Hi -

I recently bought a house with a flotec pedestal pump in a basement
sump, and a terrible leaky flexible hose that the previous owners ran
to a sink when needed. Based on last spring, the basement rarely
floods - pump only ran after extended rain - at least two days
continuous, heavy rain. Don't know about spring thaw - moved in after
that.

I'm considering replacing the pedestal pump with a submersible (same
brand, same hp 1/3).

Also want to install permanent discharge. Was planning to use the
inexpensive flexible black plastic stuff for the run up to the sill,
then put PVC through the sill, and outside. I bought some 1 1/4" PVC
at home depot (they were out of elbows for 1 1/2". )

Here are my questions:

1) Submersible vs pedestal - any reason not to change? 1/3 hp enough
for this kind of intermittent running? Rise is about 9 feet.
2) PVC - Okay to use 1 1/4 ? I've noticed other posts seem to
recommend 1 1/2". Is there much difference?
3) I'm a bit nervous about drilling through my sill and siding (vinyl)
- any special things I should know before I do that ? (Plan to use a
hole saw on a corded drill).
4) Okay to let PVC run on surface downhill and just empty behind a
hedge down the hill several feet? Some folks seem to be saying the
discharge will smell terrible and mess up the lawn in the area it
dumps. The gutter goes in the ground and I assume either runs to sewer
or to drywell. Guy at home depot said don't tap into that or I might
overflow the calculated capacity for that system.
5) People suggest various vacuum break systems - some say drill small
hole just above check valve, others suggest adding T outside with
riser - do I need the latter?

Thanks all for any help.
Michael Jasper

(MIchael Jasper) wrote:

3) I'm a bit nervous about drilling through my sill and siding (vinyl)
- any special things I should know before I do that ? (Plan to use a
hole saw on a corded drill).

Be sure your in the right place, as it is very hard to patch mistakes.

4) Okay to let PVC run on surface downhill and just empty behind a
hedge down the hill several feet? Some folks seem to be saying the
discharge will smell terrible and mess up the lawn in the area it
dumps. The gutter goes in the ground and I assume either runs to sewer
or to drywell. Guy at home depot said don't tap into that or I might
overflow the calculated capacity for that system.

Look into the sump pit, and see what is in there! It sounds like it is
ground water, which should be clear and reasonably clean. You won't have
a problem, unless the sump discharges waster water (laundry, kitchen,
etc output).

5) People suggest various vacuum break systems - some say drill small
hole just above check valve, others suggest adding T outside with
riser - do I need the latter?

For best results, put the check valve right at the sump pump. It is
when there is a pipe between them, that is when you can get airlock.

On 18 Oct 2004 15:03:14 -0700, (MIchael Jasper) wrote:

2) PVC - Okay to use 1 1/4 ? I've noticed other posts seem to
recommend 1 1/2". Is there much difference?

Follow the printed recommendations from the pump manufacturer and you
can't go wrong. Don't guess!!! Obviously, the longer the run, the
bigger the pipe.

I personally would never use pvc outside the house - it degrades when
exposed to ultraviolet light and gets brittle. It isn't so important
with a drain line (as opposed to a pressurized water line) but why
risk having to replace it in a few years? If it gets brittle and
someone trips over the pipe it will shatter, probably where it exits
the foundation. I would use galvanized steel outside the house, with
the steel/ pvc joint located inside the basement and well clamped to a
solid support.. Steel is more expensive, but how many times do you
want to do this job?

4) Okay to let PVC run on surface downhill and just empty behind a
hedge down the hill several feet? Some folks seem to be saying the
discharge will smell terrible and mess up the lawn in the area it
dumps. The gutter goes in the ground and I assume either runs to sewer
or to drywell. Guy at home depot said don't tap into that or I might
overflow the calculated capacity for that system.

I don't see any problems with your plan as long as the area you are
discharging into slopes away from the house, doesn't flow onto a
neighbor's lot, and erosion won't be a problem. It shouldn't smell -
its ground water and rain water. I agree the discharge shouldn't go
into the downspout drain, unless you know _for sure_ the drain pipe is
clear of roots and debris and is extra large (4 inches). Then it might
be ok. If the drain pipe ever clogs up you will have a real mess....

5) People suggest various vacuum break systems - some say drill small
hole just above check valve, others suggest adding T outside with
riser - do I need the latter?

Install a check valve at the pump discharge outlet, as another poster
suggested, Make sure the valve is readily accessible in case you need
to remove it for cleaning. Important!!! - install a reducing tee and a
small ball valve above the check valve so you can drain the discharge
pipe for winterizatioon and servicing.

The real purpose of a vacuum breaker is to protect your potable water
system. I don't see any reason you would have any need for one on a
sump pump.

Thanks all for any help.

Call your local building inspector and ask what is local code. As the
homeowner you may deviate from code if you really want to, but it is
safer in terms of selling your home to make sure any modifications
meet code. Especially with a highly visible and important sump pump
system.

John

John Davies TLCA 14732
http://home.comcast.net/~johnedavies/
'96 Lexus LX450
'00 Audi A4 1.8T quattro
Spokane WA USA

John Davies wrote:

5) People suggest various vacuum break systems - some say drill small
hole just above check valve, others suggest adding T outside with
riser - do I need the latter?

Install a check valve at the pump discharge outlet, as another poster
suggested, Make sure the valve is readily accessible in case you need
to remove it for cleaning. Important!!! - install a reducing tee and a
small ball valve above the check valve so you can drain the discharge
pipe for winterizatioon and servicing.

The real purpose of a vacuum breaker is to protect your potable water
system. I don't see any reason you would have any need for one on a
sump pump.

I think he is referring to the outlet, one might want a way to break the
vacuum, when the pump is off, so that the pipe will drain, which could
be important if it is subject to freezing.

This is where you would put in a "Y" or "T" fitting, at the top end of
the drain run, so that it will drain on its own. Probably un-needed in a
low use situation, and you would have to be careful of that the pipe
doesn't plug downstream, since that would overflow.

So that is a mixed bag, with good and bad.

(MIchael Jasper) wrote in message . com...
THis is some additional info to my original post. I looked a bit more
carefully at where the discharge might exit to the outside. From what
I've seen in DIY books, the best thing would be to go through the rim
joist. In much of my basement, the rim joist is bare and easily
accessed. However, along about 1/2 of the wall where the pump sits,
the area right above the sill plate is covered with insulation, and
when I peel it away, I see bricks and mortar (quite old) there,
instead of a joist. Not sure what to make of this... the water pipe
for the external spigot exits through the brick, but was patched
around with mortar.

So, given this, since I'm not inclined to figure out how to make a 2"
hole in the bricks, I can either go through the sill plate itself, or
take the hose over to the adjoining wall (about 6' away), where the
joist is bare - but then I'll come out where the driveway is, so will
need to get the discharge back to the front of the house to avoid
icing up the driveway.

This shouldn't be this complicated!

Thanks for any help,
Michael