Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be removed? (I
understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it is sealed and not
disturbed.)

On 02/01/2012 04:17 PM, mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be removed? (I
understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it is sealed and not
disturbed.)

What's the bank to do with it after if forecloses? Can't expect the
poor banks to do fixer-uppers!

Why is the government involved? Isn't the USA the land of the free?

How far our nation has fallen.

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"mcp6453" wrote in message
...
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be removed?
(I
understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it is sealed and not
disturbed.)

mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

"HeyBub" wrote:
mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

I can give examples. Asbestos hanging loose from ceiling ducting. Asbestos
inside ducts.

I got asbestos wrapped around the round ducting connections branching from
the rectangular ducting. My home inspector pointed that out. It's mostly
intact. I was going to paint over. I decided to wrap plastic ducting tape
over it instead. It should last a long time. The tape overlaps and forms a
seal.

Greg

On Feb 1, 9:57*pm, gregz wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote:
mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

I can give examples. Asbestos hanging loose from ceiling ducting. Asbestos
inside ducts.

I got asbestos wrapped around the round ducting connections *branching from
the rectangular ducting. My home inspector pointed that out. It's mostly
intact. I was going to paint over. I decided to wrap plastic ducting tape
over it instead. It should last a long time. The tape overlaps and forms a
seal.

Greg

Except that you would have no idea if there are openings
in the duct work nor a vibration condition which may be
releasing asbestos particles into the air stream in the duct...

Asbestos removal is expensive but worth the investment...

~~ Evan

On Wed, 01 Feb 2012 17:17:47 -0500, mcp6453 wrote:

Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be removed? (I
understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it is sealed and not
disturbed.)

Removal is what causes it to spread. If it's contained and sealed, it's
best left alone. It's only the dry dust small particles in the air that
get breathed that are dangerous. Big chunks that are solid or wet are
totally safe. Hell, you could probably eat them (not suggested though).

Can you think of another way? Should the tear down every home that has
the stuff? Someday we're gonna run out of building materials, why make
that day sooner for something that is much overrated as a scare tactic
so these expensive removal companies can steal your money? Then think
about this. When a building is demolished with a wrecking ball and
bulldozer, there is more asbestos getting in the air than any other
time.

When I worked as a plumber, I removed lots of it. I'd tape the spots I
intended to cut it with duct tape. Make a slice on the top of the pipe
that it was on, and soak it with wet rags or a garden hose depending on
location. After it was well soaked, I'd cut it and peel it off with
rubber gloves and shove it into trash bags. Then wipe the pipes off
with wet rags and repair the pipes. I replaced the insulation with
modern foam. The cut ends of the asbestos I'd seal with some autobody
undercoating. Then the foam would get duct tape and overlap the
asbestos. That's sealed....

I never wore space suits, or put up plastic walls or any of that
nonsense. AS long as it was wet, it was harmless. In finished floors,
I put plastic. Most of this work was in basements. Then I'd just hose
down the whole floor into a drain.

I knew a guy in the flooring business who used to sand down vinyl
asbestos tile, with a coarse floor sander to level the floor before
installing new flooring. Now that WAS dangerous. He lived to be well
into his 80's, and died from diabetes, not asbestos related.

You need to use caution, but it's not like a deadly poison waiting to
attack you at any moment.

we live in a society where there are a lot of extremists who are out to
scare people with lots of things, and much of the time it's all based on
advertising. They know there is a sucker born every minute.

I'm a farmer, I do not use any chemicals, except minimal amounts of
"Roundup" in very weedy areas, which are not used for crops or
livestock. I use maybe 2 or 3 cans of fly spray per year. That's all.
What worries me, much more than asbestos, or lead paint, or radon, or
any of that stuff, are the neighbors that spray huge tanks of chemicals,
which DOES get in my air and onto my land. A few years ago they were
using aerial spraying, and myself and several other neighbors filed a
lawsuit because the **** was going everywhere. I lost hundreds of
dollars worth of hay that year because I was just getting ready to bale
my hay, and instead had to wait several weeks for rains to dissipate
that over spray on my fields. By that time, I lost a whole cutting.

The court put a stop to the spraying, and a year later the farmer died,
and the cause of death was due to farming chemicals. If you want
something to fear that is WORTH fearing, fear these chemicals. They are
many thousand times worse than all these nonsense things such as
asbestos, radon, and lead paint. I'll add to this one last thing. Yea,
kids that chew on windowsills ARE in danger of lead poisoning from older
lead based paints. But there is a simple solution. FEED the damn kid
and they wont chew on paint! Learn to be a parent, and smack the kid
who does chew on paint. Dont blame the paint, blame the parents who are
not doing their job as parents.

"Evan" wrote in message
...
On Feb 1, 9:57 pm, gregz wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote:
mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

I can give examples. Asbestos hanging loose from ceiling ducting. Asbestos
inside ducts.

I got asbestos wrapped around the round ducting connections branching from
the rectangular ducting. My home inspector pointed that out. It's mostly
intact. I was going to paint over. I decided to wrap plastic ducting tape
over it instead. It should last a long time. The tape overlaps and forms a
seal.

Greg

Except that you would have no idea if there are openings
in the duct work nor a vibration condition which may be
releasing asbestos particles into the air stream in the duct...

Asbestos removal is expensive but worth the investment...

~~ Evan

"Evan" wrote in message
...
On Feb 1, 9:57 pm, gregz wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote:
mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

I can give examples. Asbestos hanging loose from ceiling ducting. Asbestos
inside ducts.

I got asbestos wrapped around the round ducting connections branching from
the rectangular ducting. My home inspector pointed that out. It's mostly
intact. I was going to paint over. I decided to wrap plastic ducting tape
over it instead. It should last a long time. The tape overlaps and forms a
seal.

Greg

Except that you would have no idea if there are openings
in the duct work nor a vibration condition which may be
releasing asbestos particles into the air stream in the duct...

Asbestos removal is expensive but worth the investment...

~~ Evan

Asbestos can cause many lung diseases including lung cancer and emphesymia.
If you have damaged asbestos in the house, it's no good just covering it up
the fibres will be everywhere already.
The asbestos will have to be dealt with and the house thoroughly cleaned.
This is very time consuming especially if ducts are involved as someone else
has said.

On Feb 1, 5:17*pm, mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be removed? (I
understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it is sealed and not
disturbed.)

Who says it is legal? For example, here in NJ you need a
certificate of occupancy prior to the sale or rental of a
property. Just like they check for obvious safety defects
like missing smoke detectors or railings along stairs, if
you had asbestos hanging loose and falling from the ceiling,
I would bet they would flag it.

In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

gregz wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote:
mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

I can give examples. Asbestos hanging loose from ceiling ducting.
Asbestos inside ducts.

I got asbestos wrapped around the round ducting connections
branching from the rectangular ducting. My home inspector pointed
that out. It's mostly intact. I was going to paint over. I decided to
wrap plastic ducting tape over it instead. It should last a long
time. The tape overlaps and forms a seal.


There are penetrating liquids designed for "painting" asbestos to stabilize it.
Probably a better choice than paint.

Evan wrote:

Except that you would have no idea if there are openings
in the duct work nor a vibration condition which may be
releasing asbestos particles into the air stream in the duct...

Asbestos removal is expensive but worth the investment...


How is it worth the investment, aside from making people "feel" better?

Can you point to ANY instance of ANY disease attributed to the consumer use
of asbestos or any study that supports the hypothesis?

On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 14:09:04 -0600, "HeyBub"
wrote:

Evan wrote:

Except that you would have no idea if there are openings
in the duct work nor a vibration condition which may be
releasing asbestos particles into the air stream in the duct...

Asbestos removal is expensive but worth the investment...


How is it worth the investment, aside from making people "feel" better?

Can you point to ANY instance of ANY disease attributed to the consumer use
of asbestos or any study that supports the hypothesis?

I wrapped all our heating pipes asbestos with plastic duct tape 25
years ago maybe 35 years ago as I have been here in the same house for
going on 38 years.

On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 05:29:25 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

Who says it is legal? For example, here in NJ you need a
certificate of occupancy prior to the sale or rental of a
property. Just like they check for obvious safety defects
like missing smoke detectors or railings along stairs, if
you had asbestos hanging loose and falling from the ceiling,
I would bet they would flag it.

In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

The problem with this is that the average homeowner probably dont even
know what asbestos looks like. The same for many of the other questions
on the form.

On Thu, 02 Feb 2012 15:58:20 -0600, wrote:

On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 05:29:25 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

Who says it is legal? For example, here in NJ you need a
certificate of occupancy prior to the sale or rental of a
property. Just like they check for obvious safety defects
like missing smoke detectors or railings along stairs, if
you had asbestos hanging loose and falling from the ceiling,
I would bet they would flag it.

In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

The problem with this is that the average homeowner probably dont even
know what asbestos looks like. The same for many of the other questions
on the form.
I guess I am not average as I have microscopes and can tell the
difference from fiberglass and asbestos. I also know the age of the
house which is 200 years old. I surmised that the pipes were added
about a hundred years ago from now, or more, and concluded that the
insulation on my heating pipes( leading to the radiators from the oil
fired boiler) would be asbestos, so it was wrapped with many, many
rolls of plastic duct tape.
Sad to say most people as you say would not know. They are prey to
the service or rather disservice people.

On Wed, 1 Feb 2012 18:16:30 -0600, "HeyBub"
wrote:

mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?


Federal prisons. Or pay abhorrent amounts of money from law suits.

On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 05:29:25 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:


In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

So what if it is on there? That does not make anything illegal or
unsafe. There is a lot of hysteria about asbestos. Under certain
circumstances, it can be a hazard, but left alone and covered, it is
harmless.

On Feb 2, 10:18*pm, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 05:29:25 -0800 (PST), "

wrote:

In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. *I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. *If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

So what if it is on there? *That does not make anything illegal or
unsafe. *There is a lot of hysteria about asbestos. *Under certain
circumstances, it can be a hazard, but left alone and covered, it is
harmless.

The question was "Why is it even legal to sell a home
with asbestos that needs to be removed?". Read my
reply in that context and the question on the form could
indeed matter.

Oren wrote:
On Wed, 1 Feb 2012 18:16:30 -0600, "HeyBub"
wrote:

mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?


Federal prisons. Or pay abhorrent amounts of money from law suits.

Slight correction: Unless you mean the prisoners will be dressed by Armani,
I think what you mean is "lawsuits".

On Feb 2, 3:12*pm, Evan wrote:
On Feb 2, 10:33*am, "Bob F" wrote:





gregz wrote:
"HeyBub" wrote:
mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be
removed? (I understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it
is sealed and not disturbed.)

Can you give an example of asbestos that needs to be removed?

I can give examples. Asbestos hanging loose from ceiling ducting.
Asbestos inside ducts.

I got asbestos wrapped around the round ducting connections
branching from the rectangular ducting. My home inspector pointed
that out. It's mostly intact. I was going to paint over. I decided to
wrap plastic ducting tape over it instead. It should last a long
time. The tape overlaps and forms a seal.

There are penetrating liquids designed for "painting" asbestos to stabilize it.
Probably a better choice than paint.

It is not the "outer surface you can see" that you have to
worry about with Asbestos insulation on heating ductwork,
it is the conditions inside the ductwork and whether or not
there are any holes or vibrations which could work the inner
layer of Asbestos fibers loose into the airstream, and that
is something that only the original installer would have seen
when the Asbestos was applied to the ductwork...

~~ Evan- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

Most ducts that I have ever seen use air flow under pressure, not
vacuum, so how would asbestos get into the ducts????

On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 05:29:25 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

On Feb 1, 5:17*pm, mcp6453 wrote:
Why is it even legal to sell a home with asbestos that needs to be removed? (I
understand that not all asbestos has to be removed if it is sealed and not
disturbed.)

Who says it is legal? For example, here in NJ you need a
certificate of occupancy prior to the sale or rental of a
property. Just like they check for obvious safety defects
like missing smoke detectors or railings along stairs, if
you had asbestos hanging loose and falling from the ceiling,
I would bet they would flag it.

In Vermont, a CO was required for sale, too. However, the only thing it
proved was that it was inspected at some point. The only thing that wasn't
grandfathered was that a CO detector was required. It didn't need to be AC as
does new construction, though.


In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

Sure. There is nothing wrong with that.

On Thu, 02 Feb 2012 15:58:20 -0600, wrote:

On Thu, 2 Feb 2012 05:29:25 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

Who says it is legal? For example, here in NJ you need a
certificate of occupancy prior to the sale or rental of a
property. Just like they check for obvious safety defects
like missing smoke detectors or railings along stairs, if
you had asbestos hanging loose and falling from the ceiling,
I would bet they would flag it.

In addition, the state requires a disclosure form that the
seller must fill out where they ask a long list of questions,
many of which I think are stupid. I'll bet the question of
asbestos is on there. If you lied, the buyer would have
recourse.

The problem with this is that the average homeowner probably dont even
know what asbestos looks like. The same for many of the other questions
on the form.

No problem. This is one place where ignorance is good.