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Old December 8th 03, 10:09 PM
Steve Koschamnn
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

OK group... what am I missing? I just bought a brand new surplus, 1 HP
commercial Phas a Matic rotary converter. Retails for $405.00 new..
bought it for $50.00. I figured it was worth 50.00 as it is truely brand
new.

Went to their website http://www.phase-a-matic.com/RotaryDescription.htm ,
read all the great stuff about how good their rotary is blah, blah blah ,
and well, I figured got a good deal. So lets see whats inside......

Opened up the metal enclosure on top to see the guts of the unit and what do
I see.... nothing but a SINGLE 30 microfared oil filled capacitor. No
potential relay, no banks of capacitors to balance the phases, no fuses, no
nothing else. One single starting capacitor.

THIS is worth $405.00 retail.. a 1HP Baldor motor with one single 30 uf
capacitor?????

Is there something special in the rotor of the motor that I am missing? Is
there something in the wire? Please someone let me know why and how Phase
a Matic gets away with this BS!!!

Steve Koschmann


Second question... can I parallel a standard 2HP 3 phase motor with this 1
HP unit and try to get a 3 HP converter going? Should I balance the phases
of the 1 HP unit and or the combined 1 and 2 HP (=3 HP) units?


Steve




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Old December 8th 03, 10:32 PM
Terry Thorne
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

People will spend 1-2$ for bottled water
20$ for the parts 200$ for the name
"Profit" is the name of the game

Happy Holidays!
tt


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Old December 8th 03, 10:39 PM
jim rozen
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

In article . net, Steve
Koschamnn says...

THIS is worth $405.00 retail.. a 1HP Baldor motor with one single 30 uf
capacitor?????


It's not a *motor*. It's a phase converter.

Now you know why most of use here roll our own.

Make the idler big enough, and you can leave out the
capacitor, too.

Jim

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Old December 8th 03, 10:57 PM
Roy
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?


Just like folks always tell me when they see some of my projects. How
could you build that, those things are made in factories.......duh! I
would say a little too much money in the persons pocket and not enough
initiative or willingness to tackle building one from
scratch........why I bet it costs them a lot of money to have their
stickers drawn up and made...........Phas-A-Matic, has a special ring
to it, doesn't it? No wonder it costs the $$$ they ask for it! If you
wholeheartedly think you were ripped, imagine what those folks reading
this thread feels like that paid the Retail price.........
Visit my website: http://www.frugalmachinist.com
Opinions expressed are those of my wifes,
I had no input whatsoever.
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Old December 8th 03, 11:00 PM
Spehro Pefhany
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

On Mon, 08 Dec 2003 21:09:03 GMT, the renowned "Steve Koschamnn"
wrote:

OK group... what am I missing? I just bought a brand new surplus, 1 HP
commercial Phas a Matic rotary converter. Retails for $405.00 new..
bought it for $50.00. I figured it was worth 50.00 as it is truely brand
new.

Went to their website http://www.phase-a-matic.com/RotaryDescription.htm ,
read all the great stuff about how good their rotary is blah, blah blah ,
and well, I figured got a good deal. So lets see whats inside......

Opened up the metal enclosure on top to see the guts of the unit and what do
I see.... nothing but a SINGLE 30 microfared oil filled capacitor. No
potential relay, no banks of capacitors to balance the phases, no fuses, no
nothing else. One single starting capacitor.

THIS is worth $405.00 retail.. a 1HP Baldor motor with one single 30 uf
capacitor?????

Is there something special in the rotor of the motor that I am missing? Is
there something in the wire? Please someone let me know why and how Phase
a Matic gets away with this BS!!!


A guy trying to sell one to me used the line that he'd never attach
his expensive machinery to a home-made converter..

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com


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Old December 9th 03, 12:17 AM
Grant Erwin
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

There's one born every minute .. - GWE

Steve Koschamnn wrote:

OK group... what am I missing? I just bought a brand new surplus, 1 HP
commercial Phas a Matic rotary converter. Retails for $405.00 new..
bought it for $50.00. I figured it was worth 50.00 as it is truely brand
new.

Went to their website http://www.phase-a-matic.com/RotaryDescription.htm ,
read all the great stuff about how good their rotary is blah, blah blah ,
and well, I figured got a good deal. So lets see whats inside......

Opened up the metal enclosure on top to see the guts of the unit and what do
I see.... nothing but a SINGLE 30 microfared oil filled capacitor. No
potential relay, no banks of capacitors to balance the phases, no fuses, no
nothing else. One single starting capacitor.

THIS is worth $405.00 retail.. a 1HP Baldor motor with one single 30 uf
capacitor?????

Is there something special in the rotor of the motor that I am missing? Is
there something in the wire? Please someone let me know why and how Phase
a Matic gets away with this BS!!!

Steve Koschmann


Second question... can I parallel a standard 2HP 3 phase motor with this 1
HP unit and try to get a 3 HP converter going? Should I balance the phases
of the 1 HP unit and or the combined 1 and 2 HP (=3 HP) units?


Steve




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Old December 9th 03, 12:45 AM
Jim Wilson
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

Steve Koschamnn wrote...
Second question... can I parallel a standard 2HP 3 phase motor with this 1
HP unit and try to get a 3 HP converter going? Should I balance the phases
of the 1 HP unit and or the combined 1 and 2 HP (=3 HP) units?


You can definitely increase your power capacity by adding another idler
motor. You might want to start the 2HP motor first, and then run the 1HP
off that, but with no load on either motor, I'd hazard (!) a guess that
you won't damage anything going the other way around. I don't know for
sure on the balancing question, but I suspect you want to balance the
phases and power factor with both motors running, and perhaps with a
"typical" load (electrical) applied.

Jim
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Old December 9th 03, 02:29 AM
TSJABS
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

I have seen many, many static phase converters built and used succesfully on
all types of motorized equiptment with the exception of air compressors. I use
one to power my 7.5hp pacemaker lathe. I have never seen the need to be
running an idler if you are only going to be operatiing motors of fractional or
up to 1 or 2 horsepower.
Mainly the only reason I built my superlarge static unit was to prove it can
be done and that it works very well. It also has alot of run caps and all
phases are within 2.5 amps of each other under load. I don't call that single
phasing at all. My father built about 12-15 STATIC phase converters for a
fellow that was moving his whole machineshop from town (3 ph power) to his home
(single phase). Since pretty much everything was not under load when started
they went the static converter route. That has been 10-15 years ago and as
could be expected they have had acouple caps release their magic smoke but no
biggie, repairs are quick, cheap and easy and no big motor sitting running
turning the ole power meter faster.
I plan on setting up a rotary unit in the near future only because a new mill
I bought really needs the cleaner power of the rotary unit, otherwise it would
be on a static unit.
Most small phase converters I have built I have little or no money in them.
They can also be used to start a rotary phase converter as well. The 7.5hp
static unit I built I had just over 100.00 in it and that was with 100% new
components.
Oh yes, one other thing I have been an Journeyman wireman(industrial and
commercial) for 17 years. My father was a locomotive electrician from the mid
50's till 1964 and then an Industrial/commercial electrician till he retired a
few years ago.
Looks like I am going to have to run down to the supply house and buy a large
lot of goodies and start making up some add-a-phase units, at a 100.00 a crack
wowwiieeee,,, Im in the money,,

good luck

tim
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Old December 9th 03, 02:41 AM
Roy
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

On Mon, 8 Dec 2003 13:48:39 -0800, Checkmate
snip
===
===You want a good 3 HP phase converter? Try one of mine:
===
===http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=2580033737
===
===This model doesn't have run caps. Phase voltages vary by approximately
===10% maximum. The same converter tuned with run caps will be balanced to
===approximately 3% or less. In most applications, the run caps aren't
===necessary. My converters use a contactor through a DPST toggle switch
===to turn them on. A voltage sensing relay switches the starting cap(s)
===out of the circuit when the user-provided idler motor comes up to speed.
===Startup to full speed takes just a fraction of a second.

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Sounds like the one or two or three that I have built
as well as what most of the regulars here have built already and also
like the one Bob S has an article in HSM on. I have plans for it on
my website for FREE
Visit my website: http://www.frugalmachinist.com
Opinions expressed are those of my wifes,
I had no input whatsoever.
Remove "nospam" from email addy.
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Old December 9th 03, 03:11 AM
jim rozen
 
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Default Phas a matic Rotary Converter Rip Off?

In article , TSJABS says...

I have never seen the need to be
running an idler if you are only going to be operatiing motors of fractional or
up to 1 or 2 horsepower.


One reason that a rotary converter might be preferred is
that it provides plug (instant) reversing for dynamic
braking and for operations such as threading to a shoulder.

biggie, repairs are quick, cheap and easy and no big motor sitting running
turning the ole power meter faster.


A 5 hp idler motor consumes about 200 watts of power when unloaded.
That's a *lot* less than the lighting load in my basement shop,
so I don't consider power draw to be a disadvantage to rotary
converters.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================



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