My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good 185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we get something else. Is the
argon OK?

On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 14:16:05 GMT, Dave Lyon wrote:
My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good 185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we get something else. Is the
argon OK?

Download Miller's TIG handbook from Miller's website. It is about 80
pages and discusses welding titanium (which has many gotchas). Check
out sci.engr.joining.welding.

http://www.millerwelds.com/education/TIGhandbook/
http://www.deutschetitan.de/eng/profi/kb11.html
http://www.azom.com/details.asp?ArticleID=1499

I never welded titanium, so all I know is what I saw in various
reference books.

i

It tends to burn quite nicely when properly persuaded. I'd want to
read up on it first, and perhaps have a fire department at the
ready... / mark


Dave Lyon wrote:

My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good 185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we get something else. Is the
argon OK?

Dave Lyon wrote:

My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good 185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we get something else. Is the
argon OK?




Depending on the alloy, it probably can be welded. This is a project
designed to gobble up money, obviously not for any practical use,
as what the heck does an un-manned vehicle need a roll bar to
protect, anyway?

You are going to have to use titanium filler rod. Since this is most likely
going to be made out of solid Ti wire, anyway, you can probably use scraps
of the original stock as the filler. You may need an additional TIG torch
and a helper to apply enough shield gas to prevent a fire. The helper
may need to apply shield gas to the opposide side of the weld, or to follow
the welding torch to inert the just-welded but still hot metal until it
cools.
IF you did this on tubing, you might need to fill the tube with argon first,
and then plug the bottom to keep it in.

I think Argon should be fine for Ti, and I'm pretty sure you don't want
anything with oxygen in it, like CO2.

Jon

Depending on the alloy, it probably can be welded. This is a project
designed to gobble up money, obviously not for any practical use,
as what the heck does an un-manned vehicle need a roll bar to
protect, anyway?

You'd be surprised. This little sucker does over 30 mph. He has a habit of
running into telephone polls, curbs, and over very large jumps. He has
broken 3 gas tanks, and multiple motor mounts in the last few weeks.

Of course, he could just buy a SS roll cage, but that wouldn't be as cool as
titanium.


You are going to have to use titanium filler rod. Since this is most
likely
going to be made out of solid Ti wire, anyway, you can probably use scraps
of the original stock as the filler. You may need an additional TIG torch
and a helper to apply enough shield gas to prevent a fire. The helper
may need to apply shield gas to the opposide side of the weld, or to
follow
the welding torch to inert the just-welded but still hot metal until it
cools.


Thanks, that answers some of my questions. I called my welding supplier
today. He said it had to be welded in argon, but he didn't know why. It must
be because of that pesky little fire problem. They had filler rod for me,
but I had to buy a minimum of $600.00 worth. I think instead, we'll just get
a couple 1/16 pieces from McMaster-Carr.

It TIGs quite well. For high quality welds you need to back purge
minimally or preferably work in a pure argon atmosphere.

For small work you can TIG it just like you would aluminium. It will
be ugly where the gas doesn't shield it and it won't give maximum
strength but it does hold. I watched a guy weld a sheet titanium
pyramid in one of Ernie's classes a few years ago. I didn't think it
would work but it looked great.

Cheers,

Kelley

On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 14:16:05 GMT, "Dave Lyon"
wrote:

My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good 185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we get something else. Is the
argon OK?

Bicycle shops (design ones anyway) do it all of the time.
Search for them on the net - maybe some hints.

Martin
Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder



Dave Lyon wrote:
My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good 185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we get something else. Is the
argon OK?



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Kelley Mascher wrote:

: It TIGs quite well. For high quality welds you need to back purge
: minimally or preferably work in a pure argon atmosphere.
--If at all possible you'll want to do it in a big-ass glove
box..

: and it won't give maximum strength but it does hold.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
--What he said. I'd be particularly concerned due to the
application; i.e. life saving. I've seen massively thick battlebot
armor (3/8" thick plate) that has ripped apart at the welds due to
*not* back-purging correctly. Something as wimpy as a rollbar would
probably fail under a much smaller impact..
--Also, assuming you're planning to use Ti tube you'll want to
bend it, yes? Not sure what this would entail but I'll bet it ain't
trivial... ;-)
--

"Steamboat Ed" Haas : Doodle doodle dee
Hacking the Trailing Edge! : Wubba wubba wubba...
http://www.nmpproducts.com/intro.htm
---Decks a-wash in a sea of words---

I've seen it done,but never done it myself. A
friend used to weld 10 mm I.D. titanium filling
tubes for a bleach bottle filler. When they were
damaged, he dropped them into a small open topped
tank which he consciously purged with argon before
and for a minute or two after tig welding them. He
used titanium filler rod,but I don't know where he
got it from. It was quite successful, and the
welds looked OK as well.
Tom





"Martin H. Eastburn"
wrote in message
...
Bicycle shops (design ones anyway) do it all of
the time.
Search for them on the net - maybe some hints.

Martin
Martin Eastburn
@ home at Lions' Lair with our computer
lionslair at consolidated dot net
NRA LOH, NRA Life
NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder



Dave Lyon wrote:
My employee wants to make a titanium roll cage
for his high performance
remote control monster truck. We have a good
185 amp tig welder, and he's
pretty good at using it. We are using argon as
a shield gas.

The problem is, we've never worked with
titanium before. Can it be Tig
welded? Can we use stainless rod, or should we
get something else. Is the
argon OK?



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