.

What I need to know is:

1. Is this a good approach?
1a. How do quarries sift their rock?
1b. Is there something out there that I can get my hands on that does
this task? It doesn't have to look like what I think will work, it just
needs to separate the rock from the crap.
2. Anyone have any suggestions for screen? I'm considering expanded
metal, but it looks like I can't get really thick expanded metal with
1/4" holes. I'm afraid that the 18 gauge that it seems I can get will
wear too quickly, particularly if I get a big rock bonking around in
there.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

Posting from Google? See http://cfaj.freeshell.org/google/

Saw something in a scrap yard that might work. They were feeding cars into
a huge grinder. Came out the bottom in small pieces that were dumped onto a
conveyer belt. These pieces included plastic, cloth, metal, etc. The belt
was moving fairly quickly at an upward angle. When the pieces got to the
end of the belt, they would fly off in an arc. The heavy metal pieces would
fly farther then the lighter plastics and cloth. Boards were set to deflect
the pieces into different piles. If your manure is dry it should be lighter
then the rocks and this might work.

| "Tim Wescott" wrote in
| message
| ...
| We have this big ol' pile of horse manure out
| back, which we can't spread out in the pasture
| because it is full of rocks that are just about
| exactly the right size for causing problems with
| horses feet (according to SWMBO, at least). The
| sizes range from sand to 3-4 inches.

I was just thinking about that deck grating used in industrial
environments. It's a bunch of metal strips laid on end and held together by
various means, so that ought to sift out anything larger than about 3/4" or
so. It's used for a billion things, and great for stables and barns so that
you have something solid to walk on while muck falls away between the slats
and can be washed away later.
Stand it up on a mild incline somehow and connect it by whatever means
works for you to whatever piece of machinery you have that vibrates the
most. The rocks will continue out to the low side of the grate while the
manure falls through.
Another thing that came to me was to connect it to a front loader so
that all you have to do is to drive the grate into the pile, pick up a load,
back away over the piles of clean manure previously deposited, which will
give you a nice shaking motion, then dump the rocks left behind wherever you
see fit. This way you get to move the rocks and screen them out at the same
time.

And you should smack whoever had the bright idea of mixing rocky soil
and manure together.