Great case on People's Court today.

Brand new apartment building, 5 floors, 20 apartments, the one involved
is $1.2 miillion dollars, 2000 sq.ft, 2 bedrooms and office.

General contractor hires painting contractor, painting contractor has
his employees painting the outside and the halls, and doesn't have
enough painters so he hires more, including plaintiff. Plaintiff is
hired off of CraigsList. In the words of the judge, just like us
shlubs would.

Painter does a bad job, lot of pictures of runs, overpaint, painting
over bad window caulking (does the painter do the caulking too in this
situation?), etc, judge agrees.

Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?



(The painting contractor said he just wanted him to fix the deficiencies
and he'd get paid, but the sub refused to go back and sued. The judge
points oout that the unpaid sub can, at least until the court case was
heard, file a lien and muck up sales and make everyone look bad. And
what buyer won't expect a discount when he hears the first paint job was
so bad, the painter wasn't paid?)

On 2/4/2020 9:41 PM, micky wrote:


Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

Probably more of a desperation choice. Most good contractors know
plenty of good help.


And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?

I'd be ticked if he did a crappy job. I would probably not know that
until too late. It is the responsibility of the contractor to hire
qualified help.

On Tue, 04 Feb 2020 21:41:50 -0500, micky
wrote:

Great case on People's Court today.

Brand new apartment building, 5 floors, 20 apartments, the one involved
is $1.2 miillion dollars, 2000 sq.ft, 2 bedrooms and office.

General contractor hires painting contractor, painting contractor has
his employees painting the outside and the halls, and doesn't have
enough painters so he hires more, including plaintiff. Plaintiff is
hired off of CraigsList. In the words of the judge, just like us
shlubs would.

Painter does a bad job, lot of pictures of runs, overpaint, painting
over bad window caulking (does the painter do the caulking too in this
situation?), etc, judge agrees.

Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?



(The painting contractor said he just wanted him to fix the deficiencies
and he'd get paid, but the sub refused to go back and sued. The judge
points oout that the unpaid sub can, at least until the court case was
heard, file a lien and muck up sales and make everyone look bad. And
what buyer won't expect a discount when he hears the first paint job was
so bad, the painter wasn't paid?)

When my wife was building her rule was be in "every room, every house,
every day" even when that was 16 houses at a time. She would have seen
this guy doing a bad job and told him to get that rentadrunk off her
job, get someone in there to fix the botched up work. The sub is
responsible for his workers and the job they do. If it happened very
often she would fire the sub. Subs usually get paid for one bad job
tho. They just don't get to come back.

On Tue, 4 Feb 2020 21:55:39 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 2/4/2020 9:41 PM, micky wrote:


Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

Probably more of a desperation choice. Most good contractors know
plenty of good help.


And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?

I'd be ticked if he did a crappy job. I would probably not know that
until too late. It is the responsibility of the contractor to hire
qualified help.
And to supervise and ensure the job is up to standard

In alt.home.repair, on Tue, 04 Feb 2020 23:29:19 -0500,
wrote:

On Tue, 04 Feb 2020 21:41:50 -0500, micky
wrote:

Great case on People's Court today.

Brand new apartment building, 5 floors, 20 apartments, the one involved
is $1.2 miillion dollars, 2000 sq.ft, 2 bedrooms and office.

General contractor hires painting contractor, painting contractor has
his employees painting the outside and the halls, and doesn't have
enough painters so he hires more, including plaintiff. Plaintiff is
hired off of CraigsList. In the words of the judge, just like us
shlubs would.

Painter does a bad job, lot of pictures of runs, overpaint, painting
over bad window caulking (does the painter do the caulking too in this
situation?), etc, judge agrees.

Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?



(The painting contractor said he just wanted him to fix the deficiencies
and he'd get paid, but the sub refused to go back and sued. The judge
points oout that the unpaid sub can, at least until the court case was
heard, file a lien and muck up sales and make everyone look bad. And
what buyer won't expect a discount when he hears the first paint job was
so bad, the painter wasn't paid?)

When my wife was building her rule was be in "every room, every house,
every day" even when that was 16 houses at a time. She would have seen
this guy doing a bad job and told him to get that rentadrunk off her
job, get someone in there to fix the botched up work. The sub is
responsible for his workers and the job they do. If it happened very
often she would fire the sub. Subs usually get paid for one bad job
tho. They just don't get to come back.

This sub told him to let him know when he was done and they'd have a
walkthrough. Not contemporaneous supervision, not even by one of the
ther employee painters working in the same building. The job took
Friday and Monday - Sunday, plenty of time to see how they were doing.

At the walkthrough, apparently he didnt' complain, but he didnt' pay the
90% he was planning to pay either (10% to be finished after the floor
went in) but he sent him complaints later that day

The sub sub ended up getting 3000 of the 3600 contract.

Judge Milyan frequently brings up that her father was a builder, her
brother is a builder and she knows some stuff about it.

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 05 Feb 2020 00:07:08 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Tue, 4 Feb 2020 21:55:39 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 2/4/2020 9:41 PM, micky wrote:


Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

Probably more of a desperation choice. Most good contractors know
plenty of good help.

I woudl think so.


And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?

I'd be ticked if he did a crappy job. I would probably not know that
until too late. It is the responsibility of the contractor to hire
qualified help.

That's what I figured you guys woudl say. Mostly I wanted to tell the
story.

And to supervise and ensure the job is up to standard

Yep.

On Wed, 05 Feb 2020 01:03:44 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 05 Feb 2020 00:07:08 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Tue, 4 Feb 2020 21:55:39 -0500, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

On 2/4/2020 9:41 PM, micky wrote:


Defendant said it's common practice, and that he has 4 other crews in
the same building. But he never makes clear if it's just that the other
crews are subs, or that they also came from craigslist.

So, is it common practice for decent painters to hire help from
craigslist?

Probably more of a desperation choice. Most good contractors know
plenty of good help.

I woudl think so.


And aren't there "deficiencies" that can't really be repaired? Mistakes
that absolutely shouldn't have been made. I can't think of any right
now but I think I've seen them.

Most of you won't build your own apartment building, but if you
remodeled or put on an addition and you had a general contractor who
hired a painting contractor who hired a new guy from craigslist, would
you be ticked off?

I'd be ticked if he did a crappy job. I would probably not know that
until too late. It is the responsibility of the contractor to hire
qualified help.

That's what I figured you guys woudl say. Mostly I wanted to tell the
story.

And to supervise and ensure the job is up to standard

Yep.
I've seen a lot of jobs done by "real painting contractors" that I
definitely would not sign off on with a final paiment. O've got high
standards when it comes to finishing so I end up doing most of my own
painting. I hired a gut to ro outdoor panting (siding) after getting
several good references and seeing his work -and I still checked in on
him.

Had some drywall repairs and painting done by the husband of a
co-worker who was also extremely picky. Figured if she was satisfied
with the renovation work he did on their house I'd be happy too. Was
not dissapointed.