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Lennie the Lurker July 20th 03 09:30 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
(John Flanagan) wrote in message ...

Lennie, the purpose of a gun is not to kill and maim, everybody.


I never ****ing said it was, only that I DON'T ****ING NEED ONE. Is
that so ****ing hard to understand, or shall I drop the level to that
of your dog before you understand?

Guns don't kill and maim without intent, unless, like the LA tragedy,
it's a ****ing accident, is that impossible to reconcile with your
paranoid stance? You do understand that with powerful machines,
accidents happen? Or are you looking for some terrorist everytime a
drunk doffs himself against a tree? Or maybe the 13 year old that I
once went to school with swung the 12 gauge on a quail, and found his
brothers head in the way had some evil intent? I don't ****ing think
so. Get a ****ing life, morons, there isn't evil intent in every
tragedy, not even a half percent of what enters your miniscule
intellects as being a conspiracy. The only truly evil thing that has
happened here is that gunner has had another unrelated excuse to open
his fat yap again, with no regard for the victims, or of the person
driving the car, or anything else except his need to look big at the
expense of the innocent. Excess alcohol does that to the mind.

jim rozen July 20th 03 09:55 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
In article ,
says...

You do understand that with powerful machines,
accidents happen?


Interesting phrase. "Accidents Happen."

My personal suspicion is that this was an avoidable
crash. Not really an accident. That somebody,
somewhere, dropped the ball. That somebody who
cared about the driver should have seen his license
yanked, that some goverment worker did not do his
job and let this guy slide by one more time
at the eye test or something.

As a motorbike rider I am aware that there really
are no 'accidents.' Crashes have causes, and just
saying oopsey daisy does not sufice. There was a
cause here and it wasn't the hand of god reaching
down to kill those poor people.

This is why folks with poor eyesight or impaired
judgement should be limited to non-powerful vehicles.
Like maybe a schwinn. Failing that the driver's seat in
their car should be located in front of the front
bumper.

his fat yap again, with no regard for the victims, or of the person
driving the car,


A good point. I stongly suggest we acquaint the families of the
victims with the driver of the car, all together in one room.
Second option is to reunite the car driver and the victims,
in person.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================


John Flanagan July 20th 03 10:30 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 20 Jul 2003 07:39:59 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

In article , Gunner says...

And he still killed 10 people, and maimed 45 for life. Thats not
exactly an "ooops", now is it?


Aw 'comeon gunner. It wasn't like he tried to *murder* them
or anything. There was no _intent_ to do harm.

Here I have my change to yet again trot out my patent-pending
program for the betterment of the US roadways.

Once the person fails the yearly mandatory eye test after age
65, or if they are convicted of *one* DWI, their drivers
license shall automatically be converted over into a
motorcycle *only* licencse.


You know that's a *GREAT* idea !!! At least for DUI cases. You're
absolutely right. Mobility is very important to an individual today
and losing your license can really mess things up for you. The
motorcycle only license would put the fear of God into the individual
contemplating drinking and driving in addition to reducing the
potential damage if he chooses to do so.

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

Gunner July 20th 03 11:15 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 20 Jul 2003 13:30:47 -0700, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

(John Flanagan) wrote in message ...

Lennie, the purpose of a gun is not to kill and maim, everybody.


I never ****ing said it was, only that I DON'T ****ING NEED ONE. Is
that so ****ing hard to understand, or shall I drop the level to that
of your dog before you understand?

Guns don't kill and maim without intent, unless, like the LA tragedy,
it's a ****ing accident, is that impossible to reconcile with your
paranoid stance? You do understand that with powerful machines,
accidents happen? Or are you looking for some terrorist everytime a
drunk doffs himself against a tree? Or maybe the 13 year old that I
once went to school with swung the 12 gauge on a quail, and found his
brothers head in the way had some evil intent? I don't ****ing think
so. Get a ****ing life, morons, there isn't evil intent in every
tragedy, not even a half percent of what enters your miniscule
intellects as being a conspiracy. The only truly evil thing that has
happened here is that gunner has had another unrelated excuse to open
his fat yap again, with no regard for the victims, or of the person
driving the car, or anything else except his need to look big at the
expense of the innocent. Excess alcohol does that to the mind.


Once again the old Nazi spews dreck.
He calls me (a Buddhist) a Jew, and me (a teetotaler) a drunk.

I wonder if he will ever get anything right? But when you are so
blindly filled with hatred for everyone around you, as Leslie is, its
easy to try to look into his own issues for subjects to attack others
with.

I suspect Leslie is a closet drunkard. We know already by his own
statements he is an AntiSemite and a socialist.

Shrug, must really suck big time to be him.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

dddd July 20th 03 11:53 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Sorry, to you and Glen Ashmore. I just did a Google search and found out it
was Glen who called Mark out on his welching.


--
Regards,
Dewey Clark http://www.historictimekeepers.com
Ebay Sales:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAP...ems&userid=dsc
Restorations, Parts for Hamilton M21s, Products for Craftsmen
Makers of Historic Timekeepers Ultrasonic Clock Cleaning Solution

"jim rozen" wrote in message
...
In article , "dddd" says...

How easily you forget inconvenient facts. You were the loudmouth who

said
he would send $20 to the Red Crescent if biological weapons were not

found
in Iraq within weeks after the US attack. When Jim Rozen asked you about
it, you pleaded for another month. That was 6 weeks ago.


Unfortunately you are mistake sir.

I was aware of the bet at the time it was made, but have
never made any reference to it here. I was also unaware
that my non-comment had received a reply from him.

I suspect you may have accidentally confused posters'
identities.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================




Tim Williams July 21st 03 01:09 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
"John Flanagan" wrote in message
...
I can't think of any other gun htat can do that


Vulcan?

Tim

--
In the immortal words of Ned Flanders: "No foot longs!"
Website @ http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms



erniegalts July 21st 03 04:17 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Sun, 20 Jul 2003 11:05:09 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

On 18 Jul 2003 23:37:50 -0700, (Jaws) wrote:

leon skunkers wrote in message . ..
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 03:58:47 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli

yeah. And send your contributions to MAGOO (mothers against geezers
operating oldsmobiles). Hang up posters of the dead people all over
Florida's Fossil Riviera and get celebrities to whine about the whole
thing on TV.

Hangin' is too good for these old farts that take to the road
knowingly impaired by the ravages of age.


You'll be an "old fart" one of these days. After driving all those
years you're just going to hand over your keys. No laws saying you
have to, just decide for yourself that you're to old to drive. Give
up the vintage 1999 Corvette????? Give the old guy a little respect.
Maybe he caused an accident but he's still a human being.


And he still killed 10 people, and maimed 45 for life. Thats not
exactly an "ooops", now is it?


Not in my estimation. But then again, am just an "generalist" not an
"ooops" expert such as you seem to be, Gunner.

I don't accuse others of being "self-confessed pedophiles". Some
assholes on misc.survivalism do.

Suppose should have expected you to join such lying assholes such as
Ray Keller.

After all, you have defended his posts in the past, haven't you?

He wouldn't one be one of those ex-marines who are incapable of
discriminating between a 12 year old girl and an 18 year old, would
he?

Admittedly, in a state or country where the legal age of consent was
18, it might be difficult for a normal individual to discriminate
between 17 or even 16 year old "San Quentin Quail" and an 18 year old.

But for someone over 30 to fail to recognize a 12 year old child?

This is a real stretch of the imagination, isn't it?





Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs



"_Magna est veritas et praevalebit"_
(Truth is mighty and will prevail).

erniegalts
[Australia]
[misc.survivalism]

John Flanagan July 21st 03 04:39 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Sun, 20 Jul 2003 19:09:53 -0500, "Tim Williams"
wrote:

"John Flanagan" wrote in message
...
I can't think of any other gun htat can do that


Vulcan?


I was limiting the catagory to hand helds :^). But even then the
vulcan only beats it out by around 25 projectiles a second. Now if I
had a semi automatic shotgun instead of a pump action it would beat
even a vulcan. Of course vulcans are firing a somewhat larger
projectile at a slightly higher muzzle velocity.

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

Lennie the Lurker July 21st 03 04:43 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Gunner wrote in message . ..
Gunners bull**** hacked, rightfully.

Resign yourself to the trashcan, ****head. You have defended beer
more than I have, I love the sight of burning bars, distilleries, and
breweries. But you, gummer, I suspect spend a lot of time on Market
street with your own kind. When are you and your brothers Jeffrey
Dahmer, and John Wayne Gacy going to have another family gathering?

What you posted was the most fatheaded thing that any KKkalifornee
Kweer Kween could post, all that I would expect from someone with the
intelect of an amoeba.

John Flanagan July 21st 03 04:46 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 20 Jul 2003 13:55:09 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

As a motorbike rider I am aware that there really
are no 'accidents.' Crashes have causes, and just
saying oopsey daisy does not sufice. There was a
cause here and it wasn't the hand of god reaching
down to kill those poor people.


There you go, my definition of "accidental" is something that could
have been avoided but for whatever reason wasn't. Which is in harmony
with my belief that there is no such thing as change or randomness.
All things have a cause and an accident happens only because of our
ignorance or neglect and is therefore "preventable".

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

Lennie the Lurker July 21st 03 04:59 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
jim rozen wrote in message ...

My personal suspicion is that this was an avoidable
crash. Not really an accident. That somebody,
somewhere, dropped the ball.


Not withstanding, there still was no INTENT. Intent, as in: "GuMMers
posting was with vile intent." The only malicious INTENT here has
been gunners, not the driver, not those that wouldn't do what you so
loudly argue against, put some regulation in effect that would
restrict his right to drive, because that might lead to a regulation
restricting the right to walk, and so forth until you couldn't leave
your house. Ridiculous example, I know, but no worse than what comes
from NRA.

BTW, Jim, as one that was one hour short of having my private license
for gliders, if you want to know how to look out for things not in
your control, try that. (Fixed costs of $4000+ per year isn't my idea
of how to have fun. Fortunately, it's the geriatric hobby of rich old
conservatives, and I don't miss most of them.)

jim rozen July 21st 03 05:12 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
In article ,
says...

Not withstanding, there still was no INTENT.


Yes. That changes it from murder to manslaughter, or
whatever they charge in CA. 8, 10 counts. Unless he
was drunk or otherwise knew he should not have been
operating a motor vehicle.

What does the law want to know? Would a reasonable
person think that he would crash the car, if he
went out driving with whatever disability he had?
If he had, say, failed an eye test, then a reasonable
person might say yes, crashing and killing people
might be a predictable consequence.

That could bump the charge up, depending on how
they want to play it.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================


Lennie the Lurker July 21st 03 05:12 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Gunner wrote in message . ..

More rightwing, racist, blockheaded things that I'd expect out of an
insulted Kweer Kween.

jim rozen July 21st 03 05:14 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
In article ,
says...

All things have a cause and an accident happens only because of our
ignorance or neglect and is therefore "preventable".


Well, mostly. Look up Peekskill and meteorite if you
get a chance.

If I had been bopped on the head while riding to work,
would that be a true accident?

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================


John Flanagan July 21st 03 05:32 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 03:46:40 GMT, (John
Flanagan) wrote:

On 20 Jul 2003 13:55:09 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

As a motorbike rider I am aware that there really
are no 'accidents.' Crashes have causes, and just
saying oopsey daisy does not sufice. There was a
cause here and it wasn't the hand of god reaching
down to kill those poor people.


There you go, my definition of "accidental" is something that could
have been avoided but for whatever reason wasn't. Which is in harmony
with my belief that there is no such thing as change or randomness.
All things have a cause and an accident happens only because of our
ignorance or neglect and is therefore "preventable".


Make that chance, not change.

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

Jaws July 21st 03 05:42 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Gunner wrote in message . ..
On 18 Jul 2003 23:37:50 -0700, (Jaws) wrote:

leon skunkers wrote in message . ..
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 03:58:47 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli

yeah. And send your contributions to MAGOO (mothers against geezers
operating oldsmobiles). Hang up posters of the dead people all over
Florida's Fossil Riviera and get celebrities to whine about the whole
thing on TV.

Hangin' is too good for these old farts that take to the road
knowingly impaired by the ravages of age.


You'll be an "old fart" one of these days. After driving all those
years you're just going to hand over your keys. No laws saying you
have to, just decide for yourself that you're to old to drive. Give
up the vintage 1999 Corvette????? Give the old guy a little respect.
Maybe he caused an accident but he's still a human being.


And he still killed 10 people, and maimed 45 for life. Thats not
exactly an "ooops", now is it?

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs


You're right. But he's stlii a human being.

So, you gonna give up your keys when you're an "old fart" or are you
gonna hope they got the concrete barriers up when you pass the farmers
market.

Gunner July 21st 03 08:01 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 20 Jul 2003 21:42:59 -0700, (Jaws) wrote:

Gunner wrote in message . ..
On 18 Jul 2003 23:37:50 -0700,
(Jaws) wrote:

leon skunkers wrote in message . ..
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 03:58:47 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli

yeah. And send your contributions to MAGOO (mothers against geezers
operating oldsmobiles). Hang up posters of the dead people all over
Florida's Fossil Riviera and get celebrities to whine about the whole
thing on TV.

Hangin' is too good for these old farts that take to the road
knowingly impaired by the ravages of age.

You'll be an "old fart" one of these days. After driving all those
years you're just going to hand over your keys. No laws saying you
have to, just decide for yourself that you're to old to drive. Give
up the vintage 1999 Corvette????? Give the old guy a little respect.
Maybe he caused an accident but he's still a human being.


And he still killed 10 people, and maimed 45 for life. Thats not
exactly an "ooops", now is it?

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs


You're right. But he's stlii a human being.

So, you gonna give up your keys when you're an "old fart" or are you
gonna hope they got the concrete barriers up when you pass the farmers
market.


When Im no longer able to safely navigate 5000 lbs+ of hurtling metal
rubber and glass down the road, I will sadly but willingly give up my
keys. Shrug, its a fact of life that each of us have to bear. I no
longer rock climb, race motorcycles or rodeo. Age takes it toll. I
regret not being able to climb up on the back of a bull and holler for
the gate, miss it terribly, but those days are long gone. Shrug. Im
realistic about it.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

Gunner July 21st 03 08:01 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 20 Jul 2003 20:43:33 -0700, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Gunner wrote in message . ..
Gunners bull**** hacked, rightfully.

Resign yourself to the trashcan, ****head. You have defended beer
more than I have, I love the sight of burning bars, distilleries, and
breweries. But you, gummer, I suspect spend a lot of time on Market
street with your own kind. When are you and your brothers Jeffrey
Dahmer, and John Wayne Gacy going to have another family gathering?


As I said, it appears that Leslie uses his own issues to attack others
in some vain attempt to bolster his own ego. Now he is spewing about
gays. So, from the looks of it, Leslie is a gay Nazi drunkard.

What you posted was the most fatheaded thing that any KKkalifornee
Kweer Kween could post, all that I would expect from someone with the
intelect of an amoeba.


Yup, looks like a homophobe. Pretty common for them to be latent
homosexuals.

Im quite straight, and really dont give a damn who puts what where.
Not my business.

Leslie the Loonie, Gay Nazi drunkard..sigh..must REALLY suck to be
him.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

Gunner July 21st 03 08:01 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 20 Jul 2003 21:12:26 -0700, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Gunner wrote in message . ..

More rightwing, racist, blockheaded things that I'd expect out of an
insulted Kweer Kween.


You misspelled Leftwing. The other parts do indeed apply to you
though. Thanks for pointing that out. and confirming my suspicions.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

Gunner July 21st 03 08:49 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 20 Jul 2003 07:34:25 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

In article , "dddd" says...

How easily you forget inconvenient facts. You were the loudmouth who said
he would send $20 to the Red Crescent if biological weapons were not found
in Iraq within weeks after the US attack. When Jim Rozen asked you about
it, you pleaded for another month. That was 6 weeks ago.


Unfortunately you are mistake sir.

I was aware of the bet at the time it was made, but have
never made any reference to it here. I was also unaware
that my non-comment had received a reply from him.

I suspect you may have accidentally confused posters'
identities.

Jim


Actually Jim, I dont recall pleading to any one for another month, but
its possible that I said "just wait and see", shrug, anything is
possible.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

dann mann July 21st 03 09:36 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
None of those elderly gentlemen had access to large fast moving autos.
Not a valid comparison. I've seen old people do some remarkable things
but driving in today's traffic even bothers me sometimes and I'm only
45.





dddd July 21st 03 12:15 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Just proves what a wimp you are. Not only have you admitted you are a
dishonorable person who keeps people waiting for the money you owe them ("I
owe lots of people money. Everyone gets paid, sooner or later."), but you
deny what was written.

While I had it wrong about Jim (it was in fact Glen Ashmore, see my post to
Jim Rozen) you will find the exchange of May 1 through a Google search. But
I suspect that like the use of the dictionary and library, such is beyond
your ken.

Still, at least you haven't denied that you can be shamed into correcting
your behavior. Even if you did try to behind the skirts of Jim's correction
in an attempt to deny the event ever happened.

Mark, you are an intellectual moron, a moral (oral?) coward and a chiseler.
And you wear these attributes like a badge of honor. Like the guy said, you
are a truly interesting deviation of the human genome.

If , as reported by others, your business is going down the tubes, these
attributes may have played a small part.
--
Regards,
Dewey Clark http://www.historictimekeepers.com
Ebay Sales:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAP...ems&userid=dsc
Restorations, Parts for Hamilton M21s, Products for Craftsmen
Makers of Historic Timekeepers Ultrasonic Clock Cleaning Solution

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
On 20 Jul 2003 07:34:25 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

In article , "dddd" says...

How easily you forget inconvenient facts. You were the loudmouth who

said
he would send $20 to the Red Crescent if biological weapons were not

found
in Iraq within weeks after the US attack. When Jim Rozen asked you

about
it, you pleaded for another month. That was 6 weeks ago.


Unfortunately you are mistake sir.

I was aware of the bet at the time it was made, but have
never made any reference to it here. I was also unaware
that my non-comment had received a reply from him.

I suspect you may have accidentally confused posters'
identities.

Jim


Actually Jim, I dont recall pleading to any one for another month, but
its possible that I said "just wait and see", shrug, anything is
possible.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William

Burroughs



Gunner July 21st 03 12:20 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 01:36:23 -0700 (PDT), (dann
mann) wrote:

None of those elderly gentlemen had access to large fast moving autos.
Not a valid comparison. I've seen old people do some remarkable things
but driving in today's traffic even bothers me sometimes and I'm only
45.



You dont kill and injure 50 some people with a Mobility Scooter.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

Bray Haven July 21st 03 01:32 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
There you go, my definition of "accidental" is something that could
have been avoided but for whatever reason wasn't.


Spoken like a "good" personal injury lawyer.
Greg Sefton

Lewis Hartswick July 21st 03 02:54 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
would restrict his right to drive,

I have been told that driving was not a "right" but a "priviledge"
that could be revoked at any time by the "state".

...lew...

Louis Boyd July 21st 03 02:58 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Gunner wrote:

When Im no longer able to safely navigate 5000 lbs+ of hurtling metal
rubber and glass down the road, I will sadly but willingly give up my
keys. Shrug, its a fact of life that each of us have to bear. I no
longer rock climb, race motorcycles or rodeo. Age takes it toll. I
regret not being able to climb up on the back of a bull and holler for
the gate, miss it terribly, but those days are long gone. Shrug. Im
realistic about it.

Gunner


The problem with high powered equipment which take skill but not much
physical strength to operate is knowing when one is too far "over the
hill" to use it safely. Old farts quit listening to their well
intentioned friends, spouses, and co-workers who may be suggesting to
give it up. It may not be at all obvious to someone in a declining
health (mental and/or physical) that anything is wrong. That certainly
includes operating automobile, construction machinery, machine tools,
firearms, and even computer keyboards.
--
Lou Boyd


jim rozen July 21st 03 04:10 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
In article , "dddd" says...

Sorry, to you and Glen Ashmore.


No problem. I recall that there was some kind of
wager going on but was not really sure of the substance.

But I was pretty sure that I never said what was
attributed to me, as I make it a policy to never
get involved in personal dust-ups. Sometimes
the policy gets bent a bit but rarely.

Mark and I have had our disagreements (and agreements
on some issues) over the year but in general I
respect his views.

He's pretty much stopped crossposting, too!

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================


John Flanagan July 21st 03 04:23 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 07:01:03 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

When Im no longer able to safely navigate 5000 lbs+ of hurtling metal
rubber and glass down the road, I will sadly but willingly give up my
keys. Shrug, its a fact of life that each of us have to bear. I no
longer rock climb, race motorcycles or rodeo. Age takes it toll. I
regret not being able to climb up on the back of a bull and holler for
the gate, miss it terribly, but those days are long gone. Shrug. Im
realistic about it.


So you better get crackin' on makin' some of the wee ones so you have
someone to pick you up and put you on the pot and take you to the
bingo hall when you get to that point :^)

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

John Flanagan July 21st 03 04:34 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 20 Jul 2003 21:14:18 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

In article ,
says...

All things have a cause and an accident happens only because of our
ignorance or neglect and is therefore "preventable".


Well, mostly. Look up Peekskill and meteorite if you
get a chance.

If I had been bopped on the head while riding to work,
would that be a true accident?


Not if you believe in an omnipotent God :^). But I was mostly
refering to the "accidents" humans cause. Of course if you don't
believe in an omnipototent God then free will is merely an illusion
and no "accidents" are preventable, they had to happen.

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

John Flanagan July 21st 03 04:35 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 21 Jul 2003 12:32:53 GMT, (Bray Haven) wrote:

There you go, my definition of "accidental" is something that could
have been avoided but for whatever reason wasn't.


Spoken like a "good" personal injury lawyer.


Ha! You're probably right :^).

John

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

michael July 21st 03 04:55 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Gunner wrote:

On 20 Jul 2003 20:43:33 -0700, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Gunner wrote in message . ..
Gunners bull**** hacked, rightfully.

Resign yourself to the trashcan, ****head. You have defended beer
more than I have, I love the sight of burning bars, distilleries, and
breweries. But you, gummer, I suspect spend a lot of time on Market
street with your own kind. When are you and your brothers Jeffrey
Dahmer, and John Wayne Gacy going to have another family gathering?


As I said, it appears that Leslie uses his own issues to attack others
in some vain attempt to bolster his own ego. Now he is spewing about
gays. So, from the looks of it, Leslie is a gay Nazi drunkard.

What you posted was the most fatheaded thing that any KKkalifornee
Kweer Kween could post, all that I would expect from someone with the
intelect of an amoeba.


Yup, looks like a homophobe. Pretty common for them to be latent
homosexuals.

Im quite straight, and really dont give a damn who puts what where.
Not my business.

Leslie the Loonie, Gay Nazi drunkard..sigh..must REALLY suck to be
him.

Gunner

"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs


lenniethelurker wrote:

BTW, Jim, as one that was one hour short of having my private license
for gliders, if you want to know how to look out for things not in
your control, try that. (Fixed costs of $4000+ per year isn't my idea
of how to have fun. Fortunately, it's the geriatric hobby of rich old
conservatives, and I don't miss most of them.)

Wonder how much lennie was paid for his radio? Certainly he would not have donated it to those lowlife
conservatives.

michael



jim rozen July 21st 03 05:15 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
In article ,
says...


... Of course if you don't
believe in an omnipototent God then free will is merely an illusion
and no "accidents" are preventable, they had to happen.


Sounds like ya got that backwards, John. Again.

Jim

==================================================
please reply to:
JRR(zero) at yktvmv (dot) vnet (dot) ibm (dot) com
==================================================


Steve Day July 21st 03 05:53 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

When Im no longer able to safely navigate 5000 lbs+ of hurtling metal
rubber and glass down the road, I will sadly but willingly give up my
keys. Shrug, its a fact of life that each of us have to bear. I no
longer rock climb, race motorcycles or rodeo. Age takes it toll. I
regret not being able to climb up on the back of a bull and holler for
the gate, miss it terribly, but those days are long gone. Shrug. Im
realistic about it.

Gunner

Your American,, you do not drive, you operate a vehicle, It takes cool,
class and breeding to make a motorist, it takes an american to turn a
commute into a disaster zone. :o) Thats why the yanks are the worlds best at
quarter mile drag racing, and circular indy racing, No corners to confuse
you folks:o)



Steve Day July 21st 03 05:55 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 

Im quite straight, and really dont give a damn who puts what where.
Not my business.

Leslie the Loonie, Gay Nazi drunkard..sigh..must REALLY suck to be
him.

Gunner



Gay Nazi Loony???? sound like a description of 95% of the population of
Texas? :o)



John Flanagan July 21st 03 07:58 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
On 21 Jul 2003 09:15:14 -0700, jim rozen
wrote:

In article ,
says...


... Of course if you don't
believe in an omnipototent God then free will is merely an illusion
and no "accidents" are preventable, they had to happen.


Sounds like ya got that backwards, John. Again.


???

Please note that my return address is wrong due to the amount of junk email I get.
So please respond to this message through the newsgroup.

Arthur Hardy July 21st 03 09:53 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
A-Bombs are designed to give everyone a nice quick tan.

"Tony Pratt" wrote in message
om...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message

...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony




Gunner July 21st 03 11:19 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 20:53:33 GMT, "Arthur Hardy"
wrote:

A-Bombs are designed to give everyone a nice quick tan.


They can also be used in building canals. Irrc some article many years
ago in Popular Mechanics about some proposals to do exactly that.


Gunner


"Tony Pratt" wrote in message
. com...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message

...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony



"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William Burroughs

dddd July 21st 03 11:58 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Mark,

You just proved everything I have said over the last two days all by
yourself.

You really are a self destructive moron.

Feel free to take the last word. I am done till next time.
--
Regards,
Dewey Clark http://www.historictimekeepers.com
Ebay Sales:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAP...ems&userid=dsc
Restorations, Parts for Hamilton M21s, Products for Craftsmen
Makers of Historic Timekeepers Ultrasonic Clock Cleaning Solution

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 07:15:59 -0400, "dddd" wrote:

Just proves what a wimp you are. Not only have you admitted you are a
dishonorable person who keeps people waiting for the money you owe them

("I
owe lots of people money. Everyone gets paid, sooner or later."), but you
deny what was written.


Dishonorable? Because I dont have any money to pay my creditors? I
made $22k last year, gross. My expenses last year were $24k. Do the
math.

Ever seen my various ads here to sell machines? Its not because I
wanted to, trust me. Its because the wife that left me in 2000, left
me broke, deeply in debt and in a world of ****. And then returned
with 2 heart attacks, a double bypass and Factor V/Leiden. And no
medical insurance. Wanna figure out my debt load now? Somewhere around
$400,000 at the moment.

Wanna know what a good meal for me involves? The ability to pick beans
and rice, instead of just macaroni and cheese.

Up your ass, you smarmy little ****. Unless you have walked in my
shoes for a week, your opinion means dick.

I owe Jack Erbes on this newsgroup $500 for his Logan Shaper, and I
owe Ned Simmons $60 for an O scope that I bought and was stolen, along
with the $15,000 worth of parts and tools, when I had my truck
burglarized. No insurance, couldnt afford any.

They WILL get paid. Ive never welched on a debt in my life.

I recently brokered a machine tool. The seller wanted $8,500. I found
a buyer who was happy to pay $17,500. The hand shake agreement was
10%. $1,750. The guy stiffed me completly. And it was on a deal that
I borrowed money to make happen. I had no phone, and no lights for 3
weeks, but the person I borrowed the money from, got paid back.

If its a choice between paying $20 to the Red Crescent, or $20 for
meds for my wife, or gas to go to work, which do you think is gonna
get first priority?

While I had it wrong about Jim (it was in fact Glen Ashmore, see my post

to
Jim Rozen) you will find the exchange of May 1 through a Google search.

But
I suspect that like the use of the dictionary and library, such is beyond
your ken.


Neener neener neener.

Still, at least you haven't denied that you can be shamed into correcting
your behavior. Even if you did try to behind the skirts of Jim's

correction
in an attempt to deny the event ever happened.


Did I ever deny the bet? Come on, asshole..cites.

Mark, you are an intellectual moron, a moral (oral?) coward and a

chiseler.
And you wear these attributes like a badge of honor. Like the guy said,

you
are a truly interesting deviation of the human genome.


Ah yes, you know me soo well. Indeedy. You are such a fine judge of
humanity, and me in particular. You really need to go into business.
Perhaps a weight guesser in a carnival midway?

If , as reported by others, your business is going down the tubes, these
attributes may have played a small part.


My "business" is that of independant machine tool service tech. I
travel all over California and Arizona, when there is work, fixing
machine tools. My customers are very happy with me. If they werent,
there are a bunch of other guys in the same line of work, all just as
hungry, since the manufacturing economy went south.

Oddly enough, when they have work to be done, and the money to pay for
it, they keep calling me back. I wonder why???

I keep an old ragged 1978 Aljo 22" travel trailer in an RV park in
Southern California to work out of, but if I have to work someplace
overnight, guess what, 9x out of 10, I spend the night in my truck,
and change and clean up in a public restroom, as I cannot afford a
motel room. EVERY bit of money I make goes into pay the bills.

One exception. I pay my internet account monthly, as this is virtually
the sole entertainment in my life, and my wife uses it, as she is
pretty much homebound. Now even more than before she was attacked by
the pair of pit bulls a couple weeks ago. Want to see the pictures?

But its my bronc to ride, and one Ive never shirked, no matter how
much it hurts.

When there is work, I can make good money. But it all goes back into
paying the bills from the times where is no work. Ive done everything
in the past two years, from cleaning toilets, to patching roofs, to
washing cars for gas/food money. The toys that I have, were gotten by
driving the alleys behind machine shops and asking for their junk, or
by bartering for them.

Ask Marty Escarcega, or Pete Albrect, or Fitch, or Leigh and others
here about my honor, honesty and "moral attributes". THEY, unlike you,
know me.

You have your panties on a wad, because you dont like me for my
political views, and the fact I wont take crap from you. And Bubba,
you are indeed full of crap. As a Christmas goose.

I must have really ****ed you off, for you to pass judgement on me as
a man in the real world, particularly a man you have never met and
only know by my posts on the internet. A judgement btw, which doesnt
speak highly of Your honor, honesty or moral attributes.

If it were legal, we could demonstrate our honor, by having our
seconds discuss the terms, but its not, unfortunatly. Fortunately for
you perhaps, as you cannot be phyiscally held accountable for your
judgement, poor as it is. I dont know why I even bother explaining
anything to you. You are as judgmental, pompous and arrogant as the
worst bible thumper and just as cocksure of your own self
rightiousness. Very telling. Says volumes about you.

Snicker. Bite me. Get a life. If you find a second one, Ill trade you
for it, as mine sucks. But as its the only one I have, Ill keep trying
to make the best of it. And when I stop trying, it will be because
they have kicked dirt over my box.

Want to keep being judgemental about things you have no concept of,
about me, personally, feel free. Then we can discuss you and little
boys. Sound good to you? Fair is fair, no?

Want to argue and **** and moan about politics, machining etc etc,
fine, thats part of the game here on Usenet.

Want to get personal, and Id be happy to oblige. Leslie the Loonie
learned early on, that his personal issues were easy to find, and have
displayed for all to see, when he started making personal attacks.
Want to join his exclusive club?
Chuckle, there is little about me, that is not public record already,
so you cannot hurt me in the slightest. Can you say the same? Think
hard before you answer.

Also think about the fact that Leslie the Loonie never gets
personally flamed, bashed or exposed, unless he starts it. Im not shy
about responding, but I seldom start it. While Im poor in money, Ive
got plenty of spirit left. And in the grand scheme of things, you are
no more than a skidmark in the shorts of life.

Disregards

Gunner



"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William

Burroughs



Tim Williams July 22nd 03 12:03 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
"John Flanagan" wrote in message
...
... Of course if you don't
believe in an omnipototent God then free will is merely an illusion
and no "accidents" are preventable, they had to happen.


Sounds like ya got that backwards, John. Again.


???


"It was God's will that xxxx happened"

Tim

--
In the immortal words of Ned Flanders: "No foot longs!"
Website @ http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms



dddd July 22nd 03 12:56 AM

An apology
 
Reading your post again.

Perhaps if you toned down your harangues and slurs on this newsgroup, you
might find people more supportive. The truth is, you come across as a bully
and hateful person when you write parodies involving tragic accidents, use
hateful references about the byproducts of sex to describe those with whom
you disagree, and call people unpatriotic dupes when their political
opinions differ from yours. If you want to post outrageous topics as a way
to blow off steam, then don't go attacking people who differ with you.

Most of us know what are hard times. My father deserted us when I was 9
months old, committed suicide 7 years later. This is all when the IRS
refused to divulge any information about taxpayers and before there was
organized welfare. I remember at least three Christmases when the turkey
was left at the front door. This is no ****.

I grew up in a public housing project in New York. I am convinced I only
got out because I am white and got invited into some nice homes as a
teenager. I was an alcoholic and drug abuser from the age of 12 to 28.
When I was 28 I had exactly $50 in my savings account. I was spending about
$75 per week at the bar. This on a $9000 annual salary.

I went to the local clinic because I had insomnia and after a two hour
consultation I understood I was waking up with the shakes from drying out (2
points from the bottom of the "U" curve for those who are unfortunate enough
to know). I could drink a bottle of Bourbon in three hours and talk my way
through MP checkpoints.

Your life does suck right now. But taking it out on people you don't even
know only adds to the stress. It doesn't make people feel kindly towards
you.

As far as I am concerned, this started several months ago when you came at
me for no good reason. You called me every foul name in the book simply
because I disagreed with your assessment of Bush's reasons for going into
Iraq. I felt that was uncalled for and I was ****ed off big time.

I better understand what is going on thanks to re-reading your last post. I
wish I could take back my previous response; it was meanspirited and showed
no human understanding.

--
Regards,
Dewey Clark http://www.historictimekeepers.com
Ebay Sales:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAP...ems&userid=dsc
Restorations, Parts for Hamilton M21s, Products for Craftsmen
Makers of Historic Timekeepers Ultrasonic Clock Cleaning Solution

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 07:15:59 -0400, "dddd" wrote:

Just proves what a wimp you are. Not only have you admitted you are a
dishonorable person who keeps people waiting for the money you owe them

("I
owe lots of people money. Everyone gets paid, sooner or later."), but you
deny what was written.


Dishonorable? Because I dont have any money to pay my creditors? I
made $22k last year, gross. My expenses last year were $24k. Do the
math.

Ever seen my various ads here to sell machines? Its not because I
wanted to, trust me. Its because the wife that left me in 2000, left
me broke, deeply in debt and in a world of ****. And then returned
with 2 heart attacks, a double bypass and Factor V/Leiden. And no
medical insurance. Wanna figure out my debt load now? Somewhere around
$400,000 at the moment.

Wanna know what a good meal for me involves? The ability to pick beans
and rice, instead of just macaroni and cheese.

Up your ass, you smarmy little ****. Unless you have walked in my
shoes for a week, your opinion means dick.

I owe Jack Erbes on this newsgroup $500 for his Logan Shaper, and I
owe Ned Simmons $60 for an O scope that I bought and was stolen, along
with the $15,000 worth of parts and tools, when I had my truck
burglarized. No insurance, couldnt afford any.

They WILL get paid. Ive never welched on a debt in my life.

I recently brokered a machine tool. The seller wanted $8,500. I found
a buyer who was happy to pay $17,500. The hand shake agreement was
10%. $1,750. The guy stiffed me completly. And it was on a deal that
I borrowed money to make happen. I had no phone, and no lights for 3
weeks, but the person I borrowed the money from, got paid back.

If its a choice between paying $20 to the Red Crescent, or $20 for
meds for my wife, or gas to go to work, which do you think is gonna
get first priority?

While I had it wrong about Jim (it was in fact Glen Ashmore, see my post

to
Jim Rozen) you will find the exchange of May 1 through a Google search.

But
I suspect that like the use of the dictionary and library, such is beyond
your ken.


Neener neener neener.

Still, at least you haven't denied that you can be shamed into correcting
your behavior. Even if you did try to behind the skirts of Jim's

correction
in an attempt to deny the event ever happened.


Did I ever deny the bet? Come on, asshole..cites.

Mark, you are an intellectual moron, a moral (oral?) coward and a

chiseler.
And you wear these attributes like a badge of honor. Like the guy said,

you
are a truly interesting deviation of the human genome.


Ah yes, you know me soo well. Indeedy. You are such a fine judge of
humanity, and me in particular. You really need to go into business.
Perhaps a weight guesser in a carnival midway?

If , as reported by others, your business is going down the tubes, these
attributes may have played a small part.


My "business" is that of independant machine tool service tech. I
travel all over California and Arizona, when there is work, fixing
machine tools. My customers are very happy with me. If they werent,
there are a bunch of other guys in the same line of work, all just as
hungry, since the manufacturing economy went south.

Oddly enough, when they have work to be done, and the money to pay for
it, they keep calling me back. I wonder why???

I keep an old ragged 1978 Aljo 22" travel trailer in an RV park in
Southern California to work out of, but if I have to work someplace
overnight, guess what, 9x out of 10, I spend the night in my truck,
and change and clean up in a public restroom, as I cannot afford a
motel room. EVERY bit of money I make goes into pay the bills.

One exception. I pay my internet account monthly, as this is virtually
the sole entertainment in my life, and my wife uses it, as she is
pretty much homebound. Now even more than before she was attacked by
the pair of pit bulls a couple weeks ago. Want to see the pictures?

But its my bronc to ride, and one Ive never shirked, no matter how
much it hurts.

When there is work, I can make good money. But it all goes back into
paying the bills from the times where is no work. Ive done everything
in the past two years, from cleaning toilets, to patching roofs, to
washing cars for gas/food money. The toys that I have, were gotten by
driving the alleys behind machine shops and asking for their junk, or
by bartering for them.

Ask Marty Escarcega, or Pete Albrect, or Fitch, or Leigh and others
here about my honor, honesty and "moral attributes". THEY, unlike you,
know me.

You have your panties on a wad, because you dont like me for my
political views, and the fact I wont take crap from you. And Bubba,
you are indeed full of crap. As a Christmas goose.

I must have really ****ed you off, for you to pass judgement on me as
a man in the real world, particularly a man you have never met and
only know by my posts on the internet. A judgement btw, which doesnt
speak highly of Your honor, honesty or moral attributes.

If it were legal, we could demonstrate our honor, by having our
seconds discuss the terms, but its not, unfortunatly. Fortunately for
you perhaps, as you cannot be phyiscally held accountable for your
judgement, poor as it is. I dont know why I even bother explaining
anything to you. You are as judgmental, pompous and arrogant as the
worst bible thumper and just as cocksure of your own self
rightiousness. Very telling. Says volumes about you.

Snicker. Bite me. Get a life. If you find a second one, Ill trade you
for it, as mine sucks. But as its the only one I have, Ill keep trying
to make the best of it. And when I stop trying, it will be because
they have kicked dirt over my box.

Want to keep being judgemental about things you have no concept of,
about me, personally, feel free. Then we can discuss you and little
boys. Sound good to you? Fair is fair, no?

Want to argue and **** and moan about politics, machining etc etc,
fine, thats part of the game here on Usenet.

Want to get personal, and Id be happy to oblige. Leslie the Loonie
learned early on, that his personal issues were easy to find, and have
displayed for all to see, when he started making personal attacks.
Want to join his exclusive club?
Chuckle, there is little about me, that is not public record already,
so you cannot hurt me in the slightest. Can you say the same? Think
hard before you answer.

Also think about the fact that Leslie the Loonie never gets
personally flamed, bashed or exposed, unless he starts it. Im not shy
about responding, but I seldom start it. While Im poor in money, Ive
got plenty of spirit left. And in the grand scheme of things, you are
no more than a skidmark in the shorts of life.

Disregards

Gunner



"What do you call someone in possesion of all the facts? Paranoid.-William

Burroughs




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