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Gunner July 17th 03 05:58 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli

Desert Traveler July 17th 03 06:07 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli


Or at least increase the tax on them so that we can form support groups and
government assistance agencies!

Steve



bookburn July 17th 03 06:07 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA

Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that

will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the

peddle!

If we all went to a bicycle economy and lived in villages, with
maybe a train or two for travel to the city, then we would all
live healthy, satisfying lives. Perhaps there would be less
pressure on governments to have wars.

But then populations would increase, unless you imagine satisfied
people have fewer children, and the pressures would result in
war, anyway.

That push on the peddle by an old man was only an accident,
wasn't it? What will happen when we all have atomic umbrellas?

bookburn


Ljwebb11 July 17th 03 06:54 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Ah, finally! A DIFFERENT argument that will perhaps convince a couple more
non-believers.

Not.

Regards,

Robin


"Gunner" wrote in message
.. .
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner


I face greater danger on the daily commute to the shop than from the gun-toting
gangbangers around the shop.
If only I could mount some twin .50's on the front of the truck to handle the
idiots in their SUV's and beamers that are too busy yakking on the phone and
doing paperwork to pay attention to their driving.

Les

Steve Day July 17th 03 10:13 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Is this a case of a californian motorist meeting a 90 degree corner and
finding it to complicated to down shift, slowdown, signal and turn the big
round thingy that he holds onto? :o)



Steve Day July 17th 03 10:15 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

Or at least increase the tax on them so that we can form support groups

and
government assistance agencies!

Steve

I would have thought that by now in CA they restricted their cars to 10

MPH and fitted big sift people catchers all round,not so much as a public
safety issue in CA its just so the rest of the US can see the callies
coming and get out of the way:o)



Steve Day July 17th 03 10:26 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
The State of California is taking urgent steps to prevent such a tragedy
from happening again.

The Californians naturally blame the car manufacturer for causing the
accident, its never a Californians fault for doing something stupid.

So what they are going to do is to insist car manufacturers print in large
raised letters on each pedal the words " Gas" " Clutch" " Brake" and they
are to be spaced at least 18 inches apart, they when pressed will not
function for at least twenty seconds to ensure the Californian is certain
that he is happy with his choice. He will then have to press the selected
pedal again.

The State of California has also agreed with the ACLU that in fairness to
the US right to choose that each and every pedal will be interchangable so
that californian drivers can pick which pedal they prefer in which slot.
Naturally there will be an override button in the passenger seat for the
californian drivers councillor.



Dave July 17th 03 01:58 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 


Steve Day wrote:

So what they are going to do is to insist car manufacturers print in large
raised letters on each pedal the words " Gas" " Clutch" " Brake"



P. Correctness would also require braille.

~D


Dan Petre July 17th 03 01:59 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Gunner wrote in message . ..

Ok, you can also kill damn squirels with you gun, I give you that one.
Humanely, otherwise a pellet gun would cause cruel and painful
unnecesary suffering. Nasty beasts they are.

I need Cliff to take over. Where's he?

Dan

Paul Thomas Ivy July 17th 03 02:54 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
"Steve Day" wrote in message ...
The State of California is taking urgent steps to prevent such a tragedy
from happening again.

The Californians naturally blame the car manufacturer for causing the
accident, its never a Californians fault for doing something stupid.

So what they are going to do is to insist car manufacturers print in large
raised letters on each pedal the words " Gas" " Clutch" " Brake" and they
are to be spaced at least 18 inches apart, they when pressed will not
function for at least twenty seconds to ensure the Californian is certain
that he is happy with his choice. He will then have to press the selected
pedal again.

The State of California has also agreed with the ACLU that in fairness to
the US right to choose that each and every pedal will be interchangable so
that californian drivers can pick which pedal they prefer in which slot.
Naturally there will be an override button in the passenger seat for the
californian drivers councillor.


You forgot some of the more important restrictions.

1. Compact cars (i.e., easily concealable) will be banned.

2. You will have at least a 5-day waiting period between the time you
buy it and when you can pick it up.

3. You will have to pass a federal background check prior to purchase
to ensure you are not prohibited from driving.

4. You will not be allowed to purchase more than one car in a month.

5. You will need a local Sheriff to sign the purchase permit.

6. If you are convicted of a felony, or are under a domestic
restraining order, your purchase, possession, and/or use of a car will
be a separate felony requiring a minimum 5-year prison sentence.

Garlicdude July 17th 03 03:29 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Dave wrote:

Steve Day wrote:

So what they are going to do is to insist car manufacturers print in large
raised letters on each pedal the words " Gas" " Clutch" " Brake"


P. Correctness would also require braille.

~D


In California it would need to be printed in probably about
6-8 languages
--
Regards,
Steve Saling
aka The Garlic Dude
Gilroy, CA
The Garlic Capital of The World
http://www.pulsareng.com/

Steve Day July 17th 03 03:33 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

"Dave" wrote in message
...


Steve Day wrote:

So what they are going to do is to insist car manufacturers print in

large
raised letters on each pedal the words " Gas" " Clutch" " Brake"



P. Correctness would also require braille.

~D
Not so Californians believe they are perfect, so how could one of them be

blind :o)



Glen July 17th 03 04:37 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 17 Jul 2003 04:59:43 -0700, (Dan Petre)
wrote:

Gunner wrote in message . ..

Ok, you can also kill damn squirels with you gun, I give you that one.
Humanely, otherwise a pellet gun would cause cruel and painful
unnecesary suffering. Nasty beasts they are.

I need Cliff to take over. Where's he?

Dan


He's talking with the flock of loons in his head. Don't bother him.

Kirk Gordon July 17th 03 04:49 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Hell, Gunner, I say the same thing every time I have to drive into
center city Philadelphia. Then, or course, I think of you, and I
remember that cars don't kill people. People kill cars. Or something
like that. Then I get confused and start looking for the nearest
Starbucks. Fortunately, there are lots of those in center city.
Unfortunately, you can't get near one because the parking is so
terrible, and the traffic is such a mess, and... uhhh...

What was the question?


Gunner wrote:
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli



Desert Traveler July 17th 03 10:13 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

"Tony Pratt" wrote in message
om...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message

...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony


You forgot foreplay.

Steve



Spehro Pefhany July 17th 03 10:21 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 17 Jul 2003 12:02:06 -0700, the renowned (Tony
Pratt) wrote:

Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


What else are cluster bombs used for, making coleslaw?

Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

Desert Traveler July 17th 03 10:30 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

"Robert A. Thurman" wrote in message
s.com...
...and Spanish too.


Las Vegas, Nevada

County commissioners voted yesterday that children who want to use a certain
public pool must fill out the proper forms IF they want a card good for
three years free swimming. These forms would include information such as
name, address, and parent's income. It is required for all other sections
of town, and is only to verify that the child comes from a family whose
income is low enough to entitle this child to this benefit.

A large brouhaha has ensued because this is in a Hispanic neighborhood, and
the parents either do not want to, or can't fill out the paperwork. They
are afraid of providing ANY information regarding their personal
information.

Wag the dog.

Steve



Robert A. Thurman July 17th 03 10:36 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
....and Spanish too.


Have A Good One
Robert A. Thurman
"Dave" wrote in message
...


Steve Day wrote:

So what they are going to do is to insist car manufacturers print in

large
raised letters on each pedal the words " Gas" " Clutch" " Brake"



P. Correctness would also require braille.

~D




David J. Hughes July 17th 03 10:57 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 


Tony Pratt wrote:
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...

A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...



The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony


Swords, spears, sling stones, arrows, bows, crossbows, guillotine, gas
chamber, gibbet, Iron Maiden, rack, thumbscrews, electric chair, Greek
fire, napalm, fougas,...... shall I continue?

In addition, there are line throwing guns and avalanche initiators,
both intended to save lives.

David Hughes


Jason Sheppard July 17th 03 11:05 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
(Tony Pratt) wrote in message . com...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


Swords, spears, bows and crossbows all have significant advantages (as
well as glaring disadvantages) over guns.

That car killed 8 and injured 45 without having to reload (fill up).
I can't do that with any gun I own, even my Glock 17 with the 33 round
mag.

What's your point?

Jason

Tim Williams July 17th 03 11:45 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
"Jason Sheppard" wrote in message
om...
That car killed 8 and injured 45 without having to reload (fill up).
I can't do that with any gun I own, even my Glock 17 with the 33 round
mag.


If you got a bunch of real lucky shots, grazing a few people in a row,
then outright shoot a few, you could get the same numbers...
Controlled conditions of course. ;)

Tim

--
In the immortal words of Ned Flanders: "No foot longs!"
Website @ http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms



Lennie the Lurker July 18th 03 01:01 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Gunner wrote in message . ..
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market


People hurt, people dead, and gunner can only try to make a joke out
of it as well as another of his ****headed political statements from
the heart of whackyland. Too bad some of his family wasn't included.

Gary Coffman July 18th 03 01:14 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 17 Jul 2003 14:05:27 -0700, (Jason Sheppard) wrote:
That car killed 8 and injured 45 without having to reload (fill up).
I can't do that with any gun I own, even my Glock 17 with the 33 round
mag.


Well, maybe if you lined everybody up *just* right. :-)

Gary


Gary Coffman July 18th 03 01:14 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 17 Jul 2003 12:02:06 -0700, (Tony Pratt) wrote:
The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


The most efficient killers on the battlefield are artillery, cluster bombs,
FAE, napalm, etc. In Vietnam, allied troops fired *one million rounds*
per enemy casuality produced, making the assualt rilfe the *least*
efficient killing tool of the war.

On the domestic front, the CDC reports that 1 in 42 gunshot wounds
are fatal, while 1 in 7 stabbing attacks are fatal. That makes an attack
by a knife wielding assailant 8 times more likely to prove fatal than an
attack by an assailant with a gun. (The explanation for this disparity
is that a knife wielding assailant is more likely to press home the attack,
and keep stabbing until the victim ceases to twitch than is an assailant
with a firearm.)

Now none of this actually says a gun is an inefficient tool, but in the
hands of the average soldier or civilian, the record shows it isn't applied
very efficiently.

Gary


Big-T July 18th 03 01:29 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Gunner wrote:

SNIP

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner


Well actually, we don't want an outright ban on ALL cars. We only want
to ban those nasty assault cars. You know... the ones with more than
three cylinders and wheel diameters over ten inches. And it goes
without saying, no high capacity gearboxes... the ones with more than
two speeds. (One for forward and one for reverse) G
Big-T

Jim Stewart July 18th 03 01:30 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Gary Coffman wrote:
On 17 Jul 2003 12:02:06 -0700, (Tony Pratt) wrote:

The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


On the domestic front, the CDC reports that 1 in 42 gunshot wounds
are fatal, while 1 in 7 stabbing attacks are fatal. That makes an attack
by a knife wielding assailant 8 times more likely to prove fatal than an
attack by an assailant with a gun. (The explanation for this disparity
is that a knife wielding assailant is more likely to press home the attack,
and keep stabbing until the victim ceases to twitch than is an assailant
with a firearm.)


Firstly, you're comparing knife *attacks* with
gunshot *wounds*, clearly non-sequitur.

Secondly, no matter how I run the math, I don't
get a 8x difference. 6x, yes, 8x, no.



Gates McFadden July 18th 03 01:38 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On 17 Jul 2003 16:01:33 -0700, (Lennie the
Lurker) wrote:

Gunner wrote in message . ..
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market


People hurt, people dead, and gunner can only try to make a joke out
of it as well as another of his ****headed political statements from
the heart of whackyland. Too bad some of his family wasn't included.



Thank you Tim May



Jason Sheppard July 18th 03 02:58 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
"Tim Williams" wrote in message ...
"Jason Sheppard" wrote in message
om...
That car killed 8 and injured 45 without having to reload (fill up).
I can't do that with any gun I own, even my Glock 17 with the 33 round
mag.


If you got a bunch of real lucky shots, grazing a few people in a row,
then outright shoot a few, you could get the same numbers...
Controlled conditions of course. ;)

Tim


Yeah, but I was talking about _me_ Why do you think i have a 33 round
mag in the first place...i'm a lousy shot ;)

Jason

Fred July 18th 03 05:06 AM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 16:34:20 -0700, Robert Sturgeon
scribed:

Wazza Perazzi?

I have been out of the Skeet/Trap game for a while...

Is it like a Purdy? Is it like a Peretti?

I have only the Remington 1100 Auto , in 12 and 20 and Stevens 410
(very old SBS - 1903), Old Winchester pump 12, and a Belgian Browning
12 Gauge...

Need more info... need to shoot more clays...

Freddie



On 17 Jul 2003 12:02:06 -0700, (Tony Pratt)
wrote:

Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


You could take THAT lame assertion up with the folks who buy $8,000
Perazzi shotguns - good for target shooting, a huge waste of money for
anything else. But then, you really don't know much of anything about
firearms anyway, as shown by your post, so I don't expect you to even
understand what I just wrote.



leon skunkers July 18th 03 12:32 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Thu, 17 Jul 2003 03:58:47 GMT, Gunner
wrote:

8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli


yeah. And send your contributions to MAGOO (mothers against geezers
operating oldsmobiles). Hang up posters of the dead people all over
Florida's Fossil Riviera and get celebrities to whine about the whole
thing on TV.

Hangin' is too good for these old farts that take to the road
knowingly impaired by the ravages of age.

Ian Sutherland July 18th 03 01:40 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
(Tony Pratt) wrote in message . com...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony



Ever heard of a GUILLOTINE ???

Ian Sutherland (Australia)

P.S. And your above statement is Bull**** anyway.

dddd July 18th 03 02:22 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree (what a moron)
 
Only a moron with need to shoot his mouth off (apt screen name) would try to
make a parody out of a very tragic event.

Since he still hasn't sent his $20 to the Red Crescent, maybe he'll send $20
to the victim"s families as payment for his making a lame joke at their
expense.

--
Regards,
Dewey Clark http://www.historictimekeepers.com
Ebay Sales:
http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAP...ems&userid=dsc
Restorations, Parts for Hamilton M21s, Products for Craftsmen
Makers of Historic Timekeepers Ultrasonic Clock Cleaning Solution

"Gunner" wrote in message
...
8 dead , 45 critically injured, including many children in LA Farmers
Market Driving Spree!

Ban Cars! Register them and license their owners!

No one has a need for a deadly automobile, let alone one that will
travel in excess of 60 miles per hour with one push of the peddle!

Ban these horrible instruments of death. Every year in the US, over
40,000 people are killed by them, and hundreds of thousands more are
maimed and crippled for life!

For Gods Sake,ban them for the Children!

Gunner

Liberals - Cosmopolitan critics, men who are the friends
of every country save their own. Benjamin Disraeli




Lewis Hartswick July 18th 03 03:49 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
Tony Pratt wrote:

Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony


WRONG! I can show you any number of guns that were specivically
designed
and built for the one and only purpose of punching holes in paper. I've
had
a few over the years.

...lew...

Uncle Lucky July 18th 03 04:40 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
If only I could mount some twin .50's on the front of the truck to handle the
idiots in their SUV's and beamers that are too busy yakking on the phone and
doing paperwork to pay attention to their driving.

Les


Those in the know call em Bimmers, Les.
Unless of course, you're talking bikes.
Health & Peace,
Uncle Lucky

Joe Kultgen July 18th 03 05:05 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
In article ,
says...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message ...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!

Best wishes

Tony


The designed purpose purpose of a firearm is to accurately deliver a load
of kinetic energy to a target. It is a tool like many others, nothing
more.

Later,
Joe

Dan July 18th 03 05:33 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 

"Jason Sheppard" wrote in message
om...
(Tony Pratt) wrote in message

. com...
Lewis Hartswick wrote in message

...
A-Men Gunner. :-)

...lew...


The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


Swords, spears, bows and crossbows all have significant advantages (as
well as glaring disadvantages) over guns.

That car killed 8 and injured 45 without having to reload (fill up).
I can't do that with any gun I own, even my Glock 17 with the 33 round
mag.

What's your point?

Jason


The point, obviously, is you are underarmed. Think belt feed.

Dan



Ted Edwards July 18th 03 06:17 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


Rubish! What do you do with a sword?

Ted



erniegalts July 18th 03 08:53 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 23:35:08 +1000, "Myal"
wrote:


"Lennie the Lurker" wrote in message
. com...
"Mysterion" wrote in message

thlink.net...
Or is your head so far up your ass that you can't understand simple

logic?

It's obvious that there are a lot of people that gummer dragged in
from his wacky groups that don't think others deserve any
consideration and that maybe there might be something wrong with their
simple minded lack of consideration.

There isn't a goddam one of you that knows if the families of some of
the victims are reading the group, but it doesn't bother you to treat
it like a joke.

Gunner is the ****ing joke, a subhuman in every respect. Quit your
goddam crossposting from drivel and wacko groups. This is
rec.crafts.metalworking, not alt.sicko.


On the flipside,
This is a serious thing to consider.


Yep. Which is why civilized societies demand that drivers take an
annual driving test to prove competency after a certain age.

The old guy did damage in human terms similar to that done by a suicide
bomber , but used nothing like explosives or bullets , he used a car .


True, and he exceeded the damage achieved by many suicide bombers.

It could be something to watch out for , like people driving airplanes in to
big buildings .
Who suspected airplanes could be used to kill so many people ?


There are many issues involved here, but there are some major ones.
Firstly, when designing any structure or system there is almost always
a conflict between cost and safety, so what does an engineer, or a
company employing him, try to design for?

A simple example is storm water drains in a city. Sure, it may be
possible to provide enough drainage to allow for any conceivable
amount of rainfall at any time in the next century or so.

However, it won't be cheap to provide such a system, and the large
drainage pipes required may never be needed.

So there is going to be a "tradeoff" between a system that is cheap
and allows for periodic flooding when its capacity is exceeded or an
expensive system which will prevent flooding.

Safety doesn't "sell". If it did, everyone would have smoke alarms,
wear seat belts without the necessity for laws, and so on.

When city politicians are planning a storm water system, they try to
keep costs down to keep the taxpayers happy, whether doing it
themselves or asking for some company to bid on the project.

Suppose that, historically, such flooding rains happen 3 or 4 times a
century. Do most politicians care? ....And will a company bidding on
such a project win a bid if they come up with a good system rather
than a cheap system?

As I understand it, when the WTC was designed, it was designed for the
very unlikely event of an actual accident involving a passenger
airliner at the time, probably one lost in bad weather conditions,
with no air traffic control, at the end of a long flight with minimum
fuel load.

The WTC wasn't designed for much larger aircraft, with a large fuel
load, deliberately flown into the buildings. It probably isn't
possible to design such a structure for such an event, actually.

Certainly not economical to do so. Perhaps we should give up the idea
of skyscrapers and go back to pyramids? :-)

not one
bullet fired . It could be cars next .
Look out for martyrs behind the wheel when you down the street next time.


Good advice, and a sensible point. However, it doesn't take a lot of
imagination to envision much worse possibilities involving vehicles.

Which is why society needs more controls over who is behind the wheel.

In Australia, we have a graded series of licenses, starting with a
passenger car for private use, then a cab, then vehicles carrying more
passengers or having a higher gross weight, rigid trucks, articulated
trucks ["semis"] and, finally, "road trains".

I wonder if all states in the US have similar systems. Or can anyone
with an ordinary drivers license buy, rent, or drive anything of any
passenger capacity or weight?

Myal




"_Magna est veritas et praevalebit"_
(Truth is mighty and will prevail).

erniegalts
[Australia]
[misc.survivalism]

erniegalts July 18th 03 09:59 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
On Fri, 18 Jul 2003 18:37:54 GMT, "Mysterion"
wrote:


"Lennie the Lurker" wrote in message
. com...
"Mysterion" wrote in message

thlink.net...
Or is your head so far up your ass that you can't understand simple

logic?

It's obvious that there are a lot of people that gummer dragged in
from his wacky groups that don't think others deserve any
consideration and that maybe there might be something wrong with their
simple minded lack of consideration.

There isn't a goddam one of you that knows if the families of some of
the victims are reading the group, but it doesn't bother you to treat
it like a joke.


It doesn't matter who's reading this.
Your bias against firearms is the point.

If you want to give up your freedoms, that's up to you.
You have no right to give up mine.

Gunner is the ****ing joke, a subhuman in every respect.


In general I agree.


I wouldn't go this far. Other than his present tendency to tell
defamatory lies about others he has shown himself to be a fairly
decent human being. Or at least he was prior to Y2K. Perhaps he
isn't in full control of himself these days?


The only one worse than Goofer is the kind of brainless ****head who starts
whining about guns being designed to kill.


Even speaking as a long-time gun owner and user, I cannot deny this
point. Carpenters hammers are designed to drive nails and pull nails,
can openers are designed to open cans, beer glasses are designed as
containers for beer.

All can be used as weapons, but this isn't their primary purpose.

Guns are basically designed to kill animals or people at a distance.
As are bows and arrows, boomerangs, etc.

Unlike knives or axes they aren't really a "multiple use" tool, and
there is no point in pretending that they are.

Sure, a gun can be used for "target shooting", but the purpose of this
is generally to improve ones accuracy when hunting animals or killing
people.

There are lots of shooting clubs and target ranges for guns. If we
are just talking "tools" or "skills", why aren't there an equivalent
number of archery or knife throwing clubs and/or ranges?

Quit your
goddam crossposting from drivel and wacko groups. This is
rec.crafts.metalworking, not alt.sicko.


So survivalism is "drivel" and wacko"?
I'm sure the Federal Government and the Red Cross would be interested to
discover that their recommendations are "drivel" and "wacko".


Does either organization recommend "misc.survivalism" as a usenet
group?

Perhaps they could or even should have prior to Y2K. However it now
seems to have mainly become an extremist political group.

At one time, members actually offered support to one another rather
than trying to lie and defame one another.

....But, of course, an "_ubermenschen_" such as "gunner" would never
be so weak and human, would he?

Like some others on misc.survivalism, perhaps "gunner" was born a few
decades too late for the "glories" of the Third Reich. Perhaps he
dreams about a career in the "SS" or at least the "Gestapo"?







"_Magna est veritas et praevalebit"_
(Truth is mighty and will prevail).

erniegalts
[Australia]
[misc.survivalism]

Tim Williams July 18th 03 10:32 PM

8 Murdered, 45 critically injured in LA Spree
 
"Ted Edwards" wrote in message
...
The designed purpose of any gun ever made is to kill or maim in the
most efficient manner, clearly no other object comes into this
category!!


Rubish! What do you do with a sword?


Strike either another sword, or body armor? ;)

Tim

--
In the immortal words of Ned Flanders: "No foot longs!"
Website @ http://webpages.charter.net/dawill/tmoranwms




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