I had replaced the coil and gotten spark back to the plug but it still
wasn't starting. While the plug looked good, I still went and bought
another. The 'old' plug was indeed one of the flavors that has the resistor
to cut down EMI.

When I put the new plug in it started. However, it ran rough and very
finicky. When I started using it it would stall very easily. I got about
30 minutes useage out of it and had to start it about 15 times. Each time
it got progressively worse and finally it wouldn't start at all.

As I was putting it away, I noticed there was some oil dripping onto the
deck that appeared to be coming from somewhere around where the carburetor
attached to the engine. (I am very sketchy on this as I was in a rush and
haven't gone back and looked more closely.) I had not had the lawnmower
tilted or flipped that day.

[I still need to check the flywheel key as sugested by Stormin Mormon.]

[Q: If running the oil/gas mixture in the 4-cycle fouled my valves, could
pulling the plug and filling the cylinder or spraying lots of carb cleaner
in the plug hole (while ocasionally rotating engine shaft to insure the
valves were open sometimes) at least partially clean the valves?]

On a related note and a different thread, I bought a lawnmower from somebody
else here that was sold as 'not running'. I only paid $10 for it and was
hoping that maybe between the two I could put one together and have a
running mower. It however sounds real sick when I crank it and was probably
$10 wasted....

In article , "ProdigySBC_SUX" wrote:

When I put the new plug in it started. However, it ran rough and very
finicky. When I started using it it would stall very easily. I got about
30 minutes useage out of it and had to start it about 15 times. Each time
it got progressively worse and finally it wouldn't start at all.
[...]

[I still need to check the flywheel key as sugested by Stormin Mormon.]

Do this first, before you spend time checking other things.

You need to do it anyway... and I suspect that you will find that's the
problem.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

Nobody ever left footprints in the sands of time by sitting on his butt.
And who wants to leave buttprints in the sands of time?

More counsell.... part two.

--

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
www.mormons.com


"ProdigySBC_SUX" wrote in message
om...
I had replaced the coil and gotten spark back to the plug but it still
wasn't starting. While the plug looked good, I still went and bought
another. The 'old' plug was indeed one of the flavors that has the resistor
to cut down EMI.

When I put the new plug in it started. However, it ran rough and very
finicky. When I started using it it would stall very easily. I got about
30 minutes useage out of it and had to start it about 15 times. Each time
it got progressively worse and finally it wouldn't start at all.
CY: Wow, something getting worse, there. Wish I was there to work on it with
y ou.


As I was putting it away, I noticed there was some oil dripping onto the
deck that appeared to be coming from somewhere around where the carburetor
attached to the engine. (I am very sketchy on this as I was in a rush and
haven't gone back and looked more closely.) I had not had the lawnmower
tilted or flipped that day.
CY: Makes me wonder if that's the cover which covers the ends of the valves?


[I still need to check the flywheel key as sugested by Stormin Mormon.]
CY: yes, good thing to check.


[Q: If running the oil/gas mixture in the 4-cycle fouled my valves, could
pulling the plug and filling the cylinder or spraying lots of carb cleaner
in the plug hole (while ocasionally rotating engine shaft to insure the
valves were open sometimes) at least partially clean the valves?]
CY: I doubt it. But it might rinse all the oil off the cylinder wall. I had
a neighbor of my dad's try to start Dad's generator by squirting ether in
the spark plug hole. Dried the cylinder wall, set up the engine good and
solid. I got it busted loose, and then it ran long enough to throw a piston
rod.


On a related note and a different thread, I bought a lawnmower from somebody
else here that was sold as 'not running'. I only paid $10 for it and was
hoping that maybe between the two I could put one together and have a
running mower. It however sounds real sick when I crank it and was probably
$10 wasted....
CY: Either that, or we can coach you through fixing both mowers. You can
sell the other one for $40, and have learned some skills that will last a
life time.

check that the air intake filter is not clogged with oil.


been there done that

mark

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
More counsell.... part two.

--

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
www.mormons.com



As I was putting it away, I noticed there was some oil dripping onto the
deck that appeared to be coming from somewhere around where the carburetor
attached to the engine. (I am very sketchy on this as I was in a rush and
haven't gone back and looked more closely.) I had not had the lawnmower
tilted or flipped that day.
CY: Makes me wonder if that's the cover which covers the ends of the
valves?


[I still need to check the flywheel key as sugested by Stormin Mormon.]
CY: yes, good thing to check.


[Q: If running the oil/gas mixture in the 4-cycle fouled my valves, could
pulling the plug and filling the cylinder or spraying lots of carb cleaner
in the plug hole (while ocasionally rotating engine shaft to insure the
valves were open sometimes) at least partially clean the valves?]
CY: I doubt it. But it might rinse all the oil off the cylinder wall. I
had
a neighbor of my dad's try to start Dad's generator by squirting ether in
the spark plug hole. Dried the cylinder wall, set up the engine good and
solid. I got it busted loose, and then it ran long enough to throw a
piston
rod.


So I Tore into the engine looking for this pin somewhere on the shaft and
yea verily, I think I found it. There is a groove axially cut into the
crank shaft (? axle?) of this engine and the coil/timing flywheel appears
to be mashed down on this shaft. The flywheel also has a groove cut into it
to accommodate part of this square metal pin.

The flywheel appears to have been 'wrenched' a bit and attempted to shear
that pin. Hence to two grooves of the flywheel and the grankshaft are not
exactly aligned and are off about 1/4 - 1/5 of the width of that groove -
easily somewhere between 5-10 degrees I imagine. Soooooo it looks like I
need to borrow a pulley-puller and pull that flywheel to get at that pin to
replace it.

From what i have picked up about that pin, however, I am a bit confused. I
thought I had learned somewhere that the purpose of that pin was to allow
the engine crank to be able to (at least partially) disengage from the axle
of the blade in case the blade hit something very substantial and whose
sudden change in rotation could damage the internals of the engine. Maybe
this pin goes farther in/along the shaft and does something I am unaware of
but right now, the ignition flywheel appears to be out of alignment and that
could be a big problem.

I did see where the oil that I thought I had seen leaking was indeed spilt.
I'll keep my eye on that...

The air filter was something I had started with and indeed found it to be
pretty skanked so that was changed out very early on in the game.

=====


On a related note and a different thread, I bought a lawnmower from
somebody
else here that was sold as 'not running'. I only paid $10 for it and was
hoping that maybe between the two I could put one together and have a
running mower. It however sounds real sick when I crank it and was
probably
$10 wasted....
CY: Either that, or we can coach you through fixing both mowers. You can
sell the other one for $40, and have learned some skills that will last a
life time.


RE that second mower.... bboooooooo. That appears to have been a 'pig in a
poke'. When you pull on the rope to try and start the mower there is an
awfull metallic banging noise that appears to come from the engine. I have
looked underneath to be sure the blade wasn't hitting anything and
'unfortunately' it wasn't.

So, out of curiosity, are these motors 'mostly' interchangeable from mower
body to mower body? i.e., have the mfgrs standardzed on mounting hole
patterns, crankshaft depth/length, etc.? Surely not...

Anybody here have a *favorite* book for small engine repair? I was looking
at several on Amazon...

Regards,

PSBCSux

"ProdigySBC_SUX" wrote in message
om...

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
More counsell.... part two.

--

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
www.mormons.com




So I Tore into the engine looking for this pin somewhere on the shaft and
yea verily, I think I found it. There is a groove axially cut into the
crank shaft (? axle?) of this engine and the coil/timing flywheel appears
to be mashed down on this shaft. The flywheel also has a groove cut into
it
to accommodate part of this square metal pin.

The flywheel appears to have been 'wrenched' a bit and attempted to shear
that pin. Hence to two grooves of the flywheel and the grankshaft are not
exactly aligned and are off about 1/4 - 1/5 of the width of that groove -
easily somewhere between 5-10 degrees I imagine. Soooooo it looks like I
need to borrow a pulley-puller and pull that flywheel to get at that pin
to
replace it.


The blade is mounted on a hub on the bottom end of the engine crankshaft and
it has it a similar 'key' which engage the shaft, in order to turn the
blade. I've broken that and in fact the hub which seemed to made of some
'white metal' on one occasion by hitting a rock. I understand that is,
hopefully, supposed to protect the guts of the engine. I've never broke an
engine.

But up on top it certainly sounds as though the ignition timing flywheel is
mounted way off and therefore won't run!

Also sounds like you may be able to salvage or even fix both machines.

The ignition flywheel has a magnet/s in it which induces a current in the
coil as it spins around to make the spark for the plug. It has to be in the
correct alignment or the spark timing is wrong!
Also there must be slight clearance between the face of the coil and the
magnets (very carefully sand off any rust) cos lack of clearance may 'short
out' the magnetic path and cause a poor, or no spark. The magnetic strength
of the magnet imbedded in the inner face of the rotor should be OK.

But hey brand new, at Wal Mart, here 3.5 HP Briggs and Stratton mowers are
$149 Canadian (roughly $120 US dollars!). Plus local sales tax! And that's
not even 'On sale'.

We are on our third mower in some 50 years; this now 8 to 10 years old one
being the first 'new' one we ever bought.
It was preceded by a series of used machines, coddled together from various
bits and pieces of bases and engines. I gave the remains of the old ones to
our local small engine repair guru. 'Fred Hammond'.

Fred can use any of the parts to fix machines cheaply for other people; his
costs always being so reasonable that we usually give him a 'few extra
dollars' cos he's practical, knowledgeable and helpful. You may have a local
Fred Hammond if you ask around?

Terry.

"ProdigySBC_SUX" wrote in message
om...
So I Tore into the engine looking for this pin somewhere on the shaft and
yea verily, I think I found it. There is a groove axially cut into the
crank shaft (? axle?) of this engine and the coil/timing flywheel appears
to be mashed down on this shaft. The flywheel also has a groove cut into
it
to accommodate part of this square metal pin.

The flywheel appears to have been 'wrenched' a bit and attempted to shear
that pin. Hence to two grooves of the flywheel and the grankshaft are not
exactly aligned and are off about 1/4 - 1/5 of the width of that groove -
easily somewhere between 5-10 degrees I imagine. Soooooo it looks like I
need to borrow a pulley-puller and pull that flywheel to get at that pin
to
replace it.

From what i have picked up about that pin, however, I am a bit confused.
I
thought I had learned somewhere that the purpose of that pin was to allow
the engine crank to be able to (at least partially) disengage from the
axle
of the blade in case the blade hit something very substantial and whose
sudden change in rotation could damage the internals of the engine. Maybe
this pin goes farther in/along the shaft and does something I am unaware
of
but right now, the ignition flywheel appears to be out of alignment and
that
could be a big problem.

That is indeed the purpose of the shear pin but it also is critical in
timing. Even being "'wrenched' a bit" will disturb the timing. The
flywheel must be pulled and a new pin inserted. You most likely will need a
puller to get the head off.

scroll down to Timing section:
http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lmfaq.htm



There are most likey two holes on the flywheel for the puller.

http://www.manddsmallengine.com/briggs/tools/


So, out of curiosity, are these motors 'mostly' interchangeable from mower
body to mower body? i.e., have the mfgrs standardzed on mounting hole
patterns, crankshaft depth/length, etc.? Surely not...

Yeah. Engines are available.

Northern Tool has a wide selection of new ones:

http://www.northerntool.com/

"ProdigySBC_SUX" wrote in message
om...
I had replaced the coil and gotten spark back to the plug but it still
wasn't starting. While the plug looked good, I still went and bought
another. The 'old' plug was indeed one of the flavors that has the
resistor
to cut down EMI.

When I put the new plug in it started. However, it ran rough and very
finicky. When I started using it it would stall very easily. I got about
30 minutes useage out of it and had to start it about 15 times. Each time
it got progressively worse and finally it wouldn't start at all.

As I was putting it away, I noticed there was some oil dripping onto the
deck that appeared to be coming from somewhere around where the carburetor
attached to the engine. (I am very sketchy on this as I was in a rush and
haven't gone back and looked more closely.) I had not had the lawnmower
tilted or flipped that day.

[I still need to check the flywheel key as sugested by Stormin Mormon.]

[Q: If running the oil/gas mixture in the 4-cycle fouled my valves, could
pulling the plug and filling the cylinder or spraying lots of carb cleaner
in the plug hole (while ocasionally rotating engine shaft to insure the
valves were open sometimes) at least partially clean the valves?]

On a related note and a different thread, I bought a lawnmower from
somebody
else here that was sold as 'not running'. I only paid $10 for it and was
hoping that maybe between the two I could put one together and have a
running mower. It however sounds real sick when I crank it and was
probably
$10 wasted....


First off - thanks to all who posted with help.

My last issue with this mower was indeed the partially sheared pin between
the magneto flywheel (?) and the crankshaft. I replaced it and primed the
bulb three times and it started on the first pull. Ran great and got my
lawn mowed - finally after about 2 months. Sure glad it was winter and the
grass was slow.

The engine did not 'leak' out any more oil.

After I fix some other issues around here I'll look into the other mower I
picked up. I ordered a book on repairing mowers and small engines but it
hasn't gotten here yet. Maybe some night I'll put it on the flatbed and
scan it in for everybody...

Thanks.