I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 1:33:24 PM UTC-5, Micky wrote:
I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

You win the moronic award for today!

/–ˆ\
..Î*.

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 11:39:30 -0700 (PDT), bob_villain wrote:

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 1:33:24 PM UTC-5, Micky wrote:
I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

You win the moronic award for today!

/?\
.?.

Holy Crap! You finally said something I agree with.

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 2:33:24 PM UTC-4, Micky wrote:
I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

Let me see if I understand this...

You don't think that you'll get shocked/killed if you use the "remote switch"
with soaking wet, soap covered hands, but are still reluctant to try it just
in case you are wrong. Is that correct?

If so, here is a very simple solution:

https://d2pbmlo3fglvvr.cloudfront.ne...2KAswfo5oy.JPG

Keep getting your hands wetter and wetter, even going so far as standing
in a grounded bucket of water, until you trip the device. Once you know
the conditions under which you would have been shocked, back it off a notch.

QED

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 11:39:30 -0700 (PDT)
bob_villain wrote:

You win the moronic award for today!

Nope, help by you and google groups

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 14:33:04 -0400, Micky
wrote:

I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

If you keep trying hard enough.........maybe one day.

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 12:20:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 2:33:24 PM UTC-4, Micky wrote:
I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

Let me see if I understand this...

You don't think that you'll get shocked/killed if you use the "remote switch"
with soaking wet, soap covered hands, but are still reluctant to try it just
in case you are wrong. Is that correct?

Right. It would also be hard to know if enough water has gotten into
the swtich (one of those big ones, shaped like an almond, almost 2
inches long, an inch high, and more than 1/2 inch thick, with a rocker
sw. at the top.)

If so, here is a very simple solution:

https://d2pbmlo3fglvvr.cloudfront.ne...2KAswfo5oy.JPG

Keep getting your hands wetter and wetter, even going so far as standing
in a grounded bucket of water, until you trip the device. Once you know
the conditions under which you would have been shocked, back it off a notch.

You must have misread my post. In my situation, I am not grounded.

QED

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 5:07:44 PM UTC-4, Seymore4Head wrote:


If you keep trying hard enough.........maybe one day.

Maybe easier than you think:

"but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. "

That's some mighty interesting wiring. Normally conductors are
run together, not with the hot and neutral separated. Probably
a code violation, but we don't have much to go on.

And the chances of getting shocked would also depend on what
kind of switch it is. Flipping a properly installed wall toggle
switch with wet hands, I do that all the time, obviously other
people do too, either in a bathroom without tripping
the GFCI or other switches without GFCI and I've never got a
shock. It would be hard for the water to get into the contact area
of the switch. On the other hand, if it's some half-assed little inline
switch made for a lamp cord, I sure wouldn't pick the whole thing up with wet hands, hold the cord and switch in one hand and operate the switch
with water running from my hands into it.

On 7/14/2016 5:20 PM, Micky wrote:
On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 12:20:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:



If so, here is a very simple solution:

https://d2pbmlo3fglvvr.cloudfront.ne...2KAswfo5oy.JPG

Keep getting your hands wetter and wetter, even going so far as standing
in a grounded bucket of water, until you trip the device. Once you know
the conditions under which you would have been shocked, back it off a notch.

You must have misread my post. In my situation, I am not grounded.

QED


Better solution. clap clap
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ny8-G8EoWOw

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 5:20:44 PM UTC-4, Micky wrote:
On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 12:20:07 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 2:33:24 PM UTC-4, Micky wrote:
I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

Let me see if I understand this...

You don't think that you'll get shocked/killed if you use the "remote switch"
with soaking wet, soap covered hands, but are still reluctant to try it just
in case you are wrong. Is that correct?

Right. It would also be hard to know if enough water has gotten into
the swtich (one of those big ones, shaped like an almond, almost 2
inches long, an inch high, and more than 1/2 inch thick, with a rocker
sw. at the top.)

If so, here is a very simple solution:

https://d2pbmlo3fglvvr.cloudfront.ne...2KAswfo5oy.JPG

Keep getting your hands wetter and wetter, even going so far as standing
in a grounded bucket of water, until you trip the device. Once you know
the conditions under which you would have been shocked, back it off a notch.

You must have misread my post. In my situation, I am not grounded.

QED

I didn't misread anything. I was simply suggesting that you do everything
you can to trip the GFCI, including standing in a grounded bucket of water.
Once you know what it takes to trip the GFCI, you will know how far you
can take it.

*If* you actually have to ground yourself while having a open hose stuck
down the back of your pants and the switch in your sock to finally trip
the GFCI, you can be pretty sure that you can safely use the switch with wet hands while ungrounded.

Of course, you could just leave the GFCI in place and never worry about
wet hands again.

my gas dryers stat switch recently failed the dryer is just over a year old. the original switch is designed cheaply all plastic, but not durable.

so i bought a standard momentary contact switch, but am grounding the switch for safety.

i just wish companies would go back to building stuff that lasts, ratherthan being theabsolute cheapes it can be made

On Thu, 14 Jul 2016 14:31:58 -0700 (PDT), trader_4
wrote:

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 5:07:44 PM UTC-4, Seymore4Head wrote:


If you keep trying hard enough.........maybe one day.

Maybe easier than you think:

"but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. "

That's some mighty interesting wiring. Normally conductors are
run together, not with the hot and neutral separated. Probably
a code violation, but we don't have much to go on.

No, it's not a violation of code. They are a common device, sold for
remote control of electicial items that don't come with remote
control. They're all wired the same way except I'm not sure, now
that I think about it, which wire has the swich. I assumed it should
be the hot wire by analogy to house wiring.

https://www.amazon.ca/Woods-15-Foot-.../dp/B000KKND86
https://www.amazon.com/Prime-Wire-Ca.../dp/B006G69Z44

And the chances of getting shocked would also depend on what
kind of switch it is. Flipping a properly installed wall toggle
switch with wet hands, I do that all the time, obviously other
people do too, either in a bathroom without tripping
the GFCI or other switches without GFCI and I've never got a
shock. It would be hard for the water to get into the contact area
of the switch.

Right. It's not easy, but it's also not as hard as with a wall
switch, to get water into this switch.

But the point of the question was, Does it matter if it gets water in
it? What if with a wet hand I stuck a stiff uninsulated wire in the
hot slot of a receptacle, but I was standing in slippers on carpet on
wood and I wasn't touching any other metal anywhere. That is safe,
is it not?

On the other hand, if it's some half-assed little inline

It's inline, but it's not the little one. It's one of those big
ones, shaped like an almond, or a water bug, or two parens () , about
2 inches long, an inch wide, and more than 1/2 inch thick, with a
rocker sw. on one long side.

Something like this, but the older design, made from the 1940's to the
70's or 80's.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Leviton-3...-00W/100201339
And mine is rated not for 3 amps like this one but for
5A - 250 VAC
10A - 125 VAC
5A - 125 VT

For VT see:
http://www.electro-tech-online.com/t...rating.132644/

switch made for a lamp cord, I sure wouldn't pick the whole thing up with wet hands, hold the cord and switch in one hand and operate the switch with water running from my hands into it.

That was the extreme case, and I did say all that, but in practice, my
hand would be damp with maybe one drop falling from it. In the time
it takes to walk from the bathroom all the other water would fall off.
And there's no reason to use the other hand or to touch the cord.

On 7/14/2016 1:33 PM, Micky wrote:
I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.
2,000V or 20,000V? You don't have to have much contact to get a
shock from 20,000V. Fortunately the 20,000V in a doesn't have much
current capability.

Bill

trader_4
Thu, 14
Jul 2016 21:31:58 GMT in alt.home.repair, wrote:

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 5:07:44 PM UTC-4, Seymore4Head
wrote:


If you keep trying hard enough.........maybe one day.

Maybe easier than you think:

"but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. "

That's some mighty interesting wiring. Normally conductors are
run together, not with the hot and neutral separated. Probably
a code violation, but we don't have much to go on.

Might he have wired it switch leg? That's not against code, afaik.

It would be hard for the water to get into the contact
area of the switch. On the other hand, if it's some half-assed
little inline switch made for a lamp cord, I sure wouldn't pick
the whole thing up with wet hands, hold the cord and switch in one
hand and operate the switch with water running from my hands into
it.

I wouldn't either, mostly out of caution and respect for electricity.
Not because I'd expect to be shocked, unless, I'm completing the
circuit in some way.





--
MID:
Hmmm. I most certainly don't understand how I can access a copy of a
zip file but then not be able to unzip it so I can watch it. That
seems VERY clever!
http://al.howardknight.net/msgid.cgi?ID=145716711400

On Fri, 15 Jul 2016 13:00:04 -0500, Bill Gill
wrote:

On 7/14/2016 1:33 PM, Micky wrote:
I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.
2,000V or 20,000V? You don't have to have much contact to get a
shock from 20,000V. Fortunately the 20,000V in a doesn't have much
current capability.

Just 2000 volts or so. It was limited too, or I moved too quick to
get a long dose.

I'm sure it wasn't the picture tube supply. I was nowhere near that,
and I think it would have felt even stronger. But even though I was
being very careful, it must be that my hand moved and touched
something on the main chassis or board, I forget how old it was.

It "knocked me across the room" and I dislocated my shoulder, which
hadn't been out of its socket for 11 years. After that, the shoulder
came out twice and then 3 times a week. I had surgery about 6 months
later, and it hasn't been out since. Though I can't quite get my arm
straight up, or hold my hands behind my back now.

My bad shoulders were the major reason I wasn't drafted, but I didn't
avoid surgery so as not to be drafted. I really didn't want it. I'm
reluctant to have people cut into me. And I had a summer job where
I worked hard, putting down rebar and rebar supports for an xway, and
the shoulders stopped dislocating after that. The other one hasn't
been out since that summer job, except once 20 years ago when it was
really forced out, and it sprang right back in.

The story I head in the 70's was that if a shoulder came out 3 times,
you were doomed and had to have surgery, but the left was out 4 times
already, and the right 8 or 10, before that summer job. (I read my
brother's orthopedics book on how to put the shoulder back in. A lot
of people do it wrong, including the swim coach who I let do it wrong,
shame on me -- I suspect that's still true. Customs die hard. -- and
may cause more damage. And I would stop someone on the street to ask
him to put it in for me, and tell him how. But eventually I got
control and could put it in myself using the muscles in the bad arm
itself, and my other hand.) A lot of people say it's the most pain
they've ever felt, but it didn't really hurt that much for me. I think
that's related to how easily they came out in the first place, sort
of.

And that summer job made them both stable. Even the right one
woudln't have needed surgery were it not for that tv.

"Knocked" in quotes because I don't know for sure if the shock made my
legs push me, or if I did it myself out of fear. Since the shock was
applied through my hand, I don't see how it would know about my legs,
so I must not have been knocked anywhere. I just jumped back with
more force than I normally use.

Bill

On 07/15/2016 10:49 PM, Micky wrote:
It "knocked me across the room" and I dislocated my shoulder,

How does that work? Was it like an explosive blast? Or was it more like a time warp where space was expanded behind you and compressed before you?

On Sat, 16 Jul 2016 06:54:57 -0600, Buster Hymen
wrote:

On 07/15/2016 10:49 PM, Micky wrote:
It "knocked me across the room" and I dislocated my shoulder,

How does that work? Was it like an explosive blast? Or was it more like a time warp where space was expanded behind you and compressed before you?

Possibly an explosion. Possibly a time warp. Or both together. It
was better described in the rest of my previous post.

On Thursday, July 14, 2016 at 1:33:24 PM UTC-5, Micky wrote:
I don't do this, but I have am AC fan with a remote switch. I put the
switch in the hot wire, and the neutral wire is 10 feet away. That
is, the hot wire comes to the switch and goes back to the fan's plug
and on to the fan where it does its work. The neutral wire goes
straight to the fan's plug.

I've been tempted to turn the switch on, or off, with wet hands, while
wearing slippers with soft, black soles (plastic, vinyl, rubber?) on a
carpeted floor, on a wood subfloor, while touching nothing else with
any of the rest of my body. Even were I to somehow trip, there is
nothing to touch but wood and sheetrock.

I'm trying to figure out how, even if my hands were dripping water,
soapy water that would conduct electricity, and the water made it into
the switch, as a contiguous wet area reaching from my fingers to the
metal contacts or stripped wire, I could get a shock, or killed.

And I can't see how. Since even though the wire is hot, I'm not
touching anything else. I've gotten lots of 110V shocks and iirc,
every time I touched a hot and something else. I've gotten one 2000v
shock from a color TV and I was being very careful and didn't notice
touching anything else, but I think I must have.

It is possible that the shoulder came out not due to your falling and hitting it, but by some type of severe musculature contraction when you got the shock itself.