A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

In micky writes:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Most, not all, automatic transmissions, including from
that time, will lock into the equivalent of second gear,
aka "limp home mode". But note, this can be the result
of anything from a minor "needs more fluid" to "dirty
filters" to lots and lots of heavy duty stuff.

I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?

You should be able to find a local repair shop with a more
functions reader, which might, or might not, give details
of the underlying problem.

This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

One suggestion: Disconnect the battery and see if that
resets whatever the glitch was. THere's a slight, but
realistic chance, it was a momemntary hiccup.



--
__________________________________________________ ___
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key

[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

In article ,
says...
female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.




For a car that old and many miles it is not worth it to spend very much
money on. The car may be worth $ 1500 if in good shape.

Sometimes you just have to junk the car. I had a 1991 Camry with about
that many miles and age at the time. It was in good running shape. Was
offered $ 500 for a trade in . It was over due to have the timing belt
changed. That would have been about what the trade in offer was. I
decided to drive it for a while longer before trading it in. Thinking if
it did lay down and die on me, I would not loose any money. I bought a
new car and sold that Camry to a fellow that could put the timing belt
in his self for the $ 500 I was going to get for a trade in. If I was
really going to get that much the way dealers work.

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!
Anyone who gave that advice is no mechanic and an idiot.
It is "limp HOME" mode - not "go shopping" mode. Find out what the
code is - what the transmission computer thinks is the problem. Often
it is a simple sensor or solenoid electrical failure.

Either get it fixed while it is still fixable or get it towed to the
scrapyard when it fails spectacularly. It won't likely be long

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500,
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.

And you did this more than once?

I'll tell her. It actually runs fine now, but the mechanic told her it
had some code, and all her other (girl) friends are telling her to sell
it. She's about 76 years old, loads of energy, but doesn't want to
hitchhike home from I-95.

She's had some extra expenses of about 1000, maybe more, and is in her
words, flat broke.

I'm telling her to keep it and that the worst scenario is not that bad.

I see that my own $70 code reader isn't able to read transmission codes
-- I knew that when I bought it -- but that there is a model now for
$190 that does engine, xmission, airbag, and ABS, though it doesn't do
everything such as relearning. I haven't had many xmission problem so
I'm sure I would not have bought it.
https://www.amazon.com/FOXWELL-NT614..._ob_title_auto

Thanks everyone.

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 01 Jan 2020 19:09:43 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!
Anyone who gave that advice is no mechanic and an idiot.
It is "limp HOME" mode - not "go shopping" mode.

LOL

Find out what the
code is - what the transmission computer thinks is the problem. Often
it is a simple sensor or solenoid electrical failure.

Either get it fixed while it is still fixable or get it towed to the
scrapyard when it fails spectacularly. It won't likely be long

Noted, but she drives very little, and has no money.

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 1 Jan 2020 22:09:30 +0000 (UTC), danny
burstein wrote:

In micky writes:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Most, not all, automatic transmissions, including from
that time, will lock into the equivalent of second gear,
aka "limp home mode". But note, this can be the result
of anything from a minor "needs more fluid" to "dirty
filters" to lots and lots of heavy duty stuff.

I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?

You should be able to find a local repair shop with a more
functions reader, which might, or might not, give details
of the underlying problem.

This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

One suggestion: Disconnect the battery and see if that
resets whatever the glitch was. THere's a slight, but
realistic chance, it was a momemntary hiccup.

GF's idea too.

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.
Depends what the issue is. If it is a "glitch" it may work. The
problem is aften a corroded connector.
The issue with driving in "limp mode" is it can protect the
transmission at the expense of the engine. Limp mode generally
dissables all the shift solenoids, locking the transmission in either
2nd or third gear, with apply pressures maxed to avoid slippage which
would overheat the clutches.
Driving continuously in secopnd or third gear could cause the engine
to either be overloaded or over-reved.
GENERALLY it is a signal failure that causes the light to go on -
very seldom an actual mechanical or hydraulic issue. Sometimes it can
be a shift solenoid ptoblem. USUALLY it is not a terribly expensive
repair. Going to the dealer for diagnosis may be the cheapest first
step - the service manager may say "the scanner shows P0714 - we've
seen a few corroded connectors on the tansmission fluid temperature
sensors. We may be able to just resolder the connector and get you on
your way" - or " Code p0776 indicates the pressure control solenoid is
either malfunctioning or stuck off - have you had the transmission
fluid changed in the last 2 years? If not changing the fluid and
putting in a can of BG ATC Plus conditioner will likely free up the
solenoid - if not we will have to replace the solenoid".

Taking it to an independent shop may take 3 hours of troubledhooting
to find the problem - or they may never find it.

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:35:09 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 01 Jan 2020 19:09:43 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!
Anyone who gave that advice is no mechanic and an idiot.
It is "limp HOME" mode - not "go shopping" mode.

LOL

Find out what the
code is - what the transmission computer thinks is the problem. Often
it is a simple sensor or solenoid electrical failure.

Either get it fixed while it is still fixable or get it towed to the
scrapyard when it fails spectacularly. It won't likely be long

Noted, but she drives very little, and has no money.
Give her a christmas present. Take it to the dealer and have the code
read. Or go back to the clown who told her to keep driving it and
find out what code it was and report back. Might be something even YOU
can repair if we know the code.

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:35:59 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 1 Jan 2020 22:09:30 +0000 (UTC), danny
burstein wrote:

In micky writes:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Most, not all, automatic transmissions, including from
that time, will lock into the equivalent of second gear,
aka "limp home mode". But note, this can be the result
of anything from a minor "needs more fluid" to "dirty
filters" to lots and lots of heavy duty stuff.

I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?

You should be able to find a local repair shop with a more
functions reader, which might, or might not, give details
of the underlying problem.

This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

One suggestion: Disconnect the battery and see if that
resets whatever the glitch was. THere's a slight, but
realistic chance, it was a momemntary hiccup.

GF's idea too.
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer. The VEHICLE
end of the grond cable to the positive cable - NOT the batter
end!!!!!!!

On 1/1/2020 8:35 PM, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500,
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.

And you did this more than once?

I'll tell her. It actually runs fine now, but the mechanic told her it
had some code, and all her other (girl) friends are telling her to sell
it. She's about 76 years old, loads of energy, but doesn't want to
hitchhike home from I-95.

She's had some extra expenses of about 1000, maybe more, and is in her
words, flat broke.

I'm telling her to keep it and that the worst scenario is not that bad.


Tough situation but even if you have to pay, get a reading. Auto Zone
and Advanced Auto do it for free in hopes of selling you parts to fix it.

You can try the other suggestions with the battery for temporary relief.
No fun driving a car in limp mode but it may be enough for her to make
a plan for repair or replace. The car is not worth much but if it turns
out to be a $200 repair, not a bad deal. If #2000, just scrap it.

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:35:01 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500,
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.

And you did this more than once?

Yup. maybe 3 or 4 times in the two years before we got rid of it.
It really lasted quite a while between resets but my wife wasn't
really driving it that much. Her job was about 4 miles away. A tank of
gas would last a month. I thought it was just a fluke the first couple
times it happened. We ended up trading it.

I'll tell her. It actually runs fine now, but the mechanic told her it
had some code, and all her other (girl) friends are telling her to sell
it. She's about 76 years old, loads of energy, but doesn't want to
hitchhike home from I-95.

She's had some extra expenses of about 1000, maybe more, and is in her
words, flat broke.

I'm telling her to keep it and that the worst scenario is not that bad.

I see that my own $70 code reader isn't able to read transmission codes
-- I knew that when I bought it -- but that there is a model now for
$190 that does engine, xmission, airbag, and ABS, though it doesn't do
everything such as relearning. I haven't had many xmission problem so
I'm sure I would not have bought it.
https://www.amazon.com/FOXWELL-NT614..._ob_title_auto

Thanks everyone.

Go to Auto Zone or Advanced Auto. They will scan it for free. You
might get lucky and find out it is an easy to replace part.

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 21:30:54 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.
Depends what the issue is. If it is a "glitch" it may work. The
problem is aften a corroded connector.
The issue with driving in "limp mode" is it can protect the
transmission at the expense of the engine. Limp mode generally
dissables all the shift solenoids, locking the transmission in either
2nd or third gear, with apply pressures maxed to avoid slippage which
would overheat the clutches.
Driving continuously in secopnd or third gear could cause the engine
to either be overloaded or over-reved.
GENERALLY it is a signal failure that causes the light to go on -
very seldom an actual mechanical or hydraulic issue. Sometimes it can
be a shift solenoid ptoblem. USUALLY it is not a terribly expensive
repair. Going to the dealer for diagnosis may be the cheapest first
step - the service manager may say "the scanner shows P0714 - we've
seen a few corroded connectors on the tansmission fluid temperature
sensors. We may be able to just resolder the connector and get you on
your way" - or " Code p0776 indicates the pressure control solenoid is
either malfunctioning or stuck off - have you had the transmission
fluid changed in the last 2 years? If not changing the fluid and
putting in a can of BG ATC Plus conditioner will likely free up the
solenoid - if not we will have to replace the solenoid".

Taking it to an independent shop may take 3 hours of troubledhooting
to find the problem - or they may never find it.

Just get the code and google it. There are some yacking groups out
there with a lot of knowledge on various brands.

On Thu, 02 Jan 2020 01:17:33 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:35:01 -0500, micky
wrote:

In alt.home.repair, on Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500,
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.

And you did this more than once?

Yup. maybe 3 or 4 times in the two years before we got rid of it.
It really lasted quite a while between resets but my wife wasn't
really driving it that much. Her job was about 4 miles away. A tank of
gas would last a month. I thought it was just a fluke the first couple
times it happened. We ended up trading it.

I'll tell her. It actually runs fine now, but the mechanic told her it
had some code, and all her other (girl) friends are telling her to sell
it. She's about 76 years old, loads of energy, but doesn't want to
hitchhike home from I-95.

She's had some extra expenses of about 1000, maybe more, and is in her
words, flat broke.

I'm telling her to keep it and that the worst scenario is not that bad.

I see that my own $70 code reader isn't able to read transmission codes
-- I knew that when I bought it -- but that there is a model now for
$190 that does engine, xmission, airbag, and ABS, though it doesn't do
everything such as relearning. I haven't had many xmission problem so
I'm sure I would not have bought it.
https://www.amazon.com/FOXWELL-NT614..._ob_title_auto

Thanks everyone.

Go to Auto Zone or Advanced Auto. They will scan it for free. You
might get lucky and find out it is an easy to replace part.
Most of them only have OBD2 scanners that do not read trans, brakes,
ABS, or transmission codes. Perhaps some have updated to full function
scanners

On Thu, 02 Jan 2020 01:19:57 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 21:30:54 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.
Depends what the issue is. If it is a "glitch" it may work. The
problem is aften a corroded connector.
The issue with driving in "limp mode" is it can protect the
transmission at the expense of the engine. Limp mode generally
dissables all the shift solenoids, locking the transmission in either
2nd or third gear, with apply pressures maxed to avoid slippage which
would overheat the clutches.
Driving continuously in secopnd or third gear could cause the engine
to either be overloaded or over-reved.
GENERALLY it is a signal failure that causes the light to go on -
very seldom an actual mechanical or hydraulic issue. Sometimes it can
be a shift solenoid ptoblem. USUALLY it is not a terribly expensive
repair. Going to the dealer for diagnosis may be the cheapest first
step - the service manager may say "the scanner shows P0714 - we've
seen a few corroded connectors on the tansmission fluid temperature
sensors. We may be able to just resolder the connector and get you on
your way" - or " Code p0776 indicates the pressure control solenoid is
either malfunctioning or stuck off - have you had the transmission
fluid changed in the last 2 years? If not changing the fluid and
putting in a can of BG ATC Plus conditioner will likely free up the
solenoid - if not we will have to replace the solenoid".

Taking it to an independent shop may take 3 hours of troubledhooting
to find the problem - or they may never find it.

Just get the code and google it. There are some yacking groups out
there with a lot of knowledge on various brands.
If it's like the BMW groups 90%+ is BS

On 1/1/2020 4:54 PM, micky wrote:
A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??


Sometimes a quick inspection will reveal something simple like a corroded wiring harness plug/socket.

Or maybe your tranny is seriously ****ed and you'll need a pro.


Or maybe watching a few of this guy's videos will inspire your leftocrat ass?

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtA...liY7ko1PBhzTHA

On Wednesday, January 1, 2020 at 9:30:59 PM UTC-5, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.
Depends what the issue is. If it is a "glitch" it may work. The
problem is aften a corroded connector.
The issue with driving in "limp mode" is it can protect the
transmission at the expense of the engine. Limp mode generally
dissables all the shift solenoids, locking the transmission in either
2nd or third gear, with apply pressures maxed to avoid slippage which
would overheat the clutches.
Driving continuously in secopnd or third gear could cause the engine
to either be overloaded or over-reved.
GENERALLY it is a signal failure that causes the light to go on -
very seldom an actual mechanical or hydraulic issue. Sometimes it can
be a shift solenoid ptoblem. USUALLY it is not a terribly expensive
repair. Going to the dealer for diagnosis may be the cheapest first
step - the service manager may say "the scanner shows P0714 - we've
seen a few corroded connectors on the tansmission fluid temperature
sensors. We may be able to just resolder the connector and get you on
your way" - or " Code p0776 indicates the pressure control solenoid is
either malfunctioning or stuck off - have you had the transmission
fluid changed in the last 2 years? If not changing the fluid and
putting in a can of BG ATC Plus conditioner will likely free up the
solenoid - if not we will have to replace the solenoid".

Taking it to an independent shop may take 3 hours of troubledhooting
to find the problem - or they may never find it.

I've said here before that for things like this, the dealer may be the
best option. Already she's had it to an indy and IDK what she paid,
but she didn't find out anything useful. I used to use an indy here
instead of the Mercedes dealer, twenty five years ago. Back then,
their labor rate was about 30% less and they used aftermarket parts
with big savings there. Over the years the labor rate went up to the
point that it's only a little less than the dealer. And the bills
went to showing only MB parts numbers, with prices to match. I came
to the conclusion that you're better off going to the dealer, where
they service one make, see more cars with the same problem, have the
full factory diagnostic tools, etc. They may find it, correctly
diagnose it and fix it in one hour compared to two or three, in which
case, it costs less.

For the BMW X5 I have the full BMW factory software running on a PC.
And that has certainly paid for itself a hundred times over. I can
read out all the modules and it has diagnostics where it will go
through a test for a suspected fault. Some of those tests, it has to
run the car or run it long enough to get the coolant warm. First time,
it's interesting to see the computer telling you it's doing to do that,
and then see the engine speed up.

There are OBD cables and software for smartphones now too. For the
average car owner, I think having one of those, keeping the cable in
the car, is an excellent idea. They won't read everything, but they
will read most of the engine codes.

On Thu, 02 Jan 2020 02:14:45 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Thu, 02 Jan 2020 01:19:57 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 21:30:54 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 20:08:58 -0500, wrote:

On Wed, 01 Jan 2020 16:54:02 -0500, micky
wrote:

A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I've heard that when one breaks, it goes into limp-in mode so one can
still drive home or to the shop.

True for Toyota? Yes.

True for 2002? ??

Surely not always true and depends on what breaks, right? Only true
if sensor out of range, or computer confused. But no limp-kn mode if
actual transmission failure, right?

Usually turns out to be true?

How fast is limp-in? 10mph?

Most of her errands are near her home and if perchance she has to spend
2 hours driving at 10MPH from the far side of Baltimore, that certainly
seems acceptable to me.


I have an $80 code reader, but iiuc most of them can't detect
transmission codes, right? A device to do that is over 1000 dollars?



This is funny, from
https://www.transmissionrepaircostguide.com/limp-mode/

Do not panic! Limp mode is specifically designed to limit further
damage and allow you to get your car to a service center
....
It is advised that you do not continue to drive a vehicle in limp
mode as it is unsafe and can cause further damage to your vehicle

So limit further damage includes causing further damage!!

Dunno about Toyotas but on my wife's old Honda you could make that go
away by disconnecting the battery for a minute. It was actually
shifting bad and stuff. That reset the controller and it was good for
a couple thousand more miles.
Depends what the issue is. If it is a "glitch" it may work. The
problem is aften a corroded connector.
The issue with driving in "limp mode" is it can protect the
transmission at the expense of the engine. Limp mode generally
dissables all the shift solenoids, locking the transmission in either
2nd or third gear, with apply pressures maxed to avoid slippage which
would overheat the clutches.
Driving continuously in secopnd or third gear could cause the engine
to either be overloaded or over-reved.
GENERALLY it is a signal failure that causes the light to go on -
very seldom an actual mechanical or hydraulic issue. Sometimes it can
be a shift solenoid ptoblem. USUALLY it is not a terribly expensive
repair. Going to the dealer for diagnosis may be the cheapest first
step - the service manager may say "the scanner shows P0714 - we've
seen a few corroded connectors on the tansmission fluid temperature
sensors. We may be able to just resolder the connector and get you on
your way" - or " Code p0776 indicates the pressure control solenoid is
either malfunctioning or stuck off - have you had the transmission
fluid changed in the last 2 years? If not changing the fluid and
putting in a can of BG ATC Plus conditioner will likely free up the
solenoid - if not we will have to replace the solenoid".

Taking it to an independent shop may take 3 hours of troubledhooting
to find the problem - or they may never find it.

Just get the code and google it. There are some yacking groups out
there with a lot of knowledge on various brands.
If it's like the BMW groups 90%+ is BS

I don't know about Toyota but the Honda group was pretty good. They
had a few dealer mechanics on it.

In article ,
says...

I don't know about Toyota but the Honda group was pretty good. They
had a few dealer mechanics on it.



I hope those dealere mechanics are better than the Toyota dealer
mechanic here. Took them 3 weeks to find and replace a mass air sensor
that is about $ 500. It was one of the top things on the Autozone (or
similar) internet trouble shooting cause after the simple things like
spark plugs and wires. I would have thought they would have a tester for
that item.

On 1/1/2020 1:54 PM, micky wrote:
A female friend has a 2002 Toyota 4-cyl Camry had a check-engine light.
Has a code coming from her transmission, and the shop suggested she just
drive it around town and not from city to city, rather than get another
transmission for a car with 187,000 miles. They didnt' tell her what
the code was.

I think you're in limp-wristed mode.

On Thu, 2 Jan 2020 11:11:08 -0500, Ralph Mowery
wrote:

In article ,
says...

I don't know about Toyota but the Honda group was pretty good. They
had a few dealer mechanics on it.



I hope those dealere mechanics are better than the Toyota dealer
mechanic here. Took them 3 weeks to find and replace a mass air sensor
that is about $ 500. It was one of the top things on the Autozone (or
similar) internet trouble shooting cause after the simple things like
spark plugs and wires. I would have thought they would have a tester for
that item.

That is supposed to throw a code but I suppose it might pass the test
and still be bad.

"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

In article , says...

"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil




The way I take it seems correct.

1. Disconnect the ground (usually negative) wire from the battery.
This is the correct way to start taking a battery out.

2. Take this wire and touch it to the positive battery post ( again
assuming a negative ground system).

That last step helps to discharge any capacitors in the system that may
keep the computer active or holding a memory.


He is simply following the standard battery replacement where you
disconnect the ground wire first , then the positive. This helps to
prevent welding the wrench from the battery to the frame of the car if
you do it in reverse and start with the positive lead.

If starting with the positive battery lead and the wrench makes
contact with the frame of the car and the negative lead is still hooked
up, you get major fireworks. If you start with the ground lead, it does
not make any difference if the wrench touches an already grounded frame.
There may be some very low level current that can flow due to all the
electronics , but not very much.

On Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil
How? You ALWAYS disconnect the ground first, right? So you take the
ground cable and short it to the power cable - which has NO voltage on
it measured to the chassis ground except a possible memory charge in
the ECU. Shorting them helps drain the memory to reset the CEL.
Exactly the same as removing the power wire and grounding it but daves
one step - as you ALWAYS remove the ground first and connect the
ground last - RIGHT????
By the vehicle end I mean the cable coming FROM the vehicle ground
to the battery - just to be sure some dimbulb doesn't disconnect the
ground cable from the engine or chassis instead of from the battery,
then connect that (still connected to the battery - end) to the
positive!

"Clare Snyder"

"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out
of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts.
If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground
cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the
computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

How? You ALWAYS disconnect the ground first, right? So
you take the
ground cable and short it to the power cable - which has
NO voltage on
it measured to the chassis ground except a possible memory
charge in
the ECU. Shorting them helps drain the memory to reset the
CEL.
Exactly the same as removing the power wire and grounding
it but daves
one step - as you ALWAYS remove the ground first and
connect the
ground last - RIGHT????
By the vehicle end I mean the cable coming FROM the
vehicle ground
to the battery - just to be sure some dimbulb doesn't
disconnect the
ground cable from the engine or chassis instead of from
the battery,
then connect that (still connected to the battery - end)
to the
positive!

1."The VEHICLE end of the ground cable to the positive
cable - NOT the
battery end!!!!!!!"
2. "By the vehicle end I mean the cable coming FROM the
vehicle ground
to the battery"

There yah go. The disconnected battery end of the ground
cable is
touched to the positive cable end. Since the battery is now
not
grounded there is no conducting circuit. Right? phil

On Thu, 2 Jan 2020 22:20:07 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"

"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out
of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts.
If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground
cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the
computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

How? You ALWAYS disconnect the ground first, right? So
you take the
ground cable and short it to the power cable - which has
NO voltage on
it measured to the chassis ground except a possible memory
charge in
the ECU. Shorting them helps drain the memory to reset the
CEL.
Exactly the same as removing the power wire and grounding
it but daves
one step - as you ALWAYS remove the ground first and
connect the
ground last - RIGHT????
By the vehicle end I mean the cable coming FROM the
vehicle ground
to the battery - just to be sure some dimbulb doesn't
disconnect the
ground cable from the engine or chassis instead of from
the battery,
then connect that (still connected to the battery - end)
to the
positive!

1."The VEHICLE end of the ground cable to the positive
cable - NOT the
battery end!!!!!!!"
2. "By the vehicle end I mean the cable coming FROM the
vehicle ground
to the battery"

There yah go. The disconnected battery end of the ground
cable is
touched to the positive cable end. Since the battery is now
not
grounded there is no conducting circuit. Right? phil
That is basically it - no circuit through the battery system - and a
short across the caps in the ECU to drain them

On Thursday, January 2, 2020 at 5:51:24 PM UTC-5, Ralph Mowery wrote:
In article , says...

"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil




The way I take it seems correct.

Really? I see a big explosion. Clare said to take the disconnected
vehicle end of the cable, not the battery end and touch it to the
battery positive. If you take the disconnected battery end, which
is what you would be disconnecting normally, and touch it to the positive,
then you'd get the desired effect, bleeding off any charge stored in
caps and such. I doubt it's required though.






1. Disconnect the ground (usually negative) wire from the battery.
This is the correct way to start taking a battery out.

2. Take this wire and touch it to the positive battery post ( again
assuming a negative ground system).

That last step helps to discharge any capacitors in the system that may
keep the computer active or holding a memory.


He is simply following the standard battery replacement where you
disconnect the ground wire first , then the positive. This helps to
prevent welding the wrench from the battery to the frame of the car if
you do it in reverse and start with the positive lead.

If starting with the positive battery lead and the wrench makes
contact with the frame of the car and the negative lead is still hooked
up, you get major fireworks. If you start with the ground lead, it does
not make any difference if the wrench touches an already grounded frame.
There may be some very low level current that can flow due to all the
electronics , but not very much.

In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.

This was all just confusion about a poorly
worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place.

Right. And now it has been 'Clarified' for all.
Clare is a good guy, just busy as all get out.
Now on to the next subject and drop this one.
Thanks Clare... ;)
phil

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:15:48 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.

+1


As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.

That's been my experience with codes that i've reset in various modules,
including tranny too.

Like others have said, the car needs to go to a dealer or competent
repair shop. If they read a code, then they should be able to tell the
customer what that code typically means is wrong. It could be anything
from a bad connection to a tranny that's kaput. If it's the latter
and you're a shyster, I guess you could sign up for one of those great
auto warranty company plans, drive around in limp mode for a couple
months, then take it for repair.

trader_4 writes:
On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:15:48 PM UTC-5, wrote:

Like others have said, the car needs to go to a dealer or competent
repair shop. If they read a code, then they should be able to tell the
customer what that code typically means is wrong. It could be anything
from a bad connection to a tranny that's kaput.

Or in a recent case, a cobweb in a sensor port.

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 13:15:15 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.
On most of the newer vehicles it IS in flash (NVRAM) and will not
reset by simply disconnecting the battery. Basically on any that can
be "reflashed" with new microcode. I don't think year 2000 vehicles
had that capability (better than 90% sure, but not CERTAIN.)

Some vehicles in that time period DID have "persistent" memory - with
basically a supercapacitor to hold memory when the battery had to be
replaced or disconnected for service - to avoid the ECM losing all
it's adaptive settings, and the radio losing all it's presets, and the
memory seats and pedals etc from losing all their settings. These
vehicles MAY have held their codes for up to, say, half an hour.
Shorting the supply to ground drained the charge on the capacitor,
deleting the codes and all other saved settings.

Sometimes a vehicle's memory went into a "limbo" state when power was
disconnected - or even with power surges - and shorting the memory was
the only simple way to restore the system to an operable state, since
the ECU didn't even know how to communicate with the scanner.

Not a common occurence, for sure - but a possibility none-the-less.
On a 2018 vehicle disconnecting OR shorting is unlikely to clear ANY
codes or ECM settings (or BCM either)

From 2009-2010 on up there are also "permanent DTCs" than can NOT be
cleared - even with a scan tool. The only way to clear them is to
repair the problem, delete all current, history, and pending codes,
and then successfully complete a "drive cycle" to prove to the
computer that the fault has been repaired. These are "generally" "hard
emission faults". They are generally identifiable by the code NOT
starting with a letter.

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 17:19:23 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 13:15:15 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.
On most of the newer vehicles it IS in flash (NVRAM) and will not
reset by simply disconnecting the battery. Basically on any that can
be "reflashed" with new microcode. I don't think year 2000 vehicles
had that capability (better than 90% sure, but not CERTAIN.)

Some vehicles in that time period DID have "persistent" memory - with
basically a supercapacitor to hold memory when the battery had to be
replaced or disconnected for service - to avoid the ECM losing all
it's adaptive settings, and the radio losing all it's presets, and the
memory seats and pedals etc from losing all their settings.

My 97 Honda doesn't remember **** after the most brief disconnect.
When I still had the factory radio that was a real pain in the ass
because there was a secret code you needed to enter to get it going
again. I chucked it and put in an MP3 player pretty fast. I am not
sure who would want to steal that radio in the first place. It sure
wasn't easy to get out (pre DIN) and there was nothing special about
it. It didn't really matter tho since I was already playing MP3s in
the car when I bought the car and I was only using the AMP, via a
cassette adapter, from a PC in back.

2On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 18:35:23 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 17:19:23 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 13:15:15 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.
On most of the newer vehicles it IS in flash (NVRAM) and will not
reset by simply disconnecting the battery. Basically on any that can
be "reflashed" with new microcode. I don't think year 2000 vehicles
had that capability (better than 90% sure, but not CERTAIN.)

Some vehicles in that time period DID have "persistent" memory - with
basically a supercapacitor to hold memory when the battery had to be
replaced or disconnected for service - to avoid the ECM losing all
it's adaptive settings, and the radio losing all it's presets, and the
memory seats and pedals etc from losing all their settings.

My 97 Honda doesn't remember **** after the most brief disconnect.
When I still had the factory radio that was a real pain in the ass
because there was a secret code you needed to enter to get it going
again. I chucked it and put in an MP3 player pretty fast. I am not
sure who would want to steal that radio in the first place. It sure
wasn't easy to get out (pre DIN) and there was nothing special about
it. It didn't really matter tho since I was already playing MP3s in
the car when I bought the car and I was only using the AMP, via a
cassette adapter, from a PC in back.


'97 was the first, or possibly second depending on the model, Honda
with full OBD2 compatability. Mode 6 became standard in 1998. Things
changed very little for the next 5-8 years, and then "all hell broke
loose" with Mandatory CanBus in 2008 (actually 2001 for European cars)
and EOBD and OBD3 ----- and LOTS of fun.

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 20:49:31 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

2On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 18:35:23 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 17:19:23 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 13:15:15 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.
On most of the newer vehicles it IS in flash (NVRAM) and will not
reset by simply disconnecting the battery. Basically on any that can
be "reflashed" with new microcode. I don't think year 2000 vehicles
had that capability (better than 90% sure, but not CERTAIN.)

Some vehicles in that time period DID have "persistent" memory - with
basically a supercapacitor to hold memory when the battery had to be
replaced or disconnected for service - to avoid the ECM losing all
it's adaptive settings, and the radio losing all it's presets, and the
memory seats and pedals etc from losing all their settings.

My 97 Honda doesn't remember **** after the most brief disconnect.
When I still had the factory radio that was a real pain in the ass
because there was a secret code you needed to enter to get it going
again. I chucked it and put in an MP3 player pretty fast. I am not
sure who would want to steal that radio in the first place. It sure
wasn't easy to get out (pre DIN) and there was nothing special about
it. It didn't really matter tho since I was already playing MP3s in
the car when I bought the car and I was only using the AMP, via a
cassette adapter, from a PC in back.


'97 was the first, or possibly second depending on the model, Honda
with full OBD2 compatability. Mode 6 became standard in 1998. Things
changed very little for the next 5-8 years, and then "all hell broke
loose" with Mandatory CanBus in 2008 (actually 2001 for European cars)
and EOBD and OBD3 ----- and LOTS of fun.

I have never had a need to plug anything into the OBD port on that
Honda. The only thing that really "failed" was the hydraulic cylinders
for the clutch, a leaking radiator and the door handles. I did replace
the oil filter housing but that was just to stop a drip in the
driveway. The belt job was preventive maintenance like the tires.

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 22:45:16 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 20:49:31 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

2On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 18:35:23 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 17:19:23 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 13:15:15 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.
On most of the newer vehicles it IS in flash (NVRAM) and will not
reset by simply disconnecting the battery. Basically on any that can
be "reflashed" with new microcode. I don't think year 2000 vehicles
had that capability (better than 90% sure, but not CERTAIN.)

Some vehicles in that time period DID have "persistent" memory - with
basically a supercapacitor to hold memory when the battery had to be
replaced or disconnected for service - to avoid the ECM losing all
it's adaptive settings, and the radio losing all it's presets, and the
memory seats and pedals etc from losing all their settings.

My 97 Honda doesn't remember **** after the most brief disconnect.
When I still had the factory radio that was a real pain in the ass
because there was a secret code you needed to enter to get it going
again. I chucked it and put in an MP3 player pretty fast. I am not
sure who would want to steal that radio in the first place. It sure
wasn't easy to get out (pre DIN) and there was nothing special about
it. It didn't really matter tho since I was already playing MP3s in
the car when I bought the car and I was only using the AMP, via a
cassette adapter, from a PC in back.


'97 was the first, or possibly second depending on the model, Honda
with full OBD2 compatability. Mode 6 became standard in 1998. Things
changed very little for the next 5-8 years, and then "all hell broke
loose" with Mandatory CanBus in 2008 (actually 2001 for European cars)
and EOBD and OBD3 ----- and LOTS of fun.

I have never had a need to plug anything into the OBD port on that
Honda. The only thing that really "failed" was the hydraulic cylinders
for the clutch, a leaking radiator and the door handles. I did replace
the oil filter housing but that was just to stop a drip in the
driveway. The belt job was preventive maintenance like the tires.
In just under 8 years my '96 Ranger has thrown two codes. A leaky
evap hose and a bad temperature sensor - both of which I would not
have caught without the CEL coming on (and the last one WAS hurting
gas mileage before it got to the point it stopped in the middle of the
road just as the CEL came on - - -

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 23:13:17 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 22:45:16 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 20:49:31 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

2On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 18:35:23 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 17:19:23 -0500, Clare Snyder
wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jan 2020 13:15:15 -0500, wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 06:13:45 -0800 (PST), trader_4
wrote:

On Friday, January 3, 2020 at 1:37:55 AM UTC-5, micky wrote:
In alt.home.repair, on Thu, 2 Jan 2020 17:33:47 -0500, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


"Clare Snyder"
GENERALLY the "hiccup" will reset the light and go out of
limp mode
itself if it is not redetected in a number of restarts. If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!

Please re-read this, Clare, and clarify this.
It sounds 'fishy' to me... phil

He said it right. He's discharging the car, not the battery.

Without the battery connected, the car won't have much charge but it can
have enough to hold settings, and the goal was to reset the
transmission.

No, he did not say it right:


If
you do
disconnect the battery short the disconnected ground cable
to the
positive to short and drain any charge from the computer.
The VEHICLE
end of the ground cable to the positive cable - NOT the
battery
end!!!!!!!


What does "the vehicle end of the ground cable, not the battery end"
mean? First, you would not disconnect the vehicle end of the ground
cable to begin with. It's connected to the chassis and usually not
even readily accessible. You would disconnect the BATTERY END. And then
touch that to the positive battery post, with the positive cable
still connected. And if you did disconnect the vehicle end of the
ground cable, not the battery end, and shorted that to the positive
battery terminal l like he sadi, you would have a direct short across
the battery, fireworks and possible explosion.


This was all just confusion about a poorly worded sentence and mostly
unnecessary in the first place. The capacitors in these ECUs won't
carry that load for more than a second or two anyway. If you
disconnect that battery for 10 seconds, everything that was going to
reset will reset. These days I suspect a lot of those settings are in
Flash and that isn't going to reset until you reset it.
As for the transmission in a 2000 Honda. It was reset in a couple of
seconds every time I did it. I am guessing a Toyota would be the same.
On most of the newer vehicles it IS in flash (NVRAM) and will not
reset by simply disconnecting the battery. Basically on any that can
be "reflashed" with new microcode. I don't think year 2000 vehicles
had that capability (better than 90% sure, but not CERTAIN.)

Some vehicles in that time period DID have "persistent" memory - with
basically a supercapacitor to hold memory when the battery had to be
replaced or disconnected for service - to avoid the ECM losing all
it's adaptive settings, and the radio losing all it's presets, and the
memory seats and pedals etc from losing all their settings.

My 97 Honda doesn't remember **** after the most brief disconnect.
When I still had the factory radio that was a real pain in the ass
because there was a secret code you needed to enter to get it going
again. I chucked it and put in an MP3 player pretty fast. I am not
sure who would want to steal that radio in the first place. It sure
wasn't easy to get out (pre DIN) and there was nothing special about
it. It didn't really matter tho since I was already playing MP3s in
the car when I bought the car and I was only using the AMP, via a
cassette adapter, from a PC in back.


'97 was the first, or possibly second depending on the model, Honda
with full OBD2 compatability. Mode 6 became standard in 1998. Things
changed very little for the next 5-8 years, and then "all hell broke
loose" with Mandatory CanBus in 2008 (actually 2001 for European cars)
and EOBD and OBD3 ----- and LOTS of fun.

I have never had a need to plug anything into the OBD port on that
Honda. The only thing that really "failed" was the hydraulic cylinders
for the clutch, a leaking radiator and the door handles. I did replace
the oil filter housing but that was just to stop a drip in the
driveway. The belt job was preventive maintenance like the tires.
In just under 8 years my '96 Ranger has thrown two codes. A leaky
evap hose and a bad temperature sensor - both of which I would not
have caught without the CEL coming on (and the last one WAS hurting
gas mileage before it got to the point it stopped in the middle of the
road just as the CEL came on - - -

It is what I said before. Generally speaking, the electronics are
making cars easier to fix. They usually tell you where they hurt. I am
sure if you do it long enough you have plenty of stories of things
that should have been caught and weren't but it is not the olden days
where you just had to guess what to fix and it was all shades of gray.