A friend bought an apartment on fairly high floor in a high rise,
right on the ocean and facing the water, in Florida, and it turns out
it has mold. The apartment is vacant. His wife says she's had
companies look at it, and they say they will do the job, but they
never come back.

What's going on? Have all the reliable Florida contractors gone to
NJ and NY? Don't some have families and enough business and want to
stay in Florida?

It's also possible that the wife is doing something wrong, but I don't
know what. Any guesses?

Did water get in through the windows and doors during storms not bad
enough to close the storm shutters, is that the cause? Or maybe a
leak from upstairs? Any other possible cause?

I owe this friend several big favors and fixing this for him would be
a partial repayment. I really don't want to spend the spring or
summer in Florida, or even the winter, but if work is almost all I do,
may be I won't have to stay too long.

How long do you think it would take to do a 3 BR apartment? I know
that's a stupid question because you (and I) don't know how big the
problem is, but my rough guess is that most of it is under the window
and door moldings that face the outside, and also if necessary killing
the mold with bleach and painting the walls with mold resistant paint.
(Which means mixing anti-mold liquid in with whatever paint the wife
wants.) Is 3 weeks a reasonable time estimate?

I need the exercise. I can probably only do hard work 4 hours a day
to start but after a week or two, might be up to 8 hours a day and
after that, 12 hours a day and then I can go home, fit and fiddle. So
it might benefit me, too.


Do I have to wear a respirator the whole time I'm in there? Can I
sleep there without a respirator and not get sick? I had a little
mold in my own house, one square foot in the basement for years (I
hadn't noticed it), when I spent my time equally on all three floors,
and it didn't bother me at all. On another occasion, 6 square feet
for 3 months. Again, no problems. Or do these good experiences
mean nothing because there are so many kinds of mold.

Can I let their 10-year old come in and play while I'm working, or is
it too likely he'll get sick? If I say no, I want to have some
authority like one of you to blame, so he doesn't blame me.

I'd like to hire a helper, but if the building management doesn't have
reliable names, not sure where to look.

Thanks.

Micky,

Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.


Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

They're doing you a favour. Man has evolved inhaling mold spores, and so most of us are pretty resistant to "mycotoxins" which are the toxins on the surface of spores which we might inhale in a building with mold. While it's true that people have had internal organs (like livers) fail and have even died from ingesting too much mycotoxin, that doesn't happen from inhaling mold spores. For that to happen, you need to ingest A LOT of mycotoxins, and that means making a meal out of the wrong kind of mushrooms you found growing somewhere. Anyone that tells you that you can have serious and permanent health problems from inhaling mold spores either doesn't know what they're talking about or stands to make a lot of money by influencing your purchasing decisions. In fact, for a long time doctors were reluctant to even believe that inhaling mold spores could affect a person's health because of the extremely tiny amount of mycotoxins that people can ingest that way. And, a full grown man is actually a pretty good sized animal, so it takes quite a bit to kill one. And, mycotoxins are mild toxins. They're not like the venom of some snakes and jellyfish where even a small amount of the stuff can kill you. Given all those factors, the idea that a full grown man could get sick from inhaling mold spores was a contentious issue for a long time, but now it's become widely accepted that the mycotoxins on some mold spores, if inhaled, can and does affect people's health, but to a fairly limited extent.

My guess would be that the contractors you talked to are busy doing legitimate work for an honest dollar, and don't want to jump on the MOLD!!! bandwagon. The more time I've spent on DIY web sites, the more I've come to think of MOLD!!! as just another scam to fleece homeowners out of their money. All you really need to do is find out where the water is getting in to the walls (if it's getting into the wall) and caulk that opening to stop it from happening. Then, kill the mold with bleach and you're done. It's very possible that the mold you're seeing may be just due to condensation forming on a north facing wall first thing in the morning. Exterior walls get colder at night, and if you have high humidity in the morning, then you can get condensation forming on cold walls. If that same condensation forms on cold grass, they call it "dew".

My understanding is that in some places in the US, they'll allow water supply piping to rise through the exterior walls of the buildings because there's so little chance of freezing temperatures causing those pipes to freeze and rupture. You might have condensation forming on (and dripping off) a cold water supply pipe running through an exterior wall.

I would check the wall cavities in the area worst affected by mold to see if it's growing inside the walls. If you don't find any, then it's not in the walls and you just have to clean it up wherever you see it with bleach.

No, please don't mix a mildewcide into any paint. People do that, but mildewcide "leeching" is a very technical subject, and the only way to know which mildewcide will work best with which paint binder and paint gloss level is to actually do the testing. You see, mildewcides work by being highly soluble in water, and even high humidity on one side of the paint film will cause the mildewcide in that paint film to migrate through the paint film to the surface exposed to high humidity. How QUICKLY that mildewcide migrates (or more correctly "leeches") is critical because if it migrates too fast, then you have way more protection than you need for a short period, and then nothing, and the mildew starts growing again a year or two after painting. If it migrates too slowly, then you don't have enough mildewcide reaching the paint's surface fast enough to be effective at killing the mildew spores before they grow, and the mildewcide starts growing on the paint again shortly after painting. Neither of those results are good. What you want is for the mildewcide to leach out of the paint film at the slowest rate which is still 100% effective at killing mildew spores that land on the paint. Then, the paint stays mold free for the longerst possible time.

Your best bet is to buy a paint specifically made for bathrooms, like Zinsser PermaWhite Bathroom Paint available at Home Depot or a paint simply called "Bath Paint" made by Sherwin Williams. Both of those paints are specifically formulated for bathrooms, and that means that someone did the testing to find the combination of mildewcide and paint binder resin that allowed the mildewcide to be sufficiently mobile in the plastic resin to migrate toward the moist side of the paint film at the right rate to keep the paint mildew free for a very long time. If dumping a packet of mildewcide into any paint before shaking would yield similar results, Zinsser's would drop their PermaWhite line because no one would buy it. But, it's one of the most popular products they sell.
Zinsser's PermaWhite is guaranteed to be mildew free for a minimum of 5 years, but if it only stays mildew free for 5 years, then you got a gallon from a defective batch. My own experience with it is that two coats of it will last closer to 15 years, and three coats even longer. PermaWhite comes in both Eggshell and Satin white tint base and can be tinted to any off-white (or even pastel) colour just like any other white tint base. Or, you can use it untinted if you like "psycho ward" white.

No to question #1 and yes to question #2. Many people live with mold spores and never have any health issues from exposure to them. On the other hand, some people seem to be more affected by mold spores than others. It's not so much because there are different kinds of molds, although that's true as well, it's more because we're all different. Some of us can smoke all our lives and die of a disease unrelated to smoking when we're 95. Others can smoke for 20 years and contract lung cancer and die at age 45. It's not that the cigarettes were significantly different, it's that people are significantly different in their resistance to alcohol, tobacco, caffeine, mycotoxins, polyisocyanates, etc. It's kinda like allergies. Not everyone is allergic, and those that are allergic aren't allergic to the same things, and even those that are allergic to the same things aren't equally allergic to that thing. We're all very much "individuals" when it comes to our medical sensitivities.

If exposure to mold spores hasn't been a problem for you up to now, you're like many people and not strongly affected by them.

I would.

In studies of buildings with "sick building syndrome" because of known mycotoxin producing molds growing in the building, the people that did get sick typically had MILD symptoms, such as headaches, running nose and eyes, coughing and sneezing and irritability. Sometimes skin rashes. But, in all cases, those same sick people always quickly returned to normal health once they changed jobs or were transferred to a different work location where they weren't exposed to those mycotoxin carrying mold spores anymore.

So, watch the kid, and see if he starts to exhibit the symptoms of a cold or in a really bad case, the flu. If he doesn't then he's not strongly affected by inhaling mycotoxin bearing mold spores either.

I wouldn't want to see any babies in that apartment when you're doing work that's going to produce airborne dust, tho. There HAVE been some reports of fungii spores causing hemorrhages in babies, but the link between the spores and be hemorrhages was never proven.


Well, DON'T look in your yellow pages under Mold Abatement because all those companies rely on fear to stay afloat, so there's no such thing as a "harmless" mold in their books. I would Google "mycotoxins" and look for webpages on sites with an .edu or .gov extension on them. Those will typically be medical studies and/or public information provided by government agencies that will give you the straight scoop on mold. The truth is that there are thousands of kinds of molds, but only a few of them produce mycotoxins on their spores, so only a few molds are potentially harmful to your health. And, serious and permanent health effects don't arise in adults from inhaling spores. You need to eat the wrong mushrooms for that to happen.

Here, read the section entitled "Indoor Air Quality and Sick Building Syndrome" on this web page:
Mycotoxins

On Mar 26, 8:29*pm, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"

wrote:
Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project.. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

Agree with David and Oren. It's impossible for anyone
to give much advice when even Micky doesn't know the
extent of the problem. It could be relatively simple, or it
could be a tear out of much of the apartment. Who knows.
I would not want to take on something like this for
someone else when I don't have the relevant experience
in dealing with this kind of problem. Even worse, it's in
a high rise building. If you start disturbing mold that gets
into the building ventilation system, or are found improperly
dragging molded material through the hallways, etc, you
and the owner could have big problems. And a mold
remediation company has insurance, you don't.

Also of concern is the fact that the companies that come
out to look at it apparently never call back. If it was because
they are all up in NJ/NY doing work, then why would they
waste time coming over to look at it to begin with? My
concern would be that they could be seeing that it's a
tough job for some reason and there are lower hanging
fruit.

I agree that if Mickey doesn't know how bad the mold problem is, then none of us can give him any insight into that.

I don't agree that all indoor mold growth is a health hazard or that this kind of work should be left to trained professionals wearing biohazard suits.

Mold is like anything else; it needs a source of food and a source of water to survive. I you remove either one, the mold will first go dormant and then eventually die. But, because there are so many kind of fungii, plenty of them will be able to use any natural construction material (like the paper backing on drywall) or ordinary house dust as a food source, so the food is all around them, and therefore the focus should be on eliminating their source of water.

And, for an apartment several stories up in the air, then ground water seepage into the living space can be eliminated right off the bat, and then you only have a plumbing leak or rain leaking in from the outside to investigate.

And, on top of that, most fungii are harmless to us anyway, so it's very possible that the only real reasons to get rid of this mold are aesthetic and to keep Mickey from having to deal with uninformed health nuts going full retard over the MOLD!!!

On Tuesday, March 26, 2013 5:59:40 PM UTC-4, micky wrote:
A friend bought an apartment on fairly high floor in a high rise, right on the ocean and facing the water, in Florida, and it turns out it has mold. The apartment is vacant. His wife says she's had companies look at it, and they say they will do the job, but they never come back. What's going on? Have all the reliable Florida contractors gone to NJ and NY? Don't some have families and enough business and want to stay in Florida? It's also possible that the wife is doing something wrong, but I don't know what. Any guesses? Did water get in through the windows and doors during storms not bad enough to close the storm shutters, is that the cause? Or maybe a leak from upstairs? Any other possible cause? I owe this friend several big favors and fixing this for him would be a partial repayment. I really don't want to spend the spring or summer in Florida, or even the winter, but if work is almost all I do, may be I won't have to stay too long. How long do you think it would take to do a 3 BR apartment? I know that's a stupid question because you (and I) don't know how big the problem is, but my rough guess is that most of it is under the window and door moldings that face the outside, and also if necessary killing the mold with bleach and painting the walls with mold resistant paint. (Which means mixing anti-mold liquid in with whatever paint the wife wants.) Is 3 weeks a reasonable time estimate? I need the exercise. I can probably only do hard work 4 hours a day to start but after a week or two, might be up to 8 hours a day and after that, 12 hours a day and then I can go home, fit and fiddle. So it might benefit me, too. Do I have to wear a respirator the whole time I'm in there? Can I sleep there without a respirator and not get sick? I had a little mold in my own house, one square foot in the basement for years (I hadn't noticed it), when I spent my time equally on all three floors, and it didn't bother me at all. On another occasion, 6 square feet for 3 months. Again, no problems. Or do these good experiences mean nothing because there are so many kinds of mold. Can I let their 10-year old come in and play while I'm working, or is it too likely he'll get sick? If I say no, I want to have some authority like one of you to blame, so he doesn't blame me. I'd like to hire a helper, but if the building management doesn't have reliable names, not sure where to look. Thanks.

From what I've observed most people are not bothered by mold. But occasionally a few people are. And people that aren't sometimes become bothered by it after years of exposure. So there's no telling for sure but if it has not been a problem for you in the past I doubt a few weeks of exposure will be a problem now. I would wear a mask during tear down. And I'd have a box fan I could stick in a window to exhaust the air.

Without knowing why it has a mold problem or how exstensive the problem is no one can give you much advice on fixing it. It has to be more that "it has a mold problem", someone must have had it evaluated or tested at some point in the past. Can't you get the details of that?

On Wed, 27 Mar 2013 05:45:52 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Mar 26, 8:29*pm, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"

wrote:
Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

My friend goes to work and doesn't get involved, not even it seems
when his wife is screwing up.

I don't understand either. And get this, she wants to start her own
business. When she would make a lot more money** in far less time to
just get the apartment ready for occupancy.

**The value of the apartment when it's habitable minus the value when
it's not.

She had a business in the last city they lived in, but my friend
thinks mostly she lost money.



Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

Dunno. I'm sure they had a lawyer for the closing, but that doesn't
mean they ever got back to him with these problems.

Agree with David and Oren. It's impossible for anyone
to give much advice when even Micky doesn't know the
extent of the problem. It could be relatively simple, or it
could be a tear out of much of the apartment. Who knows.
I would not want to take on something like this for
someone else when I don't have the relevant experience
in dealing with this kind of problem. Even worse, it's in
a high rise building. If you start disturbing mold that gets
into the building ventilation system, or are found improperly
dragging molded material through the hallways, etc, you
and the owner could have big problems. And a mold
remediation company has insurance, you don't.

Some of these I'd thought of, some I hadn't. It's good to be able to
"talk" about this with someone, all four of you. .

Also of concern is the fact that the companies that come
out to look at it apparently never call back. If it was because
they are all up in NJ/NY doing work, then why would they
waste time coming over to look at it to begin with? My
concern would be that they could be seeing that it's a
tough job for some reason and there are lower hanging
fruit.

I was thinking it was just the guys who barely knew anything who would
come over, and when it wasn't a very simple case, they backed out
rather than be in over their heads.

Or she bargained too much on the price. Sometimes she spends money
like water, and sometimes aiui, she's cheap as can be. She's told me
one of the cheap stories herself.

I'm going to be in Florida for a week or t0 days around Memorial day.
Maybe I can interview remediators then. It's been 8 months or more
since they bought the place. Even at current low interest rates,
they've probably lost as much in interest as the repair job would
cost.

You've given me food for thought. Thanks Trader, Oren, David and
James.

On Wed, 27 Mar 2013 14:34:35 +0000, nestork
wrote:


I agree that if Mickey doesn't know how bad the mold problem is, then
none of us can give him any insight into that.

I don't agree that all indoor mold growth is a health hazard or that
this kind of work should be left to trained professionals wearing
biohazard suits.

Mold is like anything else; it needs a source of food and a source of
water to survive. I you remove either one, the mold will first go
dormant and then eventually die. But, because there are so many kind of
fungii, plenty of them will be able to use any natural construction
material (like the paper backing on drywall) or ordinary house dust as a
food source, so the food is all around them, and therefore the focus
should be on eliminating their source of water.

Hmmm. Water. Maybe I can get her restarted indirectly, using my
status as a "home repair expert". which I think she accepts, to just
ask her about the status of the water. I don't think any hurricanes
hit this part of the coast this year, so maybe if the leak was taken
care of early on, it's not the whole apartment with problems. Maybe
I can get her to want to make progress before I arrive in two months,
just to impress me. (although if she doesn't care about her husband or
kid, why me?) .

And, for an apartment several stories up in the air, then ground water
seepage into the living space can be eliminated right off the bat, and
then you only have a plumbing leak or rain leaking in from the outside
to investigate.

And, on top of that, most fungii are harmless to us anyway, so it's very
possible that the only real reasons to get rid of this mold are
aesthetic and to keep Mickey from having to deal with uninformed health
nuts going full retard over the MOLD!!!

Well, aesthetic and that the condo board won't let my friends move in
until this is resolved. So they're living in another apartment much
smaller than the house they used to live in, with little space for
visitors like their other kids who live out of town to stay in when
they visit.

As to any possible legal case with a prior owner: If such claim
exists, the court won't look fondly on their failure to remediate
this, the possibility it's gotten worse by their not doing anything,
and the fact that they have no dollar number to sue for, since they
still haven't fixed it. I don't know how she thinks she can run a
business if she isn't aware of stuff like this. She's made her bed
and can lie in it, but I care about my friend and his son.


Go for my personal point of view. Get an ugly girl to marry you.

On Mar 27, 10:34*am, nestork wrote:
I agree that if Mickey doesn't know how bad the mold problem is, then
none of us can give him any insight into that.

I don't agree that all indoor mold growth is a health hazard or that
this kind of work should be left to trained professionals wearing
biohazard suits.

Mold is like anything else; it needs a source of food and a source of
water to survive. *I you remove either one, the mold will first go
dormant and then eventually die. *But, because there are so many kind of
fungii, plenty of them will be able to use any natural construction
material (like the paper backing on drywall) or ordinary house dust as a
food source, so the food is all around them, and therefore the focus
should be on eliminating their source of water.

And, for an apartment several stories up in the air, then ground water
seepage into the living space can be eliminated right off the bat, and
then you only have a plumbing leak or rain leaking in from the outside
to investigate.

And, on top of that, most fungii are harmless to us anyway, so it's very
possible that the only real reasons to get rid of this mold are
aesthetic and to keep Mickey from having to deal with uninformed health
nuts going full retard over the MOLD!!!

--
nestork

You may think they are "uninformed health nuts going full retard",
but you don't live in the high rise, do you? There
are plenty of real stories of houses having to be torn down
because of mold. If micky goes in there and starts disturbing
mold, it gets into a common building ventilation system
and one tenant calls the management company, they call
a mold remediation company that says he's unlicensed to
do the work, what he's doing threatens the health of the entire
building,
he's already dispersed mold into the HVAC system and to
resolve it is going to cost $$$$$, then you could have a BIG
problem. Whether all of it is true and whether they are health nuts
or not, maybe you can determine someday in court. Simple
fact is when you live in a condo or co-op there are some very
important diffences from being in your own single family house.

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:29:20 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.


Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

BTW, a property can be sold "as-is"[*] and the buyer can still have
an inspection done. His options are then to proceed with the purchase
or not. He can ask for repairs to be made but an answer has already
been given.
[*] In fact, all properties sold in Alabamistan (and I'm sure at least
some other states) are "as-is".

On Mar 31, 6:37*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:29:20 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

BTW, a property can be sold "as-is"[*] and the buyer can still have
an inspection done. *His options are then to proceed with the purchase
or not. *He can ask for repairs to be made but an answer has already
been given.

No answer has been given until the question is actually
asked. As is, just means there is no
warranty or guarantee. It doesn't mean the seller won't
make some repairs if defects are found on the inspection
report. I could be selling a car "as is". The buyer takes it
for inspection and the mechanic says it needs a new
exhaust. The buyer asks for me to pay for it by discounting
the price and I agree. It's still an "as is" sale.

On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:48:28 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Mar 31, 6:37*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:29:20 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

BTW, a property can be sold "as-is"[*] and the buyer can still have
an inspection done. *His options are then to proceed with the purchase
or not. *He can ask for repairs to be made but an answer has already
been given.

No answer has been given until the question is actually
asked.

The statement of being sold "as is" says that the sellers are not
going to do any repairs.

As is, just means there is no warranty or guarantee.

Nope. A warranty has to be explicitly stated. It's a positive
statement, not a negative.

It doesn't mean the seller won't
make some repairs if defects are found on the inspection
report.

That's what it means but it doesn't mean they can't change their mind.

I could be selling a car "as is". The buyer takes it
for inspection and the mechanic says it needs a new
exhaust. The buyer asks for me to pay for it by discounting
the price and I agree. It's still an "as is" sale.

Cars are *NOT* real estate.

On Mar 31, 11:16*pm, wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:48:28 -0700 (PDT), "





wrote:
On Mar 31, 6:37*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:29:20 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

BTW, a property can be sold "as-is"[*] and the buyer can still have
an inspection done. *His options are then to proceed with the purchase
or not. *He can ask for repairs to be made but an answer has already
been given.

No answer has been given until the question is actually
asked.

The statement of being sold "as is" says that the sellers are not
going to do any repairs.

As is, just means there is no warranty or guarantee.

Nope. *A warranty has to be explicitly stated. *It's a positive
statement, not a negative.

Yes, because sales of real estate in most states are
"as is", subject to some possible exceptions You yourself said
that. That is what "as is" means. Unless a warranty is
explicitly given or something is required by law in that state,
then the buyer has no warranty. That doesn't mean the
buyer can't do an inspection and go back to a seller that is selling
a property "as-is" and say I'll still buy it, but only
if you'll replace the broken AC. How any seller will or will
not react to that isn't predictable, ie you don't know the
answer without asking. I agree that with a sale being
advertised as "as-is" the buyer is less likely to get
concessions, at least for obvious things, small things,
etc. But it doesn't mean you can never get a concession
for anything.



It doesn't mean the seller won't
make some repairs if defects are found on the inspection
report.

That's what it means but it doesn't mean they can't change their mind.

Well, then the answer to whether they will or won't
make any repairs isn't known, just as I said. Let's say
the inspection finds extensive termite damage. Damage
the seller did not know about. Well, now they do and
if they don't sell it to you, they are going to have to disclose
the termite problem to all other buyers. In that case, it
could very well be to their advantage to discount the
price now and sell it.




I could be selling a car "as is". *The buyer takes it
for inspection and the mechanic says it needs a new
exhaust. *The buyer asks for me to pay for it by discounting
the price and I agree. *It's still an "as is" sale.

Cars are *NOT* real estate.- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Same principles apply.

On Mon, 1 Apr 2013 05:46:55 -0700 (PDT), "
wrote:

On Mar 31, 11:16*pm, wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:48:28 -0700 (PDT), "





wrote:
On Mar 31, 6:37*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:29:20 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

BTW, a property can be sold "as-is"[*] and the buyer can still have
an inspection done. *His options are then to proceed with the purchase
or not. *He can ask for repairs to be made but an answer has already
been given.

No answer has been given until the question is actually
asked.

The statement of being sold "as is" says that the sellers are not
going to do any repairs.

As is, just means there is no warranty or guarantee.

Nope. *A warranty has to be explicitly stated. *It's a positive
statement, not a negative.

Yes, because sales of real estate in most states are
"as is", subject to some possible exceptions You yourself said
that. That is what "as is" means.

So you're saying that all states have the same laws. You're as whacky
as Haller.

Unless a warranty is
explicitly given or something is required by law in that state,
then the buyer has no warranty.

Which is the *OPPOSITE* of what you just stated.

That doesn't mean the
buyer can't do an inspection and go back to a seller that is selling
a property "as-is" and say I'll still buy it, but only
if you'll replace the broken AC.

If it's being advertised as "as is" he's already stated that he's not
interested. Again, he can certainly change his mind.

How any seller will or will
not react to that isn't predictable, ie you don't know the
answer without asking. I agree that with a sale being
advertised as "as-is" the buyer is less likely to get
concessions, at least for obvious things, small things,
etc. But it doesn't mean you can never get a concession
for anything.

That's what I said. sheesh!

Good grief!

On Apr 1, 10:47*am, wrote:
On Mon, 1 Apr 2013 05:46:55 -0700 (PDT), "





wrote:
On Mar 31, 11:16*pm, wrote:
On Sun, 31 Mar 2013 16:48:28 -0700 (PDT), "

wrote:
On Mar 31, 6:37*pm, wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 17:29:20 -0700, Oren wrote:
On Tue, 26 Mar 2013 19:24:05 -0400, "David L. Martel"
wrote:

Micky,

* Forgive me but you don't sound as if you are ready for this project. Has
the moisture problem been resolved? Who needs to fix that, the building or
your friend? Have you looked at the apartment? What needs to be done? Do you
have the knowledge, experience and tools for this?
* Florida has many water damage remediation companies. Pros who are bonded.
Don't know why your friends can't find one.

Dave M.

Has the friend spoken to their real estate agent? *Was an inspection
done before purchase or bought "as is"? * What are the disclosure laws
in Florida?

BTW, a property can be sold "as-is"[*] and the buyer can still have
an inspection done. *His options are then to proceed with the purchase
or not. *He can ask for repairs to be made but an answer has already
been given.

No answer has been given until the question is actually
asked.

The statement of being sold "as is" says that the sellers are not
going to do any repairs.

As is, just means there is no warranty or guarantee.

Nope. *A warranty has to be explicitly stated. *It's a positive
statement, not a negative.

Yes, because sales of real estate in most states are
"as is", subject to some possible exceptions You yourself said
that. *That is what "as is" means.

So you're saying that all states have the same laws. *You're as whacky
as Haller.

Stop lying. I never said any such thing. Next will come
the profanity, because you're wrong and won't admit it.




Unless a warranty is
explicitly given or something is required by law in that state,
then the buyer has no warranty.

Which is the *OPPOSITE* of what you just stated.

I never said any such thing. All I said was:

A - In most states, real estate sales are "as is", which
means there is no warranty, other than anything that is
required by law. You yourself said the same thing, so
why lie now?




That doesn't mean the
buyer can't do an inspection and go back to a seller that is selling
a property "as-is" and say I'll still buy it, but only
if you'll replace the broken AC.

If it's being advertised as "as is" he's already stated that he's not
interested. *Again, he can certainly change his mind.

No **** sherlock. And the way you find that out is by
ASKING. Are you that timid that you're afraid to ASK?



How any seller will or will
not react to that isn't predictable, ie you don't know the
answer without asking. *I agree that with a sale being
advertised as "as-is" the buyer is less likely to get
concessions, at least for obvious things, small things,
etc. *But it doesn't mean you can never get a concession
for anything.

That's what I said. *sheesh!


No, what you said was that in any sale that is "as is",
the seller has already given you the answer, ie that they
will not do any repairs or make any concessions. That
is just wrong. The termite inspection example I gave you,
which of course you ignored, is a classic example. You
go to buy a house that is being sold "as is". Upon inspection, it's
discovered that there is extensive termite
damage, which the seller didn't know about. The seller
now has to disclose that to any other buyers. So, why
wouldn't they make a reduction in price? Geeez.
You're obviously not experienced in real estate transactions.